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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 14:00:27 GMT
I don't think it is. But it entirely depends on game time. If I was going to play a season at Stoke then I'd take that over the move now tbh. You do well as you're expected to and you get a better move than to Man Yoo. If Man Yoo are offering game time then agreed, it's a no brainer. I think game time has nothing or little to do with it.He's an 18 year old lad with the chance to join Man Utd,not Brighton or Wolves but Man Utd. I'm sure he'll have belief in his own ability and will have a crack at breaking onto their first team at some point and if not what does he have to lose? Chances are though he’s going to end up on loan in the darkest recesses of the Belgian league. Alternatively he could have a couple of seasons getting paid extremely well by a club that’s not short of a bob or two and get game time in the Championship and who knows even the PL - then comes the stellar move getting paid zillions rather than what Utd pay their under 23 squad these days. (That’s what’s called having faith in your own ability)
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 23, 2019 14:05:29 GMT
I don't think that fits what is actually going in with youth players and what they're chasing now. Players are moving to lesser clubs for football. In order to play and develop. If he's got a brain, the draw of 30+ games would/should be massive. That move will always be around the corner with how good he is. If he's got a brain he'll go to the biggest club in the world and always the chance to be loaned out as he develops. The move WON'T always be round the corner and may never happen again. Why would he? It's literally the opposite of what's going on at the moment with these players.
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Post by kelw on May 23, 2019 14:06:29 GMT
I think game time has nothing or little to do with it.He's an 18 year old lad with the chance to join Man Utd,not Brighton or Wolves but Man Utd. I'm sure he'll have belief in his own ability and will have a crack at breaking onto their first team at some point and if not what does he have to lose? Chances are though he’s going to end up on loan in the darkest recesses of the Belgian league. Alternatively he could have a couple of seasons getting paid extremely well by a club that’s not short of a bob or two and get game time in the Championship and who knows even the PL - then comes the stellar move getting paid zillions rather than what Utd pay their under 23 squad these days. (That’s what’s called having faith in your own ability) By 'darkest recesses of the Belgian League' you mean the team that came 4th? Didn't do John O'Shea or Jonny Evans much harm playing at that extreme basement team.
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 15:22:16 GMT
Chances are though he’s going to end up on loan in the darkest recesses of the Belgian league. Alternatively he could have a couple of seasons getting paid extremely well by a club that’s not short of a bob or two and get game time in the Championship and who knows even the PL - then comes the stellar move getting paid zillions rather than what Utd pay their under 23 squad these days. (That’s what’s called having faith in your own ability) By 'darkest recesses of the Belgian League' you mean the team that came 4th? Didn't do John O'Shea or Jonny Evans much harm playing at that extreme basement team. By darkest recesses I mean anywhere in the Belgian League !
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 15:39:37 GMT
If he's got a brain he'll go to the biggest club in the world and always the chance to be loaned out as he develops. The move WON'T always be round the corner and may never happen again. Why would he? It's literally the opposite of what's going on at the moment with these players. Who do you mean by ‘these players’? Who are you comparing him to?
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 23, 2019 15:57:04 GMT
Why would he? It's literally the opposite of what's going on at the moment with these players. Who do you mean by ‘these players’? Who are you comparing him to? Youth team players in general. The trend is for games now. It'd worry me too how long OGS has got there.
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Post by bolders on May 23, 2019 16:00:25 GMT
Love to keep him and he become an integral part of our team but now the Shit have raised their head he will go unfortunately. So I think £8.5mil up front and with good add ons and a sell on percentage would be a fair.
He might be a Liverpool fan so might not wanna go the shit 😂
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2019 16:05:26 GMT
Have we got a closet red or two on here?
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2019 16:16:43 GMT
Id be very disappointed if we started selling players on direct from the acadamy before regular Stoke Fans have had a proper chance to see them You always have a chance to see academy players at CW or on the road. They play a high number of League and Cup games, friendlies too. Some are even streamed.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 16:18:18 GMT
Who do you mean by ‘these players’? Who are you comparing him to? Youth team players in general. The trend is for games now. It'd worry me too how long OGS has got there. Who, specifically? Which youth team players?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 16:18:49 GMT
Have we got a closet red or two on here? No, just people clear-eyed enough to live in the real world.
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:30:24 GMT
Always makes me laugh on here
“ Tell Man Utd to fuck off and get him in the team with a contract extension”
<<< player turns out to be woeful >>>
“ Whoever turned down £10m and put him on a long term contract wants fucking sacking “
It’s how it works yeah?
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:33:51 GMT
Have we got a closet red or two on here? No, just people clear-eyed enough to live in the real world. I think that in the real world one or two youngsters and their representatives are probably wising up and opting not to become part of the assembly lines run by Chelsea, Utd etc. etc.
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Post by dreamtheater on May 23, 2019 16:35:42 GMT
If you 'play the game' transfer wise and the youth is decent, whoever the suitor is, its normally the next logical step in the dance i.e. offer a better and extended contract surely ? I have seen this acted out a hundred times. Mind you . theres a song werrington .......you dont like us----------------- ------- We dont care
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:36:59 GMT
No, just people clear-eyed enough to live in the real world. I think that in the real world one or two youngsters and their representatives are probably wising up and opting not to become part of the assembly lines run by Chelsea, Utd etc. etc. But the majority will see a 5 year contract on 5 times they are currently on and not taking a chance on staying put, shattering their leg in their next game and a career finished That’s the reality wuzza
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:38:28 GMT
If you play the game and the youth is decent, whoever the suitor is, its normally the next logical step in the dance i.e offer a better and extended contract surely ? I have seen this a hundred times. Mind you . theres a song werrington .......you dont like us----------------- ------- We dont care Economics and wages dictate differently though
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 16:39:01 GMT
No, just people clear-eyed enough to live in the real world. I think that in the real world one or two youngsters and their representatives are probably wising up and opting not to become part of the assembly lines run by Chelsea, Utd etc. etc. What, to stay at a mid-table team in the Championship? It's a once in a lifetime opportunity, it's going to be barely anybody.
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:40:56 GMT
I think that in the real world one or two youngsters and their representatives are probably wising up and opting not to become part of the assembly lines run by Chelsea, Utd etc. etc. What, to stay at a mid-table team in the Championship? It's a once in a lifetime opportunity, it's going to be barely anybody. If he is as good as we hope it absolutely won’t be a once in a lifetime opportunity.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2019 16:42:23 GMT
Always makes me laugh on here “ Tell Man Utd to fuck off and get him in the team with a contract extension” <<< player turns out to be woeful >>> “ Whoever turned down £10m and put him on a long term contract wants fucking sacking “ It’s how it works yeah? Or equally ridiculous scenario that hasnt happened yet and deserving of equal ire: Player moves for 7m ends up getting sold to Barcelona for 300M in 5 years time. Majority of Oatcackers: "We know our place, 7m was a great bargain at the time trust in nathan blah blah"
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:43:58 GMT
Always makes me laugh on here “ Tell Man Utd to fuck off and get him in the team with a contract extension” <<< player turns out to be woeful >>> “ Whoever turned down £10m and put him on a long term contract wants fucking sacking “ It’s how it works yeah? Or equally ridiculous scenario that hasnt happened yet and deserving of equal ire: Player moves for 7m ends up getting sold to Barcelona for 300M in 5 years time. Majority of Oatcackers: "We know our place, 7m was a great bargain at the time trust in nathan blah blah" That’s the point nobody knows When Imbula signed he was fantastic and people were lauding the club for getting him “ tied down” Yeah?
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:44:20 GMT
I think that in the real world one or two youngsters and their representatives are probably wising up and opting not to become part of the assembly lines run by Chelsea, Utd etc. etc. But the majority will see a 5 year contract on 5 times they are currently on and not taking a chance on staying put, shattering their leg in their next game and a career finished That’s the reality wuzza He wouldn’t be living like a pauper - a mid table premiership team or an artificially rich championship team like ourselves can make him extremely wealthy for 2 or 3 years while he develops and learns and then moves into the mega rich category. Much better than disappearing into a footballing black hole like so many others. It takes a bit of fore thought and a lot of confidence but it’s not completely far fetched.
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Post by cheadlestokie on May 23, 2019 16:44:42 GMT
There is a lot of second guessing going on here. The Club have not as yet to my knowledge made any comment on this matter, presumably because as yet they have no need to do so. Patience folks and keep your criticisms either way until we know what is going to occur.
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:45:43 GMT
But the majority will see a 5 year contract on 5 times they are currently on and not taking a chance on staying put, shattering their leg in their next game and a career finished That’s the reality wuzza He wouldn’t be living like a pauper - a mid table premiership team or an artificially rich championship team like ourselves can make him extremely wealthy for 2 or 3 years while he develops and learns and then moves into the mega rich category. Much better than disappearing into a footballing black hole like so many others. It takes a bit of fore thought and a lot of confidence but it’s not completely far fetched. I think you’re in cuckoo land with this one mate
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 16:49:47 GMT
What, to stay at a mid-table team in the Championship? It's a once in a lifetime opportunity, it's going to be barely anybody. If he is as good as we hope it absolutely won’t be a once in a lifetime opportunity. What if he isn't? What if he breaks his leg? He has the chance to learn at one of the biggest clubs in the world, that's going to turn most players' heads, especially young players with the world at their feet. If we were still in the Premier League and linked with a young player at, say, Rotherham or Bolton and he turned us down to play football there, we'd have people on here questioning his ambition.
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:50:06 GMT
He wouldn’t be living like a pauper - a mid table premiership team or an artificially rich championship team like ourselves can make him extremely wealthy for 2 or 3 years while he develops and learns and then moves into the mega rich category. Much better than disappearing into a footballing black hole like so many others. It takes a bit of fore thought and a lot of confidence but it’s not completely far fetched. I think you’re in cuckoo land with this one mate Well the examples for not moving as a youngster to a big club are numerous and go back years - remember that lad Liverpool signed from Oldham back in the day.
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Post by werrington on May 23, 2019 16:53:42 GMT
I think you’re in cuckoo land with this one mate Well the examples for not moving as a youngster to a big club are numerous and go back years - remember that lad Liverpool signed from Oldham back in the day. Wayne Harrison? It could always go the other way though, Jermaine pennant,Raheem Sterling etc Nobody knows
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:54:28 GMT
If he is as good as we hope it absolutely won’t be a once in a lifetime opportunity. What if he isn't? What if he breaks his leg? He has the chance to learn at one of the biggest clubs in the world, that's going to turn most players' heads, especially young players with the world at their feet. But that’s the point , he can break a leg at any club in the top flight - including ours - and be covered for life now. Look at all the youngsters who sign for Chelsea and never get nearer their first team than you or I ! Yes it’s sounds nice but it’s not a given that it’s the best thing to do and there have been enough examples of where it has proved to be absolutely the wrong thing to do to make people think twice about it if they have any sense.
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 16:56:44 GMT
Well the examples for not moving as a youngster to a big club are numerous and go back years - remember that lad Liverpool signed from Oldham back in the day. Wayne Harrison? It could always go the other way though, Jermaine pennant,Raheem Sterling etc Nobody knows That’s the boy - he is dead now I fear. Nobody knows indeed but the system of stock piling youth talent has only really kicked into overdrive in fairly recent times and its killing careers before they start.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 23, 2019 16:58:16 GMT
What if he isn't? What if he breaks his leg? He has the chance to learn at one of the biggest clubs in the world, that's going to turn most players' heads, especially young players with the world at their feet. But that’s the point , he can break a leg at any club in the top flight - including ours - and be covered for life now. Look at all the youngsters who sign for Chelsea and never get nearer their first team than you or I ! Yes it’s sounds nice but it’s not a given that it’s the best thing to do and there have been enough examples of where it has proved to be absolutely the wrong thing to do to make people think twice about it if they have any sense. And there have been plenty where it's turned out brilliantly for the player involved. Sportspeople have to back themselves and have to dream. He'll also know that there's every chance they'll be playing 60-odd games next season, most of their current centre backs are terrible and the manager, if he lasts, has spoken about his commitment to playing young players. The pathway there isn't necessarily as blocked there as it is at, say, Chelsea.
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Post by wuzza on May 23, 2019 17:08:52 GMT
But that’s the point , he can break a leg at any club in the top flight - including ours - and be covered for life now. Look at all the youngsters who sign for Chelsea and never get nearer their first team than you or I ! Yes it’s sounds nice but it’s not a given that it’s the best thing to do and there have been enough examples of where it has proved to be absolutely the wrong thing to do to make people think twice about it if they have any sense. And there have been plenty where it's turned out brilliantly for the player involved. Sportspeople have to back themselves and have to dream. He'll also know that there's every chance they'll be playing 60-odd games next season, most of their current centre backs are terrible and the manager, if he lasts, has spoken about his commitment to playing young players. The pathway there isn't necessarily as blocked there as it is at, say, Chelsea. I’m sure that is the line Utd’s representatives will feed him and who knows perhaps they will be as good as their word but the odds are against it. I am fully aware that it’s probably a foregone conclusion but it’s not beyond the realms of reason for a talented youngster to back himself and opt for an alternative (and still highly lucrative)route.
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