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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 11, 2018 14:10:55 GMT
Surely the cream would rise to the top, eventually?
Have some of us overrated our players for too long?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 11, 2018 14:16:23 GMT
It’s often said that a team has a squad that’s ‘too weird’ to stay up. That’s us this season. We’ve collected a group of players without rhyme or reason or thought to what to do with them.
I’m trying to remember the good times with Hughes but I can’t help but feel utterly furious with him for just inexplicably cocking things up on such a monumental scale.
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Post by Gods on Mar 11, 2018 14:18:22 GMT
I'd say we are among the crap teams but we were in denial about it and should have dug much deeper much earlier.
Being a bit crap is like alcoholism, to overcome it you first need to recognise it.
We spent way too long telling the world we had our best squad since promotion when the reverse was true.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 14:19:29 GMT
underperformed, massively.
Our squad should be easily top 10/12.
Our group of centre halves and keepers, in particular, is the best outside the top 6 for me. To be honest, add Arsenal into that too.
We have a poor midfield, but Allen and Cameron are an alright partnership. There was just no depth until Badou came in.
Picking attacking midfield/wingers from a group of Jese/Shaqiri/Choupo/Ramadan/Ireland really isn't that bad.
Strikers are a bit crap.
Our team is about level with Everton, Leicester and Saints. It's just that what we have in defence, they have up top or in midfield.
For our defence to have conceded as many as they have is a genuine disgrace and completely down to management.
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Post by superheroantonius on Mar 11, 2018 14:20:40 GMT
We have sold the likes of nzonzi and arnautovic
We have bought in the likes of berahino and wimmer
Crap seems to be the way We are going
But good luck to lambo :-)
I genuinely believe he wants to have a good go, at turning it around
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 11, 2018 14:21:34 GMT
underperformed, massively. Our squad should be easily top 10/12. Our group of centre halves and keepers, in particular, is the best outside the top 6 for me. To be honest, add Arsenal into that too. We have a poor midfield, but Allen and Cameron are an alright partnership. There was just no depth until Badou came in. Picking attacking midfield/wingers from a group of Jese/Shaqiri/Choupo/Ramadan/Ireland really isn't that bad. Strikers are a bit crap. Our team is about level with Everton, Leicester and Saints. It's just that what we have in defence, they have up top or in midfield. For our defence to have conceded as many as they have is a genuine disgrace and completely down to management. Think Leicester, Soton and Everton all have better squads than us, at least on paper. |
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Post by metalhead on Mar 11, 2018 14:23:10 GMT
It’s often said that a team has a squad that’s ‘too weird’ to stay up. That’s us this season. We’ve collected a group of players without rhyme or reason or thought to what to do with them. I’m trying to remember the good times with Hughes but I can’t help but feel utterly furious with him for just inexplicably cocking things up on such a monumental scale. I would say that is West Brom actually. Just look at their squad. It's made up of top 10 (and one or two top 6) players who literally cannot gel whatsoever. They're the most confused group of players in the Prem. I would say our squad had chemistry that was sucked out by Hughes mismanagement by the end. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 11, 2018 14:25:29 GMT
It’s often said that a team has a squad that’s ‘too weird’ to stay up. That’s us this season. We’ve collected a group of players without rhyme or reason or thought to what to do with them. I’m trying to remember the good times with Hughes but I can’t help but feel utterly furious with him for just inexplicably cocking things up on such a monumental scale. Aye. Van Ginkel - Imbula - Allen - N'Diaye When the other has side has been Whelan - Fletcher - Cameron And for the midfield is where we've really lost it. We've just bought the same sort of player and spent near enough 50m doing whilst we've spent nothing on a DM. The lack of thought there is just frightening. |
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Post by djduncanjames on Mar 11, 2018 14:25:39 GMT
Tough call!  |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 11, 2018 14:25:46 GMT
It’s often said that a team has a squad that’s ‘too weird’ to stay up. That’s us this season. We’ve collected a group of players without rhyme or reason or thought to what to do with them. I’m trying to remember the good times with Hughes but I can’t help but feel utterly furious with him for just inexplicably cocking things up on such a monumental scale. I agree with you. Where's Hughes, now? He's disappeared like Gordon Brown did! 😁 |
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Post by 19notbeaten72 on Mar 11, 2018 14:26:39 GMT
Hughes could not organize a defence & allowing Huth to leave was criminal. Playing a back 3 with wing backs who could not play that system was another disaster & why he kept trying to make it work god only knows.
Never replacing N,zonzi was another cock up. Buying umbula Berhino & Wimmer i could go on Mr Hughes has alot to answer for but he did all this seemingly with Coates approval so were do you lay the blame.
So to answer your question i think we under performed & to certain extent we were just crap.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 11, 2018 14:27:00 GMT
It’s often said that a team has a squad that’s ‘too weird’ to stay up. That’s us this season. We’ve collected a group of players without rhyme or reason or thought to what to do with them. I’m trying to remember the good times with Hughes but I can’t help but feel utterly furious with him for just inexplicably cocking things up on such a monumental scale. I would say that is West Brom actually. Just look at their squad. It's made up of top 10 (and one or two top 6) players who literally cannot gel whatsoever. They're the most confused group of players in the Prem. I would say our squad had chemistry that was sucked out by Hughes mismanagement by the end. Yeah the West Brom situation is bizarre. Their squad should be comfortably top half and they have a spine that in paper is as good as any outside the top six. Can’t work out how it’s gone so badly wrong there. I think our squad, as I’ve said on another thread, just isn’t built for anything? We’ve had no discernible blueprint for too long. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 14:29:25 GMT
underperformed, massively. Our squad should be easily top 10/12. Our group of centre halves and keepers, in particular, is the best outside the top 6 for me. To be honest, add Arsenal into that too. We have a poor midfield, but Allen and Cameron are an alright partnership. There was just no depth until Badou came in. Picking attacking midfield/wingers from a group of Jese/Shaqiri/Choupo/Ramadan/Ireland really isn't that bad. Strikers are a bit crap. Our team is about level with Everton, Leicester and Saints. It's just that what we have in defence, they have up top or in midfield. For our defence to have conceded as many as they have is a genuine disgrace and completely down to management. Think Leicester, Soton and Everton all have better squads than us, at least on paper. They've all got better midfields and strikers, but our defence and keeper are better. Saints have worse wingers too for me. |
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Post by mrcoke on Mar 11, 2018 14:30:11 GMT
We have sold the likes of nzonzi and arnautovic We have bought in the likes of berahino and wimmer Crap seems to be the way We are going But good luck to lambo :-) I genuinely believe he wants to have a good go, at turning it around Too simplistic a view for me. The same people who bought Berahino and Wimmer, bought N'Zonzi and Arni. N'Zonzi and Arni didn't want to stay at Stoke and there is no way you can force them. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 11, 2018 14:32:57 GMT
I would say that is West Brom actually. Just look at their squad. It's made up of top 10 (and one or two top 6) players who literally cannot gel whatsoever. They're the most confused group of players in the Prem. I would say our squad had chemistry that was sucked out by Hughes mismanagement by the end. Yeah the West Brom situation is bizarre. Their squad should be comfortably top half and they have a spine that in paper is as good as any outside the top six. Can’t work out how it’s gone so badly wrong there. I think our squad, as I’ve said on another thread, just isn’t built for anything? We’ve had no discernible blueprint for too long. Again, I agree. I would love Rondon here for a start. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 11, 2018 14:33:16 GMT
Think Leicester, Soton and Everton all have better squads than us, at least on paper. They've all got better midfields and strikers, but our defence and keeper are better. Saints have worse wingers too for me. Don’t think there’s a lot in it with the keepers (except Soton, who have the rotten Forster). Think our centre backs are probably better but our full backs aren’t, our central midfielders aren’t and our creative players and strikers aren’t. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 14:33:17 GMT
If you have no tip on your spear then you are left with a lump of dead wood and that is what we have.
In the papers again today Mr I'm alright Jack, Peter Coates is the ONLY Stoke fan still smiling while again complaining about money while he has more than any normal person could spend in a lifetime. It really has taken over his life.
Perhaps he should do the Trading Places thing with a normal fan. Bet he would be on the pitch with a corner flag demanding the board resigned.
When we are relegated he will sit in his box watch the game then go back to his millionaires lifestyle, smile in place while we kid ourselves that we are trying to get promotion with a few kids and an OAP squad.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 14:35:09 GMT
They've all got better midfields and strikers, but our defence and keeper are better. Saints have worse wingers too for me. Don’t think there’s a lot in it with the keepers (except Soton, who have the rotten Forster). Think our centre backs are probably better but our full backs aren’t, our central midfielders aren’t and our creative players and strikers aren’t. Fair, I'd have Butland over all of them, and Bauer and Stafy aswell really. Maybe not over Bertrand. Centre mids I agree, I think our group of creative players is better than Saints, and strikers i agree. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 11, 2018 14:36:21 GMT
They've all got better midfields and strikers, but our defence and keeper are better. Saints have worse wingers too for me. Don’t think there’s a lot in it with the keepers (except Soton, who have the rotten Forster). Think our centre backs are probably better but our full backs aren’t, our central midfielders aren’t and our creative players and strikers aren’t. Southampton are weird as well. Even with players most on here would have been happy with, like Lemima and Redmond, they are struggling. I think they are genuine under performers. |
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Post by dutchstokie on Mar 11, 2018 14:38:48 GMT
The players have let the fans and themselves down massively in my opinion....
Far far too many half arsed performances spread over a long period of time have lead us to where we are right now
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Mar 11, 2018 14:39:58 GMT
Don’t think there’s a lot in it with the keepers (except Soton, who have the rotten Forster). Think our centre backs are probably better but our full backs aren’t, our central midfielders aren’t and our creative players and strikers aren’t. Fair, I'd have Butland over all of them, and Bauer and Stafy aswell really. Maybe not over Bertrand. Centre mids I agree, I think our group of creative players is better than Saints, and strikers i agree. I'd take our back 5 as a unit over most of our near rivals. It's in midfield and certainly up front where we fall a long way short. By the way I think Bertrand is massively overrated . |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 11, 2018 14:45:16 GMT
Fair, I'd have Butland over all of them, and Bauer and Stafy aswell really. Maybe not over Bertrand. Centre mids I agree, I think our group of creative players is better than Saints, and strikers i agree. I'd take our back 5 as a unit over most of our near rivals. It's in midfield and certainly up front where we fall a long way short. By the way I think Bertrand is massively overrated . Ca plane pour moi was all right. |
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Post by onionman on Mar 11, 2018 14:45:50 GMT
As others have said, Hughes assembled a bunch of random players who can't be put into a sensible system.
That would be enough to sink us on its own.
Then factor in that we have very few players that are actually good enough as individuals to play consistently well in the Premier League, even if there was a system that worked for them.
We also completely disregarded the idea of recruiting players with heart and soul, or leadership qualities. That our young goalie, who is suffering a confidence wobble of his own, is our best bet for captain says it all about the mental qualities of the rest of the team.
All in all we are lucky not to be further adrift than we already are.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Mar 11, 2018 14:46:43 GMT
I'd take our back 5 as a unit over most of our near rivals. It's in midfield and certainly up front where we fall a long way short. By the way I think Bertrand is massively overrated . Ca plane pour moi was all right. Bit too plastic for me  |
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Post by djduncanjames on Mar 11, 2018 14:47:15 GMT
Recruitment has been shockingly poor. Even If we ACTIVELY tried to cock up the next 3 signings on purpose we still couldn't recreate the signings of Wimmer, Bera and Imbula. With that money used more wisely who knows. But that aside, I think we really have underperformed. We were getting smashed week in week out because of managerial tactics, not because Jack and Ryan are "crap". What a frigging shambles, just writing this makes me angry. Its all spiralled out of control now  |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 11, 2018 14:49:23 GMT
As others have said, Hughes assembled a bunch of random players who can't be put into a sensible system. That would be enough to sink us on its own. Then factor in that we have very few players that are actually good enough as individuals to play consistently well in the Premier League, even if there was a system that worked for them. We also completely disregarded the idea of recruiting players with heart and soul, or leadership qualities. That our young goalie, who is suffering a confidence wobble of his own, is our best bet for captain says it all about the mental qualities of the rest of the team. All in all we are lucky not to be further adrift than we already are. Is he the best bet for captain though? I just put that down to another nuance of Lambert not really having a Scoobies. |
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Post by senojbor on Mar 11, 2018 14:49:46 GMT
Recruitment has been shockingly poor. Even If we ACTIVELY tried to cock up the next 3 signings on purpose we still couldn't recreate the signings of Wimmer, Bera and Imbula. With that money used more wisely who knows. But that aside, I think we really have underperformed. We were getting smashed week in week out because of managerial tactics, not because Jack and Ryan are "crap". What a frigging shambles, just writing this makes me angry. Its all spiralled out of control now Expensive long term contracts given to players who were supposed to improved the squad have been disastrous. |
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Post by potterblade on Mar 11, 2018 14:55:16 GMT
We've just had no plan A or fixed starting XI for as long as Hughes was in charge. Players have been signed without any on-field strategy in mind, simply because they look like 'next level' signings on paper.
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Mar 11, 2018 14:56:55 GMT
We are utterly crap in terms of our critical off field roles and approach , our strategic approach is totally misguided and I’ll suited for this era and that’s led us to have a crap football team , never once did we match our leafiest position with our investment in the three golden 9th years .
As Shankly so often said the time to buy is when your a top the top
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Post by mrcoke on Mar 11, 2018 15:02:47 GMT
We have mainly under performed particularly at defending plus a strong element of inability mainly due to Berahino, Wimmer, and Fletcher (after a promising start). There is also a strong element of time catching up with players, who have seen their best years.
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