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Post by tony1234 on Jul 31, 2018 16:37:07 GMT
Not the HBO TV series.(perhaps my favourite of all time) but, the rotting, fetid, decaying log jam of festering uselessness the club seemingly STILL cant find a way to dispose of. Its precisely this listing of festering 'happy to be here still conning a living wallahs' that continues to hold us back. And, if you're anybody from the club looking in, you know who they are.(you might even be one). its not just us. I work Birmingham way and picked up a paper today with the local journo lamenting that Villa can't shift McCormack and Richards... the only option being to run their contracts down the bitter end... some comments from Bruce that suggested he been, at least, semi vocal about it and affecting the speed they could move forward with squad rebuilding given their FFP position. (Made me think back to the Odemwingie / Jones swap. If they were fit and able but just hated the club they were signed to and at loggerheads with the manager, could we do swappsies - 2 of their outcasts for 2 of ours?. Worst that will happen is we will neither be any better or worse off for it?) Players. Who'd buy em eh?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jul 31, 2018 16:56:52 GMT
If it was as simple as breach of contract then all clubs would be jettisoning their problem children left, right and centre, wouldn't they? It's either breach of contract or it isn't. To use other clubs as an example of why the contract has not been breached, is not the way to approach the problem.In a situation which relies on contracts between players and clubs, I would have thought it is the best way out in an extreme situation that now exists at Stoke. If Stoke just ignore this situation, it will only encourage players elsewhere to behave in the same way when it suits them. Perhaps this is why Scholes is still in a job, because he might be needed to spearhead a case against Berahino, and maybe Imbula if he can't get another loan. That makes no sense whatsover. Ours isn't an any more extreme example than dozens of others. If it was as easy as you're making out we'd have done it months if not years ago.
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DEADWOOD
Jul 31, 2018 19:36:01 GMT
via mobile
Post by Davef on Jul 31, 2018 19:36:01 GMT
What's Berahino done that's worthy of dismissal for breach of contract?
Anything worse than headbutting or slapping a colleague?
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DEADWOOD
Jul 31, 2018 19:50:22 GMT
via mobile
Post by WhyDelilah on Jul 31, 2018 19:50:22 GMT
What's Berahino done that's worthy of dismissal for breach of contract? Is "epic proportions of shitness" a legitimate reason for wielding the axe?
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Post by Davef on Jul 31, 2018 19:54:53 GMT
What's Berahino done that's worthy of dismissal for breach of contract? Is "epic proportions of shitness" a legitimate reason for wielding the axe? I doubt it. We'd be in a five-a-side league if that was the case.
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Post by WhyDelilah on Jul 31, 2018 19:57:56 GMT
Is "epic proportions of shitness" a legitimate reason for wielding the axe? I doubt it. We'd be in a five-a-side league if that was the case. Watercarriers United.
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Post by Northy on Aug 1, 2018 7:59:48 GMT
You can bet your bottom dollar now, its the wages that some of these shysters are still pulling that is most probably preventing our new manager from securing the acquisitions he still believes we really need to secure our status as real favourites. You're definitely onto something here, Tone It's as if he has a super brain to come up with that, as if it hasnt been posted on most threads 1000 times already
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Post by ursemboys on Aug 1, 2018 8:01:20 GMT
What's Berahino done that's worthy of dismissal for breach of contract? Is "epic proportions of shitness" a legitimate reason for wielding the axe? so that applies to Diouf then
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DEADWOOD
Aug 1, 2018 9:14:31 GMT
via mobile
Post by Veritas on Aug 1, 2018 9:14:31 GMT
What's Berahino done that's worthy of dismissal for breach of contract? Is "epic proportions of shitness" a legitimate reason for wielding the axe? Unfortunately not if it was we would have already dismissed most of last year's squad
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Post by lawrieleslie on Aug 1, 2018 17:06:05 GMT
Would it be possible to in effect make them redundant (I know they have contracts), with a healthy settlement which would then allow them to become Free Agents and find a club elsewhere. ? It really is a crazy situation. If we can’t loan them out I would insist they attend on match days and act as ball boys and flag wavers. People are made redundant because their position either no longer exists or it is being amalgamated with another job. That would be very hard to accomplish in a professional football club.
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Post by raythesailor on Aug 1, 2018 17:11:54 GMT
Would it be possible to in effect make them redundant (I know they have contracts), with a healthy settlement which would then allow them to become Free Agents and find a club elsewhere. ? It really is a crazy situation. If we can’t loan them out I would insist they attend on match days and act as ball boys and flag wavers. People are made redundant because their position either no longer exists or it is being amalgamated with another job. That would be very hard to accomplish in a professional football club. Thanks for that, and I understand. I did say “in effect make them redundant”. What I was trying to say was buy them out of the contract. A fig less than their remaining salaries, which then could be subsidised by any signing on fees they may get as free agents elsewhere.
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Post by CalgaryPotter on Aug 1, 2018 17:33:33 GMT
More disturbingly, we now appear to be loaning other teams deadwood
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Post by fulagoals on Aug 1, 2018 17:43:24 GMT
Could somebody please put a list of all the deadwood we have at the club. Then follow it up with what remains of a 25 man squad(academy players exempt) if we were to proceed with getting rid of all this deadwood overnight. Just curious.
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Post by magwitch on Aug 1, 2018 20:37:13 GMT
It's either breach of contract or it isn't. To use other clubs as an example of why the contract has not been breached, is not the way to approach the problem.In a situation which relies on contracts between players and clubs, I would have thought it is the best way out in an extreme situation that now exists at Stoke. If Stoke just ignore this situation, it will only encourage players elsewhere to behave in the same way when it suits them. Perhaps this is why Scholes is still in a job, because he might be needed to spearhead a case against Berahino, and maybe Imbula if he can't get another loan. That makes no sense whatsover. Ours isn't an any more extreme example than dozens of others. If it was as easy as you're making out we'd have done it months if not years ago. There are dozens of Berahinos in English league football, so you say. Thanks for telling me the facts from your obviously intimate knowledge of the murky side of the game. I was completely unaware of this. Incidently, I never said breach of contract was easy.
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DEADWOOD
Aug 1, 2018 20:42:12 GMT
via mobile
Post by bobby1eye on Aug 1, 2018 20:42:12 GMT
The deadline for loanees is 31st August, the deadline for permanent moves in most major European leagues is the 31st August. Most will be disposed of in good time, unless you have a better plan of course in which case fire away.....? I think there is a good chance quite a few will still be here, we have just got to grin and bear it It happens every season. We give too long a contract to ageing players all the time.or we give them another 12 months when they haven't played 6 games in 12 months. It's just fucking wrong.
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Post by zigazaga on Aug 1, 2018 20:58:19 GMT
Not the HBO TV series.(perhaps my favourite of all time) but, the rotting, fetid, decaying log jam of festering uselessness the club seemingly STILL cant find a way to dispose of. Its precisely this listing of festering 'happy to be here still conning a living wallahs' that continues to hold us back. And, if you're anybody from the club looking in, you know who they are.(you might even be one). I couldn't have put it better myself Why is it when we loan out players they always get returned to us? And when we eventually manage to sell 99% of the time they drop down the leagues. Is it due to constant bad luck or our grossly deficient recruitment team? 4 year contract anyone?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 1, 2018 21:54:24 GMT
That makes no sense whatsover. Ours isn't an any more extreme example than dozens of others. If it was as easy as you're making out we'd have done it months if not years ago. There are dozens of Berahinos in English league football, so you say. Thanks for telling me the facts from your obviously intimate knowledge of the murky side of the game. I was completely unaware of this. Incidently, I never said breach of contract was easy. You don’t need an intimate knowledge of any side of the game to know most clubs have their wasters. Ask yourself why they don’t just get rid of them. There must be a reason, no?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2018 21:55:08 GMT
sums things up very nicely I feel
'you incompetent fucks'
and
'dont talk to me in fucking riddles'
both seem particularly apt
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Post by dioufsboots on Aug 1, 2018 22:20:17 GMT
Could somebody please put a list of all the deadwood we have at the club. Then follow it up with what remains of a 25 man squad(academy players exempt) if we were to proceed with getting rid of all this deadwood overnight. Just curious. Would be easier put who we should of kept,butland,bauer,pieters,shawcross,bruno,allen,Ndiaye and 2 of those should be no more than back up,would probably have sold joe allen aswell even though i rate him 25 million would of got us aden flint,barry douglas,ben pearson and a bit of change for a decent loan or 2
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Post by magwitch on Aug 3, 2018 6:34:59 GMT
There are dozens of Berahinos in English league football, so you say. Thanks for telling me the facts from your obviously intimate knowledge of the murky side of the game. I was completely unaware of this. Incidently, I never said breach of contract was easy. You don’t need an intimate knowledge of any side of the game to know most clubs have their wasters. Ask yourself why they don’t just get rid of them. There must be a reason, no? Wasters are NOT all the same. Most are within their contracts despite being useless to the Club. It is clearly the Club's fault for signing them. Berahino is rather a different story. I challenge you to name one Stoke player since WW2 generally as badly behaved as Berahino. He has clearly brought the Club into disrepute and made Stoke City a laughing stock. Berahino is over and above your usual waster and, if his antics are allowed under his contract, there is something radically wrong in the game.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 3, 2018 6:38:41 GMT
You don’t need an intimate knowledge of any side of the game to know most clubs have their wasters. Ask yourself why they don’t just get rid of them. There must be a reason, no? Wasters are NOT all the same. Most are within their contracts despite being useless to the Club. It is clearly the Club's fault for signing them. Berahino is rather a different story. I challenge you to name one Stoke player since WW2 generally as badly behaved as Berahino. He has clearly brought the Club into disrepute and made Stoke City a laughing stock. Berahino is over and above your usual waster and, if his antics are allowed under his contract, there is something radically wrong in the game. Sammy Bangoura is the obvious name that springs to mind. Berahino's antics are pretty much that of your standard waster. He's a disgrace but it isn't as simple as just getting rid. If it was, you can bet your bottom dollar we'd have done it by now. You think Peter Coates is a man who happily watches 70k a week disappear for no return whatsoever?
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Post by magwitch on Aug 3, 2018 8:50:15 GMT
Wasters are NOT all the same. Most are within their contracts despite being useless to the Club. It is clearly the Club's fault for signing them. Berahino is rather a different story. I challenge you to name one Stoke player since WW2 generally as badly behaved as Berahino. He has clearly brought the Club into disrepute and made Stoke City a laughing stock. Berahino is over and above your usual waster and, if his antics are allowed under his contract, there is something radically wrong in the game. Sammy Bangoura is the obvious name that springs to mind. Berahino's antics are pretty much that of your standard waster. He's a disgrace but it isn't as simple as just getting rid. If it was, you can bet your bottom dollar we'd have done it by now. You think Peter Coates is a man who happily watches 70k a week disappear for no return whatsoever? I disagree completely that Berahino is your typical standard waster. Look at his track record. Sammy Bangoura was simply a stupid buy by Stoke City. He was never going to be good enough and I don't remember any particularly bad behaviour by him. Drug taking. Call girls at £5000 a night highlighted in the national press. Turning up late for matches. Being overweight and unfit. Showing complete lack of interest in the Club or his job. Taking large sums from the Club but offering nothing in return, and he did not even have the excuse of advancing age as some have.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 3, 2018 9:05:23 GMT
Sammy Bangoura is the obvious name that springs to mind. Berahino's antics are pretty much that of your standard waster. He's a disgrace but it isn't as simple as just getting rid. If it was, you can bet your bottom dollar we'd have done it by now. You think Peter Coates is a man who happily watches 70k a week disappear for no return whatsoever? I disagree completely that Berahino is your typical standard waster. Look at his track record. Sammy Bangoura was simply a stupid buy by Stoke City. He was never going to be good enough and I don't remember any particularly bad behaviour by him. Drug taking. Call girls at £5000 a night highlighted in the national press. Turning up late for matches. Being overweight and unfit. Showing complete lack of interest in the Club or his job. Taking large sums from the Club but offering nothing in return, and he did not even have the excuse of advancing age as some have. You don't recall Bangoura going awol on three separate occasions or missing the entirety of pre-season that time and then rocking up literally the day of the first game of the season at Southend? I'm no fan of Berahino at all but the call girl stuff, unseemly though it is, is really neither here nor there when it comes to what he does on the pitch and the drug taking, as far as we know, happened before he was here. The stuff we know about relating to his job with us is being late for training, an idle waster etc which is absolutely wretched but not enough to sack him. Again, if we could, we would.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 3, 2018 9:32:07 GMT
Sammy Bangoura is the obvious name that springs to mind. Berahino's antics are pretty much that of your standard waster. He's a disgrace but it isn't as simple as just getting rid. If it was, you can bet your bottom dollar we'd have done it by now. You think Peter Coates is a man who happily watches 70k a week disappear for no return whatsoever? I disagree completely that Berahino is your typical standard waster. Look at his track record. Sammy Bangoura was simply a stupid buy by Stoke City. He was never going to be good enough and I don't remember any particularly bad behaviour by him. Drug taking. Call girls at £5000 a night highlighted in the national press. Turning up late for matches. Being overweight and unfit. Showing complete lack of interest in the Club or his job. Taking large sums from the Club but offering nothing in return, and he did not even have the excuse of advancing age as some have. I disagree 100% with what you say about Bangoura. "Never going to be good enough" Really? Apart from Peter Thorne, he was as talented a striker as we had at in our days at the Brit until Fuller arrived. You don't remember any "particularly bad behaviour by him" Really? Give him a game abroad with his national team and you were lucky if he came back within 7 days of the due date. And once we had sussed out and acted to curb his disciplinary problems he lost interest in playing football and went from being a goal machine to being a Berahino clone. He annoyed me more than any player of the past 20 years. A huge and obvious talent (at his previous club and in his early days with us) but once he had a few quid in the bank he just couldn't be arsed to put that talent to any sort of good use on a regular basis.
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DEADWOOD
Aug 3, 2018 9:57:56 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2018 9:57:56 GMT
Deadwood = Adam, fletcher, wimmer, berahinio, affellay,imbulla,Hauggard,Cameron -not exactly rocket science is it ? and most if not all, sucking the very life out of our football club
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Post by rockthecity on Aug 3, 2018 10:04:45 GMT
Deadwood = Adam, fletcher, wimmer, berahinio, affellay,imbulla,Hauggard,Cameron -not exactly rocket science is it ? and most if not all, sucking the very life out of our football club I would not call Cameron dead wood, his versatility could be a bonus + he always gives 110% The rest can do one though ( Imbulla could come good ?? )
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Post by rockthecity on Aug 3, 2018 10:08:37 GMT
I disagree completely that Berahino is your typical standard waster. Look at his track record. Sammy Bangoura was simply a stupid buy by Stoke City. He was never going to be good enough and I don't remember any particularly bad behaviour by him. Drug taking. Call girls at £5000 a night highlighted in the national press. Turning up late for matches. Being overweight and unfit. Showing complete lack of interest in the Club or his job. Taking large sums from the Club but offering nothing in return, and he did not even have the excuse of advancing age as some have. I disagree 100% with what you say about Bangoura. "Never going to be good enough" Really? Apart from Peter Thorne, he was as talented a striker as we had at in our days at the Brit until Fuller arrived. You don't remember any "particularly bad behaviour by him" Really? Give him a game abroad with his national team and you were lucky if he came back within 7 days of the due date. And once we had sussed out and acted to curb his disciplinary problems he lost interest in playing football and went from being a goal machine to being a Berahino clone. He annoyed me more than any player of the past 20 years. A huge and obvious talent (at his previous club and in his early days with us) but once he had a few quid in the bank he just couldn't be arsed to put that talent to any sort of good use on a regular basis. Bangoura had at one point 8 goals in 10 games and got 9 in 24 in 1st season. if he had of applied himself he could of been a world beater!
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Post by magwitch on Aug 3, 2018 10:09:34 GMT
I disagree completely that Berahino is your typical standard waster. Look at his track record. Sammy Bangoura was simply a stupid buy by Stoke City. He was never going to be good enough and I don't remember any particularly bad behaviour by him. Drug taking. Call girls at £5000 a night highlighted in the national press. Turning up late for matches. Being overweight and unfit. Showing complete lack of interest in the Club or his job. Taking large sums from the Club but offering nothing in return, and he did not even have the excuse of advancing age as some have. I disagree 100% with what you say about Bangoura. "Never going to be good enough" Really? Apart from Peter Thorne, he was as talented a striker as we had at in our days at the Brit until Fuller arrived. You don't remember any "particularly bad behaviour by him" Really? Give him a game abroad with his national team and you were lucky if he came back within 7 days of the due date. And once we had sussed out and acted to curb his disciplinary problems he lost interest in playing football and went from being a goal machine to being a Berahino clone. He annoyed me more than any player of the past 20 years. A huge and obvious talent (at his previous club and in his early days with us) but once he had a few quid in the bank he just couldn't be arsed to put that talent to any sort of good use on a regular basis. I must admit i took very little interest in Stoke in those days and seldom went because I spent most of my time outside the area. So we have now established another Berahino since WW2 just one! I think that this is significant and ensures his status as a class A super waster alongside the notorious Bangoura. I must admit, Bangoura did cement his position in the Stoke City annals of fame with his unforgetable arse goal in the play-offs.
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Post by rockthecity on Aug 3, 2018 10:21:38 GMT
I disagree 100% with what you say about Bangoura. "Never going to be good enough" Really? Apart from Peter Thorne, he was as talented a striker as we had at in our days at the Brit until Fuller arrived. You don't remember any "particularly bad behaviour by him" Really? Give him a game abroad with his national team and you were lucky if he came back within 7 days of the due date. And once we had sussed out and acted to curb his disciplinary problems he lost interest in playing football and went from being a goal machine to being a Berahino clone. He annoyed me more than any player of the past 20 years. A huge and obvious talent (at his previous club and in his early days with us) but once he had a few quid in the bank he just couldn't be arsed to put that talent to any sort of good use on a regular basis. I must admit i took very little interest in Stoke in those days and seldom went because I spent most of my time outside the area. So we have now established another Berahino since WW2 just one! I think that this is significant and ensures his status as a class A super waster alongside the notorious Bangoura. I must admit, Bangoura did cement his position in the Stoke City annals of fame with his unforgetable arse goal in the play-offs. Not Bangoura mate, it was the arse of Souleymane Oulare in the play offs
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 3, 2018 10:54:35 GMT
I disagree 100% with what you say about Bangoura. "Never going to be good enough" Really? Apart from Peter Thorne, he was as talented a striker as we had at in our days at the Brit until Fuller arrived. You don't remember any "particularly bad behaviour by him" Really? Give him a game abroad with his national team and you were lucky if he came back within 7 days of the due date. And once we had sussed out and acted to curb his disciplinary problems he lost interest in playing football and went from being a goal machine to being a Berahino clone. He annoyed me more than any player of the past 20 years. A huge and obvious talent (at his previous club and in his early days with us) but once he had a few quid in the bank he just couldn't be arsed to put that talent to any sort of good use on a regular basis. I must admit i took very little interest in Stoke in those days and seldom went because I spent most of my time outside the area. So we have now established another Berahino since WW2 just one! I think that this is significant and ensures his status as a class A super waster alongside the notorious Bangoura. I must admit, Bangoura did cement his position in the Stoke City annals of fame with his unforgetable arse goal in the play-offs. If you took very little interest in Stoke in those days - how come you felt competent to offer the opinion that he was "never going to be good enough"? The evidence before we signed him was that he was a goal machine at his previous club. As has been pointed out above, he scored 8 in his first 10 games for us - before it all went tits up. But somehow, you managed to form the opinion that he was never going to be good enough. You must have amazing powers of obeservation and prediction then. Whilst he always seemed like he was going to be a "difficult player to manage", you appear to be the only person who decided he was never going to be good enough. Well done. Incidentally Bangoura never scored with his arse in the playoffs. As rock the city says - that was Oulare.
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