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Post by wazbagsbro on Dec 22, 2023 1:21:35 GMT
And the support is really unhappy with the style and results, and there is over 1000 of them saying the same thing, But your highly paid manager is sure he is correct playing 5 across the back, how long would you back that manager? . Do 1000 football supporters know what they are seeing when one manager thinks otherwise. Is it an easy decision? I’d buy a race car instead
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Post by cvillestokie on Dec 22, 2023 1:32:14 GMT
If I owned a football club and I thought that the person in charge of getting results wasn’t doing their job, I’d get rid of them.
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Post by longdistancekiddie on Dec 22, 2023 1:53:58 GMT
I would sack players
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Post by shakermaker on Dec 22, 2023 2:00:55 GMT
And your club would swiftly go bankrupt under the weight of written off transfer fees, not to mention payoffs. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 22, 2023 2:04:54 GMT
I wouldn’t, I’m not stupid.
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Post by longdistancekiddie on Dec 22, 2023 2:06:34 GMT
And your club would swiftly go bankrupt under the weight of written off transfer fees, not to mention payoffs. No I would have the contracts written so that I could. It is about time players could be sacked like everyone else. |
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Post by rivival on Dec 22, 2023 3:53:50 GMT
When you employ an idiot it reflects badly on you. So you say things like "Give him time" then pray that things change.
At what point do stop backing yourself when you keep bringing in failures to the club. Isn't it the failure of the board who employed these bad managers that is the real problem and why it keeps repeating.
Get Alex Ferguson or someone similar to chose a manager for you as clearly this clubs board haven't got a clue.
Here's hoping that they get lucky with Schumacher.
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Dec 22, 2023 5:45:35 GMT
I wouldn’t, I’m not stupid. If you owned a football club, there's no chance you wouldn't be a hybrid player/manager/owner. |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Dec 22, 2023 10:35:10 GMT
And your club would swiftly go bankrupt under the weight of written off transfer fees, not to mention payoffs. No I would have the contracts written so that I could. It is about time players could be sacked like everyone else. No player would sign the contract so how do you attract players? I don't think you've thought this one through 😂 |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Dec 22, 2023 10:37:38 GMT
Until he stops getting results.
Would I take notice about fans' opinion about 5 at the back? Would I bollocks - fans have a massively over inflated sense of their football know how and in reality haven't got the skills, knowledge or experience required to run a Sunday League team let alone a professional football club.
An owner who takes any notice of what fans say about football strategy and tactics is a fool and needs replacing with someone who rates training, knowledge and experience above lager fueled bar room bullshit.
I blame programmes like Strictly Come Dancing - they give the general public the idea that they actually know something about professional dancing. I'm waiting for Strictly Come Brain Surgery to come on air with Kevin from accounts having a go egged on by his mates from the Kings Head offering advice on his sawing technique during his first go at a full frontal lobotomy on a football club owner who told his manager to stop playing 5 at the back because the fans don't like it.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 22, 2023 10:42:45 GMT
I wouldn’t, I’m not stupid. If you owned a football club, there's no chance you wouldn't be a hybrid player/manager/owner. I wouldn’t own a football club. I like money. |
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Post by thisisouryear on Dec 22, 2023 10:50:59 GMT
I wouldn't hire a manager that played a back 5 it's that simple. It would be in the contract of employment.
No fear would be the mantra. Defensive football ain't going to fill the stadium and keep the fans happy, I would want fast attacking football.
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 11:00:05 GMT
And your club would swiftly go bankrupt under the weight of written off transfer fees, not to mention payoffs. No I would have the contracts written so that I could. It is about time players could be sacked like everyone else. Contracts written is such a way would leave your players free to leave anytime they’d had a decent game otherwise your contract would be illegal. You can’t just write a contract that means you must be able to have all your own way and it be enforceable. You’re really not nearly as smart as you seem to think you are. |
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 11:05:49 GMT
No I would have the contracts written so that I could. It is about time players could be sacked like everyone else. No player would sign the contract so how do you attract players? I don't think you've thought this one through 😂 The contract would be unenforceable anyway, the product of a childish mind. |
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Post by leicspotter on Dec 22, 2023 11:08:43 GMT
What do the supporters know? If you don't like it F*** off up the Vale, it's MY club and I'll do what I like!  Seriously, the original premise is too simplistic. There are lots of reasons why managers don't always succeed. In the case of SCFC it seems to stem from us being rooted in the '70's and not getting a club structure that is conducive to handling the demands of modern day football. In short, it is the owners fault, so I shall sack myself with immediate effect |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Dec 22, 2023 11:13:18 GMT
None of us know what goes on behind the scenes. If I owned a football club, I'd hope to have trusted people around me and be informed enough to make the right decision at the right time.
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Post by shakermaker on Dec 22, 2023 11:13:25 GMT
No I would have the contracts written so that I could. It is about time players could be sacked like everyone else. No player would sign the contract so how do you attract players? I don't think you've thought this one through 😂 The only players willing to sign such a contract would be cast-offs or over the hill types desperate to just get into football by whatever means, like those from the Boot Dreams programme. Or you'd need a very savvy recruitment structure to spot players with potential that other clubs haven't and then sign them up to a more typical employment contract like what you and I have with our employers. The problem is, just as you can fire them whenever you like they too can also quit and sign for another club whenever they like. There would be constant churn which would disrupt team dynamics and the manager would struggle to implement an established system or style of play. |
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 11:43:38 GMT
I'd set my DoF a very wide ranging set of KPT's to be cascaded down to the head coach where applicable. They'd cover all aspects their role impacts upon not just league positions and game outcomes which would just be some of numerous KPI's. Failure to work towards any of them would not just be swept under the carpet due to achievement in others. Failure in any of them would require a clear and adhered to plan to improve/achieve that particular KPT and would eventually lead to dismissal if the person responsible could not show clear improvement, adherence to agreed plans and effort to achieve the target. I'd set a frequent timetable of reviews. Sporting merit would not trump customer numbers or customer satisfaction which would obviously involve an increased level of customer engagement.
I hope and feel a lot of these things are starting to take shape at our club and obviously there would be KPT's for various people to keep on improving, reviewing and seeking out best practice to achieve that. Not have a "this is how we do things here" ethos but to be constantly looking at what others are doing to consider if it's better and obviously some room for original thinking whilst not expecting it as any sort of condition as that's neither fair or realistic.
I'd task someone with creating and monitoring the working environment to be one in which all types of personality can contribute, be accepted, be allowed to perform their role without conforming to any irrelevant criteria. All supervisory and management roles would be made aware that management involves managing all types of character not just ones you like. I really don't like to see managers ostracise players (particularly) who have something to offer over conflicts of personality. That doesn't demonstrate strength it demonstrates weakness in a manager.
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 11:48:40 GMT
No player would sign the contract so how do you attract players? I don't think you've thought this one through 😂 The only players willing to sign such a contract would be cast-offs or over the hill types desperate to just get into football by whatever means, like those from the Boot Dreams programme. Or you'd need a very savvy recruitment structure to spot players with potential that other clubs haven't and then sign them up to a more typical employment contract like what you and I have with our employers. The problem is, just as you can fire them whenever you like they too can also quit and sign for another club whenever they like. There would be constant churn which would disrupt team dynamics and the manager would struggle to implement an established system or style of play. You're still not thinking rationally. Any contract where you have slim commitment to your employee will in turn have to offer them slim commitment to you otherwise it would be deemed an unfair contract akin to modern slavery. If you want to get rid of people willy nilly you also have to accept they can walk away willy nilly. that's why the suggestion would be destined to fail. A couple of good games and they'd be off elsewhere, you'd never get anywhere. |
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Post by cvillestokie on Dec 22, 2023 11:59:46 GMT
The only players willing to sign such a contract would be cast-offs or over the hill types desperate to just get into football by whatever means, like those from the Boot Dreams programme. Or you'd need a very savvy recruitment structure to spot players with potential that other clubs haven't and then sign them up to a more typical employment contract like what you and I have with our employers. The problem is, just as you can fire them whenever you like they too can also quit and sign for another club whenever they like. There would be constant churn which would disrupt team dynamics and the manager would struggle to implement an established system or style of play. You're still not thinking rationally. Any contract where you have slim commitment to your employee will in turn have to offer them slim commitment to you otherwise it would be deemed an unfair contract akin to modern slavery. If you want to get rid of people willy nilly you also have to accept they can walk away willy nilly. that's why the suggestion would be destined to fail. A couple of good games and they'd be off elsewhere, you'd never get anywhere. Agreed. If they wanted to alter player power, they should target agents. It would be nice to see max limits of agent fees or simple things like agent fees being covered by the player themselves. |
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Post by shakermaker on Dec 22, 2023 12:02:11 GMT
The only players willing to sign such a contract would be cast-offs or over the hill types desperate to just get into football by whatever means, like those from the Boot Dreams programme. Or you'd need a very savvy recruitment structure to spot players with potential that other clubs haven't and then sign them up to a more typical employment contract like what you and I have with our employers. The problem is, just as you can fire them whenever you like they too can also quit and sign for another club whenever they like. There would be constant churn which would disrupt team dynamics and the manager would struggle to implement an established system or style of play. You're still not thinking rationally. Any contract where you have slim commitment to your employee will in turn have to offer them slim commitment to you otherwise it would be deemed an unfair contract akin to modern slavery. If you want to get rid of people willy nilly you also have to accept they can walk away willy nilly. that's why the suggestion would be destined to fail. A couple of good games and they'd be off elsewhere, you'd never get anywhere. That's what I said above in bold. Putting players on employment contracts like us regular Joe Bloggs would bring too much disruption to squad dynamics. It would be fine if all other clubs followed suit, but most would actually prefer to take the risk of longer-term contracts. I would prefer to scout high potential talent from the lower leagues that no other club has, and put those players on a long contract (say 5 years) but without breaking the bank and from what those players were used to before, a massive pay day. That way you as a club are protected - if they're good, you can command a high transfer fee from the vultures. If they're shite, then it's a write-off that hasn't hurt the club. |
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 12:13:10 GMT
You're still not thinking rationally. Any contract where you have slim commitment to your employee will in turn have to offer them slim commitment to you otherwise it would be deemed an unfair contract akin to modern slavery. If you want to get rid of people willy nilly you also have to accept they can walk away willy nilly. that's why the suggestion would be destined to fail. A couple of good games and they'd be off elsewhere, you'd never get anywhere. That's what I said above in bold. Putting players on employment contracts like us regular Joe Bloggs would bring too much disruption to squad dynamics. It would be fine if all other clubs followed suit, but most would actually prefer to take the risk of longer-term contracts. I would prefer to scout high potential talent from the lower leagues that no other club has, and put those players on a long contract (say 5 years) but without breaking the bank and from what those players were used to before, a massive pay day. That way you as a club are protected - if they're good, you can command a high transfer fee from the vultures. If they're shite, then it's a write-off that hasn't hurt the club. I personally feel like all football contracts should have a mandatory release fee. I think a clubs ability to hold a players registration for a number of years is a restriction of their human rights. |
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Dec 22, 2023 12:25:17 GMT
I would make it my business to have a 1 on 1 with every new player, coach, manager to explain how I feel about the club, what it means to me, the standards of conduct that I expect, the standards of performance I expect.
I would not tread on a managers toes but on the footballing side we are talking a small organisation.i would have regular one on ones with all playing staff, maybe 1 a quarter, where I remind them of this, about the organisation they've joined, see how they are, how they feel about their performances etc, I'd update them personally about the direction I feel we're going in, what we are trying to achieve.
If I perceived a lack of effort or respect for the club, I'd speak to the head coach and ask him what he is going to do about it.
I'm not sure what Jon Coates does on this side of things but to me, there has been a lack of respect for the club, for the history of the club, from playing staff for years.
Often they're not fit, and don't show the necessary desire during a game. If they cared about the club, we would come back from behind to win a game more than what...4 times in 6 years?.
My first impression of Schumacher is that he is intelligent and proactive. Apart from MON, our recent managers have been thick. MON I thought was too laid back.
So I am hoping that communication, standards, professionalism, will improve under Schumacher. I have every confidence in him
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Post by shakermaker on Dec 22, 2023 12:26:16 GMT
That's what I said above in bold. Putting players on employment contracts like us regular Joe Bloggs would bring too much disruption to squad dynamics. It would be fine if all other clubs followed suit, but most would actually prefer to take the risk of longer-term contracts. I would prefer to scout high potential talent from the lower leagues that no other club has, and put those players on a long contract (say 5 years) but without breaking the bank and from what those players were used to before, a massive pay day. That way you as a club are protected - if they're good, you can command a high transfer fee from the vultures. If they're shite, then it's a write-off that hasn't hurt the club. I personally feel like all football contracts should have a mandatory release fee. I think a clubs ability to hold a players registration for a number of years is a restriction of their human rights. The problem with that is the bigger clubs can exercise those mandatory fees at a stroke, unlike those in the EFL. No-one is holding a gun to the head of those players signing long-term contracts and in fact for the player himself, it is a guaranteed salary for a large chunk of his career. If one of my players on those 5-year contracts was attracting interest from the vultures after a year or two, I would invite him to sign an extension on a higher salary (again, a rise that the player would be reasonably content with but that doesn't break the bank). |
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 12:34:30 GMT
I personally feel like all football contracts should have a mandatory release fee. I think a clubs ability to hold a players registration for a number of years is a restriction of their human rights. The problem with that is the bigger clubs can exercise those mandatory fees at a stroke, unlike those in the EFL. No-one is holding a gun to the head of those players signing long-term contracts and in fact for the player himself, it is a guaranteed salary for a large chunk of his career. If one of my players on those 5-year contracts was attracting interest from the vultures after a year or two, I would invite him to sign an extension on a higher salary (again, a rise that the player would be reasonably content with but that doesn't break the bank). It's a thing in some countries the release fee is set by some formula that involves the purchase price and wages and is fair to the registration holder. Doesn't matter whether they have a gun held to their head or anything else every contract should have a release mechanism that allows a parting of the ways without ongoing restrictions. It's simple human decency. |
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Post by wuzza on Dec 22, 2023 12:40:20 GMT
The problem with that is the bigger clubs can exercise those mandatory fees at a stroke, unlike those in the EFL. No-one is holding a gun to the head of those players signing long-term contracts and in fact for the player himself, it is a guaranteed salary for a large chunk of his career. If one of my players on those 5-year contracts was attracting interest from the vultures after a year or two, I would invite him to sign an extension on a higher salary (again, a rise that the player would be reasonably content with but that doesn't break the bank). It's a thing in some countries the release fee is set by some formula that involves the purchase price and wages and is fair to the registration holder. Doesn't matter whether they have a gun held to their head or anything else every contract should have a release mechanism that allows a parting of the ways without ongoing restrictions. It's simple human decency. Who remembers the good old ‘transfer tribunal’ - that worked well 😱😱😱 |
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Post by baconburger on Dec 22, 2023 12:46:39 GMT
It's a thing in some countries the release fee is set by some formula that involves the purchase price and wages and is fair to the registration holder. Doesn't matter whether they have a gun held to their head or anything else every contract should have a release mechanism that allows a parting of the ways without ongoing restrictions. It's simple human decency. Who remembers the good old ‘transfer tribunal’ - that worked well 😱😱😱 It was only for out of contract players an even worse restriction of personal freedom. |
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Post by stokiejoe on Dec 22, 2023 12:54:49 GMT
The best way to make a small fortune out of owning a football club is to start with a large fortune.
You need a daft amount of money, perhaps we should look at the German system where fans are shareholders and the managing league holds the title so it cannot be changed.
Have a good look at Coventry sometime who sold their ground and it was regretted by fans ever since.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Dec 22, 2023 13:05:19 GMT
If you owned a football club, there's no chance you wouldn't be a hybrid player/manager/owner. I wouldn’t own a football club. I like money. You actually write that as if you could own a football club if you wanted. Haha so deluded you are Bayern. Hows your mega yacht and helicopter doing? |
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Post by wuzza on Dec 22, 2023 13:11:44 GMT
Who remembers the good old ‘transfer tribunal’ - that worked well 😱😱😱 It was only for out of contract players an even worse restriction of personal freedom. It shafted the ‘selling’ club with monotonous regularity. |
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