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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 11:44:27 GMT
You shouldn’t have taken the bait………here comes another tranche of posts from people who wanted their cake and eat it as my mum used to say. People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe.
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Post by onefatcopper on Apr 18, 2022 11:58:54 GMT
By aspiring for total football we might not be in the mess we’re in now ! All the run up to the final was about if Etherington would he be fit, it was he at the time who was pulling the strings for our attack. We kept the embryonic Man City that you see now pretty quiet for much of the final so don’t belittle those players efforts, because I’m sure that they wanted and tried to win that game as much as the fans did. Nothing to do with belittling the players effort but the managers mindset it was his default setting it was horrible, negative and unambitious. I take it he'd still be here left to you? So this is the same manager and team that you would probably had been praising to the rafters after beating Bolton ? Man City were a different beast to Bolton and HE, don’t be frightened to write it Pulis ? Pragmatically thought his tactics were the way to win the Cup. If you have a point of view about Stoke and your unable to take other fans observations, you have no need to revert to your default setting of the Tony Pulis card ! It’s just a repetitive way of arguing yourself out of a corner
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Post by mickmillslovechild on Apr 18, 2022 11:59:18 GMT
Half time was unbearable. Thinking of all the ways we could bodge it up. Nice to know we're all the same as Stoke fans then. My non-Stoke fan mate was watching it on telly (and recording it for me) and texted me when Kenwynne scored saying "That's it mate, you're in the final", with me replying "Fuck off and don't jinx it". Spent halftime in my seat without moving, in case me leaving my seat would somehow cause us to fuck the second half up Oh, the life of being a Potter! Great day though and went straight round to my mate's when i got back from London that night to re-watch it from start to finish. Still buzzing from SJW's first whenever i see it now.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 12:13:32 GMT
Nothing to do with belittling the players effort but the managers mindset it was his default setting it was horrible, negative and unambitious. I take it he'd still be here left to you? So this is the same manager and team that you would probably had been praising to the rafters after beating Bolton ? Man City were a different beast to Bolton and HE, don’t be frightened to write it Pulis ? Pragmatically thought his tactics were the way to win the Cup. If you have a point of view about Stoke and your unable to take other fans observations, you have no need to revert to your default setting of the Tony Pulis card ! It’s just a repetitive way of arguing yourself out of a corner Obviously Pulis' mentality was pure fucking marmite. Why you people expect those who hated it to just shut up and have it your own way I've no idea.
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Post by mickstupp on Apr 18, 2022 12:14:43 GMT
You shouldn’t have taken the bait………here comes another tranche of posts from people who wanted their cake and eat it as my mum used to say. People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe. You have your head in the clouds and aspire to a level that you will never see us play to. It’s admirable but unrealistic. You are simply setting yourself up for lifetime of sporting frustration following this club.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 12:19:31 GMT
People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe. You have your head in the clouds and aspire to a level that you will never see us play to. It’s admirable but unrealistic. You are simply setting yourself up for lifetime of sporting frustration following this club. Well being as I've already had the vast majority of it I wouldn't worry too much about that. I agree that for the vast majority of my life as a Stoke supporter we've had a manager and a mentality I detest. Problem for your theory is occasionally in those brief interludes we have met my expectations and I treasure them.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Apr 18, 2022 12:23:19 GMT
You shouldn’t have taken the bait………here comes another tranche of posts from people who wanted their cake and eat it as my mum used to say. People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe. I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈
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Post by onefatcopper on Apr 18, 2022 12:23:55 GMT
So this is the same manager and team that you would probably had been praising to the rafters after beating Bolton ? Man City were a different beast to Bolton and HE, don’t be frightened to write it Pulis ? Pragmatically thought his tactics were the way to win the Cup. If you have a point of view about Stoke and your unable to take other fans observations, you have no need to revert to your default setting of the Tony Pulis card ! It’s just a repetitive way of arguing yourself out of a corner Obviously Pulis' mentality was pure fucking marmite. Why you people expect those who hated it to just shut up and have it your own way I've no idea. Procrastination caused by outdated thoughts and beliefs are holding you back, break that cycle and release your inner self !
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 12:26:38 GMT
People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe. I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈 You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 12:37:13 GMT
People who dare to dream, have high levels of aspiration rather than people of low expectation who're satisfied with being the irritating grit in someones shoe. I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈 Just says to me you like pissing people off far more than you enjoy watching football. The 3 9th place finishes might mean nothing but quite a bit of the football played in them was inspirational and an absolute privilidge to watch a Stoke team going toe to toe with the elite playing football not trying to strangle the life out of the game. Each to their own as you say but I for one won't be drowned out by folk who's only aspiration is to be horrible.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 12:42:47 GMT
I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈 You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. Great way you have of putting things into words. So much more poetic than my efforts.
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Post by onefatcopper on Apr 18, 2022 12:51:51 GMT
I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈 You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. So roughly ten games define the past decade and a bit in your life as a Stoke fan ? They all seem to be under the management of Mark Hughes, it’s great to pick the odd game but we never strung those odd games together, we were a enigma. I can remember when we destroyed Manchester City and Liverpool, that was in the Waddington era, and again that was a enigmatic team that promised much but by cruel fate failed to deliver. Under Hughes at times we were worse than dire, Coventry City, Wolves the lap of honour too a empty stadium, a riot at the train station as the team returned home, were you cheering for the lads then ?
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 13:13:09 GMT
You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. So roughly ten games define the past decade and a bit in your life as a Stoke fan ? They all seem to be under the management of Mark Hughes, it’s great to pick the odd game but we never strung those odd games together, we were a enigma. I can remember when we destroyed Manchester City and Liverpool, that was in the Waddington era, and again that was a enigmatic team that promised much but by cruel fate failed to deliver. Under Hughes at times we were worse than dire, Coventry City, Wolves the lap of honour too a empty stadium, a riot at the train station as the team returned home, were you cheering for the lads then ? Under Pulis we were worse than dire in the vast majority of games with a far smaller ammount of games to reminisce about. Pulisball was exciting and effective mainly only for a brief spell during cup final season. By the lap of shame most of us ardent Hughes fans were saying his shelf life had expired, it was the right time to part ways just as it was the right time to part ways with Pulis. Inexplicably the owners either couldn't or wouldn't see it. You're right that lap of shame was every bit as damning as the drop off in season ticket renewals under Pulis. They waited then paniced and the result was Lambert.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Apr 18, 2022 13:17:42 GMT
I can only talk personally. I was pragmatically happy with having the opportunity of seeing close up world class footballers at the Brit week in, week out. Having a club identity which was disliked by the purists (especially those who we’d beaten) and of course the TV pundits. The potential for a decent cup run and European adventures. Not enough for some who still slobber about 3 x 9th place finishes (being meaningless in the scheme of things) and who remain vociferous about managers not being good enough. Good enough for what I’m not sure. Been there, seen it, done it. We had it, we lost it and that’s FACT Re-wind the clock any time and give me the 2nd TP era. Everyone to their own 👈 You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. Sincere apologies for not enjoying relegation, and a few heavy defeats (7-2 comes to mind). We were nice to watch though. Sorry for you if you didn’t enjoy promotion, an FA Cup Final and European football, but everyone to their own. I’ll bet you’re over the moon of being in the EFL. The Devil after having a disastrous run of results between February and May 2013 was 4 points short of a 9th place finish. Now that would have been success
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Post by lordb on Apr 18, 2022 13:24:37 GMT
Pulis was fucking great but had to go in the end/went at the exact right time Hughes was fucking great but should have gone the summer before Thougt there was consensus on this?
As for the Cup Final given the injuries we were fucked
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 13:34:27 GMT
You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. So roughly ten games define the past decade and a bit in your life as a Stoke fan ? They all seem to be under the management of Mark Hughes, it’s great to pick the odd game but we never strung those odd games together, we were a enigma. I can remember when we destroyed Manchester City and Liverpool, that was in the Waddington era, and again that was a enigmatic team that promised much but by cruel fate failed to deliver. Under Hughes at times we were worse than dire, Coventry City, Wolves the lap of honour too a empty stadium, a riot at the train station as the team returned home, were you cheering for the lads then ? Sorry can’t make head nor tail of that. For starters you don’t finish top half of the top division by only doing anything in ‘roughly 10 games’. Second, if it was that easy, why couldn’t the manager before him manage that? Thirdly, where did I say anything about ‘defining my life as a Stoke fan’? No idea where you’ve got that from at all. Also, the ‘were you cheering for the lads then’ thing is rubbish too, I’ve said numerous times on here I wanted Hughes sacked a good 12 months before he was. He lost the plot, as did Pulis, one was moved on at the right time, the other wasn’t, to our great cost. My post was in response to Owdestokie’s, who again revealed himself to be a fan of TPFC rather than Stoke City. In all our time as a top flight club, how many Stoke managers have ‘strung those odd games together’? Would you dismiss everyone but them as a consequence?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 13:41:56 GMT
You post such consistent drivel but honestly the image of you angrily sitting on your hands, chewing a wasp while Bojan and the lads destroyed Manchester City or those six goals went in against Liverpool, pausing only to mutter ‘meaningless’ through gritted teeth while everyone else went mental, is phenomenal. Sincere apologies for not enjoying relegation, and a few heavy defeats (7-2 comes to mind). We were nice to watch though. Sorry for you if you didn’t enjoy promotion, an FA Cup Final and European football, but everyone to their own. I’ll bet you’re over the moon of being in the EFL. The Devil after having a disastrous run of results between February and May 2013 was 4 points short of a 9th place finish. Now that would have been success I did enjoy the good times under Pulis. The difference between us is that I could see the good and bad and that he went at the right time whereas you couldn’t see any fault in him whatsoever right to the end.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 13:45:46 GMT
Sincere apologies for not enjoying relegation, and a few heavy defeats (7-2 comes to mind). We were nice to watch though. Sorry for you if you didn’t enjoy promotion, an FA Cup Final and European football, but everyone to their own. I’ll bet you’re over the moon of being in the EFL. The Devil after having a disastrous run of results between February and May 2013 was 4 points short of a 9th place finish. Now that would have been success I did enjoy the good times under Pulis. The difference between us is that I could see the good and bad and that he went at the right time whereas you couldn’t see any fault in him whatsoever right to the end. That's true you argued with me for hours on here that he could/might evolve. I see you've come around to my way of thinkng now, they just don't it's as rare as hen's teeth. They keep doing what worked for them once despite every piece of evidence pointing in the opposite direction.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 13:53:38 GMT
I did enjoy the good times under Pulis. The difference between us is that I could see the good and bad and that he went at the right time whereas you couldn’t see any fault in him whatsoever right to the end. That's true you argued with me for hours on here that he could/might evolve. I see you've come around to my way of thinkng now, they just don't it's as rare as hen's teeth. They keep doing what worked for them once despite every piece of evidence pointing in the opposite direction. Yeah that was when I lost faith, the chance was there to evolve and build on that run to the cup final, and instead he dismantled everything that made it work and reverted to one-paced percentages stuff. And spent what was at that time the biggest budget of any Stoke manager in history to do it. I loved the good times under him but the narrative that he was somehow stabbed in the back or that everything that came after him was rubbish or somehow tainted is so, so weird.
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Post by scfc75 on Apr 18, 2022 13:58:27 GMT
Ah the bi-monthly Pulis vs Hughes argument.
Here’s my own take on it.
Pulis did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager. Hughes did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager.
If you told me that we could stay in the Premier League forever guaranteed under Pulis, but it would mean I’d never see some of the superb wins we had under Hughes, I’d say no thanks. Being in the top flight isn’t the be all and end all for me, it’s about entertainment, and for a time Hughes had us at the next level. The mistake some fans make is that they think that the next level will eventually cost you relegation, and the only way to survive is to keep on chugging around 12th to 15th every season, scraping enough points to get by.
Well that’s not for me, and I’m glad we had both managers, as I have good memories from both spells.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 14:00:13 GMT
Ah the bi-monthly Pulis vs Hughes argument. Here’s my own take on it. Pulis did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager. Hughes did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager. If you told me that we could stay in the Premier League forever guaranteed under Pulis, but it would mean I’d never see some of the superb wins we had under Hughes, I’d say no thanks. Being in the top flight isn’t the be all and end all for me, it’s about entertainment, and for a time Hughes had us at the next level. The mistake some fans make is that they think that the next level will eventually cost you relegation, and the only way to survive is to keep on chugging around 12th to 15th every season, scraping enough points to get by. Well that’s not for me, and I’m glad we had both managers, as I have good memories from both spells. The biggest thing people misrepresent imo is the notion that there was no chance we could ever be relegated under Pulis. If the board hadn’t acted when they did we’d have been right in the mix in 2013-14 imo.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Apr 18, 2022 14:05:11 GMT
Sincere apologies for not enjoying relegation, and a few heavy defeats (7-2 comes to mind). We were nice to watch though. Sorry for you if you didn’t enjoy promotion, an FA Cup Final and European football, but everyone to their own. I’ll bet you’re over the moon of being in the EFL. The Devil after having a disastrous run of results between February and May 2013 was 4 points short of a 9th place finish. Now that would have been success I did enjoy the good times under Pulis. The difference between us is that I could see the good and bad and that he went at the right time whereas you couldn’t see any fault in him whatsoever right to the end. Just because I didn’t and still don’t jump up and down making outlandish statements at times doesn’t mean I wasn’t bitterly disappointed at times. Said before I endeavour to be pragmatic and consider and understand the bigger picture. The same now applies with MON
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 14:08:15 GMT
I did enjoy the good times under Pulis. The difference between us is that I could see the good and bad and that he went at the right time whereas you couldn’t see any fault in him whatsoever right to the end. Just because I didn’t and still don’t jump up and down making outlandish statements at times doesn’t mean I wasn’t bitterly disappointed at times. Said before I endeavour to be pragmatic and consider and understand the bigger picture. The same now applies with MON ‘The bigger picture’ being what in this context?
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 14:20:54 GMT
Ah the bi-monthly Pulis vs Hughes argument. Here’s my own take on it. Pulis did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager. Hughes did a good job. I enjoyed the majority of his spell as manager. If you told me that we could stay in the Premier League forever guaranteed under Pulis, but it would mean I’d never see some of the superb wins we had under Hughes, I’d say no thanks. Being in the top flight isn’t the be all and end all for me, it’s about entertainment, and for a time Hughes had us at the next level. The mistake some fans make is that they think that the next level will eventually cost you relegation, and the only way to survive is to keep on chugging around 12th to 15th every season, scraping enough points to get by. Well that’s not for me, and I’m glad we had both managers, as I have good memories from both spells. The biggest thing people misrepresent imo is the notion that there was no chance we could ever be relegated under Pulis. If the board hadn’t acted when they did we’d have been right in the mix in 2013-14 imo. There's little doubt he was taking WBA down every bit as much as Hughes relegated us. They had to act support was dropping off when it should have been increasing. How many of us would have eventually bought a ST even if they kept him now that's for us to know it was a silent protest.
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Post by senojbor on Apr 18, 2022 18:57:06 GMT
Sacking Pulis was a big mistake Others disagree. What followed, followed But what is disturbing now is that the owners are accepting that mid-table Championship finishes are okay. It's not okay
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Post by PotterLog on Apr 18, 2022 19:14:10 GMT
I did a 15000-mile round trip over the weekend for this. It was good.
*my vain attempt to rescue the thread from the depressing yet predictable derailment it has suffered
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 18, 2022 19:18:45 GMT
Sacking Pulis was a big mistake Others disagree. What followed, followed But what is disturbing now is that the owners are accepting that mid-table Championship finishes are okay. It's not okay It was 100% the right decision.
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Post by scfc75 on Apr 18, 2022 19:44:25 GMT
Sacking Pulis was a big mistake Others disagree. What followed, followed But what is disturbing now is that the owners are accepting that mid-table Championship finishes are okay. It's not okay Who says they accept it? I’m sure they don’t, and I’m sure they are disappointed with where we are, especially after investing significant sums of money into the playing squad and 3 different managers since we were relegated. I don’t think they accept our current position at all. Why would they sit back and think that 14th to 16th was ok? If they thought that, why did they throw £50m+ at Rowett then sack him when he wasn’t far off the playoffs? Why did they employ Jones and give him even more money if they just wanted to plod along just above the relegation places? They would have just kept Rowett, wouldn’t they? They don’t lack ambition at all. They lack the competence to make the right, often hard decisions at the right time. Saying that they want to finish lower mid-table is plain fucking nonsense.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Apr 18, 2022 19:52:57 GMT
Sacking Pulis was a big mistake Others disagree. What followed, followed But what is disturbing now is that the owners are accepting that mid-table Championship finishes are okay. It's not okay Who says they accept it? I’m sure they don’t, and I’m sure they are disappointed with where we are, especially after investing significant sums of money into the playing squad and 3 different managers since we were relegated. I don’t think they accept our current position at all. Why would they sit back and think that 14th to 16th was ok? If they thought that, why did they throw £50m+ at Rowett then sack him when he wasn’t far off the playoffs? Why did they employ Jones and give him even more money if they just wanted to plod along just above the relegation places? They would have just kept Rowett, wouldn’t they? They don’t lack ambition at all. They lack the competence to make the right, often hard decisions at the right time. Saying that they want to finish lower mid-table is plain fucking nonsense. I think they might be caught between two stools. They really like the player development and integration but they'd like to be in the Prem which in turn makes the former extremely difficult.
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Post by scfc75 on Apr 18, 2022 20:00:12 GMT
Who says they accept it? I’m sure they don’t, and I’m sure they are disappointed with where we are, especially after investing significant sums of money into the playing squad and 3 different managers since we were relegated. I don’t think they accept our current position at all. Why would they sit back and think that 14th to 16th was ok? If they thought that, why did they throw £50m+ at Rowett then sack him when he wasn’t far off the playoffs? Why did they employ Jones and give him even more money if they just wanted to plod along just above the relegation places? They would have just kept Rowett, wouldn’t they? They don’t lack ambition at all. They lack the competence to make the right, often hard decisions at the right time. Saying that they want to finish lower mid-table is plain fucking nonsense. I think they might be caught between two stools. They really like the player development and integration but they'd like to be in the Prem which in turn makes the former extremely difficult. I just don’t buy the argument that they are happy to float around in the championship at all. It’s nonsense. Do you want to be in the top league where all the big revenue is, with full stadiums, bigger global opportunity and greater exposure for the B365 brand… or do you want to spaff around in the Champo with cash you can’t spend and the club hemorrhaging money? As I said previously, they have the ambition, they just lack the competence. I actually think our academy would be a great asset if we were back in the top flight, loaning promising players out to the Championship for development and then selling them on… maybe the odd one would make it to the first team. it’s as close to self-sustainability as they could get.
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