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Post by Trouserdog on Nov 6, 2022 18:19:17 GMT
Only a few weeks ago, we were dreaming about a rise up the table- now it looks pretty clear that we should be worrying about the other end of it.
So who do you think are the teams we need to finish above?
Rotherham: looked poor against us despite the result. The worst side in the league on Xg.
Hull: a -14 GD spells trouble. Also bottom 3 on Xg. They lost to us 0-3. This alone means they must be incredibly shit.
Wigan: Rumours of more financial trouble and another side who looked poor against us according to those who saw the game. (I couldn't be arsed!)
Blackpool: Another side with poor Xg and lost their one good player in the summer window.
Huddersfield: Getting cut adrift a bit at the bottom, and I know someone who supports them- he says they're nailed on to go down.
No chance Middlesbrough or West Brom will be down there at the end of the season- both are top 6 on Xg and Boro looked a quality side against us (not hard I know). West Brom been very unlucky in a lot of games by all accounts. That would have us finishing 19th.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2022 18:30:06 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation.
I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now.
We do nothing well.
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Post by chigstoke on Nov 6, 2022 18:31:39 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. If I were the manager of any of the bottom teams, I'd be rubbing my hands together at the thought of playing Stoke City right now. |
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Post by Fred Merger on Nov 6, 2022 18:32:34 GMT
We are looking poor at this moment in time,but a couple of upgrades in January could make a big difference, ie an experienced goalkeeper and a left sided cb and maybe a decent number 9 could turn us into a top 10 side by the end of the season IF we do our research and bring in the right type of players.
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Post by Block 26 on Nov 6, 2022 18:33:43 GMT
I think that Huddersfield, Wigan & Hull will go down this year. With Rotherham & Blackpool in the scrap.
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Post by haway on Nov 6, 2022 18:51:32 GMT
It’s a silly league, it’s so tight.
Only 9 points separate 23rd and 7th.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2022 19:00:27 GMT
Barnstoneworth Utd but if Alex Neil carries on it won't be for long
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Post by cheadlepotter on Nov 6, 2022 19:14:44 GMT
I’ve only watched the home games this season but only Watford have looked better than us. A half decent keeper and we’d be top half but keep with Bursik and we will be in a relegation fight.
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Post by bagnallboothen on Nov 6, 2022 19:30:01 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. We did something well enough 4 days ago to beat one of the teams who are worse than us. The same as we did at Hull a month or so ago. We're terrible but thankfully there's worse. |
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Post by kev1060 on Nov 6, 2022 20:01:49 GMT
I agree with those 5, & would add Cardiff, Brizzle City & despite their start Reading into the mix that we need to finish above.
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Post by chuckrocky on Nov 6, 2022 20:09:15 GMT
It’s a mental league. We are absolutely dire but have taken half of our 22 points off the current top 6.
Our away form and a couple of good purchases in the January window should see us safe without much drama.
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Post by march4 on Nov 6, 2022 20:14:07 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. Somehow, Wigan did. |
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Nov 6, 2022 21:22:26 GMT
PNE looked really poor against us,yet they are in the top 6, same for Sheff Utd and Blackburn.
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Post by swampySCFC on Nov 6, 2022 21:23:33 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. If I were the manager of any of the bottom teams, I'd be rubbing my hands together at the thought of playing Stoke City right now. This |
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Post by robwahlmann on Nov 6, 2022 21:44:45 GMT
Many, but they still seem to pick up more points than us!  |
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Post by chuckrocky on Nov 6, 2022 22:03:07 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. If I were the manager of any of the bottom teams, I'd be rubbing my hands together at the thought of playing Stoke City right now. Our record against the teams below us is pretty good, only Huddersfield have beaten us. Our record against the top 6 is also very good, only Norwich have beaten us. It’s the mid-table sides we seem to struggle against. We haven’t managed beat a side currently placed between 7th and 17th. |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Nov 6, 2022 22:18:00 GMT
No chance Middlesbrough or West Brom will be down there at the end of the season- both are top 6 on Xg and Boro looked a quality side against us (not hard I know). West Brom been very unlucky in a lot of games by all accounts. That would have us finishing 19th. We're 3rd on xG so on that basis should be fine too. I've been saying this a lot the last few years and it's yet to happen, but we largely need some luck. We've been terrible at times since Neil joined, but football often runs on such small margins, we don't need a lot to change. And i f Powell, Souttar and Tymon can remain fit after the World Cup, and Neil makes a couple of key signings in January, I still believe we'll be playoff contenders. |
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Post by scfcno1fan on Nov 6, 2022 22:29:39 GMT
No chance Middlesbrough or West Brom will be down there at the end of the season- both are top 6 on Xg and Boro looked a quality side against us (not hard I know). West Brom been very unlucky in a lot of games by all accounts. That would have us finishing 19th. We're 3rd on xG so on that basis should be fine too. I've been saying this a lot the last few years and it's yet to happen, but we largely need some luck. We've been terrible at times since Neil joined, but football often runs on such small margins, we don't need a lot to change. And i f Powell, Souttar and Tymon can remain fit after the World Cup, and Neil makes a couple of key signings in January, I still believe we'll be playoff contenders. God knows how we’re 3rd. Just shows stats can’t be trusted. |
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Post by Trouserdog on Nov 7, 2022 6:37:05 GMT
We're 3rd on xG so on that basis should be fine too. I've been saying this a lot the last few years and it's yet to happen, but we largely need some luck. We've been terrible at times since Neil joined, but football often runs on such small margins, we don't need a lot to change. And i f Powell, Souttar and Tymon can remain fit after the World Cup, and Neil makes a couple of key signings in January, I still believe we'll be playoff contenders. God knows how we’re 3rd. Just shows stats can’t be trusted. We're around 8-10th according to most sites (for overall Xg performance). Given some of the games we've dominated but not won, I'd say that's probably correct. |
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Post by theonlooker on Nov 7, 2022 7:40:46 GMT
Our xG will surely drop and put pressure on the current forwards to be more efficient if the manager carries out his threat to return to Binaryball.
I'm not too convinced it will work, which might render this comparison a little bit useless.
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Post by metalhead on Nov 7, 2022 8:08:17 GMT
We have the look of a team heading for relegation. I can't imagine there being a team in this league who look worse than we do right now. We do nothing well. We're a team turning potential draws into defeats. We can't buy a win at home. We pick up points away but it's inconsistent. Like you said, all the right ingredients for a fresh relegation challenge. It's absolutely nailed on right now. |
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Post by nottsover60 on Nov 7, 2022 8:27:20 GMT
I would say I have seen very few teams who are better than us this season, perhaps Middlesborough are the only team I've seen at Stoke. As a team we can be as good as anyone. Our problem is individual players who make mistakes be it giving the ball away, missing an easy chance, losing their player at a corner, not competing properly for a ball they should win or at least make difficult for the opposition to win and most of all having no confidence in their ability to pull a goal back once they concede. If we take the lead we hold on to it and play as well as anyone.
I have said before a sport psychologist is what they need more than any coach. The ability is there the mental attitude is weak.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2022 9:48:16 GMT
I would say I have seen very few teams who are better than us this season, perhaps Middlesborough are the only team I've seen at Stoke. As a team we can be as good as anyone. Our problem is individual players who make mistakes be it giving the ball away, missing an easy chance, losing their player at a corner, not competing properly for a ball they should win or at least make difficult for the opposition to win and most of all having no confidence in their ability to pull a goal back once they concede. If we take the lead we hold on to it and play as well as anyone. I have said before a sport psychologist is what they need more than any coach. The ability is there the mental attitude is weak. Middlesbrough absolutely annihilated us but we somehow scummed a 2-2 draw. Even Watford who thrashed us arguably weren’t as dominant. |
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Post by Stretfordpotterer on Nov 7, 2022 10:25:00 GMT
It's difficult to reconcile the shit we churn out most weeks with the fact that going in to Saturdays game, the top 5 was
Sheff Utd - won at home
Burnley - drew away
Blackburn - won away
QPR - drew away
Preston - won away
As much as i find it difficult to warm to any of these players i can't help but feel this has been and continues to be a managerial/psychological issue.
2 of our 6 wins have come on the very odd occasions we have played 4 at the back and were comfortably our best two performances.
The PNE came shows as 5 at the back when you look at the line up but we played a lot of it with 4 as Fosu was really high on the left and Sterling tucked in on the right.
We need to ditch 5 at the back, especially at home, i just fail to understand what this manager or the previous manager is seeing that everyone with functioning pair of eyes cannot. When we play 5 at the back, we are largely shit, when we play 4 at the back, we are not.
I just don't want to see 3 centre halves on the pitch, ever. It's a shit formation unless you are good enough to overwhelm the opposition. We are not.
You can see the fear whenever we play it, the centre halves don't want the ball so they rush passes across the line and make stupid mistakes. The opposition invariable packs the midfield by dropping a striker into midfield and playing narrow meaning we cannot, or don't have the confidence to play through the middle. Bakers, Smallbone, Laurent, Powell, whoever is in the middle, have no time and no space to play meanwhile a superfluous centre back stands around doing nothing except creating the potential for confusion. We try to go down the sides, the opposition largely let us do that knowing that we will play all day and not win a header in the opposition box.
When Thordarson tried to foist wing backs on us the stands were hollering 4-4-2 at him within a few weeks.
Go 4-4-2 and simplify it, i think we have the players for it, or 4-3-3 at home. Anything, just not this fucking shit sandwich.
Otherwise, i don't think we go down....but we'll be way to close for comfort and will be relying on continuing to take points off the better teams who open up a bit more.
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Post by stokemark on Nov 7, 2022 11:19:41 GMT
It's difficult to reconcile the shit we churn out most weeks with the fact that going in to Saturdays game, the top 5 was Sheff Utd - won at home Burnley - drew away Blackburn - won away QPR - drew away Preston - won away As much as i find it difficult to warm to any of these players i can't help but feel this has been and continues to be a managerial/psychological issue. 2 of our 6 wins have come on the very odd occasions we have played 4 at the back and were comfortably our best two performances. The PNE came shows as 5 at the back when you look at the line up but we played a lot of it with 4 as Fosu was really high on the left and Sterling tucked in on the right. We need to ditch 5 at the back, especially at home, i just fail to understand what this manager or the previous manager is seeing that everyone with functioning pair of eyes cannot. When we play 5 at the back, we are largely shit, when we play 4 at the back, we are not. I just don't want to see 3 centre halves on the pitch, ever. It's a shit formation unless you are good enough to overwhelm the opposition. We are not. You can see the fear whenever we play it, the centre halves don't want the ball so they rush passes across the line and make stupid mistakes. The opposition invariable packs the midfield by dropping a striker into midfield and playing narrow meaning we cannot, or don't have the confidence to play through the middle. Bakers, Smallbone, Laurent, Powell, whoever is in the middle, have no time and no space to play meanwhile a superfluous centre back stands around doing nothing except creating the potential for confusion. We try to go down the sides, the opposition largely let us do that knowing that we will play all day and not win a header in the opposition box. When Thordarson tried to foist wing backs on us the stands were hollering 4-4-2 at him within a few weeks. Go 4-4-2 and simplify it, i think we have the players for it, or 4-3-3 at home. Anything, just not this fucking shit sandwich. Otherwise, i don't think we go down....but we'll be way to close for comfort and will be relying on continuing to take points off the better teams who open up a bit more. Nice post and overall agree I do think that a huge part of the problem is that recruitment has been based on playing 5 at the back and we lack the personnel to play any other formation (which I think has led to Neil's approach to seek the best outcomes based on what we have). We dont have a decent centre back pairing that can be relied on not to concede / make errors, we lack quality defensive midfield options to protect a back 4 and the biggest issue of all (for me) is that we do not have a goalkeeper that can be relied on. Where I do disagree with you is that this is not a managerial / psychological issue beyond the fact that we dont win enough football matches to lift confidence off the floor. It is a managerial issue only in that the utter joke of a decision to keep MON, allow him to make the signings he did to then sack him remains with the Board who are 100% responsible for this shit show. |
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Post by Stretfordpotterer on Nov 7, 2022 11:39:09 GMT
It's difficult to reconcile the shit we churn out most weeks with the fact that going in to Saturdays game, the top 5 was Sheff Utd - won at home Burnley - drew away Blackburn - won away QPR - drew away Preston - won away As much as i find it difficult to warm to any of these players i can't help but feel this has been and continues to be a managerial/psychological issue. 2 of our 6 wins have come on the very odd occasions we have played 4 at the back and were comfortably our best two performances. The PNE came shows as 5 at the back when you look at the line up but we played a lot of it with 4 as Fosu was really high on the left and Sterling tucked in on the right. We need to ditch 5 at the back, especially at home, i just fail to understand what this manager or the previous manager is seeing that everyone with functioning pair of eyes cannot. When we play 5 at the back, we are largely shit, when we play 4 at the back, we are not. I just don't want to see 3 centre halves on the pitch, ever. It's a shit formation unless you are good enough to overwhelm the opposition. We are not. You can see the fear whenever we play it, the centre halves don't want the ball so they rush passes across the line and make stupid mistakes. The opposition invariable packs the midfield by dropping a striker into midfield and playing narrow meaning we cannot, or don't have the confidence to play through the middle. Bakers, Smallbone, Laurent, Powell, whoever is in the middle, have no time and no space to play meanwhile a superfluous centre back stands around doing nothing except creating the potential for confusion. We try to go down the sides, the opposition largely let us do that knowing that we will play all day and not win a header in the opposition box. When Thordarson tried to foist wing backs on us the stands were hollering 4-4-2 at him within a few weeks. Go 4-4-2 and simplify it, i think we have the players for it, or 4-3-3 at home. Anything, just not this fucking shit sandwich. Otherwise, i don't think we go down....but we'll be way to close for comfort and will be relying on continuing to take points off the better teams who open up a bit more. Nice post and overall agree I do think that a huge part of the problem is that recruitment has been based on playing 5 at the back and we lack the personnel to play any other formation (which I think has led to Neil's approach to seek the best outcomes based on what we have). We dont have a decent centre back pairing that can be relied on not to concede / make errors, we lack quality defensive midfield options to protect a back 4 and the biggest issue of all (for me) is that we do not have a goalkeeper that can be relied on. Where I do disagree with you is that this is not a managerial / psychological issue beyond the fact that we dont win enough football matches to lift confidence off the floor. It is a managerial issue only in that the utter joke of a decision to keep MON, allow him to make the signings he did to then sack him remains with the Board who are 100% responsible for this shit show. I'd say the performances with 4 at the back, and not just this year, under o'Neill as well, are very much at odds with the assertion that the squad make up constrains us to 5 at the back. I do think that the performances of certain players, in isolated games, namely Tymon and Now Sterling/Clarke/Fosu, has given rise to the view within the management team that it's the only way to get the best out of our best players. But when you're only getting one of those performance 1 game in 5, and the formation is detrimental to everyone else other than your wing backs, it's completely self defeating. |
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Post by victoria on Nov 7, 2022 11:44:41 GMT
When we are the best 5th team in the league on away results. Then are many teams worse than us?
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Post by raythesailor on Nov 7, 2022 11:48:04 GMT
Most of them are in many ways worse or no better than us.
We just can’t beat them 😏
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Post by chiswickpotter on Nov 7, 2022 13:10:46 GMT
God knows how we’re 3rd. Just shows stats can’t be trusted. We're around 8-10th according to most sites (for overall Xg performance). Given some of the games we've dominated but not won, I'd say that's probably correct. Although the analyst who regularly posts on here did a piece for The Sentinel which suggested our attacking xG is driven by a high volume of poor chances suggesting we shoot form he wrong places. Powell by contrast tends to create and take a smaller number of high quality chances. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2022 13:36:33 GMT
I think some of the teams in div1 & 2 might be worse than us although we would find a way to lose to them I'm sure.
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