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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2021 15:36:13 GMT
He is definitely no Kante , agreed and I like him at a centre half, but according to Wikipedia he played 27 games for Watford and 5 for Udinese mainly as a holding midfielder en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_WilmotWith Thompson out of contention , who would you you like to see slot in to a CDM role , if we are being over run ? Where does it say he played mainly as a holding midfielder sorry? Under the heading ...style of play
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Nov 21, 2021 15:38:14 GMT
Where does it say he played mainly as a holding midfielder sorry? Under the heading ...style of play It says he played there for Stevenage’s youth team and then during 2018-19, a season in which he made six appearances for Watford and five for Udinese. He’s played the majority of his career as a centre back.
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Post by masterpotter on Nov 21, 2021 16:01:23 GMT
Moan moan moan. You upset because we won and ruined your Saturday. Very sad You're not very bright are you - bless. Gouranga. Why do you say that. Believe me I’m a lot brighter than you will ever be. You’re just very sad constantly criticising gouranga 😴
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Post by Trouserdog on Nov 21, 2021 16:04:07 GMT
The midfield was bypassed a lot yesterday- we were hitting it long out of defence and they were hitting it long too.
None of the three had a good game though.
Now that we've moved away from the passing-out-of-defence tactic (with Batth in the backline, we had to), then it's less important to have a DM who can take the ball off the defence and pass it around. That's what MON saw sawyers as- a playmaker who would take the ball off the CBs and then dictate the play from deep. We really have to get someone in with a bit of steel in that position in January.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Nov 21, 2021 17:27:25 GMT
The midfield was bypassed a lot yesterday- we were hitting it long out of defence and they were hitting it long too. None of the three had a good game though. Now that we've moved away from the passing-out-of-defence tactic (with Batth in the backline, we had to), then it's less important to have a DM who can take the ball off the defence and pass it around. That's what MON saw sawyers as- a playmaker who would take the ball off the CBs and then dictate the play from deep. We really have to get someone in with a bit of steel in that position in January. Have we, we still tried it yesterday. It was laughable when Allen dropped deep took the ball off the defence and immediately gave it away, hopefully you're right but it still seemed like it with passing it short from goal kicks etc.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 21, 2021 17:28:47 GMT
The midfield was bypassed a lot yesterday- we were hitting it long out of defence and they were hitting it long too. None of the three had a good game though. Now that we've moved away from the passing-out-of-defence tactic (with Batth in the backline, we had to), then it's less important to have a DM who can take the ball off the defence and pass it around. That's what MON saw sawyers as- a playmaker who would take the ball off the CBs and then dictate the play from deep. We really have to get someone in with a bit of steel in that position in January. Have we, we still tried it yesterday. It was laughable when Allen dropped deep took the ball of the defence and immediately gave it away, hopefully you're right but it still seemed like it with passing it short from goal kicks etc. Davies rolling the ball out to Batth time and time again 🤦♂️
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Post by pottersrule on Nov 21, 2021 17:38:36 GMT
I'd rather have both Vrancic and Sawyers starting and one of Thompson and Allen. More worrying for me is the total disappearance of Tymon. He’s been played to much. Needed a rest weeks ago He's just had 2 bloody weeks off!
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Post by pottersrule on Nov 21, 2021 17:40:44 GMT
Have we, we still tried it yesterday. It was laughable when Allen dropped deep took the ball of the defence and immediately gave it away, hopefully you're right but it still seemed like it with passing it short from goal kicks etc. Davies rolling the ball out to Batth time and time again 🤦♂️ Fills you with dread every time doesn't it.
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Post by Trouserdog on Nov 21, 2021 18:51:57 GMT
Have we, we still tried it yesterday. It was laughable when Allen dropped deep took the ball of the defence and immediately gave it away, hopefully you're right but it still seemed like it with passing it short from goal kicks etc. Davies rolling the ball out to Batth time and time again 🤦♂️ That's not hitting it long out of defence..that's the GK rolling it to a CB.🤦♂️ What did Batth do with it? Knock it from side to side between the CBs like we were doing earlier in the season? No, did he fuck. For the most part he hit it longer up to Fletcher and Brown.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 21, 2021 19:06:10 GMT
Davies rolling the ball out to Batth time and time again 🤦♂️ That's not hitting it long out of defence..that's the GK rolling it to a CB.🤦♂️ What did Batth do with it? Knock it from side to side between the CBs like we were doing earlier in the season? No, did he fuck. For the most part he hit it longer up to Fletcher and Brown. He gave it to Ostigard generally. We tried to play out from the back for most of the game.
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Post by Trouserdog on Nov 21, 2021 19:11:05 GMT
That's not hitting it long out of defence..that's the GK rolling it to a CB.🤦♂️ What did Batth do with it? Knock it from side to side between the CBs like we were doing earlier in the season? No, did he fuck. For the most part he hit it longer up to Fletcher and Brown. He gave it to Ostigard generally. We tried to play out from the back for most of the game. Sometimes he/we did, but in general we've been much more direct since Batth came back into the side.
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Post by leicspotter on Nov 21, 2021 19:13:18 GMT
We still need an "athlete" in midfield to provide the drive and energy we can't get from Allen, Sawyers or Vrancic. Granted we won't be able to get an N'Zonzi but there must be someone out there who could fill the role?
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Post by milky on Nov 21, 2021 19:13:30 GMT
The problem with us playing it long with this system is its almost impossible to create the overload to get Tymon and Smith involved.
And the problem with trying to play from the back when we kept giving it to DB ,which we did a lot, was obvious. He either passed sidewards to Ostigard or Chester or played it short to Allen.
It's how I saw it anyway.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 21, 2021 19:25:41 GMT
He gave it to Ostigard generally. We tried to play out from the back for most of the game. Sometimes he/we did, but in general we've been much more direct since Batth came back into the side. Playing short was still the main game plan though. We need to hoof and drop 10 yards.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Nov 21, 2021 19:30:08 GMT
The problem with us playing it long with this system is its almost impossible to create the overload to get Tymon and Smith involved. And the problem with trying to play from the back when we kept giving it to DB ,which we did a lot, was obvious. He either passed sidewards to Ostigard or Chester or played it short to Allen. It's how I saw it anyway. This is not having a go mate but what exactly does Souttar do any different to that? Don't get me wrong Batth isn't a footballer and he gives me the willies when he is put under pressure with the ball at his feet. But yesterday he didn't do much wrong. And in fairness he made a couple of decent diagonal punts in behind their wingbacks not unlike Souttar at his most imperious.
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Post by fentonstokie1 on Nov 21, 2021 19:31:33 GMT
It's a mystery how we've kept 3 consecutive clean sheets with these non tackling midfield players who don't do any of the 'dirty work'. We clearly desperately need a right hard dirty bastard in that midfield......don't we?? The manager seems to think not, I think he's wrong. Even against struggling sides once they have to up there game they all just roll over our midfield, a better team would have punished us yesterday.
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Post by milky on Nov 21, 2021 19:35:40 GMT
The problem with us playing it long with this system is its almost impossible to create the overload to get Tymon and Smith involved. And the problem with trying to play from the back when we kept giving it to DB ,which we did a lot, was obvious. He either passed sidewards to Ostigard or Chester or played it short to Allen. It's how I saw it anyway. This is not having a go mate but what exactly does Souttar do any different to that? Don't get me wrong Batth isn't a footballer and he gives me the willies when he is put under pressure with the ball at his feet. But yesterday he didn't do much wrong. And in fairness he made a couple of decent diagonal punts in behind their wingbacks not unlike Souttar at his most imperious. I just think Souttar can see more what's happening in front of him ,is quicker in thought and we move it quicker through the pitch. No problem mate ,just how I see it and it's no fault of DB ,it's not really his game and I don't expect him to turn into Bobby Moore. It's not his playing style.
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Post by fentonstokie1 on Nov 21, 2021 19:37:05 GMT
Well, I strayed onto here to cheer me up after a shitty week, to enjoy the reaction to another useful Stoke City win. Wish I hadn't fucking bothered. There's some properly miserable bastards on this message board, who like nothing more than bathing in negativity. Life is way too short for this. I take it you didn't watch the whole game, we won and three in a row is wonderful but our lack of grit in midfield is a worry as once the other side decides to have a go our midfield is wide open and will be exploited by better sides.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Nov 21, 2021 19:42:17 GMT
This is not having a go mate but what exactly does Souttar do any different to that? Don't get me wrong Batth isn't a footballer and he gives me the willies when he is put under pressure with the ball at his feet. But yesterday he didn't do much wrong. And in fairness he made a couple of decent diagonal punts in behind their wingbacks not unlike Souttar at his most imperious. I just think Souttar can see more what's happening in front of him ,is quicker in thought and we move it quicker through the pitch. No problem mate ,just how I see it and it's no fault of DB ,it's not really his game and I don't expect him to turn into Bobby Moore. It's not his playing style. Oh I agree mate Harry is head and shoulders above Batth in mind and body. I just don't think we did a great deal different at the back to what we've done all season. It was the midfield that killed us yesterday and unfortunately we were down to the bare bones. Apart from playing a centre half who some fancy as a defensive midfielder, but none have ever seen him play there, and Tom fucking Ince that was as good as it gets until we start getting a few back from injury or limping through to January.
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Post by wakeypotter on Nov 21, 2021 20:52:01 GMT
He’s been played to much. Needed a rest weeks ago He's just had 2 bloody weeks off! 😃
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Post by scfcno1fan on Nov 21, 2021 21:43:57 GMT
Batth was looking for Allen to pass to.
But he didn’t want the ball. Just kept moving behind their players.
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Post by kustokie on Nov 21, 2021 21:54:29 GMT
We’ll have to manage without much of a midfield until Powell returns in January. Even then he’ll have to be phased in and unfortunately he has a target on his back and is quite injury prone. Also the best use of Powell might be up front with Campbell. I’d start Vrancic instead of Allen or Thompson, but O’Neil seems to see it differently and somehow we are 4th without our best players.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Nov 21, 2021 23:44:51 GMT
Davies rolling the ball out to Batth time and time again 🤦♂️ That's not hitting it long out of defence..that's the GK rolling it to a CB.🤦♂️ What did Batth do with it? Knock it from side to side between the CBs like we were doing earlier in the season? No, did he fuck. For the most part he hit it longer up to Fletcher and Brown. It was pretty clear they were still meant to be passing it about, but because they weren't capable or the midfield were hiding they had to resort to lumping it pretty much every time after two or three passes between themselves.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Nov 22, 2021 8:19:20 GMT
My reading of the game was that after we scored the early goal the midfield sat back and defended the lead. The problem we had during our recent dodgy spell was holding on to a lead and I suspect this was a deliberate tactic. The problem was that this didn't suit the midfield - they would have looked far more comfortable further up the pitch taking the game to the opposition. They didn't look great and although Peterborough had a lot of position they weren't exactly putting the defence (who looked pretty comfortable all game) under a lot of pressure. To be fair on the midfield they had to play against type and put in a disciplined performance - they just aren't that good at playing that way.
The defence mixed it up more than usual going long more often than usual but still tried to play out of defence a good deal of the time which was less effective in large part because the whole of the midfield were sitting so deep. I can't recall Batth misplacing a single pass. Wilmott's passing at times this season has been poor and he gets away with it while Batth gets slated for not being as good a footballer and "potentially" making errors he doesn't actually make.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2021 8:27:44 GMT
needs addressing in January but MONs hands tied today. Has he been out with Frank Bough?
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Post by a on Nov 22, 2021 10:54:07 GMT
Didn’t Sawyers get an assist?
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Post by theoptimist on Nov 22, 2021 12:07:47 GMT
Didn’t Sawyers get an assist? Yes. A simple short pass for Vrancic. To be fair the real assist was from defenders backside!
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