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Post by bayernoatcake on May 27, 2018 13:22:42 GMT
But it is part of the reason we shouldn't touch him with a barge pole. This shit follows him around like a bad smell. Combine that with him not having the talent to deflect it and it makes it a no brainer not to sign him. Dunna get me wrong bayern....I agree with ya wholeheartedly.....it's just that reading some of the posts on here, it's becoming way to deep!!! It is but that's what he brings whether he and people like it or not. It's why it's such a daft idea.
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Post by banksisgod on May 27, 2018 13:27:35 GMT
.....which brings us right back to the kernel of this thread. James McClean, should he end up at Stoke, will divide opinion. He has broken no law (unlike increasing numbers of footballers and sports people generally). He merely holds very strong political opinions with which a number of people on here disagree. It is your privilege as citizens of an open democracy to air your anger/disgust/loathing as it is his to ignore you. Such freedoms are what demoracies are built on in the first place. Freedoms that countless individuals, groups and peoples throughout history were prepared to die for.
Catholics in Derry marched and died for the right to be treated equally to their protestant neighbours. This wasn't in the middle ages; this was 1972, no more than 200 miles from the centre of Stoke-on-Trent.
Excuse me for letting football interrupt a heated political debate, but if McClean does, indeed, end up at Stoke, you can shout your displeasure as loudly as you wish, as is your right. Me? As a passionate, obsessive Stoke fan for over fifty years, I will be shouting my support of him louder than you, not because I agree with all of his views (I don't, but I try to understand where they come from), but because he wears the colours of the club I love.
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 27, 2018 13:28:44 GMT
.....which brings us right back to the kernel of this thread. James McClean, should he end up at Stoke, will divide opinion. He has broken no law (unlike increasing numbers of footballers and sports people generally). He merely holds very strong political opinions with which a number of people on here disagree. It is your privilege as citizens of an open democracy to air your anger/disgust/loathing as it is his to ignore you. Such freedoms are what demoracies are built on in the first place. Freedoms that countless individuals, groups and peoples throughout history were prepared to die for. Catholics in Derry marched and died for the right to be treated equally to their protestant neighbours. This wasn't in the middle ages; this was 1972, no more than 200 miles from the centre of Stoke-on-Trent. Excuse me for letting football interrupt a heated political debate, but if McClean does, indeed, end up at Stoke, you can shout your displeasure as loudly as you wish, as is your right. Me? As a passionate, obsessive Stoke fan for over fifty years, I will be shouting my support of him louder than you, not because I agree with all of his views (I don't, but I try to understand where they come from), but because he wears the colours of the club I love. Do you want a medal? 😂
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on May 27, 2018 13:38:56 GMT
I don't really want him for footballing reasons but I simply can't agree with or understand the non-footballing reasons other people are giving for him not to be signed.
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Post by vahl on May 27, 2018 13:49:14 GMT
We are the 51.9% voting British public. You know, the majority? So non of the other 48.1% are proud Englishmen or Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish? What a peculiar view. I'm part of a slim majority the rest of you are traitors. It's not a peculiar view, it's rather your question is a good one. 48.1% wanted the country to be controlled, governed and populated by other nations, at their own will. That to me, simply put, means you are not very proud or happy with what Britain as a standalone entity stood for? The British Empire is the reason our Foreign Aid budget (even in 2018) absolutely takes the piss too, pure guilt money - I don't get your point? Are we supposed to be ashamed of our heritage or something? Not me mate. It's alright for everyone else to be proud of their heritage and in a dog-eat-dog world, we were a fucking Wolf, so what. This ties in to the player in question too because why would you want to play for Stoke City when Stoke-On-Trent was the highest voting Brexit City in the entire country? Again it makes no sense if you don't do British values. It's as big a deal politically as Ireland is/was. Stokies are so British it hurts, so why would you want to be here? You can't pick and choose the bits you like and dislike when you're British mate. That is bollocks and that's why I think James McClean is an absolute mega tit. He is also too crap to play for us IMO, we are better than him.
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Post by banksisgod on May 27, 2018 13:55:30 GMT
Do I want a medal? That's a bit trite, isn't it?
I simply find it sad that people on here would boo their own player for any reason. What next? I'll boo that guy because he used to play for Celtic, so he must be "dodgy"?
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Post by alster on May 27, 2018 13:57:02 GMT
So non of the other 48.1% are proud Englishmen or Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish? What a peculiar view. I'm part of a slim majority the rest of you are traitors. It's not a peculiar view, it's rather your question is a good one. 48.1% wanted the country to be controlled, governed and populated by other nations, at their own will. That to me, simply put, means you are not very proud or happy with what Britain as a standalone entity stood for? The British Empire is the reason our Foreign Aid budget (even in 2018) absolutely takes the piss too, pure guilt money - I don't get your point? Are we supposed to be ashamed of our heritage or something? Not me mate. It's alright for everyone else to be proud of their heritage and in a dog-eat-dog world, we were a fucking Wolf, so what. This ties in to the player in question too because why would you want to play for Stoke City when Stoke-On-Trent was the highest voting Brexit City in the entire country? Again it makes no sense if you don't do British values. It's as big a deal politically as Ireland is/was. Stokies are so British it hurts, so why would you want to be here? You can't pick and choose the bits you like and dislike when you're British mate. That is bollocks and that's why I think James McClean is an absolute mega tit. He is also too crap to play for us IMO, we are better than him. So let me try to get my head around this. You disagree fundamentally with the size of the international aid budget (as do I incidentally) but I and others can't pick and choose what we agree with and what we don't and still remain proud patriotic Englishmen or whatever. I think you're extremely confused
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Post by Admin on May 27, 2018 13:59:41 GMT
It's not a peculiar view, it's rather your question is a good one. 48.1% wanted the country to be controlled, governed and populated by other nations, at their own will. That to me, simply put, means you are not very proud or happy with what Britain as a standalone entity stood for? The British Empire is the reason our Foreign Aid budget (even in 2018) absolutely takes the piss too, pure guilt money - I don't get your point? Are we supposed to be ashamed of our heritage or something? Not me mate. It's alright for everyone else to be proud of their heritage and in a dog-eat-dog world, we were a fucking Wolf, so what. This ties in to the player in question too because why would you want to play for Stoke City when Stoke-On-Trent was the highest voting Brexit City in the entire country? Again it makes no sense if you don't do British values. It's as big a deal politically as Ireland is/was. Stokies are so British it hurts, so why would you want to be here? You can't pick and choose the bits you like and dislike when you're British mate. That is bollocks and that's why I think James McClean is an absolute mega tit. He is also too crap to play for us IMO, we are better than him. So let me try to get my head around this. You disagree fundamentally with the size of the international aid budget (as do I incidentally) but I and others can't pick and choose what we agree with and what we don't and still remain proud patriotic Englishmen or whatever. I think you're extremely confused Any chance of taking this discussion elsewhere?
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on May 27, 2018 14:03:00 GMT
There is something ironic about a player like this potentially signing for a football club who's City status in England is pretty much the 'home of Brexit'. Is there another City in the UK with such a staunch taste for Britishness? He's still a shite footballer though. He is the sort we used to sign when we were completely crap ourselves. Don't mean to shock you but that 69% vote wasn't through pure patriotism and love for their country.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2018 14:14:09 GMT
So non of the other 48.1% are proud Englishmen or Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish? What a peculiar view. I'm part of a slim majority the rest of you are traitors. It's not a peculiar view, it's rather your question is a good one. 48.1% wanted the country to be controlled, governed and populated by other nations, at their own will. That to me, simply put, means you are not very proud or happy with what Britain as a standalone entity stood for? The British Empire is the reason our Foreign Aid budget (even in 2018) absolutely takes the piss too, pure guilt money - I don't get your point? Are we supposed to be ashamed of our heritage or something? Not me mate. It's alright for everyone else to be proud of their heritage and in a dog-eat-dog world, we were a fucking Wolf, so what. This ties in to the player in question too because why would you want to play for Stoke City when Stoke-On-Trent was the highest voting Brexit City in the entire country? Again it makes no sense if you don't do British values. It's as big a deal politically as Ireland is/was. Stokies are so British it hurts, so why would you want to be here? You can't pick and choose the bits you like and dislike when you're British mate. That is bollocks and that's why I think James McClean is an absolute mega tit. He is also too crap to play for us IMO, we are better than him. It's true, you can't pick and choose what parts of our history you prefer. It's good to see both sides of an argument too. To recognise the dark and the light is healthy Maclean? My main issue is he too old or good enough? If he comes he'll have to wear red and white, the colours of England. I wonder if his political stance is there to cheer or protect the people back home? I respect his free speech but ultimately I really don't care Only care IF he signs and is good enough to get us back up If he's not then I hope we don't sign him, the reverse if true
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Post by vahl on May 27, 2018 14:17:33 GMT
There is something ironic about a player like this potentially signing for a football club who's City status in England is pretty much the 'home of Brexit'. Is there another City in the UK with such a staunch taste for Britishness? He's still a shite footballer though. He is the sort we used to sign when we were completely crap ourselves. Don't mean to shock you but that 69% vote wasn't through pure patriotism and love for their country. It was for all sorts of reasons, yeah. I'm not even bothered about a Brexit discussion tbh, it was more making the point that James McClean is a professional footballer that has used a Premier League media platform to put across his feelings on a certain subject matter, so scrutiny will come to him naturally and rightly so. I just got a bit sidetracked. My problem, apart from not rating him as a footballer anyway, is that why would you consider plying your trade in an area that is so politically against what he believes, it must mean so much to him that he felt the need to openly tell us in front of millions and millions of people world-wide.
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Post by tuum on May 27, 2018 14:19:03 GMT
Absolutely spot on, civilians shot dead by the forces who were supposedly sent in to protect them from a Protestant Loyalist Apartheid. I can’t actually believe people can deny him his view. Every person on this board would feel the same way! They weren’t innocents they knew full well who was amongst them and their intentions as clearly admitted by McGuiness innocents would have gone out of their way to be nowhere to be seen never mind shot. You should read the conclusion to the Saville report. One of their findings expressly states that the Army would not/could not have known who was (or had been) a rioter and who was (or had been) a lawful marcher. The original order was expressly not to chase the crowds into the Bogside but only to keep clear a very small specific area at the entry to the Bogside. That order was ignored by the Colonel on the ground in charge of the operation. He had his own agenda that was not in keeping with the express instructions from his superiors. www.gov.uk/government/publications/report-of-the-bloody-sunday-inquiry
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Post by tuum on May 27, 2018 14:21:11 GMT
Oops. Just saw the request from Admin to keep the discussion on topic. No more politics from me on this thread.
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Post by heworksardtho on May 27, 2018 15:46:00 GMT
You should give your head a wobble , and go visit the war cemetery’s then you might change your opinion I have been to plenty of war cemetery's thank you. Good on you , I take it all back
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Post by heworksardtho on May 27, 2018 15:47:18 GMT
You should give your head a wobble , and go visit the war cemetery’s then you might change your opinion Would going to an Iraqi cemetery which is home to the half a million innocent civilians killed since 2003 influence me as well? How do I know you should go then come back on here , and let us all know
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Post by heworksardtho on May 27, 2018 15:48:39 GMT
Absolutely spot on, civilians shot dead by the forces who were supposedly sent in to protect them from a Protestant Loyalist Apartheid. I can’t actually believe people can deny him his view. Every person on this board would feel the same way! You absolutely right, he is entitled to his views, and entitled to display them however he wants. Is it not somewhat hypocritical though to ply your trade in a country that you have so much hatred, or so many feelings of hurt? Personally, if it was me, I wouldn’t step foot in the country, I’d prefer to play football elsewhere. McClean must be a better man than me if he can compartmentalise wealth, fame and fortune from his daily hurt of his deep rooted beliefs. Spit on
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Post by heworksardtho on May 27, 2018 15:49:14 GMT
You absolutely right, he is entitled to his views, and entitled to display them however he wants. Is it not somewhat hypocritical though to ply your trade in a country that you have so much hatred, or so many feelings of hurt? Personally, if it was me, I wouldn’t step foot in the country, I’d prefer to play football elsewhere. McClean must be a better man than me if he can compartmentalise wealth, fame and fortune from his daily hurt of his deep rooted beliefs. Spit on Spot on it should have read
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on May 27, 2018 15:52:36 GMT
Don't mean to shock you but that 69% vote wasn't through pure patriotism and love for their country. It was for all sorts of reasons, yeah. I'm not even bothered about a Brexit discussion tbh, it was more making the point that James McClean is a professional footballer that has used a Premier League media platform to put across his feelings on a certain subject matter, so scrutiny will come to him naturally and rightly so. I just got a bit sidetracked. My problem, apart from not rating him as a footballer anyway, is that why would you consider plying your trade in an area that is so politically against what he believes, it must mean so much to him that he felt the need to openly tell us in front of millions and millions of people world-wide. Choosing not to wear a poppy on his shirt wasn't him 'telling millions about his views', the controversy was only generated because of this country's poppy hysteria every November. And he doesn't hate Britain, he just dislikes what its Army did to his community back home.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on May 27, 2018 15:55:56 GMT
Oh my god are we shopping at Aldi already?
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Post by thevoid on May 27, 2018 15:57:43 GMT
I don’t believe he’s ever stated hatred for the English, it is the actions of the British that he refers to. Britain is a political collective rather than a nationality. He was also born in Britain so has every right to ply his trade in Britain. By the way, I am English and very proud of it, however I also dislike the British ideology, won’t sing the national anthem or wave the Union Jack, I still work in England, have worked in Scotland and Northern Ireland - Should I be packing my bags and finding work somewhere else? English not British for me. I quite like the idea of an independent English republic.
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Post by vahl on May 27, 2018 16:06:52 GMT
It was for all sorts of reasons, yeah. I'm not even bothered about a Brexit discussion tbh, it was more making the point that James McClean is a professional footballer that has used a Premier League media platform to put across his feelings on a certain subject matter, so scrutiny will come to him naturally and rightly so. I just got a bit sidetracked. My problem, apart from not rating him as a footballer anyway, is that why would you consider plying your trade in an area that is so politically against what he believes, it must mean so much to him that he felt the need to openly tell us in front of millions and millions of people world-wide. Choosing not to wear a poppy on his shirt wasn't him 'telling millions about his views', the controversy was only generated because of this country's poppy hysteria every November. And he doesn't hate Britain, he just dislikes what its Army did to his community back home. Anything Premier League footballers do is a thing to millions. Don't underestimate the influence and power of the Premier League media train. It stretches the globe. His actual opinion on the matter is pretty deep as well. It's more than not wearing a poppy. He has spoken about how he grew up with this over him, influencing who he was, even years after the events took place.
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Post by thevoid on May 27, 2018 16:08:52 GMT
You should give your head a wobble , and go visit the war cemetery’s then you might change your opinion Would going to an Iraqi cemetery which is home to the half a million innocent civilians killed since 2003 influence me as well? You could get War-Marshall Blair to go with you 😊
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Post by block23 on May 27, 2018 16:31:46 GMT
It was for all sorts of reasons, yeah. I'm not even bothered about a Brexit discussion tbh, it was more making the point that James McClean is a professional footballer that has used a Premier League media platform to put across his feelings on a certain subject matter, so scrutiny will come to him naturally and rightly so. I just got a bit sidetracked. My problem, apart from not rating him as a footballer anyway, is that why would you consider plying your trade in an area that is so politically against what he believes, it must mean so much to him that he felt the need to openly tell us in front of millions and millions of people world-wide. Choosing not to wear a poppy on his shirt wasn't him 'telling millions about his views', the controversy was only generated because of this country's poppy hysteria every November. And he doesn't hate Britain, he just dislikes what its Army did to his community back home. He doesn’t, hate Britain you say, so why did he turn his back on the national anthem in the USA when playing for West Brom? He is a twat, end of. PS and not good enough to play for us in my opinion
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Post by thischarmingmanc on May 27, 2018 16:39:45 GMT
Shut up u clown u ain't forced to wear it u ain't in the public eye even the German players wear it n it is political with this prick he has been pictured many times with murderer Adams Of course its a political statement, he is entitled to a political opinion. The British parachute regiment at the least fucked up massively as regards the bloody Sunday shootings, they shot many civilians, made the northern Irish problems significantly worse, and probably contributed to many other deaths in the troubles because of it. The fault just doesn't lie with them but the politicians who put a front line combat unit in a policing role. However if they were responsible for the deaths and shootings of people in my community, maybe even extended family or family friends I would not want to wear a symbol that supported them. It may surprise you to know the number of people who have been photogrpahed with Gerry Adams includes British prime ministers, leaders of the DUP, american president and members of the royal family, do you want all of them sacked too? We have had peace in Northen Ireland for 20 years, I don't expect member of the armed forces to wear symbols that support the IRA, neither do I expect Irish republicans to show symbols of support for the British army. We have a peace, we should live in, and not be stuck in the conflicts of over 20 years ago.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2018 16:41:35 GMT
The wanker wants go Celtic so let him go there. Match made in heaven.
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Post by skip on May 27, 2018 18:26:03 GMT
Personally, I don't see what the big deal is- the guy has his reasons for not wanting to wear a poppy; that's up to him, he's not trying to stop anyone else wearing one so I couldn't really care less. I'll continue to wear one every year, I always have done, but it doesn't affect my life one way or the other if someone else either wears one or doesn't. So all footballers who didn't wear one prior to 2011 (IIRC) were all a bunch of Arms Forces disrespecting bastards? i.e. all of them. The irony is that the people most in uproar about James McClean's stance on the poppy are the ones who are typically up in arms at the PC Gone Mad brigade.
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Post by Veritas on May 27, 2018 18:53:19 GMT
No thanks scummy ira twat .the club say they have learnt lessons well listen to the fans .there are alot of us veterans in the stoke city family who never want this scum near our club .if u buy him he will get booed he should never wear our shirt .hope he has returned all his premiership wages with the queens head on it He has an opinion it is a valid one and he is entitled to hold it, if it different to yours so what? Are there other mainstream political views that are not allowed at Stoke?
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Post by alster on May 27, 2018 18:57:01 GMT
No thanks scummy ira twat .the club say they have learnt lessons well listen to the fans .there are alot of us veterans in the stoke city family who never want this scum near our club .if u buy him he will get booed he should never wear our shirt .hope he has returned all his premiership wages with the queens head on it He has an opinion it is a valid one and he is entitled to hold it, if it different to yours so what? Are there other mainstream political views that are not allowed at Stoke? I'd prefer it if players did not use our club or any other as a platform for their political or religious views whether I agree with them or not. I just don't think it is appropriate.
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Post by Veritas on May 27, 2018 19:04:33 GMT
He has an opinion it is a valid one and he is entitled to hold it, if it different to yours so what? Are there other mainstream political views that are not allowed at Stoke? I'd prefer it if players did not use our club or any other as a platform for their political or religious views whether I agree with them or not. I just don't think it is appropriate. Equally why should someone be forced to support political symbols they disagree with, last time I checked this is still a free country.
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Post by sheriffofrockridge on May 27, 2018 19:08:47 GMT
Admin! Surely this is one for the Everything Else board now.
I have a great interest in politics but I have no interest in seeing it debated on the football section of the site.
If I open a thread with the name of a player, I'm looking for a discussion about the player and not his political views.
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