|
Post by mrred on May 4, 2019 10:37:32 GMT
I made this very point. And I was moaned at, everyone told me to suspend disbelief and there’s no science to it. Which is kind of ok but it needs a degree of consistency to even function. Which it stopped doing for me... The crypt could’ve been really ace I’m thinking like proper horror, but instead you’ve got half a carcass usain bolting its way towards some people and a recently deceased individual lumbering. Well, which is it?? It's not the series we all fell in love with. This has been a big problem for a while. Since they started running out of book material and diverged the story to tell their own- the writing, pacing and convenience in sake of plot have all suffered greatly. I'm not saying GRR Martin is a literary genius, but the pacing of the show was far better for the first 3-4 seasons whilst it was running off his material. Look at the first season for instance. How long it took and how much they emphasised how long it took for Robert and Ned to reach Kings Landing. How long it took Robb to March south. How long it took Danny to fuck about in Essos and wherever. In the last few seasons everyone has the ability to fast travel because it's convenient and they want to rush the story to wrap up for this season so they can fuck off and do Star Wars. I'd have taken another 3 seasons of developing the characters carefully and not sacrificing 'realism' and breaking the established rules for convenience and to keep the general audience short attention span that picked up the show after the red wedding. I fell in love with the series on the back of those uneasy meetings in the council chambers, the uneasy alliances and because no one had plot armour. Its wrote no better than fucking fan fiction. I got more and more frustrated as the episode went on and ended up involuntarily saying "oh fuck off" several times.
|
|
|
Post by thevoid on May 4, 2019 11:03:49 GMT
It's not the series we all fell in love with. This has been a big problem for a while. Since they started running out of book material and diverged the story to tell their own- the writing, pacing and convenience in sake of plot have all suffered greatly. I'm not saying GRR Martin is a literary genius, but the pacing of the show was far better for the first 3-4 seasons whilst it was running off his material. Look at the first season for instance. How long it took and how much they emphasised how long it took for Robert and Ned to reach Kings Landing. How long it took Robb to March south. How long it took Danny to fuck about in Essos and wherever. In the last few seasons everyone has the ability to fast travel because it's convenient and they want to rush the story to wrap up for this season so they can fuck off and do Star Wars. I'd have taken another 3 seasons of developing the characters carefully and not sacrificing 'realism' and breaking the established rules for convenience and to keep the general audience short attention span that picked up the show after the red wedding. I fell in love with the series on the back of those uneasy meetings in the council chambers, the uneasy alliances and because no one had plot armour. Its wrote no better than fucking fan fiction. I got more and more frustrated as the episode went on and ended up involuntarily saying "oh fuck off" several times. Agree with you about timescale- how long did it take Daenerys to nip up north and rescue the group who were capturing the wight last series? Even on a dragon? All of sudden Westeros seemed about a big as Malta.
|
|
|
Post by Pretty Little Boother on May 4, 2019 15:02:50 GMT
It's not the series we all fell in love with. This has been a big problem for a while. Since they started running out of book material and diverged the story to tell their own- the writing, pacing and convenience in sake of plot have all suffered greatly. I'm not saying GRR Martin is a literary genius, but the pacing of the show was far better for the first 3-4 seasons whilst it was running off his material. Look at the first season for instance. How long it took and how much they emphasised how long it took for Robert and Ned to reach Kings Landing. How long it took Robb to March south. How long it took Danny to fuck about in Essos and wherever. In the last few seasons everyone has the ability to fast travel because it's convenient and they want to rush the story to wrap up for this season so they can fuck off and do Star Wars. I'd have taken another 3 seasons of developing the characters carefully and not sacrificing 'realism' and breaking the established rules for convenience and to keep the general audience short attention span that picked up the show after the red wedding. I fell in love with the series on the back of those uneasy meetings in the council chambers, the uneasy alliances and because no one had plot armour. Its wrote no better than fucking fan fiction. I got more and more frustrated as the episode went on and ended up involuntarily saying "oh fuck off" several times. Great post. The Hound taking Arya to Lyssa Arryn at The Eyrie was like a whole season's worth of plot, it was great. Nobody travels anymore. However I will say that even though I agree with you, the last two episodes of the last series are two of my favourites, The Battle of the Bastards leading into The Winds of Winter, superb.
|
|
|
Post by thevoid on May 4, 2019 15:25:20 GMT
This has been a big problem for a while. Since they started running out of book material and diverged the story to tell their own- the writing, pacing and convenience in sake of plot have all suffered greatly. I'm not saying GRR Martin is a literary genius, but the pacing of the show was far better for the first 3-4 seasons whilst it was running off his material. Look at the first season for instance. How long it took and how much they emphasised how long it took for Robert and Ned to reach Kings Landing. How long it took Robb to March south. How long it took Danny to fuck about in Essos and wherever. In the last few seasons everyone has the ability to fast travel because it's convenient and they want to rush the story to wrap up for this season so they can fuck off and do Star Wars. I'd have taken another 3 seasons of developing the characters carefully and not sacrificing 'realism' and breaking the established rules for convenience and to keep the general audience short attention span that picked up the show after the red wedding. I fell in love with the series on the back of those uneasy meetings in the council chambers, the uneasy alliances and because no one had plot armour. Its wrote no better than fucking fan fiction. I got more and more frustrated as the episode went on and ended up involuntarily saying "oh fuck off" several times. Great post. The Hound taking Arya to Lyssa Arryn at The Eyrie was like a whole season's worth of plot, it was great. Nobody travels anymore. However I will say that even though I agree with you, the last two episodes of the last series are two of my favourites, The Battle of the Bastards leading into The Winds of Winter, superb. There's not enough intrigue and maneuvering lately is there, it seems to have gone 'full Tolkien'. Hopefully the next few episodes will be a return to form. Littlefinger is a big miss, I enjoyed his game-playing.
|
|
|
Post by questionable on May 4, 2019 15:35:05 GMT
I’ve got myself a bottle of White Walker from ASDA, straight into storage unopened. Reviews of the content don’t look that good though.
|
|
|
Post by questionable on May 4, 2019 16:53:57 GMT
I have the book collection if anyone’s interested, found them far to hard to follow, more so as I accidentally started on the third book
|
|
|
Post by mrred on May 4, 2019 18:54:00 GMT
This has been a big problem for a while. Since they started running out of book material and diverged the story to tell their own- the writing, pacing and convenience in sake of plot have all suffered greatly. I'm not saying GRR Martin is a literary genius, but the pacing of the show was far better for the first 3-4 seasons whilst it was running off his material. Look at the first season for instance. How long it took and how much they emphasised how long it took for Robert and Ned to reach Kings Landing. How long it took Robb to March south. How long it took Danny to fuck about in Essos and wherever. In the last few seasons everyone has the ability to fast travel because it's convenient and they want to rush the story to wrap up for this season so they can fuck off and do Star Wars. I'd have taken another 3 seasons of developing the characters carefully and not sacrificing 'realism' and breaking the established rules for convenience and to keep the general audience short attention span that picked up the show after the red wedding. I fell in love with the series on the back of those uneasy meetings in the council chambers, the uneasy alliances and because no one had plot armour. Its wrote no better than fucking fan fiction. I got more and more frustrated as the episode went on and ended up involuntarily saying "oh fuck off" several times. Great post. The Hound taking Arya to Lyssa Arryn at The Eyrie was like a whole season's worth of plot, it was great. Nobody travels anymore. However I will say that even though I agree with you, the last two episodes of the last series are two of my favourites, The Battle of the Bastards leading into The Winds of Winter, superb. Yeah that's a good example. The Hound and Arya made for some of the best moments in the show because they had time to establish their relationship and more importantly, we got to see it. So them travelling the continent helped with the world building and how far the war reached. Don't get me wrong, I've loved almost everything since they pissed Dorne up the wall and could 2 sort of overlook the fast travelling by Little Finger, Danny and Jon. It just felt a little bit silly when they gave plot lines like the High Sparrow so much room to breathe. Al lot of people didn't enjoy it because it wasn't snappy enough. Give it as much time as they want and hook it straight into the veins for me. And yeah, Battle of the Bastards was probably my favourite battle in the whole show. But again it had so much weight because the plot and Ramsey were given time to develop.
|
|
|
Post by followyoudown on May 6, 2019 8:19:12 GMT
Man shit is about to get real in episode 5 next week
|
|
|
Post by chuckrocky on May 6, 2019 9:15:41 GMT
Really didn’t enjoy episode 4.
Didn’t think it was well written at all.
|
|
|
Post by questionable on May 6, 2019 9:16:24 GMT
Man shit is about to get real in episode 5 next week A little slow for the first 30 minutes or so but agreed next week can’t come quick enough.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 6, 2019 10:18:40 GMT
Really didn’t enjoy episode 4. Didn’t think it was well written at all. There’s no Ying without yang 😏
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 6, 2019 11:07:58 GMT
Some very bad pacing and writing in that episode, juxtaposed with some very good action and some great scenes. I defended the battle of Winterfell to some degree but I have this nagging feeling the Show form is going to end in the most predictable way possible.
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 6, 2019 11:09:39 GMT
Great post. The Hound taking Arya to Lyssa Arryn at The Eyrie was like a whole season's worth of plot, it was great. Nobody travels anymore. However I will say that even though I agree with you, the last two episodes of the last series are two of my favourites, The Battle of the Bastards leading into The Winds of Winter, superb. Yeah that's a good example. The Hound and Arya made for some of the best moments in the show because they had time to establish their relationship and more importantly, we got to see it. So them travelling the continent helped with the world building and how far the war reached. Don't get me wrong, I've loved almost everything since they pissed Dorne up the wall and could 2 sort of overlook the fast travelling by Little Finger, Danny and Jon. It just felt a little bit silly when they gave plot lines like the High Sparrow so much room to breathe. Al lot of people didn't enjoy it because it wasn't snappy enough. Give it as much time as they want and hook it straight into the veins for me. And yeah, Battle of the Bastards was probably my favourite battle in the whole show. But again it had so much weight because the plot and Ramsey were given time to develop. Choosing the Iron Born story over Dorne (who have a lot more interest in the fight with the death of Elia) was a blunder the show has struggled to recover from. Doran Martell is the sort of cerebral character that makes the books so absoltely amazing, in the show they shat on his story and development. He was another Tywin Lannister kingpin who should be with Dany now.
|
|
|
Post by lordb on May 6, 2019 13:03:21 GMT
Yeah that's a good example. The Hound and Arya made for some of the best moments in the show because they had time to establish their relationship and more importantly, we got to see it. So them travelling the continent helped with the world building and how far the war reached. Don't get me wrong, I've loved almost everything since they pissed Dorne up the wall and could 2 sort of overlook the fast travelling by Little Finger, Danny and Jon. It just felt a little bit silly when they gave plot lines like the High Sparrow so much room to breathe. Al lot of people didn't enjoy it because it wasn't snappy enough. Give it as much time as they want and hook it straight into the veins for me. And yeah, Battle of the Bastards was probably my favourite battle in the whole show. But again it had so much weight because the plot and Ramsey were given time to develop. Choosing the Iron Born story over Dorne (who have a lot more interest in the fight with the death of Elia) was a blunder the show has struggled to recover from. Doran Martell is the sort of cerebral character that makes the books so absoltely amazing, in the show they shat on his story and development. He was another Tywin Lannister kingpin who should be with Dany now. I'm still enjoying the show but it's feeling a bit rushed. When they remake the whole thing in 25 years I'm sure they will do it differently.
|
|
|
Post by Pretty Little Boother on May 6, 2019 16:10:09 GMT
Bad writing? Bad pacing? I can't believe some people didn't like that episode, it was easily the best of the season so far.
The sense of dread created through the slow pacing was excellent, creating a real sense of mistrust and paranoia.
I really liked the straining of the relationships and the suggestion that our heros may actually start to fracture amongst themselves regardless of the result against Cersei.
Superb episode, wonderfully written- there were some excellent conversations and tremendous, non-verbal emotional revelations through the acting too, particularly from Emilia Clarke, whose acting talents I've always felt were a bit suspect. I really enjoyed it (Starbucks-coffee-cup-left-on-Dany's-table-blooper aside).
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 6, 2019 17:17:20 GMT
Bad writing? Bad pacing? I can't believe some people didn't like that episode, it was easily the best of the season so far. The sense of dread created through the slow pacing was excellent, creating a real sense of mistrust and paranoia. I really liked the straining of the relationships and the suggestion that our heros may actually start to fracture amongst themselves regardless of the result against Cersei. Superb episode, wonderfully written- there were some excellent conversations and tremendous, non-verbal emotional revelations through the acting too, particularly from Emilia Clarke, whose acting talents I've always felt were a bit suspect. I really enjoyed it (Starbucks-coffee-cup-left-on-Dany's-table-blooper aside). The Winterfell bit was superb, as you say there were some great convos and. non verbal references to what we can only assume will lead to Daenerys’ impending madness. My issue was after leaving Winterfell though, it took Sansa literally 5 on screen minutes to divulge the secret she swore not to tell, revealing it so soon ruins any tension regarding its use if Dany does go insane. The Bronn scene felt tagged on as an afterthought imo. I also would have had the main shock of the episode done differenty too, *spoilers* I would have had Rhaegal shot during the negotiations with Cersei, and a frantic getaway. Dany being up high and some how not seeing the Iron Fleet was just a jarring contrivance, though unlike others I have no problem with the artillery being used. Again it’s an issue of fast travelling and lack of any reference to time passing, all of which could be avoided through judicious use of conjoining scenes, which GoT did fantastically for 6.5 seasons. Also, Jon would never leave Ghost like that, they may as well have literally said they couldn’t afford the CGI for it as well as the battle scenes.
|
|
|
Post by upthefud on May 6, 2019 17:22:59 GMT
Just watched it for the second time as I always do just to make sure there’s nothing huge I missed.
Really enjoyed it tonight. If I’m being critical though I’d say the very quick Bronn Jaime and Tyrion scene annoyed me. Fair enough he’s been sent to kill them but he’d never shown the same amount of anger towards Tyrion before when Cersi was offering a thousand gold dragons for his head. Just thought it was rushed, unnecessarily aggressive and out of character.
The surprising death of the dragon and Missendai (ignore the spelling) was welcome as it had been a bit predictable so far
|
|
|
Post by thevoid on May 7, 2019 9:08:55 GMT
Back on form- loved the whispering going on between Varys and Tyrion, it was like the show used to be. Danny starting to resemble her old man. Was hoping Bronn would team up with Tyrion and Jamie, they make a good band of brothers so was shocked by his demeanour. Episode flew by.
|
|
|
Post by Pretty Little Boother on May 7, 2019 11:37:41 GMT
The Bronn bit was odd but still made sense character-wise; he's getting to a point where he wants out of the whole thing. His "anger" towards Tyrion can be explained by increasing paranoia and a desire to be out of Winterfell and safe. He's more nervous and impatient than angry and aggressive.
Having said that, it did feel a bit awkward and jammed in where they felt they could fit it.
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 7, 2019 12:00:23 GMT
The Bronn bit was odd but still made sense character-wise; he's getting to a point where he wants out of the whole thing. His "anger" towards Tyrion can be explained by increasing paranoia and a desire to be out of Winterfell and safe. He's more nervous and impatient than angry and aggressive. Having said that, it did feel a bit awkward and jammed in where they felt they could fit it. I wouldn't call being allocated Highgarden a way out of this or any other conflict, it's the former seat of a major house and Westeros' bread basket. If anything it would put him in more political danger moving forward. Also, he surely brings the paranoia on himself by sneaking in? He's well known by many of the characters in Winterfell as a friend and they didn't kill Jaime on sight (after he tried to run Dany down with his horse) so why would they kill Bronn? Then we could have had a nice "oh how've you been" scene followed by a gradual increase in tension as he reveals why he's there, then the bargaining ensues etc. No exposition on how he got there, how he's getting back which leaves you filling in the blanks which good writing should not do. Barely any surprise from Tyrion and Jaime etc.
|
|
|
Post by maxplonk on May 7, 2019 13:56:14 GMT
I’ve got myself a bottle of White Walker from ASDA, straight into storage unopened. Reviews of the content don’t look that good though.
|
|
|
Post by flea79 on May 7, 2019 15:04:53 GMT
the spoilers/leaks that have made it online including small video clips and images could mean this ends worse than lost
|
|
|
Post by Boothen on May 7, 2019 17:58:57 GMT
I'm still a little confused as to how Daenerys failed to see a massive formation of ships from a thousand feet up and in clear weather. Also.
|
|
|
Post by Frogger Theft Auto on May 7, 2019 19:43:26 GMT
Why didn’t she swing the dragon the long way around the back of the ships and wipe them all out from behind? The stupidly overpowered and accurate spear-firing things were set on the front of the ships, the ships were all facing forward and would take a while to turn around, they can’t fire backwards without wiping out their own sails... she should have taken them all out from behind like she’s done with other ships. War won.
And why didn’t they use the many ridiculously overpowered and accurate spear-firing things on the dragon and Khaleesi when they were vulnerable by the city walls? Just seemed mental that they had about 20 of the things lined up that could have wiped out the dragon, the unsullied and Khaleesi in one volley. War won. Neither side seemed to realise what a vulnerable position they were in, which was out of character for both sides.
|
|
|
Post by mattyd on May 7, 2019 19:49:04 GMT
Never seen a single episode of GoT…
Quite tempted to give it a go though, maybe watch S1 over next week or so...
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 8, 2019 0:34:20 GMT
David Nutter (episode director) basically admitted they didn’t give Ghost a proper farewell because “The wolves are CG characters so we felt it best to leave it as simple as possible”. Sorry, that’s just lazy and completely undermines one of the best early scenes of the show, the discovery of the direwolves and Jon’s insistence on keeping them to care for. Ruinous disregard of character development for the sake of ease.
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on May 8, 2019 0:36:24 GMT
Never seen a single episode of GoT… Quite tempted to give it a go though, maybe watch S1 over next week or so... Seasons 1-5 are absolute genius, and a great example of source material very well transformed to screen, when the source material runs out (the books are still being written) the show is still pretty epic for all of season 6. Season 7 has some absolutely fantastic moments in, but loose writing underpinning it whereas this final season has been lurching from sublime to ridiculous scene to scene. Well worth your time however. I only criticise the show because I care so much about it.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 8, 2019 4:58:32 GMT
|
|
|
Post by zerps on May 8, 2019 5:12:05 GMT
Far too much holding hands and talking about feelings in this series. It’s like it’s been hijacked by the far left. They’ve completely run out of episodes to end it properly. The white walker battle should have been a series, the whole travelling south and being ambushed with giant catapult thing didn’t last as long as the soppy stuff with the king slayer and the giant knight. It needed another couple of series to end it properly not just one.
|
|
|
Post by upthefud on May 8, 2019 6:48:55 GMT
Far too much holding hands and talking about feelings in this series. It’s like it’s been hijacked by the far left. They’ve completely run out of episodes to end it properly. The white walker battle should have been a series, the whole travelling south and being ambushed with giant catapult thing didn’t last as long as the soppy stuff with the king slayer and the giant knight. It needed another couple of series to end it properly not just one. Disagree about the white walker thing. They built the plot line for 8 series’, I’m really not sure how you could prolong it more when every time someone dies the corpse joins the army of the dead. The battle of winterfell was the absolute last chance to defeat them
|
|