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Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 1, 2019 12:19:51 GMT
Gary rowett made his reputation of the back of the abject failures of others at Birmingham that made him appear a decent manager.
His reputation seems likely to recover following the abject failures of others here.
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Post by redwhite on Sept 1, 2019 12:33:38 GMT
I know how to get promotion, let's hound every manager we have out of the door. Sure to work. To be perfectly honest, for hounding rowett out it's just deserts, wasnt doing a bad job was he, Gary? Just not playing bojan. Hound jones out, good luck with it if he does go I'll follow something else myself, fuck it. the fans are as poisonous os as the CEO. What happens if the next man doesn't hit the ground running or play the fans poster boy. Frankly, if we go down it's just deserts Gary Rowett did an absolutely attrocious job. You’re rewriting history.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 12:36:10 GMT
Still 8 points off 6th near the end though so it must have worked to some degree, look at us now Eight points off sixth after that kind of a spend really isn't very clever and there was zero sign it was going to get any better. Whoever is in charge, we’re not suddenly going to turn into a top 6 side overnight. It takes time. Rowett was picking up points albeit with turgid football, expectations were sky high at the time and mid table was deemed not good enough. But in hindsight, how many of us would have taken Rowett and his mid table mediocrity at the hope he may one day sort it out. The difference with Jones is the difference between mid table mediocrity and relegation, I really want it to work out for him as I like the guy, but he’s taking us down if he carries on like this. At this point I’d definitely take Moyes if he was willing to come here, but I suspect we are too shit for him now. For me it’s too much of a risk to back NJ, survival is more important now than the prospect of pretty football in a few years time.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 1, 2019 12:45:00 GMT
We've come full circle, haven't we? I remember suggesting Chris Hughton when Hughes turned to shit, only to hear from a very good poster that Norwich fans didn't like the football he played.
Similar was said about Dyche. Now we are practically begging for a pragmatic manager like Hughton and would probably kill for Dyche.
As Onlooker has alluded to, what if even Hughton or someone similar fails, too? Where do we look, then?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 1, 2019 12:45:48 GMT
Eight points off sixth after that kind of a spend really isn't very clever and there was zero sign it was going to get any better. Whoever is in charge, we’re not suddenly going to turn into a top 6 side overnight. It takes time. Rowett was picking up points albeit with turgid football, expectations were sky high at the time and mid table was deemed not good enough. But in hindsight, how many of us would have taken Rowett and his mid table mediocrity at the hope he may one day sort it out. The difference with Jones is the difference between mid table mediocrity and relegation, I really want it to work out for him as I like the guy, but he’s taking us down if he carries on like this. At this point I’d definitely take Moyes if he was willing to come here, but I suspect we are too shit for him now. For me it’s too much of a risk to back NJ, survival is more important now than the prospect of pretty football in a few years time. But the mediocrity was at least in part BECAUSE OF HIM. That's the point. He has helped to create this mess.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 1, 2019 12:47:04 GMT
We've come full circle, haven't we? I remember suggesting Chris Hughton when Hughes turned to shit, only to hear from a very good poster that Norwich fans didn't like the football he played. Similar was said about Dyche. Now we are practically begging for a pragmatic manager like Hughton and would probably kill for Dyche. As Onlooker has alluded to, what if even Hughton or someone similar fails, too? Where do we look, then? I wouldn't be happy about Hughton because he is another fairly tedious pragmatist but he's got more strings to his bow than Pulis and is the best available option and the board don't have the imagination to find anyone good overseas.
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Post by berahinosgoals on Sept 1, 2019 12:51:33 GMT
Eight points off sixth after that kind of a spend really isn't very clever and there was zero sign it was going to get any better. Whoever is in charge, we’re not suddenly going to turn into a top 6 side overnight. It takes time. Rowett was picking up points albeit with turgid football, expectations were sky high at the time and mid table was deemed not good enough. But in hindsight, how many of us would have taken Rowett and his mid table mediocrity at the hope he may one day sort it out. The difference with Jones is the difference between mid table mediocrity and relegation, I really want it to work out for him as I like the guy, but he’s taking us down if he carries on like this. At this point I’d definitely take Moyes if he was willing to come here, but I suspect we are too shit for him now. For me it’s too much of a risk to back NJ, survival is more important now than the prospect of pretty football in a few years time. agree r.e rowett, mid table security would have been the end result if we missed out on the play-offs, followed by a january & summer of further reshaping the squad. His record suggested he knew how to get a club into the play offs and dramatically improve clubs results at this level. I strangely think moyes might be interested at this point because if he can turn us into promotion contenders from a position of free fall it would improve his stock too. He can't really lose from here, rock bottom of the championship. Moyes was actually my first choice and wasn't initially happy with the appointment of jones, calling him the 'managerial equivalent of chris greenacre', we imo needed a more experienced head like a moyes and if jones does go that's who we still need imo, David moyes. Feel sorry for jones tbh, likeable bloke, enthusiastic but scfc atm is a big job for the most experienced and established managers. We're getting to a point now where we need results quickly. Right man at the wrong time for me. This club has not snapped out of a losing mentality, the fans have ran out of patience and the expectations are massive, chuck on top a need to completely install a new squad it's been a shitter of a job for jones. If we replace jones with a tried & tested no mark scfc can fuck right off for me. To sack this guy under these circumstances it has to be for a moyes. A manager of bigger proven profile. Moyes worked under immense pressure at man utd and clubs don't get any bigger than them. He also had a better record than mourhino if I remember right
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Post by noustie on Sept 2, 2019 10:18:09 GMT
It's all a bit bizarre - we spent a load on Afobe and sent him to a rival who seemed to have revived him fairly easily. It raises questions on why we can't get the best out of him and why we thought it was a good idea to give Bristol a go. Diouf's confidence must be shot to shit because he should be a beast in this league as his touch is less of an issue. No idea why we didn't persist to see if we could get a tune out of him rather than spending money on worse players. There was a story on an Aberdeen video I used to have where Fergie asked the chairman for money soon after arriving. Chairman told him he had 26 professional players on the books and he was employed to make a team out of it. Our squad should be more than enough to compete in the championship. Nobody has been able to make much of a team out of the deadheads though have they? I'm not convinced Afobe is revived - he has one more goal than he did here this time last year, let's see how he's doing in a couple of months. Presumably we thought it was a good idea to give Bristol a go so we can claw something back for him - would you have persisted with him after his diabolical showings last season? Diouf has done absolutely nothing for about three years now. Sure he's a lovely guy, he's done well for us in the past but he's shown nothing recently to suggest he's what we need. In terms of comparing Rowett and Jones I think Hughes left a team that was weighed down with deadwood. Rowett had little choice but to jettison Berahino, Imbula, Wimmer et al but then added to the mess by signing more players that didn’t seem to fit any formation and somehow managed to unbalance the team further. He did manage to get a tune out of them to an extent but it was as slow and ponderous as a 10 year old’s first efforts at ‘three blind mice’ on the recorder. Then Jones has come in and added to the driftwood by now casting Afobe and BMI aside then brought in even more players who don’t seem to fit the style he wants to play. Even a jazz pianist off his bonce on lsd couldn’t recognise a tune in the random crap Jones has churned out and he has somehow managed to make us worse and less balanced than when he was appointed. Personally I would have persisted with Afobe, Diouf and even Bojan with the main reason being we seem to be replacing them with worse players so it seems counterintuitive that we’re spending more money on lesser ability when we could just look to resurrect what we already have. Granted some players aren’t saveable but it surely shows a real lack of coaching ability in both Rowett and Jones plus the ‘process’ in that it just seems too easy to go out and spunk more money up the wall rather than work with what we have. I was all for Jones but if the Hatter fan is right in that he wasn’t the brains of the operation and Luton were crap when Hart was assistant then it shows the ‘due diligence’ done wasn’t up to much. In hindsight having someone who was determined to play one style wasn’t probably the best fit given the squad we had were lacking in fundamental areas to carry it out. To make it even worse the ‘process’ has then failed to address these key areas entirely whilst making the squad even more bloated and unbalanced again. For the next manager I think we need to be saying that we’ll get them a left back and a midfielder who can tackle but from there they have to make a team out of what we have. If they manage to get something out of that it would then change the perception every window where we would need a couple instead of ripping it up and getting 7-8+ in. The other positive for a new manager is the fans’ expectations are rock bottom and putting a team out that wasn’t embarrassing plus capable of staying in the league is probably where everyone is at the moment. If we got Hughton, and he couldn’t keep us up on that basis, then we would definitely know it’s got nothing to do with the manager.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 2, 2019 11:10:57 GMT
Nobody has been able to make much of a team out of the deadheads though have they? I'm not convinced Afobe is revived - he has one more goal than he did here this time last year, let's see how he's doing in a couple of months. Presumably we thought it was a good idea to give Bristol a go so we can claw something back for him - would you have persisted with him after his diabolical showings last season? Diouf has done absolutely nothing for about three years now. Sure he's a lovely guy, he's done well for us in the past but he's shown nothing recently to suggest he's what we need. In terms of comparing Rowett and Jones I think Hughes left a team that was weighed down with deadwood. Rowett had little choice but to jettison Berahino, Imbula, Wimmer et al but then added to the mess by signing more players that didn’t seem to fit any formation and somehow managed to unbalance the team further. He did manage to get a tune out of them to an extent but it was as slow and ponderous as a 10 year old’s first efforts at ‘three blind mice’ on the recorder. Then Jones has come in and added to the driftwood by now casting Afobe and BMI aside then brought in even more players who don’t seem to fit the style he wants to play. Even a jazz pianist off his bonce on lsd couldn’t recognise a tune in the random crap Jones has churned out and he has somehow managed to make us worse and less balanced than when he was appointed. Personally I would have persisted with Afobe, Diouf and even Bojan with the main reason being we seem to be replacing them with worse players so it seems counterintuitive that we’re spending more money on lesser ability when we could just look to resurrect what we already have. Granted some players aren’t saveable but it surely shows a real lack of coaching ability in both Rowett and Jones plus the ‘process’ in that it just seems too easy to go out and spunk more money up the wall rather than work with what we have. I was all for Jones but if the Hatter fan is right in that he wasn’t the brains of the operation and Luton were crap when Hart was assistant then it shows the ‘due diligence’ done wasn’t up to much. In hindsight having someone who was determined to play one style wasn’t probably the best fit given the squad we had were lacking in fundamental areas to carry it out. To make it even worse the ‘process’ has then failed to address these key areas entirely whilst making the squad even more bloated and unbalanced again. For the next manager I think we need to be saying that we’ll get them a left back and a midfielder who can tackle but from there they have to make a team out of what we have. If they manage to get something out of that it would then change the perception every window where we would need a couple instead of ripping it up and getting 7-8+ in. The other positive for a new manager is the fans’ expectations are rock bottom and putting a team out that wasn’t embarrassing plus capable of staying in the league is probably where everyone is at the moment. If we got Hughton, and he couldn’t keep us up on that basis, then we would definitely know it’s got nothing to do with the manager. I agree with a lot of that. I think we do have a squad in terms of ability that is much, much better than this, or at least would be with a couple of tweaks. I take the Luton fans' talk about Jones with a pinch of salt as it's standard Jilted John 'never fancied her anyway' stuff for the most part. They weren't saying that when he was there. As you say, some players aren't salvageable. I would put Afobe and Diouf very much into that bracket. I don't think the strikers we've brought in are worse than either of them. The great intangible as far as the squad goes is the fragile mental state and losing habit that sees us fall to pieces the second we concede. I don't know how you get rid of that to be honest. I guess the only way, once you're in that spiral, is through getting in someone more experienced who commands that respect instantly.
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