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Post by slash on Jan 13, 2023 12:22:34 GMT
Still the best manager we've had in your lifetime. Just sayin' And yet he'll never be universally loved. That's got to sting- sorry buddy 😠 pulis was a very good championship manager, and a very wank premiership manager. that said, i'm not convinced that pulis could pull this team back into the prem with how vastly different the game is today than it was 20 years ago.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2023 12:23:01 GMT
Real issues at Stoke , hard to get to the bottom of it .
The on going financial situation of the Coates family , writing off any loss of any amount , for any failed project , doesn't help .
It's like Stoke are in some fantasy bubble , where the normal rules of football or even life , don't apply .
Come to Stoke , where success , mediocrity and failure are all handsomely rewarded . Anything and everything richly rewarded ( we are not joking , honest )
What kind of ethos is that ?
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Post by slash on Jan 13, 2023 12:27:06 GMT
Real issues at Stoke , hard to get to the bottom of it is it really though? we've been shit at recruitment since the end of the Hughes era, but even moreso now that we refuse to look further than the borders of England.
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Post by march4 on Jan 13, 2023 12:34:59 GMT
That wasn’t a problem to TP. Shame that winning games was around that time. No it wasn’t. He set out to win certain games and was largely successful in that aim. Other games he wasn’t bothered about.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 13, 2023 12:39:29 GMT
Shame that winning games was around that time. No it wasn’t. He set out to win certain games and was largely successful in that aim. Other games he wasn’t bothered about. Presumably the games he wasn't bothered about included 18 of our last 22 league games that season.
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Post by Pugsley on Jan 13, 2023 12:43:21 GMT
And yet he'll never be universally loved. That's got to sting- sorry buddy 😠 pulis was a very good championship manager, and a very wank premiership manager. that said, i'm not convinced that pulis could pull this team back into the prem with how vastly different the game is today than it was 20 years ago. Clearly not true. I'm not his greatest fan (ahem) but he was a good manager. Let's not talk about his methods though.
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Post by greenman on Jan 13, 2023 12:46:57 GMT
It's a problem now because we've got ourselves into a hole and can't magically spend our way out of bother. Tbh, it's a good job given the infrastructure but the lack of knowledge on the board's part is a huge problem. The fact Alex Neil is seemingly ripping everything up behind the scenes says a lot. We have been left behind, and it's quite shocking given our owners are supposedly forward thinking business people. Brighton saw a manager, two key players and another player have to retire in recent months. Yet have a plan to deal with all of that. If (when) Alex Neil leaves we won't have any plan. It'll be back to hoping for a new Pulis to pop up. Or the original one... I`m not sure John or Peter could be described as forward thinking business people, maybe Denise but not those two.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jan 13, 2023 12:48:50 GMT
No, it was because he was organising a party behind TP's back after being told not to I believe. No it wasn’t he’d agreed to them having it then got a shit on when we lost a game and tried to stop it and Beattie stood up to him. Don’t know why people feel the need to rewrite history. The man was a bully and a crook and a liar and got away with numerous offences that he was bang to rights for including the assault in question.
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Post by thevoid on Jan 13, 2023 13:17:06 GMT
Shame that winning games was around that time. No it wasn’t. He set out to win certain games and was largely successful in that aim. Other games he wasn’t bothered about. Oh, so the games he didn't win he just 'wasn't bothered about'? Interesting perspective What about the binary season where he spent 20+ games trying to prove a point?
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Post by skip on Jan 13, 2023 13:21:39 GMT
Shame that winning games was around that time. No it wasn’t. He set out to win certain games and was largely successful in that aim. Other games he wasn’t bothered about. That in itself is the most bizarre approach to take to football management because it puts more pressure onto the players for the games the managers thinks they should be winning. It's Pulis' cynicism in a nutshell and hardly the way to defend his methods.
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Jan 13, 2023 13:36:09 GMT
No it wasn’t. He set out to win certain games and was largely successful in that aim. Other games he wasn’t bothered about. That in itself is the most bizarre approach to take to football management because it puts more pressure onto the players for the games the managers thinks they should be winning. It's Pulis' cynicism in a nutshell and hardly the way to defend his methods. Second best manager in my lifetime after Sir Waddo, to say he was a bad premiership manager is nonsense he was a stubborn so and so and his tactics were much better suited to home games in the prem and we had some amazing memories that are now light years away given the garbage we have become. I'm looking forward to his Duck interview, I hope he is honest about the final six months or so and why he totally lost the plot.
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Post by hoppo96 on Jan 13, 2023 13:46:01 GMT
It's a problem now because we've got ourselves into a hole and can't magically spend our way out of bother. Tbh, it's a good job given the infrastructure but the lack of knowledge on the board's part is a huge problem. The fact Alex Neil is seemingly ripping everything up behind the scenes says a lot. We have been left behind, and it's quite shocking given our owners are supposedly forward thinking business people. Brighton saw a manager, two key players and another player have to retire in recent months. Yet have a plan to deal with all of that. If (when) Alex Neil leaves we won't have any plan. It'll be back to hoping for a new Pulis to pop up. Or the original one... I`m not sure John or Peter could be described as forward thinking business people, maybe Denise but not those two. yeah fair point. It's more Bet365, they saw a gap with the internet on the rise and took advantage of it. We still operate like we've just invented the telephone.
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Jan 13, 2023 14:08:13 GMT
come on we are all missing the obvious culprit KITSON!!! Personally I think it was the decline of Agent Sonko in the game. Who's our 00 Agent now?
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Post by Ryan_Shawjosh on Jan 13, 2023 14:39:19 GMT
Don't disagree but it's a completely different game and club from the time Pulis was in charge. He wouldn't have the same success with the club in it's current state and needing to deal with FFP. Oh yes he would, better than the current village idiot! I didn't say he wouldn't be better than AN or any of the managers we've had. But he wouldn't do as well as last time he was here.
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Post by chumley on Jan 13, 2023 16:43:39 GMT
Hughes commented that he would have a weekly meeet with Peter and John Coates, and the 1 question Hughes was always asked was " What do you need? If that's shit control of a club then christ knows what's good.. We got Billionaire local fans running the club who want to bring success and willing to pay to get it. Ask any other club if they would settle for that.... That set up has helped to create this situation though hasn’t it? [/quote You reckon ?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 13, 2023 16:57:50 GMT
That set up has helped to create this situation though hasn’t it? You reckon ? Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not.
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Post by chumley on Jan 13, 2023 18:03:22 GMT
No, Not at all , see what you mean but in all honesty we will never know. Ideal scenario would be to get whatever you need but could be to detriment by giving too much, which is what you may be saying,,, i think.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 13, 2023 18:09:58 GMT
No, Not at all , see what you mean but in all honesty we will never know. Ideal scenario would be to get whatever you need but could be to detriment by giving too much, which is what you may be saying,,, i think. Kind of, in so far as money alone doesn’t solve the problem. It’s more that just continually giving managers to have carte blanche to mould the club in their own image is creating an unholy mess that needs ripping up and starting again when they fail.
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Post by dirtclod on Jan 13, 2023 19:31:03 GMT
There could be an element of truth in it though. Hughes said that he'd never been in a job where the manager had so much to do before coming to Stoke. He was experienced at the top end of football as player and manager. The current manager is clearly struggling and has admitted that this is the first time he's not had a reaction after going into a club. There are a lot of variables in the current situation that might mask or replicate issues we don't know about but to dismiss what Jones is saying out of hand I think is a bit dangerous, even if you accept that he is over icing the cake somewhat. The evidence is there for us to see. Pro rata we must be the most underperforming football clubs in Europe spanning 5+ years now and there has to be a bigger reason for that. Spot On. Could our "bogeyman" "satanic cult" "what's all the fuss about" [Conspiracy Theory bulk party-package] of the past 7 years really just be as simple as the managers job-scope being out of control at Stoke? Too much business interfering with football? Probably what Jones was on about it being a "hard" job. (And to build up his media-reputation, given his current situation) Beginning to think it burned Hughes out. Then Lambert, Rowett, Jones, none of them would have been experienced with this "multitasking" at the time. Probably why MON had some off-pitch triumphs in clearing out the trash etc. but not much on the pitch. To me he's more of an "operations-type" than a coach. Short answer - yes. And during this, nobody addressed on-pitch coaching or health-sciences much as we ended up with a squad of leaderless, overfed, 45-minute endurance, injury-prone players who couldn't execute basic fundamentals and infestations like...Jese. (Football interrupting his "music career") And straight from Woes R Us: Recruitment - [The death-stench from each successive manager's recruitment-list] I think [and hope] that Ricky Martin/Coates/Neal will continue to completely restructure things so that we start moving more from a "manager" model to a "coach" model for our on-pitch exploits. Refine the scope of these jobs. THEN let the operations people continue to work on [pregnant pause] some sort of recruitment strategy, (Possible additional hire) club-operations, stadium management etc. while the manager completely concentrates on that next match and who/what he has available. (I too would like to see an actual honey-badger starting in our midfield) There should be multiple sets of eyes on other players deemed "prospects" and good multi-angle analysis done on them. (7 ways to Sunday at a minimum) A good opportunity for JC to learn some more football and operations things. At least it's something. However: This structure should be an enduring one that isn't dependent upon a manager who can move on suddenly (Like the incumbent) and take half your staff with him. The manager should be just a component of that structure that can be replaced if he goes into twit-mode (Starts beating his chest or something akin to that) with minimum disruption to the ongoing mission of the club. But we've been a rebel without a cause for most of this time and just keep cycling through the former manager's squads and bad recruitment decisions without a clear mission that fans can see. I recommend the club be given a dose of Narcan. I think in corporate-circles they call it "organization." Immediately
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Post by swampySCFC on Jan 14, 2023 17:51:14 GMT
Tony Pulis never had a problem Just saying ….. In fact he loved it. He made some big decisions the likes of which are not being made since relegation
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Post by swampySCFC on Jan 14, 2023 22:20:52 GMT
Tony Pulis never had a problem Just saying ….. Well he did when he was picking his squad for Valencia and shitting himself over Swansea and Norwich Just saying Just saying what? When will be ever near Valencia again in your lifetime
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Post by thevoid on Jan 14, 2023 23:28:33 GMT
Well he did when he was picking his squad for Valencia and shitting himself over Swansea and Norwich Just saying Just saying what? When will be ever near Valencia again in your lifetime Which kind of proves we should have taken a once in a lifetime fixture a bit more seriously? The bloke did what he does best, he shit it
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Post by metalhead on Jan 16, 2023 11:42:33 GMT
It's nonsense in my opinion. We're a great club to be the manager of, just because we're in a tough period doesn't means it's not an attractive proposition. Unless Scholes was holding a gun to Jones' head and telling him to sign Stephen Ward, Sam Vokes, Jordan Cousins and the like I'd suggest he's wrong......... It might be nonsense. But what does mad Nath have to gain from saying it, other than a small amount of face? He's already gone onto bigger things and if he keeps Southampton up, we will be a footnote on his resume.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Jan 16, 2023 12:53:44 GMT
It's nonsense in my opinion. We're a great club to be the manager of, just because we're in a tough period doesn't means it's not an attractive proposition. Unless Scholes was holding a gun to Jones' head and telling him to sign Stephen Ward, Sam Vokes, Jordan Cousins and the like I'd suggest he's wrong......... It might be nonsense. But what does mad Nath have to gain from saying it, other than a small amount of face? He's already gone onto bigger things and if he keeps Southampton up, we will be a footnote on his resume. Hes done well at 1 club, failed in a step up and is struggling in his second step up. Doesnt that mean theres a lot in for him right now to try to blame Stoke for that first failing to make success his pattern not an inability to step up?
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Post by flea79 on Jan 16, 2023 13:12:14 GMT
the behind the scenes running has been shambolic for a large number of years
How teflon kept his job for so long is incredible but thats only the surface of it
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2023 13:14:20 GMT
It might be nonsense. But what does mad Nath have to gain from saying it, other than a small amount of face? He's already gone onto bigger things and if he keeps Southampton up, we will be a footnote on his resume. Hes done well at 1 club, failed in a step up and is struggling in his second step up. Doesnt that mean theres a lot in for him right now to try to blame Stoke for that first failing to make success his pattern not an inability to step up? This would be a reasonable thought if it wasn't for how poor we've been under other managers who are successful elsewhere. Rowett, Jones, Neil have all come from and/or gone on to be decent managers at other clubs. There's certainly a big problem with how our club is run, and as many issues as the names above may have had, the main problems are higher up than the managers.
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Post by metalhead on Jan 16, 2023 13:35:58 GMT
It might be nonsense. But what does mad Nath have to gain from saying it, other than a small amount of face? He's already gone onto bigger things and if he keeps Southampton up, we will be a footnote on his resume. Hes done well at 1 club, failed in a step up and is struggling in his second step up. Doesnt that mean theres a lot in for him right now to try to blame Stoke for that first failing to make success his pattern not an inability to step up? Him doing well at one club nearly took them into the Premier League; them also being a very very poor club really. You could argue that was his step up and he succeeded. Mad Nath's current record at Southampton is played 5, lost 4, won 1. His record is slightly worse than that of his predecessor. However they've just beaten Palace in the third round of the FA Cup, Man City in the League Cup Quarter Final and beaten Everton in a key relegation match. I know where I'd rather be.
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