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Post by Lakeland Potter on Mar 9, 2022 11:52:40 GMT
I have thought in the past that the women's team seems a missed opportunity for Stoke and that a lot more could have been done. Comments like the below are unhelpful however popular or unpopular women's football is or isn't. In a parallel universe where women's football wasn't banned by the FA and women weren't discriminated against by and in comparison to men, it'd probably be more popular than the men's game. Support and coverage of the game are long, long, looooong overdue. At the very least, now girls can see football is something they can do. Then as more girls take up the sport, the standard will improve. It gets far too much attention on the mainstream media for me whether you agree or not.With the amount of folk interested and in attendance it doesn’t warrant the coverage it gets at the minute. Don't be daft. You'd have had a point in the days of 4 TV channels - or even just 1 channel when I was a nipper! But these days there are so many channels they must struggle to find enough programs to fill them! I know I'd rather watch a women's footy match on TV than fall asleep in front of one of the shopping channels!
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 9, 2022 11:53:43 GMT
From what I've read and seen of this it appears as though this kind of sums up all things Stoke City FC right now! That the potentials there to build something good & worthwhile as the footings are in place to step up to the next level but the powers that be have rested on their laurels & are clearly happy to leave things festering away in the misguided belief all's good in the world. & by the time something clearly needs maintaining or repairing its all to late! Stoke City Football Club, had it all and mismanaged badly has taken it all away! That's definitely what it reads as. But again we sit here none the wiser really. What are these plans she has wanted? No one is coming out of this in a good light imo. I think if the plans were shared and they were reasonable then there would be a load of people ready to jump down their throats. As it is we know nothing. One of the plans includes paying the players to go full time, even a salary of £20k-£30k a year with a squad of 20+ and coaches etc and you are quickly looking towards £1m+ a year for a team that attracts a few hundred people a game - why should the Coates family be expected to fund this ?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 11:56:51 GMT
That's definitely what it reads as. But again we sit here none the wiser really. What are these plans she has wanted? No one is coming out of this in a good light imo. I think if the plans were shared and they were reasonable then there would be a load of people ready to jump down their throats. As it is we know nothing. One of the plans includes paying the players to go full time, even a salary of £20k-£30k a year with a squad of 20+ and coaches etc and you are quickly looking towards £1m+ a year for a team that attracts a few hundred people a game - why should the Coates family be expected to fund this ? I would agree with that with the little knowledge I have. That's why I would like to know more. Would it go against FFP? I don't believe it does but haven't seen anything concrete. I agree there's no justification there to go full time at such costs. Is that the cost though? But certainly if the salaries are of that order it would be.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 9, 2022 12:03:08 GMT
That's definitely what it reads as. But again we sit here none the wiser really. What are these plans she has wanted? No one is coming out of this in a good light imo. I think if the plans were shared and they were reasonable then there would be a load of people ready to jump down their throats. As it is we know nothing. One of the plans includes paying the players to go full time, even a salary of £20k-£30k a year with a squad of 20+ and coaches etc and you are quickly looking towards £1m+ a year for a team that attracts a few hundred people a game - why should the Coates family be expected to fund this ? They can fund what they choose to. But each year for the sake of a couple of days salary for Denise Coates they could start a pathway for aspiring female footballers in Stoke-on-Trent to get into the game permanently, help get more and more into the sport through community projects, and potentially leave a legacy for after they move on. So I think it would be worth it personally but it's not my cash......
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 9, 2022 12:10:49 GMT
One of the plans includes paying the players to go full time, even a salary of £20k-£30k a year with a squad of 20+ and coaches etc and you are quickly looking towards £1m+ a year for a team that attracts a few hundred people a game - why should the Coates family be expected to fund this ? I would agree with that with the little knowledge I have. That's why I would like to know more. Would it go against FFP? I don't believe it does but haven't seen anything concrete. I agree there's no justification there to go full time at such costs. Is that the cost though? But certainly if the salaries are of that order it would be. Dont think it goes against FFP. Minimum wage is going up / gone up to £9.18 an hour thats £17k-£19k presume they would need to offer more to compensate for the time / earnings you lose in your non football career, for the length of a 3 year contract you could become a supervisor / manager in a shop, qualify or PQ as an accountant, nurse, doctor, lawyer etc etc I have as much interest in womans football as I do watching Burnley v Palace or Watford v Norwich but in my eyes, at "our" level its basically non league maybe you get expenses for driving to games etc if you are really good you will get to move up and might get paid or be able to go full time if you are lucky but otherwise its basically more like a hobby than a job.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 12:13:48 GMT
One of the plans includes paying the players to go full time, even a salary of £20k-£30k a year with a squad of 20+ and coaches etc and you are quickly looking towards £1m+ a year for a team that attracts a few hundred people a game - why should the Coates family be expected to fund this ? They can fund what they choose to. But each year for the sake of a couple of days salary for Denise Coates they could start a pathway for aspiring female footballers in Stoke-on-Trent to get into the game permanently, help get more and more into the sport through community projects, and potentially leave a legacy for after they move on. So I think it would be worth it personally but it's not my cash...... Would that need a full time team though? I'm not sure it does unless they climbed the ladder and justified it. And I still think you could do the other stuff (that I agree should be happening) without full time costs for a team. You'd need some full timers to achieve it. But this is why I'd like to know more. I don't enough re pay structures etc. A squad of 18 on 20k a year is 360k. Is that about right? Not sure. Is it worth the money? Not sure. It's why I'd like to see some plans and some arguments about the value for money and what it could do.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 12:17:16 GMT
I would agree with that with the little knowledge I have. That's why I would like to know more. Would it go against FFP? I don't believe it does but haven't seen anything concrete. I agree there's no justification there to go full time at such costs. Is that the cost though? But certainly if the salaries are of that order it would be. Dont think it goes against FFP. Minimum wage is going up / gone up to £9.18 an hour thats £17k-£19k presume they would need to offer more to compensate for the time / earnings you lose in your non football career, for the length of a 3 year contract you could become a supervisor / manager in a shop, qualify or PQ as an accountant, nurse, doctor, lawyer etc etc I have as much interest in womans football as I do watching Burnley v Palace or Watford v Norwich but in my eyes, at "our" level its basically non league maybe you get expenses for driving to games etc if you are really good you will get to move up and might get paid or be able to go full time if you are lucky but otherwise its basically more like a hobby than a job. Yeah same really but I think a thriving development section is key to the club tbh. The higher level, I'm not overly arsed about but would find it interesting re the costs. I worked with a woman who played for the Vale ladies team and she did her full time job and then that on the side. And they're a bit below us. I think it's a vital community tool. And if you develop good players as a by product and they do well then I'd like to think they'd be backed. But I'm not convinced we could justify a full time team. What other Championship clubs have a full time womens team?
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Mar 9, 2022 12:19:16 GMT
It gets far too much attention on the mainstream media for me whether you agree or not.With the amount of folk interested and in attendance it doesn’t warrant the coverage it gets at the minute. Don't be daft. You'd have had a point in the days of 4 TV channels - or even just 1 channel when I was a nipper! But these days there are so many channels they must struggle to find enough programs to fill them! I know I'd rather watch a women's footy match on TV than fall asleep in front of one of the shopping channels! Give me QVC anytime🤣
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Post by tomcmod on Mar 9, 2022 12:31:15 GMT
Isn't the player haven't the biggest pop at Stoke her partner/girlfriend.... As has been pointed out in this thread already is there actually a market for ploughing money in to it here? It's all well and good trying to push things along and trying to progress but some things can't do this. You'd think if it was possible that Denise would be all over it.
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Post by Not_Nick_H on Mar 9, 2022 13:26:14 GMT
On pay per view TV the Women's Super League averages around 113,000 per game according to the last set of figures, and around 500,000 on free to air TV. To give you a comparison that compares roughly with Rugby League's Super League. The Championship as a comparison averages 178,000 per game on pay per view TV, the highest viewing figures this season being Forest v Coventry which pulled in about 460,000 viewers. The trick is not to compare it to mens football as it's chalk and cheese, but it certainly holds it's own against sports like Rugby League and I'm not seen a clamour for their coverage to be reduced? The less rugby league on the tv the better quite frankly 😂 It's possible to go off some people y'know.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 13:29:56 GMT
The less rugby league on the tv the better quite frankly 😂 It's possible to go off some people y'know. haha sorry, you're Warrington based aren't you? I never got to go a game there when I lived there but would love to watch a game live. It's just never been a sport I've been able to get in to.
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Post by Not_Nick_H on Mar 9, 2022 13:34:39 GMT
Have you got these viewing figures to see then mate and what do you class as decent figures? On satellite TV the Women's Super League averages around 113,000 per game according to the last set of figures, and around 500,000 on free to air TV. To give you a comparison that compares roughly with Rugby League's Super League. The Championship as a comparison averages 178,000 per game on satellite TV, the highest viewing figures this season being Forest v Coventry which pulled in about 460,000 viewers. The trick is not to compare it to mens football as it's chalk and cheese, but it certainly holds it's own against sports like Rugby League and I'm not seen a clamour for their coverage to be reduced? It'll be interesting to see how things pan out for RL/Super League now that Channel 4 are picking up 10 live games a year. Their coverage is slick and makes the incumbent Sky Sports stuff look a bit stale in comparison. I still feel that putting sports on Satellite is effectively sidelining them. Both Women's footie and (Rugby) Superleague can only benefit to one extent or another by being infront of a wider audience. (25 years of living in Warrington and I'm bigging up rugby league FFS).
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 9, 2022 13:37:42 GMT
On satellite TV the Women's Super League averages around 113,000 per game according to the last set of figures, and around 500,000 on free to air TV. To give you a comparison that compares roughly with Rugby League's Super League. The Championship as a comparison averages 178,000 per game on satellite TV, the highest viewing figures this season being Forest v Coventry which pulled in about 460,000 viewers. The trick is not to compare it to mens football as it's chalk and cheese, but it certainly holds it's own against sports like Rugby League and I'm not seen a clamour for their coverage to be reduced? It'll be interesting to see how things pan out for RL/Super League now that Channel 4 are picking up 10 live games a year. Their coverage is slick and makes the incumbent Sky Sports stuff look a bit stale in comparison. I still feel that putting sports on Satellite is effectively sidelining them. Both Women's footie and (Rugby) Superleague can only benefit to one extent or another by being infront of a wider audience. (25 years of living in Warrington and I'm bigging up rugby league FFS). It needs a boost, I saw that attendances are way down as well there only seems to be 2/3 teams where they're holding up.......
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Post by Not_Nick_H on Mar 9, 2022 13:40:06 GMT
It's possible to go off some people y'know. haha sorry, you're Warrington based aren't you? I never got to go a game there when I lived there but would love to watch a game live. It's just never been a sport I've been able to get in to. - no worries. I was ambivalent when I moved here, but it grows on you eventually - especially when there's no footie in the summer. My lad is Warrington born and bred (but a full-on "Stokie") and he's very much of the generation that wants to see the game spread out of the cloth cap and ferret heartland*. * The M62.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 14:02:52 GMT
haha sorry, you're Warrington based aren't you? I never got to go a game there when I lived there but would love to watch a game live. It's just never been a sport I've been able to get in to. - no worries. I was ambivalent when I moved here, but it grows on you eventually - especially when there's no footie in the summer. My lad is Warrington born and bred (but a full-on "Stokie") and he's very much of the generation that wants to see the game spread out of the cloth cap and ferret heartland*. * The M62. I think that’s a tough sell. People seem to prefer Union (I do) and the T20 and Hundred cricket I would suggest are taking over too in the summer. I do want to go a game though, I have fond memories of Warrington and feel like it was something I missed out on. I went to watch Warrington Town a few times though. Good little club.
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Post by apb1 on Mar 9, 2022 14:49:58 GMT
They can fund what they choose to. But each year for the sake of a couple of days salary for Denise Coates they could start a pathway for aspiring female footballers in Stoke-on-Trent to get into the game permanently, help get more and more into the sport through community projects, and potentially leave a legacy for after they move on. So I think it would be worth it personally but it's not my cash...... Would that need a full time team though? I'm not sure it does unless they climbed the ladder and justified it. And I still think you could do the other stuff (that I agree should be happening) without full time costs for a team. You'd need some full timers to achieve it. But this is why I'd like to know more. I don't enough re pay structures etc. A squad of 18 on 20k a year is 360k. Is that about right? Not sure. Is it worth the money? Not sure. It's why I'd like to see some plans and some arguments about the value for money and what it could do. Below the top tier most clubs are semi pro - at our level (tier 3) I'm not sure any get paid. Given its profile is going up, and will get a further boost from the Euros in England this summer, and Denise's personal millions, let alone B365, if we could shovel cash their way without buggering up FFP, then it would seem a good idea. Even allowing for 3-4 professionals could make a difference. Who knows where it will go, but growth is likely and in my view the increased coverage is also a good thing, given the historic neglect and even sabotage of women's football and sport in general by horrible old men for decades if not centuries!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 14:56:47 GMT
Would that need a full time team though? I'm not sure it does unless they climbed the ladder and justified it. And I still think you could do the other stuff (that I agree should be happening) without full time costs for a team. You'd need some full timers to achieve it. But this is why I'd like to know more. I don't enough re pay structures etc. A squad of 18 on 20k a year is 360k. Is that about right? Not sure. Is it worth the money? Not sure. It's why I'd like to see some plans and some arguments about the value for money and what it could do. Below the top tier most clubs are semi pro - at our level (tier 3) I'm not sure any get paid. Given its profile is going up, and will get a further boost from the Euros in England this summer, and Denise's personal millions, let alone B365, if we could shovel cash their way without buggering up FFP, then it would seem a good idea. Even allowing for 3-4 professionals could make a difference. Who knows where it will go, but growth is likely and in my view the increased coverage is also a good thing, given the historic neglect and even sabotage of women's football and sport in general by horrible old men for decades if not centuries! I think something like that would make more sense than going the whole hog straight away. I think the development side of it needs to be there. And the way I'd look at it is having 2 strands of that almost. A general one for girls of all abilities and a more "elite" route.
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Post by lagwafis on Mar 9, 2022 14:58:10 GMT
They can fund what they choose to. But each year for the sake of a couple of days salary for Denise Coates they could start a pathway for aspiring female footballers in Stoke-on-Trent to get into the game permanently, help get more and more into the sport through community projects, and potentially leave a legacy for after they move on. So I think it would be worth it personally but it's not my cash...... Would that need a full time team though? I'm not sure it does unless they climbed the ladder and justified it. And I still think you could do the other stuff (that I agree should be happening) without full time costs for a team. You'd need some full timers to achieve it. But this is why I'd like to know more. I don't enough re pay structures etc. A squad of 18 on 20k a year is 360k. Is that about right? Not sure. Is it worth the money? Not sure. It's why I'd like to see some plans and some arguments about the value for money and what it could do. I know next to nothing about how the league structure works, the business model or salaries. From a quick google a FourFourTwo article from last year mentions - "In the Women's Super League in England, the average women's footballer salary is thought to be around £30,000. Starting salaries are supposedly around £20,000"League structure wise it looks to be as follows: FA Women's Super League (equivalent of the Premier League) - average salary £20k - £30k (according to FourFourTwo magazine in 2021) FA Woman's Championship (equivalent of the Championship) Below this you have a National League North and National League South (equivalent to League One and Two, though geographical). If we are in National League North (according to this) then the players are two promotions away from the level where players are averaging £20k - £30k. Of course, if there is no FFP you could pay whatever you want but something like this is usually dictated by the market and revenue streams at a particular level. Also, if Stoke started to pay £30k where does it leave other clubs in the same league like Brighthouse Town, Flyde and Loughborough Lightning (great name!). Do we then get accused of inflating salaries, buying success and going against the principles of FFP in football as a whole (even if this doesn't directly tie in with the mens ruling). Again, I know very little about it apart from an 'internet search' which took ten minutes. Someone please correct me if the above is incorrect!
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Post by cheadlepotter on Mar 9, 2022 15:29:09 GMT
Hopefully the next council minutes shed some light on the matter. If I had the Coates’ money I’d love to fund a successful ladies Stoke team and help a bunch of young girls to be involved in a sport I love (or hate, like last night!). But it is their money to do what they’d like with and if it’s loss making then we can’t really complain.
Games played at CW seems a reasonable idea, with the odd game at the stadium. The womens game needs to develop though so that it’s not Stoke vs some local side including some massively overweight players and Stoke winning 12-0. That’s not good for anyone.
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Post by apb1 on Mar 9, 2022 17:56:54 GMT
The average salaries in the WSL are low, but the top 4 clubs are in a different bracket - there's no salary cap which I think some other leagues do have. It wouldn't surprise me if Miedema at Arsenal is on at least 100k, while Chelsea pay crazy money, around 300k per season for some top players I've seen quoted.
Barcelona are the best club side I've seen, destroying Chelsea in the CL final last year. 4-0 after 36 mins.
A bit depressing how closely the European giants mirror the mens' game. Lyon were pretty dominant till recently but you'll see Juventus, PSG, Bayern, Barcelona, Real Madrid etc are in the later stages of the CL.
As for Stoke we seemed to have a decent womens' team a couple of years ago but then lockdowns cancelled all the games for ages and we lost whatever it was we had. It would be interesting to hear exactly what requests were made, and the rationale for refusing them. Can't imagine it was much more than small change cost wise, given the context of National League Women's football finances!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 17:59:31 GMT
The average salaries in the WSL are low, but the top 4 clubs are in a different bracket - there's no salary cap which I think some other leagues do have. It wouldn't surprise me if Miedema at Arsenal is on at least 100k, while Chelsea pay crazy money, around 300k per season for some top players I've seen quoted. Barcelona are the best club side I've seen, destroying Chelsea in the CL final last year. 4-0 after 36 mins. A bit depressing how closely the European giants mirror the mens' game. Lyon were pretty dominant till recently but you'll see Juventus, PSG, Bayern, Barcelona, Real Madrid etc are in the later stages of the CL. As for Stoke we seemed to have a decent womens' team a couple of years ago but then lockdowns cancelled all the games for ages and we lost whatever it was we had. It would be interesting to hear exactly what requests were made, and the rationale for refusing them. Can't imagine it was much more than small change cost wise, given the context of National League Women's football finances! It would. With everything I've read (thank you everyone) I still can't see the justification or need for a fully pro side. It doesn't seem like it'd add anything as things stand.
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Post by callas12 on Mar 9, 2022 22:39:07 GMT
Now the funding side of things like wages etc I do get as a reason Stoke may have decided not to push on with making Stoke Ladies a professional outfit up to this point. But it does seem to me that we had the groundwork in place to move to the next level as Chloe Jones alluded to in her departure message, but appear reluctant to.
However this is 2022 & women's football is absolutely massive now and it's an area of the game that is really growing quickly and it just seems Stoke have toyed with it for abit but decided against pushing on to take us to the next level.
Now I know its not our money and easy to say others should be spending it but I feel if the hierarchy are genuinely serious of seeing Stoke City FC progress and compete as a top club in the men's league, a professional female outfit is also required to bring our club up to scratch and to be competing with the best.
Just to glance at the WSL1, all the main clubs in the Premier League mens league are represented by women's teams. Even Reading have a womens team in WSL1 & they're meant to be in financial issues as a club but can still fund a women's team!
The WSL2 is represented by Bristol City, Charlton, Sheff Utd, Sunderland, Lewes (remember them?!) Blackburn and Watford. Financially as a club we're miles ahead of these teams. So will be interesting to see or hear what's actually going on behind the scenes coz it looks like our women's team is in a rut & with Chloe Jones leaving under the circumstances she has I'm guessing the future is looking very uncertain for the Stoke Ladies team right now.
My daughters play for Stafford Town which has girl/women teams from U10 all the way up the younger age groups to an U18, U21 and 1st team, & I'm sure other local clubs are the same. It's a growing sport that is already excelling & increasing year on year, & will continue to do so. If clubs at grass roots level are taking the Women's football seriously why aren't Stoke?
I know for a fact Port Vale also have girls teams through the various age ranges as my daughters play against their teams. All the Vale teams wear the actual Vale kits for matches and also wear the training gear etc, they look like a professional outfit and that's at U13 level! To my knowledge Stoke don't have teams in the younger age categories. Credit where credits due though my daughters have been to the Stoke Ladies school holiday training camps that they run, with Lucy Ridgeway & they thoroughly enjoy this. But there's certainly no team/league format for girls of school age that alot of other clubs do within Stoke.
I've actually taken my daughters to 2x women's FA Cup finals at Wembley pre covid, Arsenal v Chelsea one year and Man City v West Ham the other, which were trips organised by Stafford Town and its been a great family day out, & that's watching on as a neutral. Would of been amazing see a women's Stoke team there but think that ships sailed for the foreseeable.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 22:41:57 GMT
Now the funding side of things like wages etc I do get as a reason Stoke may have decided not to push on with making Stoke Ladies a professional outfit up to this point. But it does seem to me that we had the groundwork in place to move to the next level as Chloe Jones alluded to in her departure message, but appear reluctant to. However this is 2022 & women's football is absolutely massive now and it's an area of the game that is really growing quickly and it just seems Stoke have toyed with it for abit but decided against pushing on to take us to the next level. Now I know its not our money and easy to say others should be spending it but I feel if the hierarchy are genuinely serious of seeing Stoke City FC progress and compete as a top club in the men's league, a professional female outfit is also required to bring our club up to scratch and to be competing with the best. Just to glance at the WSL1, all the main clubs in the Premier League mens league are represented by women's teams. Even Reading have a womens team in WSL1 & they're meant to be in financial issues as a club but can still fund a women's team! The WSL2 is represented by Bristol City, Charlton, Sheff Utd, Sunderland, Lewes (remember them?!) Blackburn and Watford. Financially as a club we're miles ahead of these teams. So will be interesting to see or hear what's actually going on behind the scenes coz it looks like our women's team is in a rut & with Chloe Jones leaving under the circumstances she has I'm guessing the future is looking very uncertain for the Stoke Ladies team right now. My daughters play for Stafford Town which has girl/women teams from U10 all the way up the younger age groups to an U18, U21 and 1st team, & I'm sure other local clubs are the same. It's a growing sport that is already excelling & increasing year on year, & will continue to do so. If clubs at grass roots level are taking the Women's football seriously why aren't Stoke? I know for a fact Port Vale also have girls teams through the various age ranges as my daughters play against their teams. All the Vale teams wear the actual Vale kits for matches and also wear the training gear etc, they look like a professional outfit and that's at U13 level! To my knowledge Stoke don't have teams in the younger age categories. Credit where credits due though my daughters have been to the Stoke Ladies school holiday training camps that they run, with Lucy Ridgeway & they thoroughly enjoy this. But there's certainly no team/league format for girls of school age that alot of other clubs do within Stoke. I've actually taken my daughters to 2x women's FA Cup finals at Wembley pre covid, Arsenal v Chelsea one year and Man City v West Ham the other, which were trips organised by their football club and its been a great day out, & that's watching on as a neutral. Would of been amazing see a women's Stoke team there but think that ships sailed for the foreseeable. I don’t agree we should have a pro team. But I’m shocked we haven’t got teams down the ages. That’s appalling.
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Post by a on Mar 9, 2022 23:06:43 GMT
Would that need a full time team though? I'm not sure it does unless they climbed the ladder and justified it. And I still think you could do the other stuff (that I agree should be happening) without full time costs for a team. You'd need some full timers to achieve it. But this is why I'd like to know more. I don't enough re pay structures etc. A squad of 18 on 20k a year is 360k. Is that about right? Not sure. Is it worth the money? Not sure. It's why I'd like to see some plans and some arguments about the value for money and what it could do. Below the top tier most clubs are semi pro - at our level (tier 3) I'm not sure any get paid. Given its profile is going up, and will get a further boost from the Euros in England this summer, and Denise's personal millions, let alone B365, if we could shovel cash their way without buggering up FFP, then it would seem a good idea. Even allowing for 3-4 professionals could make a difference. Who knows where it will go, but growth is likely and in my view the increased coverage is also a good thing, given the historic neglect and even sabotage of women's football and sport in general by horrible old men for decades if not centuries! How many years has there been a real push for womens footie now? 4,5,6 years? Is it making money? That’s the deciding factor, not ticking a Diversity and Inclusion box. If tens of thousands (across the league) of supporters won’t turn out every week like the top leagues then it’ll continue to be as popular as lower/non league, that’s how it works in essence.
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Post by apb1 on Mar 10, 2022 13:17:36 GMT
Below the top tier most clubs are semi pro - at our level (tier 3) I'm not sure any get paid. Given its profile is going up, and will get a further boost from the Euros in England this summer, and Denise's personal millions, let alone B365, if we could shovel cash their way without buggering up FFP, then it would seem a good idea. Even allowing for 3-4 professionals could make a difference. Who knows where it will go, but growth is likely and in my view the increased coverage is also a good thing, given the historic neglect and even sabotage of women's football and sport in general by horrible old men for decades if not centuries! How many years has there been a real push for womens footie now? 4,5,6 years? Is it making money? That’s the deciding factor, not ticking a Diversity and Inclusion box. If tens of thousands (across the league) of supporters won’t turn out every week like the top leagues then it’ll continue to be as popular as lower/non league, that’s how it works in essence. Well yes, if it's not attracting people it will not be popular! That's self-evident. I have to say I just don't see what the issue is with showing it on tv, there's enough other stuff (too much) already there...and while coverage in the press arguably takes space from the championship or whatever, I've never seen much decent coverage of anything much outside Chelsea, the Shit, Man City etc in my whole lifetime and I'm 57. There are tons of issues with women's football (onesidedness, lack of uptake/facilities in poorer areas), but my prediction is it will become the most popular game played by women in the next few years (if not already) and that the coverage it's receiving now will have a (limited) effect in boosting its popularity. As others have said, it's no threat to, and in any case shouldn't be compared with, men's football, which has its roots in industrial cities and century odd of being part of the national consciousness. All in all, given that girls generally have said they feel less confident in undertaking sport and are less likely to do so than boys, any presentation of a positive example is probably a good thing. Sometimes ticking diversity and inclusion boxes is a good thing if it improves society. Especially as football's history is littered with sexism and exclusion tick boxes, from banning it from happening (thanks FA) to suggesting women wear skimpy outfits (Blatter I think that was). Bring on the 2022 Euros! Sure there'll be cricket and rugby league on if you don't want to watch it
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2022 13:46:22 GMT
I think the main problem with women's football is that women are monumentally shit at it.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 10, 2022 13:53:03 GMT
Now the funding side of things like wages etc I do get as a reason Stoke may have decided not to push on with making Stoke Ladies a professional outfit up to this point. But it does seem to me that we had the groundwork in place to move to the next level as Chloe Jones alluded to in her departure message, but appear reluctant to. However this is 2022 & women's football is absolutely massive now and it's an area of the game that is really growing quickly and it just seems Stoke have toyed with it for abit but decided against pushing on to take us to the next level. Now I know its not our money and easy to say others should be spending it but I feel if the hierarchy are genuinely serious of seeing Stoke City FC progress and compete as a top club in the men's league, a professional female outfit is also required to bring our club up to scratch and to be competing with the best. Just to glance at the WSL1, all the main clubs in the Premier League mens league are represented by women's teams. Even Reading have a womens team in WSL1 & they're meant to be in financial issues as a club but can still fund a women's team! The WSL2 is represented by Bristol City, Charlton, Sheff Utd, Sunderland, Lewes (remember them?!) Blackburn and Watford. Financially as a club we're miles ahead of these teams. So will be interesting to see or hear what's actually going on behind the scenes coz it looks like our women's team is in a rut & with Chloe Jones leaving under the circumstances she has I'm guessing the future is looking very uncertain for the Stoke Ladies team right now. My daughters play for Stafford Town which has girl/women teams from U10 all the way up the younger age groups to an U18, U21 and 1st team, & I'm sure other local clubs are the same. It's a growing sport that is already excelling & increasing year on year, & will continue to do so. If clubs at grass roots level are taking the Women's football seriously why aren't Stoke? I know for a fact Port Vale also have girls teams through the various age ranges as my daughters play against their teams. All the Vale teams wear the actual Vale kits for matches and also wear the training gear etc, they look like a professional outfit and that's at U13 level! To my knowledge Stoke don't have teams in the younger age categories. Credit where credits due though my daughters have been to the Stoke Ladies school holiday training camps that they run, with Lucy Ridgeway & they thoroughly enjoy this. But there's certainly no team/league format for girls of school age that alot of other clubs do within Stoke. I've actually taken my daughters to 2x women's FA Cup finals at Wembley pre covid, Arsenal v Chelsea one year and Man City v West Ham the other, which were trips organised by their football club and its been a great day out, & that's watching on as a neutral. Would of been amazing see a women's Stoke team there but think that ships sailed for the foreseeable. I don’t agree we should have a pro team. But I’m shocked we haven’t got teams down the ages. That’s appalling. The team doesn't have to be full time I agree. But it should be integrated into the fabric of the club, the games should be played either at Newcastle Town, Clayton Wood or The Bet365 where possible. And the biggest thing is there should be girls teams of all age groups like the boys game. It's about more than getting a return for your investment it should be about getting as many girls into the game as possible and the numbers are currently growing year on year up and down the country at grass roots level.......
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Post by werrington on Mar 10, 2022 13:54:17 GMT
They are discussing it on P&G tonight at 6 with Chloe Jones in the studio
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 10, 2022 13:57:00 GMT
I don’t agree we should have a pro team. But I’m shocked we haven’t got teams down the ages. That’s appalling. The team doesn't have to be full time I agree. But it should be integrated into the fabric of the club, the games should be played either at Newcastle Town, Clayton Wood or The Bet365 where possible. And the biggest thing is there should be girls teams of all age groups like the boys game. It's about more than getting a return for your investment it should be about getting as many girls into the game as possible and the numbers are currently growing year on year up and down the country at grass roots level....... They play at a ground already, one that is probably better than Castle Town in all reality (from the last time I went either). The only thing I have against it is its location. I'm shocked we don't have teams down the ages. I presumed we did.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 10, 2022 14:21:36 GMT
The team doesn't have to be full time I agree. But it should be integrated into the fabric of the club, the games should be played either at Newcastle Town, Clayton Wood or The Bet365 where possible. And the biggest thing is there should be girls teams of all age groups like the boys game. It's about more than getting a return for your investment it should be about getting as many girls into the game as possible and the numbers are currently growing year on year up and down the country at grass roots level....... They play at a ground already, one that is probably better than Castle Town in all reality (from the last time I went either). The only thing I have against it is its location. I'm shocked we don't have teams down the ages. I presumed we did. Playing at Norton Utd makes no sense though, the pitch at Newcastle Town is far superior.......
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