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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 9:38:24 GMT
It's not our decision though. And within that we've hampered his development with countless loans, countless 30 year olds etc. There is room for both. We have chosen not to make that room and give a 39 and 33 year old the chance instead. And probably a loan too. That’s complete speculation though. We don’t know that it was not our decision, could be that we offered a lowly sum on a short contract because we weren’t that fussed, he and his agent wanted more? 🤷♂️ he’s had 1 loan, not countless, and that involved 4 games for Mansfield in League 2. He’s valued at £45k - let’s not talk bollox that we’ve lost some Uber promising youngster due to mis-management just as a way to fuel your on going agenda Bayern. To me it’s also massively telling that he went on loan to local Mansfield and flopped and now he’s gone oh so far in heading to the Vale. Possibly a kid who might have rather narrow/local viewpoint on life and small footballing aspirations if he’s only staying local? Out of all the possible clubs you could go to for the best development, contract and first team opportunities and all so happens to be perfect for for the closest club to us…. 🤔 Flopped? They wanted him back.
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Post by potterburt on Jul 26, 2022 9:39:12 GMT
That’s complete speculation though. We don’t know that it was not our decision, could be that we offered a lowly sum on a short contract because we weren’t that fussed, he and his agent wanted more? 🤷♂️ he’s had 1 loan, not countless, and that involved 4 games for Mansfield in League 2. He’s valued at £45k - let’s not talk bollox that we’ve lost some Uber promising youngster due to mis-management just as a way to fuel your on going agenda Bayern. To me it’s also massively telling that he went on loan to local Mansfield and flopped and now he’s gone oh so far in heading to the Vale. Possibly a kid who might have rather narrow/local viewpoint on life and small footballing aspirations if he’s only staying local? Out of all the possible clubs you could go to for the best development, contract and first team opportunities and all so happens to be perfect for for the closest club to us…. 🤔 Flopped? They wanted him back. To carry on being back up and sit on the bench? 👏
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Post by themistocles on Jul 26, 2022 9:39:12 GMT
The amount of youngsters MON falls out with worrying.
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Post by jokker on Jul 26, 2022 9:40:05 GMT
He was barely used last season, even after he'd got a couple of games reasonably late on in dead rubbers. He was soon not making the bench again. Could be as simple as MON not rating him, and Forrester backing himself to kickstart his career and not wanting jam tomorrow, but making a real start on a proper career at the age of 21. Can't really blame him Not according to the same Sentinel story you're quoting from, where O'Neill speaks of him in glowing terms, so either the manager is a two faced liar, or as you suggest, Forrester has realised that with more incoming central defenders the manager is never going to make him first choice. Or both. He's 21 and he can't be an eternal talent. He has to play first team football now. It's Stoke's loss and Port Vale's gain. I wonder what the Coates family will be thinking about yet another academy prospect leaving. I guess they'll have to trust the manager's instincts. Again.
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Post by themistocles on Jul 26, 2022 9:40:22 GMT
Flopped? They wanted him back. To carry on being back up and sit on the bench? 👏 " that's just complete speculation "
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Post by potterburt on Jul 26, 2022 9:40:43 GMT
The amount of youngsters MON falls out with worrying. The amount of youngsters he’s given opportunities to and established into the first team as well as trying to bring in young loaners is so much more than any of the managers we’ve had put together in the past 15-20 years
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 9:40:49 GMT
The amount of youngsters MON falls out with worrying. Can you name them? I can remember 5 or 6 signing new contracts and a couple who let's be honest would get game time leaving
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 9:40:49 GMT
Flopped? They wanted him back. To carry on being back up and sit on the bench? 👏 Total speculation
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Post by themistocles on Jul 26, 2022 9:43:01 GMT
The amount of youngsters MON falls out with worrying. The amount of youngsters he’s given opportunities to and established into the first team as well as trying to bring in young loaners is so much more than any of the managers we’ve had put together in the past 15-20 years Have we had the standard of youngsters we have now anytime in the past 15-20 years?
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Post by jhtstokie on Jul 26, 2022 9:43:33 GMT
Get rid of a good upcoming talent in Forrester to them lot but bring in a 33 year old Aden flint in😂 can’t get my head around this one at all.
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Post by bunnyscfc on Jul 26, 2022 9:44:10 GMT
At the end of the day, the most worrying thing for me is that last season the manager thought more of James Chester than he did Will Forrester. That tells me a lot.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 9:45:23 GMT
To carry on being back up and sit on the bench? 👏 Total speculation Unlike Martinez being a huge fan of Verlinden and only a matter of time before he was in the Belgian squad.
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Post by jokker on Jul 26, 2022 9:45:36 GMT
Looked stand out at U23 and a real leader. I never thought he bought that to the Seniors but it was bit part and not the easiest way to stake a claim. Probably right for all parties. Well he was man of the match (by Sky, not the Sentinel) on his debut and he scored the winning goal that day. So I'd say he brought exactly that to the team.
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Post by Batfink on Jul 26, 2022 9:45:56 GMT
The amount of youngsters MON falls out with worrying. It would undoubtedly be upsetting to be told by the manager that he doesn’t think you cut the mustard just yet. Egos will then sometimes get in the way (especially when they see other youngsters higher up the pecking order). Do we actually know if it is anything more than this?
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Post by bagnallboothen on Jul 26, 2022 9:46:00 GMT
I keep being told he's rejected a new deal but I also keep being told he's a free agent, by someone at the Vale. There's nothing to suggest he was released, he traveled and played in Ireland a couple of weeks ago. I find both parts of their story a bit odd. Like FM has said the last public thing re his contract said it expired at the end of last season. But there was nothing to suggest it did? So I presumed and it is a presumption we had an option and extended that because as you say he’s been involved in pre season and wasn’t released. Maybe it was up and we were trying to convince him to stay? Again that’s a guess. Which would make sense if he'd played more than 45 minutes at Cork. Was hardly going to twist his arm was it.
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Post by potterburt on Jul 26, 2022 9:46:23 GMT
To carry on being back up and sit on the bench? 👏 Total speculation But wait, speculation is the only realm you know how to discuss and from where you incessantly bang on from… This gonna be another Verlinden for you? Your whole point you are trying to make is that Forrester was due to be a great talent, better than Soutts…. But due to poor mismanagement then that won’t nessecerily be the case and now we’ve ‘lost’ a good youngster….. Can you get any more bullshit speculative than that?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 9:47:01 GMT
Get rid of a good upcoming talent in Forrester to them lot but bring in a 33 year old Aden flint in😂 can’t get my head around this one at all. Or maybe the manager who brought Collins and Souttar through to the first team and sees him every day realised that he isn't good enough.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 9:47:32 GMT
Like FM has said the last public thing re his contract said it expired at the end of last season. But there was nothing to suggest it did? So I presumed and it is a presumption we had an option and extended that because as you say he’s been involved in pre season and wasn’t released. Maybe it was up and we were trying to convince him to stay? Again that’s a guess. Which would make sense if he'd played more than 45 minutes at Cork. Was hardly going to twist his arm was it. The relationship was broke before then.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 9:48:23 GMT
Total speculation But wait, speculation is the only realm you know how to discuss and from where you incessantly bang on from… This gonna be another Verlinden for you? Your whole point you are trying to make is that Forrester was due to be a great talent, better than Soutts…. But due to poor mismanagement then that won’t nessecerily be the case and now we’ve ‘lost’ a good youngster….. Can you get any more bullshit speculative than that? I've said he could be. What is it with people on here not understanding basic English?
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Post by Batfink on Jul 26, 2022 9:48:52 GMT
Like FM has said the last public thing re his contract said it expired at the end of last season. But there was nothing to suggest it did? So I presumed and it is a presumption we had an option and extended that because as you say he’s been involved in pre season and wasn’t released. Maybe it was up and we were trying to convince him to stay? Again that’s a guess. Which would make sense if he'd played more than 45 minutes at Cork. Was hardly going to twist his arm was it. Alternatively, we may have not offered him a contract, but let him stay as a favour until he found something (not to convince him). Do we actually know?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 9:49:54 GMT
Total speculation But wait, speculation is the only realm you know how to discuss and from where you incessantly bang on from… This gonna be another Verlinden for you? Your whole point you are trying to make is that Forrester was due to be a great talent, better than Soutts…. But due to poor mismanagement then that won’t nessecerily be the case and now we’ve ‘lost’ a good youngster….. Can you get any more bullshit speculative than that? All these fantastic young players that leave go on to great things of course despite the same person moaning like an old woman every time they go.
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Post by jokker on Jul 26, 2022 9:51:18 GMT
Get rid of a good upcoming talent in Forrester to them lot but bring in a 33 year old Aden flint in😂 can’t get my head around this one at all. Or maybe the manager who brought Collins through to the first team Nathan Jones did.
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Post by slicko on Jul 26, 2022 9:51:31 GMT
Trust that it’s a correct decision by a team of managers who see his daily performance and do not discount a buy-back pre-contract.
Give the club some credit.
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Post by foxysgloves on Jul 26, 2022 9:54:08 GMT
But wait, speculation is the only realm you know how to discuss and from where you incessantly bang on from… This gonna be another Verlinden for you? Your whole point you are trying to make is that Forrester was due to be a great talent, better than Soutts…. But due to poor mismanagement then that won’t nessecerily be the case and now we’ve ‘lost’ a good youngster….. Can you get any more bullshit speculative than that? I've said he could be. What is it with people on here not understanding basic English? No. But you did say this. “Forrester is ready for Champo football. Souttar wasn't at that point.” Which is complete bullshit. If Forrester is so ready where are all the Championship clubs beating our door down? You create these weird obsessions with certain players and use them to fuel your anti-manager agenda. It’s very strange but has become so predictable.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 9:57:04 GMT
I've said he could be. What is it with people on here not understanding basic English? No. But you did say this. “Forrester is ready for Champo football. Souttar wasn't at that point.” Which is complete bullshit. If Forrester is so ready where are all the Championship clubs beating our door down? You create these weird obsessions with certain players and use them to fuel your anti-manager agenda. It’s very strange but has become so predictable. No it's not. At the same age Forrester is better. Souttar then sky rocketed after that second loan and I've even said development isn't linear so it doesn't necessarily mean that Forrester would become a better player. The only weird thing is focussing on one sole post when there's more that paint the full picture but that doesn't fit your bullshit attacks on me. It's fucking tiresome.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2022 9:57:35 GMT
Or maybe the manager who brought Collins through to the first team Nathan Jones did. Collins and Campbell were different players under that clown. Campbell went a dozen odd games without a goal and Collins and Souttar were brought in gradually in the cups and looked quality when so many asking to just chuck them in. Both signed up of course as did Campbell. This nonsense of youngsters falling out with MON is a myth and nothing to back it up. Can criticise MON but one mistake he simply hasn't made is handling the youngsters. Just more Bayern nonsense. Not every young player is a great prospect, destined for great things because they're young. No one can name a youngster we let go in recent times who proved us wrong as there simply isn't one
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 10:00:18 GMT
Collins and Campbell were different players under that clown. Campbell went a dozen odd games without a goal and Collins and Souttar were brough in gradually in the cups and looked quality when so many asking to just chuck them in. Both signed up of course as did Campbell. This nonsense if youngsters falling out with MON is a myth and nothing to back it up. Can criticise MON but one mistake he dplybhadnt made is handling the youngsters. Just more Bayern nonsense. Not every young player is s great prospect, destined for great things because they're young. And I don't say they are. That's just bollocks. We just happen to have had a very good crop of young players who with the right wind can do lots in the game. Taylor, Souttar and Forrester all with the right wind should be PL footballers. It has fuck all to do with their age. That's just a lazy bullshit argument made up by people who can't think of anything original to say. It's boring.
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Post by foxysgloves on Jul 26, 2022 10:03:06 GMT
No. But you did say this. “Forrester is ready for Champo football. Souttar wasn't at that point.” Which is complete bullshit. If Forrester is so ready where are all the Championship clubs beating our door down? You create these weird obsessions with certain players and use them to fuel your anti-manager agenda. It’s very strange but has become so predictable. No it's not. At the same age Forrester is better. Souttar then sky rocketed after that second loan and I've even said development isn't linear so it doesn't necessarily mean that Forrester would become a better player. The only weird thing is focussing on one sole post when there's more that paint the full picture but that doesn't fit your bullshit attacks on me. It's fucking tiresome. It’s not just one post. It’s literally thousands. Tiresome indeed.
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Post by warringtonstokie on Jul 26, 2022 10:03:31 GMT
The mismanagement of young players under MON is becoming a growing and concerning trend.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 26, 2022 10:04:40 GMT
No it's not. At the same age Forrester is better. Souttar then sky rocketed after that second loan and I've even said development isn't linear so it doesn't necessarily mean that Forrester would become a better player. The only weird thing is focussing on one sole post when there's more that paint the full picture but that doesn't fit your bullshit attacks on me. It's fucking tiresome. It’s not just one post. It’s literally thousands. Tiresome indeed. Read them then and get the full picture before spouting off about one isolated post.
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