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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Sept 2, 2020 22:33:30 GMT
I see from Facebook that Lakeland Potter had to be rescued yesterday from the top of a mountain by the air ambulance. A bit dramatic, even for you, John Hope your foot's OK. That'll teach you to go on such foolhardy expeditions at your ( our) age
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Post by questionable on Sept 3, 2020 0:09:55 GMT
I hope he has insurance, costs a fortune to keep bailing people out, sure I read somewhere where the amount of people being rescued was ridiculous and they we’re considering getting people to take out private insurance to cover the rescue costs.
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Sept 3, 2020 6:50:08 GMT
I hope he has insurance, costs a fortune to keep bailing people out, sure I read somewhere where the amount of people being rescued was ridiculous and they we’re considering getting people to take out private insurance to cover the rescue costs. We don't require that for any other kind of activity which can result in emergency services being required so I don't see any good reason why we should discriminate against mountain walkers in that regard. Lakeland can ( and no doubt will ) speak for himself but it seems this incident was the result of an injury, not irresponsibility by venturing up the mountain in poor conditions etc. Just for clarity my comment about foolhardy expeditions was entirely tongue in cheek. I know that he is a very experienced fell walker and wouldn't do anything irresponsible in that regard.
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 3, 2020 7:00:33 GMT
I hope he has insurance, costs a fortune to keep bailing people out, sure I read somewhere where the amount of people being rescued was ridiculous and they we’re considering getting people to take out private insurance to cover the rescue costs. We don't require that for any other kind of activity which can result in emergency services being required so I don't see any good reason why we should discriminate against mountain walkers in that regard. Lakeland can ( and no doubt will ) speak for himself but it seems this incident was the result of an injury, not irresponsibility by venturing up the mountain in poor conditions etc. Just for clarity my comment about foolhardy expeditions was entirely tongue in cheek. I know that he is a very experienced fell walker and wouldn't do anything irresponsible in that regard. Indeed. Accidents will happen. Btw - the hills have become incredibly busy this year. Leastways, the popular ones. Some folk bump their gums about it, but I think it is wonderful. Hill walking is one of the best forms of exercise you can get - good for you physically and mentally. And something pretty much anyone can do - it’s just a matter of fitness which you easily gain the more you do. Hope Mr Lakeland is back up on a hill soon.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 7:09:55 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51."
It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor.
In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members.
Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week.
As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day.
That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks.
NOW THE IMPORTANT BIT
I have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app.
The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct.
I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Sept 3, 2020 7:27:48 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words when they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not walkers - it could change your life!My brother introduced me to what three words. I couldn't believe that there is a unique code for such small areas across the whole of the planet. As you say I gather the emergency services increasingly use it. There was also an extraordinary case where someone who had been kidnapped and locked in a container was able to use it to tell the police not only where they were, but exactly which container it was. When I first got it, I amused myself for a while with the entirely pointless activity of feeding in any three words off the top of my head, and seeing where in the world it took me to
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Post by jeycov on Sept 3, 2020 7:45:12 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad you’re ok
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Post by Clem Fandango on Sept 3, 2020 7:47:49 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad to hear you're okay mate! As for the what3words bit I work closely with the what3words guys as I work in emergency service command and control. Its a very clever algorithm they have created and is definitely a game changer but has taken some time to get off the ground. Some emergency services have got it now so that they can text you the link to the w3w website so you don't necessarily need the app.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 8:06:51 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad to hear you're okay mate! As for the what3words bit I work closely with the what3words guys as I work in emergency service command and control. Its a very clever algorithm they have created and is definitely a game changer but has taken some time to get off the ground. Some emergency services have got it now so that they can text you the link to the w3w website so you don't necessarily need the app. That's interesting. As a walker for over 50 years I got used to reading the OS Grid Reference off paper maps and when GPS arrived and the OS Grid Reference App was produced, I and others, got very superior about "people who needed technology" to know where they were. We soon realised, however, that any technology which makes it easier for the man in the street to give an accurate indication as to his position had to be a good thing. What3words advances the technology even more and your comment that it is now possible to text a link to the w3w website means that it really can be a game changer for everyone not just walkers and skiers. The fact that it is accurate to 3 metres is amazing - although it does mean that I have over 100 w3w locations in my own garden - which does seem OTT!
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Post by blackpoolred on Sept 3, 2020 8:10:40 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad to hear you are ok - I love walking in the lakes and fallen over or slipped on a few occasions - but fortunately was ok to continue walking - so good advise for the apps and will download P.S: if you continue to pick up injuries we will have to start calling you Shawx - also could you remember me in your will - regarding leave your house to me - it sounds like you live in paradise
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 8:24:55 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad to hear you are ok - I love walking in the lakes and fallen over or slipped on a few occasions - but fortunately was ok to continue walking - so good advise for the apps and will download P.S: if you continue to pick up injuries we will have to start calling you Shawx - also could you remember me in your will - regarding leave your house to me - it sounds like you live in paradise Considering that, in my time, I have been a climber, a skier, a caver and a mountain walker I have been remarkably lucky with injuries. One fall skiing resulted in dislocated shoulder 4 years ago when I was 70. I've had minor injuries a few times walking but this was the first time I could not make it back to the car under my own steam - although two of us did have to call out the Glencoe MRT after two friends had a bad accident winter mountaineering 40 years ago. No problems caving and just a rope burn when rock climbing when the guy on the other end of the rope took a big fall - but he had no injuries (he was left dangling in the air!) and we managed to get off the face without help. I also got a frost bitten toe in the Alps but the toe recovered - although the big toe nail has never been the same again. That's it after 55 years.
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Post by wizardofdribble on Sept 3, 2020 8:33:35 GMT
Sorry to hear about your accident LP, glad that the rescue services came good ( as always)...... I must admit to having a wry smile when reading your post, it sounds almost Liam Lawrence like .........so tell me, did you actually fall over your dog ? 😉😉
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Post by Somebody_Told_Me on Sept 3, 2020 8:33:54 GMT
Get well soon Lakeland.
What3words has been advertised on national radio alot lately, it is a great idea. I was a Community First Responder for many years, finding a patent wa always the dreaded fear for me. Far more than the first aid bit!
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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 3, 2020 8:35:38 GMT
Amazing what some attention seeking posters will do, just to monopolise a thread! Get well soon.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 8:54:36 GMT
Sorry to hear about your accident LP, glad that the rescue services came good ( as always)...... I must admit to having a wry smile when reading your post, it sounds almost Liam Lawrence like .........so tell me, did you actually fall over your dog ? 😉😉 It was a bit of a freak accident. I had had a sore foot for about a week but it was getting better every day and I seemed fine to walk on Tuesday. And I was fine - I could feel the foot but the foot worked OK. Then on the path between two peaks on the Langdale Pikes (Pavey Ark and Harrison Stickle) I was using walking poles on the rocky traverse path. The walking poles help take the weight off your feet especially when going downhill on rocky ground. Unfortunately one of the locks which are used to lengthen or shorten the telescopic poles, decided to fail when I put weight on the pole and the pole collapsed and my bad foot crashed to the ground with my full weight on it instead of hitting the ground gently with the weight being taken by the pole. My foot could no longer bear weight. We were 2,300 feet above sea level and 2,000 feet above the valley floor at New Dungeon Ghyll. I suppose I could theoretically, have crawled down but darkness would have arrived long before we reached the bottom and no way would I crawl down Stickle Ghyll in the dark even with a head torch. There was no option but to call the MRT out. I was very lucky that the route down was via Stickle Ghyll which is very steep and full of boulders and is a nightmare for the MRT to get a stretcher down - so that was why they called out the air ambulance which landed on the broad grassy ridge 150 feet above us and the MRT stretchered me up to the helicopter. Then 5 minutes down to the valley to the annoyance of Jo who was picking her way down the gill with her dog and mine. She had started down as soon as it became clear I was going down by helicopter - maybe an hour and a half before I got into the helicpoter - and I reached the car 40 minutes before she did. I really owe her big time and am thinking what to buy her as a thank you.
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Post by cerebralstokie on Sept 3, 2020 9:08:47 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Glad to know that all's well that end well. I have been coming to the Lake District (Langdale) for over 50 years. I have a timeshare there (in February). I have walked most of the fells, but age now means that I am confined to the minnows such as Loughrigg Fell. I have brought school parties, hosteling, many times in the past and most seem to have wanted to come again when the opportunity was offered. It is a pity that many of today's generation seem to year for more distant pastures when they may be unaware of the delights that are available, with a little effort, on their own doorstep.
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Post by blackpoolred on Sept 3, 2020 9:11:30 GMT
Glad to hear you are ok - I love walking in the lakes and fallen over or slipped on a few occasions - but fortunately was ok to continue walking - so good advise for the apps and will download P.S: if you continue to pick up injuries we will have to start calling you Shawx - also could you remember me in your will - regarding leave your house to me - it sounds like you live in paradise Considering that, in my time, I have been a climber, a skier, a caver and a mountain walker I have been remarkably lucky with injuries. One fall skiing resulted in dislocated shoulder 4 years ago when I was 70. I've had minor injuries a few times walking but this was the first time I could not make it back to the car under my own steam - although two of us did have to call out the Glencoe MRT after two friends had a bad accident winter mountaineering 40 years ago. No problems caving and just a rope burn when rock climbing when the guy on the other end of the rope took a big fall - but he had no injuries (he was left dangling in the air!) and we managed to get off the face without help. I also got a frost bitten toe in the Alps but the toe recovered - although the big toe nail has never been the same again. That's it after 55 years. You sound like the archetypal Stoke supporter: Mountaineer, Caver and Skier - all the things Stoke is famous for
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 9:14:45 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. Glad to know that all's well that end well. I have enjoyed the Lakes for over 50 years. I go to Langdale every year (in February). I have walked on nearly all the fells but age now confines my efforts to minnows such as Loughrigg Fell. I have introduced many youngsters to the area via hostelling trips in the past and most opted for repeat trips when on offer. I think it is a pity that today's generation seem to opt for more distant pastures and many seem unaware of the delights to be found, with a little effort, on their own doorstep. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Thanks for the comments which have appeared in the middle of mine!!!!!
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Post by eddyclamp on Sept 3, 2020 9:18:14 GMT
Forny , how exactly does that what 3words app work?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 3, 2020 9:20:36 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!I hope he has insurance, costs a fortune to keep bailing people out, sure I read somewhere where the amount of people being rescued was ridiculous and they we’re considering getting people to take out private insurance to cover the rescue costs. . Lakeland can ( and no doubt will ) speak for himself Didn't he half
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 9:25:16 GMT
Forny , how exactly does that what 3words app work? The planet has been divided into squares each of 3 metres per side. Each square is identified by a code of three words. For example my front door step has the code fountain.boast.giant If you download the app then tap it at any time and anywhere in the world, it will give you the three word code for the 3 metre square where you are. Give this to the police and they or any other rescue service will know exactly were you are. As an earlier poster has said, some (but not all) rescue services are now able to text a link to the website if you don't have the app downloaded. Better safe than sorry - download the app yourself TODAY!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2020 9:26:23 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Did your new SCFC jacket cut the mustard? I was only joking when I said to test its durability by getting stuck up a mountain. They saw the bright yellow flashing didn't they, please tell me that's what saved you?
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Post by BristolMick on Sept 3, 2020 9:29:13 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!You don’t need to justify not having insurance to any ‘questionable’ dick on here mate. BM
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Sept 3, 2020 9:30:02 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!Did your new SCFC jacket cut the mustard? I was only joking when I said to test its durability by getting stuck up a mountain. They saw the bright yellow flashing didn't they, please tell me that's what saved you? Sorry to disappoint you, the lady in my life supports West Ham and gives me a hard time if I wear visible Stoke City gear on fellwalks. If I do wear Stoke stuff it is well hidden under other layers if I am walking with her. I was wearing Rohan trousers, a Berghause fleece, Meindle Boots and a Paramo Jacket - sorry!
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Post by eddyclamp on Sept 3, 2020 9:42:56 GMT
Forny , how exactly does that what 3words app work? The planet has been divided into squares each of 3 metres per side. Each square is identified by a code of three words. For example my front door step has the code fountain.boast.giant If you download the app then tap it at any time and anywhere in the world, it will give you the three word code for the 3 metre square where you are. Give this to the police and they or any other rescue service will know exactly were you are. As an earlier poster has said, some (but not all) rescue services are now able to text a link to the website if you don't have the app downloaded. Better safe than sorry - download the app yourself TODAY! Done it Jon , very impressed , I could get lost walking around Westport Lake. I did a map reading day in Derbyshire Dales last year which was useful.
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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 3, 2020 9:52:49 GMT
"I was wearing Rohan trousers, a Berghause fleece, Meindle Boots and a Paramo Jacket - sorry! " Lakeland, are you sponsored?
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Post by femark on Sept 3, 2020 10:00:13 GMT
What Three Words is one of the best apps ever made. One of my friends wouldn't be here today without it.
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Post by leicspotter on Sept 3, 2020 10:04:18 GMT
Thanks for that, Malcolm! You are referring to the day I became known as "Mr MRT incident number 51." It was, in fact the third time I have called out a Mountain Rescue Team but the previous 2 occasions I was making the call on behalf of someone else. So, I suppose after over 55 years of mountain walking it was about my time. As far as age is concerned one of the team members was at least as old as me! And, I have put the hours in myself as I was in an MRT team myself for several years when I lived and worked within sight of Dartmoor. In answer to Questionable's point about insurance. I'd happily pay for an insurance policy but only if it became compulsory for all walkers/climbers. Indeed when I have walked and climbed abroad I've always had rescue insurance. We are amazingly lucky to have free rescue by MRTs in this country and free helicopter rescue when necessary - and, much to my amazement, I was helicoptered down to the car on Tuesday whilst my companion had to make her own way down Stickle Ghyll at the end of a traumatic day with my dog as well as hers - to be honest she was as much a star as the MRT members. Living where I do I see the various MRTs and the Air Ambulance at work pretty well every day - there was a major incident to rescue a climber last month who had taken a very serious fall on Castle Rock of Triermain and the helicopter was visible from my front window as it lifted him to hospital after a 2 hour rescue operation. Like most serious walkers who live in the mountains, I donate to my local MRT EVERY year and I have a standing order to give a modest monthly payment to the Air Ambulance. I will be making a one off donation to the Ambleside MRT once I have spoken to them this week. As to my foot, my GP (like the MRT doctor) thinks it is only a soft tissue injury but wants to speak again tomorrow when he will make the decision as to whether I need an x-ray at the local cottage hospital. It is feeling less painful every day. That just leaves the dog. Luckily I live on a mountain side which she knows like the back of her hand. As it doesn't have sheep on it at the moment I can shove her through the dog gate in the garden wall and she will charge around within sight of the cottage but sometimes up to 500 feet above it and will come back after 15 minutes. If she couldn't do that I would have to find a neighbour to take her for walks. NOW THE IMPORTANT BITI have an app on my phone which gives me a Grid Reference automatically - it is called something like GridReferenceFreeOS. Every serious walker should download the app. The Police control room also asked me if I had a more modern FREE app which works all over the world. It is called what3words and allocates a unique set of three words to every 3 metre square on the surface of the earth. I have it and gave them the 3 words which they used to confirm the grid reference was correct. I would recommend that everyone downloads the what3words app even if they are not serious walkers - it could change/save your life!So now you want to waste even more tax payers money with an x-ray...some people As for what three words: a few spring to mind Glad your OK
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Post by The Stubborn Optimist on Sept 3, 2020 10:14:00 GMT
Sorry to hear about your accident LP, glad that the rescue services came good ( as always)...... I must admit to having a wry smile when reading your post, it sounds almost Liam Lawrence like .........so tell me, did you actually fall over your dog ? 😉😉 It was a bit of a freak accident. I had had a sore foot for about a week but it was getting better every day and I seemed fine to walk on Tuesday. And I was fine - I could feel the foot but the foot worked OK. Then on the path between two peaks on the Langdale Pikes (Pavey Ark and Harrison Stickle) I was using walking poles on the rocky traverse path. The walking poles help take the weight off your feet especially when going downhill on rocky ground. Unfortunately one of the locks which are used to lengthen or shorten the telescopic poles, decided to fail when I put weight on the pole and the pole collapsed and my bad foot crashed to the ground with my full weight on it instead of hitting the ground gently with the weight being taken by the pole. My foot could no longer bear weight. We were 2,300 feet above sea level and 2,000 feet above the valley floor at New Dungeon Ghyll. I suppose I could theoretically, have crawled down but darkness would have arrived long before we reached the bottom and no way would I crawl down Stickle Ghyll in the dark even with a head torch. There was no option but to call the MRT out. I was very lucky that the route down was via Stickle Ghyll which is very steep and full of boulders and is a nightmare for the MRT to get a stretcher down - so that was why they called out the air ambulance which landed on the broad grassy ridge 150 feet above us and the MRT stretchered me up to the helicopter. Then 5 minutes down to the valley to the annoyance of Jo who was picking her way down the gill with her dog and mine. She had started down as soon as it became clear I was going down by helicopter - maybe an hour and a half before I got into the helicpoter - and I reached the car 40 minutes before she did. I really owe her big time and am thinking what to buy her as a thank you. Glad you're ok mate. (Can I just say I've never been to the Lake District, nearest I've been is Carlisle away. I've never been in a helicopter either.)
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Post by werrington on Sept 3, 2020 10:18:34 GMT
It was a bit of a freak accident. I had had a sore foot for about a week but it was getting better every day and I seemed fine to walk on Tuesday. And I was fine - I could feel the foot but the foot worked OK. Then on the path between two peaks on the Langdale Pikes (Pavey Ark and Harrison Stickle) I was using walking poles on the rocky traverse path. The walking poles help take the weight off your feet especially when going downhill on rocky ground. Unfortunately one of the locks which are used to lengthen or shorten the telescopic poles, decided to fail when I put weight on the pole and the pole collapsed and my bad foot crashed to the ground with my full weight on it instead of hitting the ground gently with the weight being taken by the pole. My foot could no longer bear weight. We were 2,300 feet above sea level and 2,000 feet above the valley floor at New Dungeon Ghyll. I suppose I could theoretically, have crawled down but darkness would have arrived long before we reached the bottom and no way would I crawl down Stickle Ghyll in the dark even with a head torch. There was no option but to call the MRT out. I was very lucky that the route down was via Stickle Ghyll which is very steep and full of boulders and is a nightmare for the MRT to get a stretcher down - so that was why they called out the air ambulance which landed on the broad grassy ridge 150 feet above us and the MRT stretchered me up to the helicopter. Then 5 minutes down to the valley to the annoyance of Jo who was picking her way down the gill with her dog and mine. She had started down as soon as it became clear I was going down by helicopter - maybe an hour and a half before I got into the helicpoter - and I reached the car 40 minutes before she did. I really owe her big time and am thinking what to buy her as a thank you. Glad you're ok mate. (Can I just say I've never been to the Lake District, nearest I've been is Carlisle away. I've never been in a helicopter either.) It’s too expensive and a bit more elite than the likes of your type
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