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Post by Olgrligm on Nov 10, 2019 20:31:14 GMT
I feel really guilty about it, but I refuse to get excited. For three years we've had false dawns, fantastic managerial debuts and players putting in herculean performances. Every time it has been followed by a deluge of disappointment. Woods has been hailed as the missing piece on at least three different occasions now. I dearly, dearly hope O'Neill gets it right and that both he and the players don't let us down now. Fantastic managerial debuts, when the fcuk was that during the last three years Yesterday. Jones vs Leeds Lambert vs Huddersfield
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Post by march4 on Nov 10, 2019 20:56:13 GMT
Waddo didn’t win till game 7 losing the first match 3-1.
TP didn’t win till game 11 losing the first match 4-2.
I don’t think the first game tells us much.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 20:58:53 GMT
I agree Rob but I also can't get that abomination of a performance at St Andrews out of my head, a 433 system with similar, almost identical players as yesterday. Performances were chalk and cheese pretty much across the board. I'm not moaning. It's fabulous we've finally got a new manager bounce. It just doesn't sit right and it's a dangerous 'precedent' almost. Management is not just simply about 433 or any other system you care to mention, it's not 'Football Manager', there are so many other aspects to the way you manage and communicate with your players in training and before they go out to play. How much can you get across in a 45 minute training session that turns players from playing poorly under the last manager in a number of systems, to even worse under the caretaker to apparent world beaters that break a record going back 2 years or more within 24 hours? I hope i'm wrong for obvious reasons but I'm less convinced by this lot than some on here and think MON has his work cut out in the mid to long term, especially when the emperors new clothes turn a bit dirty around the edges. You let yourself down with the Football Manager jibe.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 21:10:45 GMT
Fantastic managerial debuts, when the fcuk was that during the last three years Yesterday. Jones vs Leeds Lambert vs Huddersfield Jones debut was away at Brentford.
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Post by spitthedog on Nov 10, 2019 21:10:57 GMT
Management is not just simply about 433 or any other system you care to mention, it's not 'Football Manager', there are so many other aspects to the way you manage and communicate with your players in training and before they go out to play. How much can you get across in a 45 minute training session that turns players from playing poorly under the last manager in a number of systems, to even worse under the caretaker to apparent world beaters that break a record going back 2 years or more within 24 hours? I hope i'm wrong for obvious reasons but I'm less convinced by this lot than some on here and think MON has his work cut out in the mid to long term, especially when the emperors new clothes turn a bit dirty around the edges. You let yourself down with the Football Manager jibe. Wasn't meant as a jibe, so my apologies.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 21:11:59 GMT
How much can you get across in a 45 minute training session that turns players from playing poorly under the last manager in a number of systems, to even worse under the caretaker to apparent world beaters that break a record going back 2 years or more within 24 hours? I hope i'm wrong for obvious reasons but I'm less convinced by this lot than some on here and think MON has his work cut out in the mid to long term, especially when the emperors new clothes turn a bit dirty around the edges. You let yourself down with the Football Manager jibe. Wasn't meant as a jibe, so my apologies. Fair do's, apologies for taking it that way.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 21:21:28 GMT
Clean slate for everyone.....
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Post by shipshape on Nov 10, 2019 21:23:12 GMT
Management is not just simply about 433 or any other system you care to mention, it's not 'Football Manager', there are so many other aspects to the way you manage and communicate with your players in training and before they go out to play. How much can you get across in a 45 minute training session that turns players from playing poorly under the last manager in a number of systems, to even worse under the caretaker to apparent world beaters that break a record going back 2 years or more within 24 hours? I hope i'm wrong for obvious reasons but I'm less convinced by this lot than some on here and think MON has his work cut out in the mid to long term, especially when the emperors new clothes turn a bit dirty around the edges. You let yourself down with the Football Manager jibe. On the long journey home yesterday, I thought about this. If a new manager (Jones) came in to my work and said we're doing things my way, no matter whether it suits your skills and experience, I might try to embrace it at first. When, as a result I was continually underperforming, I would get pissed off, and lose appetite and not try as hard. Particularly when I know I can do a specific role well enough but aren't being allowed to do that. If the next man (O'Neill) came in and said to me and my team, I'm gonna focus on you all doing what your best at, and forget the bollocks from before, it would be a morale boost. Nothing is solved yet, but I can understand a bit more if they appear to be putting more into it.
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Post by malteser68 on Nov 10, 2019 21:31:41 GMT
In other words, it shows you what a bunch of cheats we have in the dressing room. Great start, let's see how long the chameleons run with it before they change colour again. The big issue will be supporting the manager when they do. We absolutely must back him. On the contrary, it shows you what a fraud we had as manager, a clueless clown unable to string a tune out of arguably the best squad in the championship.
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Post by elystokie on Nov 10, 2019 21:42:43 GMT
Waddo didn’t win till game 7 losing the first match 3-1. TP didn’t win till game 11 losing the first match 4-2. I don’t think the first game tells us much. Maybe not, but he now only has to get 4 wins from the next 23 games to get more than TP did Piece of piss for any half decent manager..
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 22:06:09 GMT
The concern is that that team on paper screams Gary Rowett, with the exception of a more purpose fit lone striker in Gregory and some better players on the fringes like Badou.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 22:27:48 GMT
I don't know why, but I feel happier with a manager in the dugout that has made an effort to look businesslike and presentable. He is actually going to be on the TV representing the club after the game. Pulis never impressed me in his tracksuit and cap, but I coped. Why on earth Jones persisted in wearing clothing that showed every contour of his body, I just do not know. As he didn't actually have any contours, he looked like some sort of underdeveloped, malnourished Spiderman.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2019 23:03:25 GMT
The concern is that that team on paper screams Gary Rowett, with the exception of a more purpose fit lone striker in Gregory and some better players on the fringes like Badou. Why would that be a concern? If it gets results that's what is needed right now
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2019 8:47:36 GMT
The concern is that that team on paper screams Gary Rowett, with the exception of a more purpose fit lone striker in Gregory and some better players on the fringes like Badou. Why would that be a concern? If it gets results that's what is needed right now It has got one result against the poorest team in the league, just throwing caution to the wind. We were dreadful playing that team under Rowett.
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Post by mamasgloves on Nov 11, 2019 8:56:50 GMT
Why would that be a concern? If it gets results that's what is needed right now It has got one result against the poorest team in the league, just throwing caution to the wind. We were dreadful playing that team under Rowett. This point seems to have been lost on a few here. Yes, we've played the shape plenty but it's what they did in possession on Saturday that differed. We played 433 under Rowett but when we got the ball we plodded slowly with 5yd passes and the oppo got back into shape and we were blocked. On Saturday, the second we got possession there was purpose, midfielders broke forward and we quickly switched the ball wide with the full back moving up too. Night and day despite the shape being the same.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2019 9:28:46 GMT
It has got one result against the poorest team in the league, just throwing caution to the wind. We were dreadful playing that team under Rowett. This point seems to have been lost on a few here. Yes, we've played the shape plenty but it's what they did in possession on Saturday that differed. We played 433 under Rowett but when we got the ball we plodded slowly with 5yd passes and the oppo got back into shape and we were blocked. On Saturday, the second we got possession there was purpose, midfielders broke forward and we quickly switched the ball wide with the full back moving up too. Night and day despite the shape being the same. Its not been lost and if that continues then fair play, same shape and same players coupled with the fact we’ve been terrible for at least 2 years means I’d like to see a few games first.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Nov 11, 2019 10:18:02 GMT
The biggest difference was playing Woods. He's the one player that I think gives everyone else confidence in attack and defence.
His positioning is brilliant in picking up the loose ball and then playing it forwards.
Ndiaye is still great at breaking up the play. But I was so happy to Woods in the starting 11.
We have been screaming out for a Whelan replacement for years and Woods is that player.
Jones will rue putting some of those players on the naughty step. I think behind the scenes he fell out with a lot of players and they just disappeared from the first-team squad
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2019 10:28:32 GMT
The biggest difference was playing Woods. He's the one player that I think gives everyone else confidence in attack and defence. His positioning is brilliant in picking up the loose ball and then playing it forwards. Ndiaye is still great at breaking up the play. But I was so happy to Woods in the starting 11. We have been screaming out for a Whelan replacement for years and Woods is that player. Jones will rue putting some of those players on the naughty step. I think behind the scenes he fell out with a lot of players and they just disappeared from the first-team squad Gregory was far less isolated as well with Ince and McClean playing high up the pitch. Was far more balanced and fluid albeit against a poor team.....
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Post by AlliG on Nov 11, 2019 11:33:07 GMT
Why would that be a concern? If it gets results that's what is needed right now It has got one result against the poorest team in the league, just throwing caution to the wind. We were dreadful playing that team under Rowett. This poorest team in the league had just got a 2-2 draw away at West Brom (where even our resident Baggies fan suggested they could have won) and a 2-2 draw at home to Bristol City.
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Post by stokie1947 on Nov 11, 2019 11:45:27 GMT
you just can't please some folk it was a good start BUT he knows he still has hell of a job on like he says we have a massive squad that want's trimming quite a lot so that he can get some of his own players in all this will take time especially with the length of some of the contracts so let's just give him the time to do it his way i reckon at least a couple of years
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Post by musik on Nov 11, 2019 12:01:16 GMT
He wasn't fanatic about playing a certain formation, like a diamond.
Didn't he say somewhere in the interview afterwards that the players played in positions they were used to? That should be an obvious basic rule. However, some flexibility is always appreciated.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2019 12:32:23 GMT
It has got one result against the poorest team in the league, just throwing caution to the wind. We were dreadful playing that team under Rowett. This poorest team in the league had just got a 2-2 draw away at West Brom (where even our resident Baggies fan suggested they could have won) and a 2-2 draw at home to Bristol City. What are you trying to suggest? They’re bottom of the league and just conceded 4 at home to us.
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Post by Will_75 on Nov 11, 2019 12:32:35 GMT
Apart from taking our chances for a change we didn't look that balanced. A great win under the circumstances but we still look all over the place defensively. It will take MICON several games before we start seeing what affect he is having on the team tactically but the result is masking what i thought was a poor performance against a poor team. All right, but apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, a fresh water system, and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us?
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Post by AlliG on Nov 11, 2019 13:32:12 GMT
This poorest team in the league had just got a 2-2 draw away at West Brom (where even our resident Baggies fan suggested they could have won) and a 2-2 draw at home to Bristol City. What are you trying to suggest? They’re bottom of the league and just conceded 4 at home to us. I am just pointing out that Barnsley isn't the gimme gentle stroll in the park that some seem to suggest (and that they managed better results against both West Brom & Bristol City than we did).
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