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Post by franklin on Nov 24, 2022 6:58:18 GMT
But surely that would not be a clear error so why are VAR getting involved that's the bit I don't understand plus how accurate is this tech I assume there is a + & - tolerance because nothing is 100% accurate.
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Post by mickmillslovechild on Nov 24, 2022 9:23:35 GMT
But surely that would not be a clear error so why are VAR getting involved that's the bit I don't understand plus how accurate is this tech I assume there is a + & - tolerance because nothing is 100% accurate. Foe offsides they are also using the in-ball chip (which uses AI) as well as VAR, hence us seeing such ridiculously tight calls as that tech can track offsides that are far tighter than any lino would spot. The clear and obvious error rule applies to fouls etc. not goals. All goals are checked regardless.
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Post by upthefud on Nov 24, 2022 9:39:11 GMT
If it was restricted to clear and obvious mistakes that'd be fine. The marginal offside decisions are ridiculous. There isn't a football fan around who wouldn't accept a "too close to call" decision one way or the other, eg that Ecuador v Qatar goal. I've no problems with the right calls being made for holding but they must be consistent, and that's the problem. As long as they are consistent, players will stop doing it. And that means having the balls to carry on making these decisions even when it's 0-0 in the final in the 89th minute. Consistency is key. I sort of know what you mean but at the same time, VAR doesn’t work unless it’s black and white. If you start saying, ‘that was pretty close, let it go’, you open the game up to refs favouring the big sides
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Post by tuum on Nov 26, 2022 13:17:02 GMT
Yep I’m one of those. We are turning football into a sterile computer game. Fuck VAR off completely, it destroys football You rather be moaning re a Maradona style decision and how you were robbed 40 years later? Ok Of course, and why not? The injustice of it all is what makes it interesting for the average fan. Arguing about dodgy decisions that go against you in the 94th minute is all part of the emotion of the game.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2022 13:40:07 GMT
You rather be moaning re a Maradona style decision and how you were robbed 40 years later? Ok Of course, and why not? The injustice of it all is what makes it interesting for the average fan. Arguing about dodgy decisions that go against you in the 94th minute is all part of the emotion of the game. It shouldn't be though. Not decisions like that after 4 years of getting that far in a tournament.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Nov 26, 2022 13:45:06 GMT
VAR
What a complete and utter load of bollocks
Destroying football
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Nov 26, 2022 13:47:36 GMT
Let’s freeze frame every single second to see if there’s the slightest infraction.
Computer game bollocks
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Post by starkiller on Nov 26, 2022 13:47:41 GMT
VARCE
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Post by tuum on Nov 26, 2022 14:01:07 GMT
Of course, and why not? The injustice of it all is what makes it interesting for the average fan. Arguing about dodgy decisions that go against you in the 94th minute is all part of the emotion of the game. It shouldn't be though. Not decisions like that after 4 years of getting that far in a tournament. I understand your point re. the WC where the rewards are much greater and I think the refs are more prone to bungs than the domestic leagues (who can forget S. Korea v Itly in 2002?).However, the standard of reffing at WC's has improved massively over my lifetime and the money they are paid now may make them less susceptible to outside influence. So, I can see an argument for VAR in those circumstances but I don't like it and wish we didn't have it. Just trust the refs to do their job. And, yes, I am still ok with England, or Stoke for that matter, being done by a dodgy late goal.
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Post by kustokie on Nov 26, 2022 14:32:19 GMT
VAR technology is not the problem. At times, those interpreting it have been boarder line incompetent. How millions of people can see a slow motion replay one way and five officials can see it completely differently is incomprehensible. Mind you, it wouldn’t be the first time FIFA has been involved in shady, brown-envelope-under-the-table shenanigans.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Nov 28, 2022 20:51:07 GMT
More VAR bollocks.
Absolutely ruining the game
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Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 28, 2022 20:59:14 GMT
More VAR bollocks. Absolutely ruining the game Got to be one of the worst VAR decisions ever! I know the ref doesn't HAVE to give it but how often do you see the ref overturn the VAR call?
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Nov 28, 2022 21:01:38 GMT
Oh fuck off VAR you vile piece of shit. It's solved nothing and we have arguably more controversy now than we did before.
It's time they sack off the madness.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2022 21:07:59 GMT
That was a shocker but the first time have said that in the tournament
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Post by franklin on Nov 29, 2022 7:35:10 GMT
More VAR bollocks. Absolutely ruining the game Got to be one of the worst VAR decisions ever! I know the ref doesn't HAVE to give it but how often do you see the ref overturn the VAR call? Once again spot on the ref should have stood his ground and said carry on ridiculous decision.
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Post by J-Roar on Nov 29, 2022 10:07:13 GMT
Got to be one of the worst VAR decisions ever! I know the ref doesn't HAVE to give it but how often do you see the ref overturn the VAR call? Once again spot on the ref should have stood his ground and said carry on ridiculous decision. The referees are shit scared of rocking the boat - 1 bad call against a 'big' nation and they are sent back home.
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Post by spitthedog on Nov 29, 2022 10:38:26 GMT
Let’s freeze frame every single second to see if there’s the slightest infraction. Computer game bollocks This is precisely the problem. If you freeze frame a ball against a hand it is nearly always going to look like a handball offence. Put it into real time you get a completely different picture. Why haven't the authorities thought this one out? With all the resources thrown in to it, this is massive oversight.
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Post by franklin on Nov 29, 2022 10:45:57 GMT
Once again spot on the ref should have stood his ground and said carry on ridiculous decision. The referees are shit scared of rocking the boat - 1 bad call against a 'big' nation and they are sent back home. Might be something in that however VAR should wind their necks in the ref was asked to go look at it he should have said no I've seen it and I've made a decision they have no business interfering in that way.
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Post by citynickscfc on Nov 29, 2022 11:08:48 GMT
Disagree with most on this thread. VAR checks if it's a goal or not, it can see more than the referee, thus if it's not a valid goal it was never a goal anyway. I would rather a fair victory than the referee doing whatever they wanted. There are still mistakes and improvements to be made but if something is offside and needs to be checked, so be it. If goals are disallowed, again so be it. You need to score legitimately. I'm enjoying the validation and decisions being explained.
Are you forgetting that referees never had to explain their decisions previously? Now we finally get reasons why and not corruption.
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Post by J-Roar on Nov 29, 2022 12:53:03 GMT
Disagree with most on this thread. VAR checks if it's a goal or not, it can see more than the referee, thus if it's not a valid goal it was never a goal anyway. I would rather a fair victory than the referee doing whatever they wanted. There are still mistakes and improvements to be made but if something is offside and needs to be checked, so be it. If goals are disallowed, again so be it. You need to score legitimately. I'm enjoying the validation and decisions being explained. Are you forgetting that referees never had to explain their decisions previously? Now we finally get reasons why and not corruption. Have you seen the 2 penalties Penaldo has been awarded? Both ludicrous
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Post by PotterLog on Nov 29, 2022 13:52:42 GMT
More VAR bollocks. Absolutely ruining the game Got to be one of the worst VAR decisions ever! I know the ref doesn't HAVE to give it but how often do you see the ref overturn the VAR call? As I understand it, when the ref goes to review it, hasn't the VAR basically deferred to him? So it's not a VAR "call" as such, more of a "you might want to have a look" thing. So in yesterday's case it was just a stone-cold terrible decision by the on-field ref. To quote the rule, he decided the position of the player's arm was "not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation". Which is mental.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Nov 29, 2022 14:03:00 GMT
Why do they pay the Ref and his assistants? If they can't get decisions right then pack it in.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 29, 2022 14:31:23 GMT
Got to be one of the worst VAR decisions ever! I know the ref doesn't HAVE to give it but how often do you see the ref overturn the VAR call? As I understand it, when the ref goes to review it, hasn't the VAR basically deferred to him? So it's not a VAR "call" as such, more of a "you might want to have a look" thing. So in yesterday's case it was just a stone-cold terrible decision by the on-field ref. To quote the rule, he decided the position of the player's arm was "not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation". Which is mental. That's right, that's why I said the referee doesn't HAVE to give it but if the VAR doesn't make the call, then the game continues and the ref would never have been called over to view the monitor in the first place. And the fact that referees always seem to be under way too much pressure to stick with their original call, has, to all intents and purposes, resulted in the VAR becoming the actual arbiter.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2022 14:52:25 GMT
For me ,I object to it , even when they get it right
A brilliant goal disallowed, because technically someone's little toe was offside in the build up . Even though that is not noticeable to the naked eye , watching the game in real time.
It's petty , it might be right but it is petty.
It's like the school ringing up to say your kid was two seconds late for school today.
Who cares ?
The offside rule , should be the goal stands , unless the ref deems it blatantly offside ( clear daylight between the striker and last defender ) .
Easy to understand and no need for VAR
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Post by Northy on Nov 29, 2022 15:03:54 GMT
It shouldn't be though. Not decisions like that after 4 years of getting that far in a tournament. I understand your point re. the WC where the rewards are much greater and I think the refs are more prone to bungs than the domestic leagues (who can forget S. Korea v Itly in 2002?).However, the standard of reffing at WC's has improved massively over my lifetime and the money they are paid now may make them less susceptible to outside influence. So, I can see an argument for VAR in those circumstances but I don't like it and wish we didn't have it. Just trust the refs to do their job. And, yes, I am still ok with England, or Stoke for that matter, being done by a dodgy late goal. The S. Korea Spain Game in 2002 was even more dodgy.
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Post by Veritas on Nov 29, 2022 15:14:50 GMT
For me ,I object to it , even when they get it right A brilliant goal disallowed, because technically someone's little toe was offside in the build up . Even though that is not noticeable to the naked eye , watching the game in real time. It's petty , it might be right but it is petty. It's like the school ringing up to say your kid was two seconds late for school today. Who cares ? The offside rule , should be the goal stands , unless the ref deems it blatantly offside ( clear daylight between the striker and last defender ) . Easy to understand and no need for VAR But then VAR would be required to see if it was actually clear daylight at yje point of the pass. As soon as you have any line there will be highly marginal decisions.
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Post by tuum on Nov 29, 2022 15:18:15 GMT
I understand your point re. the WC where the rewards are much greater and I think the refs are more prone to bungs than the domestic leagues (who can forget S. Korea v Itly in 2002?).However, the standard of reffing at WC's has improved massively over my lifetime and the money they are paid now may make them less susceptible to outside influence. So, I can see an argument for VAR in those circumstances but I don't like it and wish we didn't have it. Just trust the refs to do their job. And, yes, I am still ok with England, or Stoke for that matter, being done by a dodgy late goal. The S. Korea Spain Game in 2002 was even more dodgy. Not being a massive international football fan,Ithought I made a mistake and got Italy mixed up with Spain so I googled it.Turns out the ref for the Italy game had form.10 years ago,he also served 2.5years in jail in the US for trying to smuggle 6kg of heroin through JFK hidden in his underpants.
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Post by Olgrligm on Nov 29, 2022 15:20:00 GMT
For me ,I object to it , even when they get it right A brilliant goal disallowed, because technically someone's little toe was offside in the build up . Even though that is not noticeable to the naked eye , watching the game in real time. It's petty , it might be right but it is petty. It's like the school ringing up to say your kid was two seconds late for school today. Who cares ? The offside rule , should be the goal stands , unless the ref deems it blatantly offside ( clear daylight between the striker and last defender ) . Easy to understand and no need for VAR But then VAR would be required to see if it was actually clear daylight at yje point of the pass. As soon as you have any line there will be highly marginal decisions. True, but there's then some skill involved from the defender and attacker, rather than the current system which basically makes it random chance. That's without getting into a discussion on who determines which frame of the image is the point that the ball was released.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 29, 2022 15:23:18 GMT
Interesting decision last night in the Portugal Uruguay game for the penalty at the end.
While the defender didn't mean to handle the ball, his side did get an advantage from his doing so. The pundits were furious about it.
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Post by tejstokie on Nov 30, 2022 3:59:40 GMT
Interesting decision last night in the Portugal Uruguay game for the penalty at the end. While the defender didn't mean to handle the ball, his side did get an advantage from his doing so. The pundits were furious about it. VAR and referee should be mic'd like Rugby. Joke it isn't with such corruption and bias in the game. Kills it for me.
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