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Post by AlbertTatlock on Sept 28, 2020 12:18:00 GMT
I know we lost by 2 to Brizzle but from a Stoke view we could well be looking at a binary season, ultra defensive 5-3-1-1 even against 10 men and at home. I know it's early door but the signs are worrying as MON seems to want to stick with this system. If it works and we get to the play-offs or better then everyone will be applauding it but got it's fucking boring. We looked very good when things clicked last season and scored some good goals with some good victories, yes we got spanked a couple of times but surely all we need to do was improve on what we were already doing to take it up a notch. Gouranga.  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 12:25:57 GMT
I know we lost by 2 to Brizzle but from a Stoke view we could well be looking at a binary season, ultra defensive 5-3-1-1 even against 10 men and at home. I know it's early door but the signs are worrying as MON seems to want to stick with this system. If it works and we get to the play-offs or better then everyone will be applauding it but got it's fucking boring. We looked very good when things clicked last season and scored some good goals with some good victories, yes we got spanked a couple of times but surely all we need to do was improve on what we were already doing to take it up a notch. Gouranga. Apparently O'Neill sends the team out with a totally different formation and attacking tactics according to his post-match interviews, but the players revert to the tactics that were instilled in them by Rowett and Jones, and their own previous managers; the manager brings in new players but they just follow the lead of those who were here before. |
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Post by shrewspotter on Sept 28, 2020 12:29:51 GMT
The last 6 games of last season yielded 12 goals and we conceded 7 including 5 at Leeds
I just think our players have been a bit tentative early season but I feel it will click
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Post by AlbertTatlock on Sept 28, 2020 12:30:48 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. |
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Post by shrewspotter on Sept 28, 2020 12:33:58 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. whats a crock of shit?? |
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Post by EccyStokie on Sept 28, 2020 12:45:55 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. We signed Souttar in 2016 but I get your point. |
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Post by nottsover60 on Sept 28, 2020 12:48:57 GMT
We should have had at least 3 on Saturday and could have had 5. If it hadn't been for Davies they would have scored at least one so I wouldn't say we are heading for a binary season. O'Neill might set up with a fairly defensive team but his tactics are nothing like those of Pulis. We generally start a match with a high tempo press, our full backs, centre halves and defensive midfielders are often seen in the box at times other than set pieces and last season we scored freely under O'Neill. . If we suffer a binary season it will be down to players who cannot score.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 28, 2020 13:52:16 GMT
In the binary season Pulis instructed the team to play defensively and nick a goal, usually from a set piece - i.e. we set up to be boring. I don't believe O'Neill is deliberately setting the team to play a boring defensive game - the reason it's looking boring is because the players aren't getting on the front foot. 532 is defensive, 352 isn't - it all depends on where the wing backs spend most of their time and at the moment they are sitting too deep. The other thing that can make it less effective is over reliance on the long ball by the CBs to the strikers - which is something else we've done too much of so far.
If the players get the system the goals will come. If they don't then yes change it - but then you are likely to get another goal drought as they get used to that system.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 14:05:57 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. whats a crock of shit?? My opinion... |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 28, 2020 14:31:17 GMT
In the binary season Pulis instructed the team to play defensively and nick a goal, usually from a set piece - i.e. we set up to be boring. I don't believe O'Neill is deliberately setting the team to play a boring defensive game - the reason it's looking boring is because the players aren't getting on the front foot. 532 is defensive, 352 isn't - it all depends on where the wing backs spend most of their time and at the moment they are sitting too deep. The other thing that can make it less effective is over reliance on the long ball by the CBs to the strikers - which is something else we've done too much of so far. If the players get the system the goals will come. If they don't then yes change it - but then you are likely to get another goal drought as they get used to that system. It's also because the key elements the system needs to succeed offensively aren't filled by players who fit it. Neither wing back is a good fit, and the nominal 'creative' midfielders aren't - which is why we're struggling for fluidity and creativity. |
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Post by AlbertTatlock on Sept 28, 2020 14:33:38 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. We signed Souttar in 2016 but I get your point. You are correct but MON is the only Stoke manager to give him a game. Gouranga. |
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Post by AlbertTatlock on Sept 28, 2020 14:58:13 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. whats a crock of shit?? It was aimed at kpsja's quote about MON (not kpsja's opinion). If MON expects us to believe that he must also think we all believe in Leprechauns. Gouranga. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 28, 2020 15:56:30 GMT
In the binary season Pulis instructed the team to play defensively and nick a goal, usually from a set piece - i.e. we set up to be boring. I don't believe O'Neill is deliberately setting the team to play a boring defensive game - the reason it's looking boring is because the players aren't getting on the front foot. 532 is defensive, 352 isn't - it all depends on where the wing backs spend most of their time and at the moment they are sitting too deep. The other thing that can make it less effective is over reliance on the long ball by the CBs to the strikers - which is something else we've done too much of so far. If the players get the system the goals will come. If they don't then yes change it - but then you are likely to get another goal drought as they get used to that system. It's also because the key elements the system needs to succeed offensively aren't filled by players who fit it. Neither wing back is a good fit, and the nominal 'creative' midfielders aren't - which is why we're struggling for fluidity and creativity. I agree other than possibly Tymon (who is a bit weak defensively) we don't have natural wing backs (I've assumed Edwards isn't in the reckoning because he's so far out of favour. However Smith does have a cross on him so the issue there is more to do with him having confidence to go forward. Powell and Clucas have the potential to be creative but haven't started well. TOB has the potential to be a very creative asset and if that assist on Saturday is anything to go by so as Mikel. We've got Allen to come back as well and O'Neill appears to thinking of giving Tymon a more central role which could be interesting. I don't think we've cracked 532 yet but I still disagree with the OP about it being inevitable that it will result in a binary season - it's how we play it. But I do agree with you there is still a question as to whether we have the personnel to pull it off as intended, |
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Post by thisisouryear on Sept 28, 2020 16:12:45 GMT
It always takes a few games to get going, it's not worth reading too much into performances this early in the season. We haven't really been that goal shy under MON on the whole so I fully expect us to kick on after 10 games, maybe before that.
We are getting points on the board early on so that's a positive.
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Post by lordb on Sept 28, 2020 16:13:13 GMT
Results have been binary but to compare the perfomances...
sorry but there it's not a tenable comparison
shit bin
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 28, 2020 16:33:50 GMT
Results have been binary but to compare the perfomances... sorry but there it's not a tenable comparison shit bin To be honest I think if you compared shots on target it wouldn't be far off binary shite and we certainly aren't the entertainers by any measure. It doesn't have to be like this, certainly not at home. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 16:35:29 GMT
What a crock of shit that is. MON has bought in Fox, Souttar, Fletcher, Brown, Mikel, Davies, TOB and Chester who all started on Saturday. This is his team. Gouranga. Davies was bought by Jones - who never played him. Make of it what you will, but the team does not play the way O'Neill and Albert Tatlock want the team to play. So why don't they? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 16:38:54 GMT
It was aimed at kpsja's quote about MON (not kpsja's opinion). If MON expects us to believe that he must also think we all believe in Leprechauns. Gouranga. In what way does my qoute differ from my opinion...? Don't bother answering. I disagree. |
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Post by lordb on Sept 28, 2020 18:29:47 GMT
Results have been binary but to compare the perfomances... sorry but there it's not a tenable comparison shit bin To be honest I think if you compared shots on target it wouldn't be far off binary shite and we certainly aren't the entertainers by any measure. It doesn't have to be like this, certainly not at home. The stats say one thing but there is no comparison really TP is the only manager I can think of who has defended a 1.0 defecit. Not joking either, 1.0 down with 15 minutes to go every other manager goes more attacking (how much varies of course) TP wouldn't. Fullbacks fined for crossing the halfway line e.t.c. It's not the same is it. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 28, 2020 18:33:28 GMT
To be honest I think if you compared shots on target it wouldn't be far off binary shite and we certainly aren't the entertainers by any measure. It doesn't have to be like this, certainly not at home. The stats say one thing but there is no comparison really TP is the only manager I can think of who has defended a 1.0 defecit. Not joking either, 1.0 down with 15 minutes to go every other manager goes more attacking (how much varies of course) TP wouldn't. Fullbacks fined for crossing the halfway line e.t.c. It's not the same is it. I think our efforts to chase down a a one goal deficit last Sunday speaks for itself. The reasons may be different but when you look at our set up, are they so much? Really? |
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Post by lordb on Sept 28, 2020 18:35:23 GMT
The stats say one thing but there is no comparison really TP is the only manager I can think of who has defended a 1.0 defecit. Not joking either, 1.0 down with 15 minutes to go every other manager goes more attacking (how much varies of course) TP wouldn't. Fullbacks fined for crossing the halfway line e.t.c. It's not the same is it. I think our efforts to chase down a a one goal deficit last Sunday speaks for itself. The reasons may be different but when you look at our set up, are they so much? Really? Yes, we are currently too defensive Which makes it vastly more attacking than the Binary season Like comparing a Korma with a Vindaloo |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 28, 2020 18:42:16 GMT
I think our efforts to chase down a a one goal deficit last Sunday speaks for itself. The reasons may be different but when you look at our set up, are they so much? Really? Yes, we are currently too defensive Which makes it vastly more attacking than the Binary season Like comparing a Korma with a Vindaloo We didn't have a single shot on target allegedly chasing a game at home in the Championship with a squad worth tens of millions. It was pretty disgraceful even if you don't want to call it binary. |
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Post by bgreen13 on Sept 28, 2020 18:47:30 GMT
How many seasons have we started off slowly?
At least we've got off the mark points wise this time. The players will get into thier stride and if they don't we seem to (for once) have decent depth to our squad.
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Post by leicspotter on Sept 28, 2020 18:50:36 GMT
Bring back the "cage"  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 19:50:36 GMT
We've just got the balance wrong at the moment but I trust MON to work it out. He's an intelligent manager.
Wouldn't be surprised if we add a more mobile CB if we can ship a few more out. Don't think he would of got Fox in if he was wedded to 352.
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Post by Waggy on Sept 28, 2020 19:58:17 GMT
How many seasons have we started off slowly? At least we've got off the mark points wise this time. The players will get into thier stride and if they don't we seem to (for once) have decent depth to our squad. Macari’s Division 2 championship winning got off to a slow start. We need to get behind the only manager in a few years that as given the team a bit of fight and us a bit of hope. |
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Post by boskampsflaps on Sept 28, 2020 21:24:40 GMT
How many seasons have we started off slowly? At least we've got off the mark points wise this time. The players will get into thier stride and if they don't we seem to (for once) have decent depth to our squad. Apart from at wing back which this set up relies heavily upon, we currently have none. |
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Post by boskampsflaps on Sept 28, 2020 21:26:07 GMT
We've just got the balance wrong at the moment but I trust MON to work it out. He's an intelligent manager. Wouldn't be surprised if we add a more mobile CB if we can ship a few more out. Don't think he would of got Fox in if he was wedded to 352. Even if we lose one we don't need another CB, Collins/Batth are good enough back up as it stands. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 21:57:34 GMT
I've been pretty critical of how the manager has set up this season but it's nowhere near the dirge he served up. That was by design, this is by circumstance.
I can't be as confident as others that it will suddenly click, but I can be confident any run of binary results certainly isn't meant to be!
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Post by sergeifaye on Sept 28, 2020 22:19:37 GMT
You'd rather have the utter rubbish we've been watching for the last 3 years than a binary season where we're actually winning games?!
Do me a favour.
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