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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2018 13:46:06 GMT
You don't know Rowett won't turn things round using your own argument. Obviously, but aspiring clubs make pro-active decisions when things are clearly not working. If Moyes is available and keen, Coates will pull the trigger if it gets bad tomorrow, IMHO. Aspiring clubs also make pro-active decisions that sometimes go to rat shit. That's football. Whilst Scholes and Cartwright are there a new manager will only solve part of the issue.....
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Post by FullerMagic on Dec 31, 2018 13:49:28 GMT
It appears Rowett has had 100% autonomy on signings.
So how is Cartwright culpable when the manager has effectively been given carte blanche?
(of course, you could argue giving any manager carte blanche on signings in the modern era is foolish)
I'd like him to spell out what he's driving at.
And in fairness to Carto, he was dead against Wimmer and Berahino - and didn't drive the Imbula signing either.
He isn't to blame for the entirety of the shitshow.
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Post by Pugsley on Dec 31, 2018 13:50:35 GMT
Obviously, but aspiring clubs make pro-active decisions when things are clearly not working. If Moyes is available and keen, Coates will pull the trigger if it gets bad tomorrow, IMHO. Aspiring clubs also make pro-active decisions that sometimes go to rat shit. That's football. Whilst Scholes and Cartwright are there a new manager will only solve part of the issue..... We've sat on our hands before and watched Rome burn. We'll be making the same mistakes again if we don't get rid. I agree on Scholes and Carto but it looks like they are going nowhere. Moyes is red hot on recruitment and perhaps he would see through Carto immediately and suggest to Coates that he is replaced? Wishful thinking on my part I know.
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Post by scfcno1fan on Dec 31, 2018 13:54:00 GMT
We lose tomorrow, there is a chance he’ll get sacked.
I still don’t think they’ll act until the end of the season though.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2018 13:57:40 GMT
Aspiring clubs also make pro-active decisions that sometimes go to rat shit. That's football. Whilst Scholes and Cartwright are there a new manager will only solve part of the issue..... We've sat on our hands before and watched Rome burn. We'll be making the same mistakes again if we don't get rid. I agree on Scholes and Carto but it looks like they are going nowhere. Moyes is red hot on recruitment and perhaps he would see through Carto immediately and suggest to Coates that he is replaced? Wishful thinking on my part I know. He's worked with Scholes before at Preston, guess it depends on his opinion of him at the time.....
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Post by davejohnno1 on Dec 31, 2018 14:01:48 GMT
It appears Rowett has had 100% autonomy on signings. So how is Cartwright culpable when the manager has effectively been given carte blanche? (of course, you could argue giving any manager carte blanche on signings in the modern era is foolish) I'd like him to spell out what he's driving at. And in fairness to Carto, he was dead against Wimmer and Berahino - and didn't drive the Imbula signing either. He isn't to blame for the entirety of the shitshow. John percy again alluding to problems that run far deeper than the manager. If they aren't Scholes and Cartwright, what are they?
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Post by FullerMagic on Dec 31, 2018 14:06:58 GMT
It appears Rowett has had 100% autonomy on signings. So how is Cartwright culpable when the manager has effectively been given carte blanche? (of course, you could argue giving any manager carte blanche on signings in the modern era is foolish) I'd like him to spell out what he's driving at. And in fairness to Carto, he was dead against Wimmer and Berahino - and didn't drive the Imbula signing either. He isn't to blame for the entirety of the shitshow. John percy again alluding to problems that run far deeper than the manager. If they aren't Scholes and Cartwright, what are they? I agree that that must be what Percy is alluding to. But they're easy targets, aren't they? (and God knows, I've had a go at them too) But no-one knows how exactly they're the problem. I haven't seen any suggestion at all that Rowett hasn't got all of HIS choices in - and it's been reported previously that some of the real notorious signings under the old manager were personal Hughes picks (notably Berahino and Wimmer) that Carto was against. And every other Championship manager wouild kill for the budget and training facilities he's been provided with - and similarly we've been told all the poisonous players from the bad old days are gone and he's now working with a set of good pros of his choosing
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Post by datguy on Dec 31, 2018 14:10:43 GMT
Rowett's been bang average at best. And he hasn't helped himself in the media either. But getting rid of him solves very little really.
We'll still be stuck with the rotten core that controls the club. Peter's trust (or misplaced trust) in Scholes is really quite alarming to be honest. That's if Peter's still in charge of the football club anyway.
Moyes would probably come because we're all he's got and we've got money to spend. But bet he can't wait work with Cartwright, Scholes et al...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2018 14:11:40 GMT
Is Percy alluding to the power struggle between father and son? Last year when we were looking for maw manager there were articles in relation to the different direction John wanted to take the club down than Peter.
It can be the only thing I can think of
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2018 14:14:08 GMT
David Moyes is in the stands today. Guest of Coates.
@goals442
Can you put any meat on the bones from this post prior to the Bolton game?
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Post by pavel on Dec 31, 2018 14:15:19 GMT
We lose tomorrow, there is a chance he’ll get sacked. I still don’t think they’ll act until the end of the season though. It shouldn’t be if we lose tomorrow, scrape a win or draw, a few more games to see if he can turn it around. All the warning signs are there, he’s lost many of the fans and probably some players, maybe a lot of them, we are way off pace, the footballs dire, his comments on players are disgraceful and bring the club into disrepute and the mood at the club seems toxic at many levels. He has to go, as Pugsley says we can’t fiddle whilst Rome burns again, no dithering, no more time, it’s time to act now.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 31, 2018 14:23:14 GMT
Alan Nixon @reluctantnickoDo you think they could tempt Moyes? He would be in the frame Personally I would have tried to interest Moyes in a Director of Football type role when it was obvious to all the direction that we were heading in under the later stages of Hughes’s tenure. Giving him carte blanche responsibility to restructure (as necessary) all aspects of the footballing side of the club (academy to first team) and that includes recruitment of management, coaching and playing staff. That would leave Scholes to concentrate on corporate hospitality, burgers and programme sales
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Post by Edward Tattsyrup on Dec 31, 2018 14:32:28 GMT
David Moyes is in the stands today. Guest of Coates. @goals442 Can you put any meat on the bones from this post prior to the Bolton game?
I missed that. Was it ever confirmed Moyes was there? Can't see the press missing that one.
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Post by dirtygary69 on Dec 31, 2018 14:40:51 GMT
So are these issues ones that are acknowledged by those at the club or is Percy basing this on what he’s heard people say?
If the issues are known about internally and if it is a functional, personal or family problem, why is it constantly being allowed to drag on? If it means sacking someone, sack someone and if means someone having to swallow their pride, get fucking swallowing.
For what it’s worth, I think Rowett should be doing a lot better whatever is going on behind the scenes but the fact that these rumours have been rumbling in for years is a joke. Who’s running the fucking thing?
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Post by neddy on Dec 31, 2018 14:42:43 GMT
@goals442 Can you put any meat on the bones from this post prior to the Bolton game?
I missed that. Was it ever confirmed Moyes was there? Can't see the press missing that one. They said he was there but I thought guest of Coates was conjecture?
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Post by nott1 on Dec 31, 2018 14:44:51 GMT
Moyes would not have been there for entertainment that's for sure!
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Post by Edward Tattsyrup on Dec 31, 2018 14:46:32 GMT
I missed that. Was it ever confirmed Moyes was there? Can't see the press missing that one. They said he was there but I thought guest of Coates was conjecture? Cheers neddy, it certainly an interesting development.
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Post by lordb on Dec 31, 2018 14:47:31 GMT
Rowett's been bang average at best. And he hasn't helped himself in the media either. But getting rid of him solves very little really. We'll still be stuck with the rotten core that controls the club. Peter's trust (or misplaced trust) in Scholes is really quite alarming to be honest. That's if Peter's still in charge of the football club anyway. Moyes would probably come because we're all he's got and we've got money to spend. But bet he can't wait work with Cartwright, Scholes et al... He worked quite happily with Scholes at PNE and supposedly agreed to come to Stoke Autumn 2017 only for Hughes to get a stay of execution by winning at Watford. Interesting not convinced Moyes is the best candidate (Jokanovic is) however he's miles better than we could end up with (Coleman,Pardew) and given he has worked well with Scholes before that's a plus isn't it?
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Post by FullerMagic on Dec 31, 2018 15:06:49 GMT
Rowett's been bang average at best. And he hasn't helped himself in the media either. But getting rid of him solves very little really. We'll still be stuck with the rotten core that controls the club. Peter's trust (or misplaced trust) in Scholes is really quite alarming to be honest. That's if Peter's still in charge of the football club anyway. Moyes would probably come because we're all he's got and we've got money to spend. But bet he can't wait work with Cartwright, Scholes et al... He worked quite happily with Scholes at PNE and supposedly agreed to come to Stoke Autumn 2017 only for Hughes to get a stay of execution by winning at Watford. Interesting not convinced Moyes is the best candidate (Jokanovic is) however he's miles better than we could end up with (Coleman,Pardew) and given he has worked well with Scholes before that's a plus isn't it? Looks like he's basically been offered it three teams. 1.) October 2017 before the win at Watford meant they kept faith with Hughes for a couple more months 2.) January 2018 www.theguardian.com/football/2018/may/09/david-moyes-west-ham-ambition-contractMoyes said he remained loyal when one of West Ham’s relegation rivals, believed to be Stoke City, approached him and he does not expect to be short of offers if he leaves. “I could have joined a Premier League club during the season here when I was West Ham manager,” 3. May 2018 www.stokesentinel.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/stoke-city-david-moyes-rowett-1590616Stoke City have made their move for Gary Rowett after being given little encouragement by David Moyes, The Sentinel understands. Moyes has let it be known that he is not keen to jump straight back into management, certainly not in the Championship, and Stoke's owners want a speedy appointment. If at any point he decides he wants it, you'd think it'd be his!
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Dec 31, 2018 16:14:45 GMT
Alan Nixon @reluctantnickoDo you think they could tempt Moyes? He would be in the frame Personally I would have tried to interest Moyes in a Director of Football type role when it was obvious to all the direction that we were heading in under the later stages of Hughes’s tenure. Giving him carte blanche responsibility to restructure (as necessary) all aspects of the footballing side of the club (academy to first team) and that includes recruitment of management, coaching and playing staff. That would leave Scholes to concentrate on corporate hospitality, burgers and programme sales He can’t do any of those either
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Post by mrcoke on Dec 31, 2018 17:07:56 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2018 17:37:22 GMT
It appears Rowett has had 100% autonomy on signings. So how is Cartwright culpable when the manager has effectively been given carte blanche? (of course, you could argue giving any manager carte blanche on signings in the modern era is foolish) I'd like him to spell out what he's driving at. And in fairness to Carto, he was dead against Wimmer and Berahino - and didn't drive the Imbula signing either. He isn't to blame for the entirety of the shitshow. The role of Carto very much seems like it was diminished, or at least spelled out to us that he isn't as influential as we like to think he is. Scholes on the other hand I can see being a source of pain for (at least one of) the Coates family. Whilst last Summer, post-Etebo at least, Rowett was the principal driver behind the signings made, I do wonder whether serious promises were broken. The chases of Ritchie, Gayle and Chester showed the types of players that were on his 'A' List, and I wonder whether he's mighty pissed off that the guys above simply couldn't conclude the deals he wanted (we've all heard the tales of Scholes & Co. trying to be too 'cute' during negotiations). His frustrations are probably doubly-compunded by the fact they've not been able to move on the players that he doesn't want, including certain 'fan favourites' that are now being used as a stick with which to beat him. It sounds like there are serious differences of opinion on how to take this club forward at Board level, assuming that's what Percy is alluding to. And whilst it is Rowett's responsibility to get the best out of his considerable staff (Coaching and Playing) - which we can all agree he's currently underperforming at - the issues at this club were evident way before his arrival and will continue until there is a clear consensus and direction being set by the Board; preferably with John as Chairman (or Denise if she's had a change of heart and fancies taking it on). The club desperately needs a shake-up.
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Post by Pugsley on Dec 31, 2018 17:40:07 GMT
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Post by lordb on Dec 31, 2018 17:56:59 GMT
It appears Rowett has had 100% autonomy on signings. So how is Cartwright culpable when the manager has effectively been given carte blanche? (of course, you could argue giving any manager carte blanche on signings in the modern era is foolish) I'd like him to spell out what he's driving at. And in fairness to Carto, he was dead against Wimmer and Berahino - and didn't drive the Imbula signing either. He isn't to blame for the entirety of the shitshow. The role of Carto very much seems like it was diminished, or at least spelled out to us that he isn't as influential as we like to think he is. Scholes on the other hand I can see being a source of pain for (at least one of) the Coates family. Whilst last Summer, post-Etebo at least, Rowett was the principal driver behind the signings made, I do wonder whether serious promises were broken. The chases of Ritchie, Gayle and Chester showed the types of players that were on his 'A' List, and I wonder whether he's mighty pissed off that the guys above simply couldn't conclude the deals he wanted (we've all heard the tales of Scholes & Co. trying to be too 'cute' during negotiations). His frustrations are probably doubly-compunded by the fact they've not been able to move on the players that he doesn't want, including certain 'fan favourites' that are now being used as a stick with which to beat him. It sounds like there are serious differences of opinion on how to take this club forward at Board level, assuming that's what Percy is alluding to. And whilst it is Rowett's responsibility to get the best out of his considerable staff (Coaching and Playing) - which we can all agree he's currently underperforming at - the issues at this club were evident way before his arrival and will continue until there is a clear consensus and direction being set by the Board; preferably with John as Chairman (or Denise if she's had a change of heart and fancies taking it on). The club desperately needs a shake-up. One point of order: When it comes to transfer negotiations it's not Scholes and co. It's just Scholes. Others may identify players & although in the main players get offered to clubs - but it's To y who does all the negotiations.
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Post by BuckRogers on Jan 1, 2019 9:10:04 GMT
ROWETT out! Just clearing my voice for today. Hopefully clueless last game today
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Post by FullerMagic on Jan 1, 2019 11:20:08 GMT
Alan Nixon @reluctantnicko A draw. Crowd reaction most important thing today. If they revolt again ...........
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Post by thevoid on Jan 1, 2019 11:28:59 GMT
Come on, onlooker, I know you're just desperate for MON to get down here We might as well appoint Big Ron. Someone needs to tell Sleepy Pete it's 2019 not 1999.
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Post by toppercorner on Jan 1, 2019 11:31:03 GMT
Alan Nixon @reluctantnickoA draw. Crowd reaction most important thing today. If they revolt again ........... that'll do. time to be unsavoury towards our 'leader'
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Post by milky on Jan 1, 2019 11:31:52 GMT
Well considering we will always go British if Moyes has given us even the slightest encouragement we should move mountains to get him in and not piss about dithering.
Sooner rather than later you expect one of the clubs fighting the drop from the Premiership will be looking for a proven experienced manager....
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Post by thevoid on Jan 1, 2019 11:32:13 GMT
On a serious note. Who do we get? For what it’s worth, lose on NYD I think Rowett will walk. IF he goes (big "if"), anybody who's prepared to play attacking football. I wouldn't be against Jon Walters being appointed for the rest of the season. Then review. Does it have to Walters, or can it be anyone who used to play for us and has no previous managerial experience?
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