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Post by Bod on Jul 20, 2022 20:22:04 GMT
I’m disappointed in G all tour. Not prepared to dig in and take the odd risk I would be surprised if he ever gets to lead a team into a grand tour again I agree, he's been playing it safe all Tour, and certainly ever since he got 3rd place in the G.C. I'm surprised he's actually been able to get 3rd but had hoped he'd at least have made one or two serious attacks. He doesn’t have it in him. I don’t think Thomas is physically incapable of attacking to that extent. He is comfortably the third best rider in the race, but he doesn’t possess the engine to make an attack. I don’t think it’s directly related to riding conservatively either; I just don’t think he could do it even if he wanted to. Stage was interesting for what was happening beyond third place but the ‘battle’ at the front was a non-event. Again, not through lack of effort but you had Bjerg and McNulty setting that ferocious pace in what was an attempt to thin the group out (success) and tire Pogacar (seemed to fail, but maybe it was all a softening up exercise for tomorrow…) Yates had his ‘Yates’ day and Pidcock took a pasting. This is why I wanted to see what he could do at the end of three weeks. That’s not meant to be hyper-critical of him either, it’s more to temper expectations a bit. I’ll say it again, but I’d love to see him with a Classics focus and dabble in one week races which aren’t too mountain heavy for a good few years yet and then see what happens.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 20, 2022 20:39:10 GMT
I agree, he's been playing it safe all Tour, and certainly ever since he got 3rd place in the G.C. I'm surprised he's actually been able to get 3rd but had hoped he'd at least have made one or two serious attacks. He doesn’t have it in him. I don’t think Thomas is physically incapable of attacking to that extent. He is comfortably the third best rider in the race, but he doesn’t possess the engine to make an attack. I don’t think it’s directly related to riding conservatively either; I just don’t think he could do it even if he wanted to. Stage was interesting for what was happening beyond third place but the ‘battle’ at the front was a non-event. Again, not through lack of effort but you had Bjerg and McNulty setting that ferocious pace in what was an attempt to thin the group out (success) and tire Pogacar (seemed to fail, but maybe it was all a softening up exercise for tomorrow…) Yates had his ‘Yates’ day and Pidcock took a pasting. This is why I wanted to see what he could do at the end of three weeks. That’s not meant to be hyper-critical of him either, it’s more to temper expectations a bit. I’ll say it again, but I’d love to see him with a Classics focus and dabble in one week races which aren’t too mountain heavy for a good few years yet and then see what happens. Fair assessment. Pidcock is like a jack of all trades master of none. Obviously that is unfair as he’s won the d’huez stage, mtb gold etc He’s awesome with great potential. The boy has talent in Abundance I dont think he knows yet what to concentrate on He’s like a footballer who doesn’t get to hold down a position because he’s too versatile
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Post by marylandstoke on Jul 21, 2022 0:15:38 GMT
I agree, he's been playing it safe all Tour, and certainly ever since he got 3rd place in the G.C. I'm surprised he's actually been able to get 3rd but had hoped he'd at least have made one or two serious attacks. He doesn’t have it in him. I don’t think Thomas is physically incapable of attacking to that extent. He is comfortably the third best rider in the race, but he doesn’t possess the engine to make an attack. I don’t think it’s directly related to riding conservatively either; I just don’t think he could do it even if he wanted to. Stage was interesting for what was happening beyond third place but the ‘battle’ at the front was a non-event. Again, not through lack of effort but you had Bjerg and McNulty setting that ferocious pace in what was an attempt to thin the group out (success) and tire Pogacar (seemed to fail, but maybe it was all a softening up exercise for tomorrow…) Yates had his ‘Yates’ day and Pidcock took a pasting. This is why I wanted to see what he could do at the end of three weeks. That’s not meant to be hyper-critical of him either, it’s more to temper expectations a bit. I’ll say it again, but I’d love to see him with a Classics focus and dabble in one week races which aren’t too mountain heavy for a good few years yet and then see what happens. Interesting. I wanted to write a post saying I was a little disappointed with Pidcock but wondered if I was being too harsh. I have my answer.
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Post by Bod on Jul 21, 2022 11:25:45 GMT
Today is the day then. Or not. Rated as the toughest day of the race so everyone is going to be hurting
Two HC climbs and one first cat. It may be the first cat climb that does the damage rather than the Aubisque or Hautacam as it’s a bit of a weird one with lots of steep gradients and turns.
Pog needs time, Vingegaard looks unfazed. Too many mountain stages turn into damp squibs, but surely Pogacar has to try something from distance if he is able? If he does, I feel for the guys in the lower half of the top 10 and into the top 15 as it will be carnage. I usually have a vague idea of what I think will happen (rather than what will actually happen, admittedly) but I’m unsure today. It could be a complete eyeballs out go from the gun stage and riders are hanging on or a tentative feeling out process. I’d opt for it being very hard to control with repeated attacks from people who are too high profile to be let into a breakaway. If that’s the case, everyone will be knackered before the Aubisque, which is where Pogacar goes full on 96 Pantani…
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 21, 2022 11:40:52 GMT
As you say today is (or should) be the day. Pogacar has simply got to go for it today if he has any hope of catching Vingegaard. It's got be full banzai mode from Pogacar, if he's feeling good enough. Vingegaard seemed to be able to cover any attack yesterday and I got the impression at the finish that Pogacar had almost accepted the fact that he couldn't make Vingegaard crack. Today's another day though and Pogacar must be ready to leave absolutely everything on the road in one huge last effort.
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 21, 2022 15:43:40 GMT
Well, that stage had it all !
Chapeau Vingegaard - well deserved winner of the stage and Tour. After nearly falling off, then Pogacar falling off, then waiting for Pogacar, and the handshake - two real sportsmen ! Unlike my mate Quintana who was caught cheating on camera !
Great effort from Pogacar, well done to G for his likely third place, but the time gaps are pretty big this year aren't they.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 21, 2022 16:19:50 GMT
Well, that stage had it all ! Chapeau Vingegaard - well deserved winner of the stage and Tour. After nearly falling off, then Pogacar falling off, then waiting for Pogacar, and the handshake - two real sportsmen ! Unlike my mate Quintana who was caught cheating on camera ! Great effort from Pogacar, well done to G for his likely third place, but the time gaps are pretty big this year aren't they. So impressed with the sportsmanship. Vinnegard is well deserves and the stage win was something else but pog will be back G won’t lead GC again WVA is a superstar Great stage.
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 21, 2022 16:49:19 GMT
Well, that stage had it all ! Chapeau Vingegaard - well deserved winner of the stage and Tour. After nearly falling off, then Pogacar falling off, then waiting for Pogacar, and the handshake - two real sportsmen ! Unlike my mate Quintana who was caught cheating on camera ! Great effort from Pogacar, well done to G for his likely third place, but the time gaps are pretty big this year aren't they. So impressed with the sportsmanship. Vinnegard is well deserves and the stage win was something else but pog will be back G won’t lead GC again WVA is a superstar Great stage. Yes, agree with all that. I actually forgot to mention WVA - he's some rider isn't he ? Barring some unforeseen disaster it all looks sorted now. Looking forward to the Vuelta already !
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jul 21, 2022 18:55:37 GMT
Great stage today, fantastic viewing.
Congrats Vingegaard, always good to see a new name emerge.
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Post by Bod on Jul 21, 2022 21:03:03 GMT
I’m going to be the contrary voice here and say that no way should Vingegaard have waited for Pogacar. It made for a great visual but it was a racing incident. He hasn’t been flicked by a car, got a flag in his rear mech, broke his chain, etc. It was full on racing and should have been treated as such. The cynic in me thinks perhaps Vingegaard waited because he knew he had the beating of Pogacar on Hautacam…
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Post by salopstick on Jul 21, 2022 21:37:46 GMT
I’m going to be the contrary voice here and say that no way should Vingegaard have waited for Pogacar. It made for a great visual but it was a racing incident. He hasn’t been flicked by a car, got a flag in his rear mech, broke his chain, etc. It was full on racing and should have been treated as such. The cynic in me thinks perhaps Vingegaard waited because he knew he had the beating of Pogacar on Hautacam… Whilst you are probably right, that act of sportsmanship does a lot of good for the sport and the individuals concerned. With that in mind I would disagree with you that it was absolutely the right thing to do. It’s easy to be the better man In Terms of sportsmanship when you know at that time you are winning. It doesn’t mean you should not do it. I think it enhanced the stage and his victory
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Post by Bod on Jul 21, 2022 21:52:05 GMT
I’m going to be the contrary voice here and say that no way should Vingegaard have waited for Pogacar. It made for a great visual but it was a racing incident. He hasn’t been flicked by a car, got a flag in his rear mech, broke his chain, etc. It was full on racing and should have been treated as such. The cynic in me thinks perhaps Vingegaard waited because he knew he had the beating of Pogacar on Hautacam… Whilst you are probably right, that act of sportsmanship does a lot of good for the sport and the individuals concerned. With that in mind I would disagree with you that it was absolutely the right thing to do. It’s easy to be the better man In Terms of sportsmanship when you know at that time you are winning. It doesn’t mean you should not do it. I think it enhanced the stage and his victory I’m sort of playing Devil’s Advocate here but the aim of the game was to put Vingegaard under pressure on the descent and that’s exactly what happened through no shenanigans or foul play. However, I also agree that as a fan of the sport, it was a throughly decent thing to do and can pay dividends as regards to how a sport that has a sketchy perception (ie drug use) is not fundamentally rotten. My issue is probably one of the bigger picture in terms of ‘patrons’ neutralising races when they have no right to, which is not what happened today. Cancellara did it on a couple of occasions and it simply shouldn’t have happened. Crashes occur and riders get distanced. If the race was on, the race was on. Attacking as soon as someone crashes, as a response to the crash is out of order though.
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Post by Bod on Jul 21, 2022 22:00:01 GMT
So impressed with the sportsmanship. Vinnegard is well deserves and the stage win was something else but pog will be back G won’t lead GC again WVA is a superstar Great stage. Yes, agree with all that. I actually forgot to mention WVA - he's some rider isn't he ? Barring some unforeseen disaster it all looks sorted now. Looking forward to the Vuelta already ! Vuelta is a decent looking line up and since they altered the nature of the stages (stopping those interminable stages where just raced up motorways for hours) it is a great race. Hindley, Roglic, O’Connor, Carapaz, Rodriguez, Valverde (I love this gnarly old bastard,) Mas, Evenepoel, Pogacar (hmm, let’s see shall we,) Bilbao, Landa all scheduled to start. 6 summit finishes and 8 mountain stages in total.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 21, 2022 22:06:26 GMT
Yes, agree with all that. I actually forgot to mention WVA - he's some rider isn't he ? Barring some unforeseen disaster it all looks sorted now. Looking forward to the Vuelta already ! Vuelta is a decent looking line up and since they altered the nature of the stages (stopping those interminable stages where just raced up motorways for hours) it is a great race. Hindley, Roglic, O’Connor, Carapaz, Rodriguez, Valverde (I love this gnarly old bastard,) Mas, Evenepoel, Pogacar (hmm, let’s see shall we,) Bilbao, Landa all scheduled to start. 6 summit finishes and 8 mountain stages in total. As soon as you said valverde I thought the same thing. He’s great. Isn’t he retiring this year?
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Post by Bod on Jul 22, 2022 11:17:01 GMT
Vuelta is a decent looking line up and since they altered the nature of the stages (stopping those interminable stages where just raced up motorways for hours) it is a great race. Hindley, Roglic, O’Connor, Carapaz, Rodriguez, Valverde (I love this gnarly old bastard,) Mas, Evenepoel, Pogacar (hmm, let’s see shall we,) Bilbao, Landa all scheduled to start. 6 summit finishes and 8 mountain stages in total. As soon as you said valverde I thought the same thing. He’s great. Isn’t he retiring this year? He is, sadly. Movistar will be even more stuffed without him. 17 years with the same team, albeit in slightly different incarnations. In other Movistar news, Mas is a DNS today and not one person noticed. The whisper was that he had a panic attack after getting in the break yesterday as at one point he looked around, didn’t have a wheel to follow and his brain went into standby mode.
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Post by Bod on Jul 22, 2022 11:24:35 GMT
Today’s the day that Ewan wins a stage! I’ve got a couple of hours before I get home, but must be a day when sprinters teams take hold of it after suffering like dogs for what seems like the whole race.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 22, 2022 12:22:55 GMT
Today’s the day that Ewan wins a stage! I’ve got a couple of hours before I get home, but must be a day when sprinters teams take hold of it after suffering like dogs for what seems like the whole race. I think it’s great that it hasn’t really been a sprinters race. WVA has almost single handed neutralised them
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Post by marylandstoke on Jul 22, 2022 13:16:27 GMT
Should be a very classic sprint finish today.
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Post by marylandstoke on Jul 22, 2022 13:19:16 GMT
Nowadays? Next to nothing of note. I raced for a while and was a very, very average 3rd cat rider. I swapped cycling for running, but now enjoy just going out for 2 or 3 hours just to keep my hand in and do some interval work to hopefully get a little carryover to running. Never been good enough to race but I enjoy a weekly 10TT around 25 mins on a road bike good enough for a work out. Apart from that I love 100 mile + endurance sportives I dipped heavily into the red just reading this.
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Post by thepremierbanksy on Jul 22, 2022 13:53:37 GMT
Whilst you are probably right, that act of sportsmanship does a lot of good for the sport and the individuals concerned. With that in mind I would disagree with you that it was absolutely the right thing to do. It’s easy to be the better man In Terms of sportsmanship when you know at that time you are winning. It doesn’t mean you should not do it. I think it enhanced the stage and his victory I’m sort of playing Devil’s Advocate here but the aim of the game was to put Vingegaard under pressure on the descent and that’s exactly what happened through no shenanigans or foul play. However, I also agree that as a fan of the sport, it was a throughly decent thing to do and can pay dividends as regards to how a sport that has a sketchy perception (ie drug use) is not fundamentally rotten. My issue is probably one of the bigger picture in terms of ‘patrons’ neutralising races when they have no right to, which is not what happened today. Cancellara did it on a couple of occasions and it simply shouldn’t have happened. Crashes occur and riders get distanced. If the race was on, the race was on. Attacking as soon as someone crashes, as a response to the crash is out of order though. He had every right to attack him, but it made zero tactical sense to do so as he had two domestiques in the group behind.
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 22, 2022 15:29:54 GMT
Finally, a French stage winner on stage 19. Tough luck yet again for Fred Wright.
It's been an almost total domination by Jumbo Visma this year, holding yellow, green, and KOM jerseys, and another stage win today.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 22, 2022 16:32:38 GMT
Never been good enough to race but I enjoy a weekly 10TT around 25 mins on a road bike good enough for a work out. Apart from that I love 100 mile + endurance sportives I dipped heavily into the red just reading this. 24:37 on Wednesday. Gutted held up by a tractor and a roundabout
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Post by Bod on Jul 22, 2022 17:03:21 GMT
You suffer through the mountains. Your team does the work all day. You get to the final 1200m and then you all look at each other and go ‘Well, I’m not chasing that little group.’ Nose. Off. To. Spite. Face. Ridiculous. Letting Laporte slide off the front was madness. Strong as Laporte is, he should not be getting away there.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 23, 2022 14:43:48 GMT
It will be a sporting tragedy if WVA never wins this race. He’s brilliant
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Post by Bod on Jul 23, 2022 15:46:51 GMT
Oof. Big G just went ‘Pop.’
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 23, 2022 16:19:53 GMT
I was listening to Rob Hatch on Eurosport and he said this year's Tour has been the best he's ever seen. I don't know if I'm missing something but IMO apart from three or four stages it's been nothing out of the ordinary and I certainly wouldn't class it as memorable.
Great performance from WVA yet again - superb rider.
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Post by Bod on Jul 23, 2022 16:29:34 GMT
I was listening to Rob Hatch on Eurosport and he said this year's Tour has been the best he's ever seen. I don't know if I'm missing something but IMO apart from three or four stages it's been nothing out of the ordinary and I certainly wouldn't class it as memorable. Great performance from WVA yet again - superb rider. Rob Hatch is a known hyperbolic offender. You have Kirby who is enthusiastic, rambling, all over the shop at times and who gets into crazy mode on very stage with about 15km to go (but I like him.) On the other hand, there is Hatch who overstates and seems to be in constant salesman mode. ‘This is the greatest day/ride/race/stage ever.’ It’s like the boy who cried wolf. If he really, really believes this was the best TdF he’s ever seen then he needs to be checked out for some type of neural disorder.
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 23, 2022 16:43:53 GMT
I was listening to Rob Hatch on Eurosport and he said this year's Tour has been the best he's ever seen. I don't know if I'm missing something but IMO apart from three or four stages it's been nothing out of the ordinary and I certainly wouldn't class it as memorable. Great performance from WVA yet again - superb rider. Rob Hatch is a known hyperbolic offender. You have Kirby who is enthusiastic, rambling, all over the shop at times and who gets into crazy mode on very stage with about 15km to go (but I like him.) On the other hand, there is Hatch who overstates and seems to be in constant salesman mode. ‘This is the greatest day/ride/race/stage ever.’ It’s like the boy who cried wolf. If he really, really believes this was the best TdF he’s ever seen then he needs to be checked out for some type of neural disorder. Yes, I much prefer Carlton Kirby for all his excesses and meanderings. I know I'm a Sky/Ineos fan, so for them to be so far off the G.C. pace it's spoilt the overall Tour for me. Even so it's just been a decent Tour, with only a couple of genuine G.C. contenders with a few good stages, and a couple of excellent stages. The time gaps show just how big the difference has been between the top two and the rest - Thomas is 3rd at 8 min 13 sec for goodness sake, and Gaudu 4th at 13' 56" ! WVA has been the rider of the Tour by the proverbial country mile.
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Post by salopstick on Jul 23, 2022 16:57:33 GMT
I was listening to Rob Hatch on Eurosport and he said this year's Tour has been the best he's ever seen. I don't know if I'm missing something but IMO apart from three or four stages it's been nothing out of the ordinary and I certainly wouldn't class it as memorable. Great performance from WVA yet again - superb rider. I prefer ITV4. I like David millar
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Post by deeside2 on Jul 23, 2022 17:06:37 GMT
I was listening to Rob Hatch on Eurosport and he said this year's Tour has been the best he's ever seen. I don't know if I'm missing something but IMO apart from three or four stages it's been nothing out of the ordinary and I certainly wouldn't class it as memorable. Great performance from WVA yet again - superb rider. I prefer ITV4. I like David millar Millar's good but I find Ned boring as a commentator.
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