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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 7, 2021 16:46:22 GMT
Fuck it I'll say it
He was a massive hindrance today, our weak link.
He was awful, absolutely awful. And he's trying to play more positionally I can see that, but having no impact on the game at all.
The manager needs to show the courage to drop him. I hope he improves and finds some semblance of fitness but he was miles off today. Nowhere near ready
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Post by chuckrocky on Aug 7, 2021 16:48:32 GMT
He really was dreadful.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 16:51:53 GMT
via mobile
Post by scfcno1fan on Aug 7, 2021 16:51:53 GMT
Fuck it I'll say it He was a massive hindrance today, our weak link. He was awful, absolutely awful. And he's trying to play more positionally I can see that, but having no impact on the game at all. The manager needs to show the courage to drop him. I hope he improves and finds some semblance of fitness but he was miles off today. Nowhere near ready He’s made him captain, I doubt he’ll drop him. I was intrigued to hear how he played today. Doesn’t sound good so far.
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Post by houstonsteve on Aug 7, 2021 16:52:48 GMT
its never easy to be critical after a win but I agree.
However, as club captain I can't see how MON doesn't try to play him every week but he is not the answer at CDM in my view. Too weak in the tackle, can't make simple passes, still finds himself way up the pitch half the time. its a tricky one but this position will make or break us this season unless we are going to be having 3-2, 4-3s etc every weak and rely on outscoring everyone we play because with Allen at CDM we will get overrun in midfield against the better teams unless he improves dramatically.
Hopefully Allen will grow into the position and this all becomes moot though.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Aug 7, 2021 16:53:23 GMT
We're a proper DM from having a decent starting 11.
But as scfcno1fan says, no way he'll be dropped after being made captain.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 16:54:31 GMT
Simply tries too hard, and it ultimately holds him back.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 16:54:32 GMT
via mobile
Post by wearepremierleague on Aug 7, 2021 16:54:32 GMT
I’ve backed him every season. Today and last week he was absolutely abysmal. Needs to sort it out, and quick
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Post by mickey4137 on Aug 7, 2021 16:54:39 GMT
He looked off the pace against Swift who was excellent. He was better after he came off.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 16:57:39 GMT
via mobile
Post by lordb on Aug 7, 2021 16:57:39 GMT
Poor today
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Post by theonlooker on Aug 7, 2021 16:59:48 GMT
The whole midfield isn't right if we're honest and Allen will be the fall guy for the fact that he is the only real genuine central midfielder in there. We literally handed the two inside channels to Readings wide men and full backs all game as Powell and Vrancic cannot and to be frank, should not be playing where there are. The fact that Reading are so shit meant we got away with it.
I've said it in another thread but all three players are the spare men in a three man midfield, and should be played alongside ( in Allen's case) and in front of (in Powell and Vrancic's case) two more mobile destroyer types. We are playing Allen as the deeper ball winner type infront of the back three with two number 8's in Powell and Vrancic. That isn't Allen's game nor is it Powell's game. Vrancic at a push alongside the right man. At the very least we could play Allen and Vrancic alongside a destroyer. How we are playing now will eventually set them all up to fail. Eventually Vrancic will be bypassed, Powell will be sucked deeper rendering his creativity null and void and Allen will be hung out to dry. Everything is new at the moment but we all know that when cracks appear if they aren't corrected they get bigger over time. A proper top end Championship side will absolutely steam roller that midfield.
I'm no fan of Allen at all, especially post relegation, but to slaughter him for his performance in 'that' midfield is totally unfair IMO.
Win or no win, it's crap and it needs changing.
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Post by chesterfieldstokie on Aug 7, 2021 16:59:55 GMT
hes shit, runsaround like a headless chicken, second touch is always a tackle, signing him was the start of our downfall
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 7, 2021 17:04:44 GMT
I thought he shielded the defence quite well.
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Post by maine on Aug 7, 2021 17:05:02 GMT
ALL of the above (with the exception of 'Onlooker') are absurdly prejudiced and simply wrong. (in my opinion obviously!)
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:05:03 GMT
via mobile
Post by scfcno1fan on Aug 7, 2021 17:05:03 GMT
The whole midfield isn't right if we're honest and Allen will be the fall guy for the fact that he is the only real genuine central midfielder in there. We literally handed the two inside channels to Readings wide men and full backs all game as Powell and Vrancic cannot and to be frank, should not be playing where there are. The fact that Reading are so shit meant we got away with it.
I've said it in another thread but all three players are the spare men in a three man midfield, and should be played alongside ( in Allen's case) and in front of (in Powell and Vrancic's case) two more mobile destroyer types. We are playing Allen as the deeper ball winner type infront of the back three with two number 8's in Powell and Vrancic. That isn't Allen's game nor is it Powell's game. Vrancic at a push alongside the right man. At the very least we could play Allen and Vrancic alongside a destroyer. How we are playing now will eventually set them all up to fail. Eventually Vrancic will be bypassed, Powell will be sucked deeper rendering his creativity null and void and Allen will be hung out to dry. Everything is new at the moment but we all know that when cracks appear if they aren't corrected they get bigger over time. A proper top end Championship side will absolutely steam roller that midfield. I'm no fan of Allen at all, especially post relegation, but to slaughter him for his performance in 'that' midfield is totally unfair IMO. Win or no win, it's crap and it needs changing.
Good points. Midfield and midfield balance is definitely a worry area.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:05:45 GMT
via mobile
Post by nonameface on Aug 7, 2021 17:05:45 GMT
Thought he looked okay today, but can easily see him getting overrun against other midfields.
Never been a fan of his, his reputation has kept him in the team ever since signing him. That said before his most recent injury, the best he's played for us was under MON, so fingers crossed he can replicate that.
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Post by Caerwrangonpotter on Aug 7, 2021 17:08:13 GMT
Unless a bid of some sorts comes in for him before the end of the window then he is here for good
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:09:03 GMT
via mobile
Post by wearestoke80 on Aug 7, 2021 17:09:03 GMT
Poor today. Think it’s about time he moved on
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Post by zerps on Aug 7, 2021 17:18:08 GMT
He’s never had, or will have, the Stoke dna.
I can’t believe he’s been here so long.
A leftover from our relegation muppets.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:18:17 GMT
via mobile
Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 7, 2021 17:18:17 GMT
11 minutes for his first pass to touch.
Never goal side as per.
Very poor.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:18:47 GMT
via mobile
Post by chuckrocky on Aug 7, 2021 17:18:47 GMT
His ‘assist’ for Reading’s first goal pretty much summed him up. He was trying bless him but I lost count of the time he turned over possession.
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Post by houstonsteve on Aug 7, 2021 17:20:08 GMT
His ‘assist’ for Reading’s first goal pretty much summed him up. He was trying bless him but I lost count of the time he turned over possession. that was Vrancic
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Post by wuzza on Aug 7, 2021 17:26:47 GMT
I think Joe is a quality footballer who never gives less than 100%. There we go.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:33:01 GMT
via mobile
Post by greenhoff on Aug 7, 2021 17:33:01 GMT
The balance of the midfield wasnt great but Allen was really poor today. I honestly think he needs a move away q
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 7, 2021 17:35:28 GMT
The whole midfield isn't right if we're honest and Allen will be the fall guy for the fact that he is the only real genuine central midfielder in there. We literally handed the two inside channels to Readings wide men and full backs all game as Powell and Vrancic cannot and to be frank, should not be playing where there are. The fact that Reading are so shit meant we got away with it.
I've said it in another thread but all three players are the spare men in a three man midfield, and should be played alongside ( in Allen's case) and in front of (in Powell and Vrancic's case) two more mobile destroyer types. We are playing Allen as the deeper ball winner type infront of the back three with two number 8's in Powell and Vrancic. That isn't Allen's game nor is it Powell's game. Vrancic at a push alongside the right man. At the very least we could play Allen and Vrancic alongside a destroyer. How we are playing now will eventually set them all up to fail. Eventually Vrancic will be bypassed, Powell will be sucked deeper rendering his creativity null and void and Allen will be hung out to dry. Everything is new at the moment but we all know that when cracks appear if they aren't corrected they get bigger over time. A proper top end Championship side will absolutely steam roller that midfield.
I'm no fan of Allen at all, especially post relegation, but to slaughter him for his performance in 'that' midfield is totally unfair IMO.
Win or no win, it's crap and it needs changing.
In what type of midfield do you play him though? Where should be play? How? I'm struggling, what is his place in the modern game? He can't sit in, I'm struggling to think of what he can do these days
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 17:40:35 GMT
You knew it was coming no matter what
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:41:43 GMT
via mobile
Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 7, 2021 17:41:43 GMT
His ‘assist’ for Reading’s first goal pretty much summed him up. He was trying bless him but I lost count of the time he turned over possession. that was Vrancic What actually happened? I knew it came off a Stoke player so could save myself at being outraged with the ref for ignoring the liner but not a clue as to what actually happened.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:42:05 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 17:42:05 GMT
I thought it was the most dominant performance of a midfield three that we’ve shown since being relegated. We weren’t dominant, but it’s a lot better than I’ve seen the Stoke midfield play.
My biggest concern was three pretty slow centre backs.
Out of the three in the middle though, I’d rather we swap Allen out if we can get a real defensive midfielder in.
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Joe Allen
Aug 7, 2021 17:42:54 GMT
via mobile
Post by theonlooker on Aug 7, 2021 17:42:54 GMT
The whole midfield isn't right if we're honest and Allen will be the fall guy for the fact that he is the only real genuine central midfielder in there. We literally handed the two inside channels to Readings wide men and full backs all game as Powell and Vrancic cannot and to be frank, should not be playing where there are. The fact that Reading are so shit meant we got away with it.
I've said it in another thread but all three players are the spare men in a three man midfield, and should be played alongside ( in Allen's case) and in front of (in Powell and Vrancic's case) two more mobile destroyer types. We are playing Allen as the deeper ball winner type infront of the back three with two number 8's in Powell and Vrancic. That isn't Allen's game nor is it Powell's game. Vrancic at a push alongside the right man. At the very least we could play Allen and Vrancic alongside a destroyer. How we are playing now will eventually set them all up to fail. Eventually Vrancic will be bypassed, Powell will be sucked deeper rendering his creativity null and void and Allen will be hung out to dry. Everything is new at the moment but we all know that when cracks appear if they aren't corrected they get bigger over time. A proper top end Championship side will absolutely steam roller that midfield.
I'm no fan of Allen at all, especially post relegation, but to slaughter him for his performance in 'that' midfield is totally unfair IMO.
Win or no win, it's crap and it needs changing.
In what type of midfield do you play him though? Where should be play? How? I'm struggling, what is his place in the modern game? He can't sit in, I'm struggling to think of what he can do these days The problem is, ever since he's been at Stoke we've never played him in his proper role. At Swansea and Liverpool he was used as a ball playing 6, alongside a ball winner. At Stoke he's been used as a box to boxer, a number 10 and now a player to sit in front of the back three/four. His best spell for me came alongside Clucas under ONeill at the start, when he briefly played 4231 and even then it still wasn't using him quite right. All that said, what do you expect from a player that has frankly been messed around since the day he walked through the door? You say he can't sit any more and I'd probably agree, because in my mind he hasn't been the same player since clever clogs Hughes tried to convert him to a goalscoring number 10. We simply have to give him an extended run in a midfield next to a destroyer and get him back to doing what he does best, something he hasn't been allowed to do since 2016, 5 years ago. It's a long time.
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Post by pottersrule on Aug 7, 2021 17:46:35 GMT
Fuck it I'll say it He was a massive hindrance today, our weak link. He was awful, absolutely awful. And he's trying to play more positionally I can see that, but having no impact on the game at all. The manager needs to show the courage to drop him. I hope he improves and finds some semblance of fitness but he was miles off today. Nowhere near ready He was poor today against a cracking opponent in Swift.I think to drop him after one poor performance is a bit harsh and Thompson as his replacement doesn't really do it for me.We need a defensive midfielder sooner rather than later for sure.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 17:46:57 GMT
His ‘assist’ for Reading’s first goal pretty much summed him up. He was trying bless him but I lost count of the time he turned over possession. Summed a few up on here as wasn't even him
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