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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Jan 2, 2018 0:01:59 GMT
The margins in the PL are incredibly small. The whole of the lower half of the table is trying to do exactly what we are trying to do. There are no guarantees either way. IMHO If Hughes stays we might go down, but we might not. If he goes, we might stay up, but we might not, not least because that option is of course two decisions - getting rid of Hughes is followed by the choice of an alternative. You would have to offer me very generous odds to take a bet that the three relegated clubs won't have changed their manager in attempt to stay up. There's probably a greater chance that all three relegated clubs will all have changed their manager for that reason. Peter Coates is a shrewd, hands on, chairman who knows english football very well (unlike many foreign-based owners) and is a lifelong supporter of his club (again unlike many owners) who has invested a great deal in Stoke City, both emotionally and financially. He now has a judgement to make. Personally, I would trust his judgement more than my own on this one, simply because he is in a much more informed position than I am to make it. I wish him well in making it and just hope and pray that he gets it right. If you had to make the decision now what would you do Malcolm? Hughes out? Or give him the rest of the season? It would depend to a significant extent on what knowledge I had about who would be available to take over. Nearly all of the discussion treats it as a single decision - Hughes in or Hughes out, whereas, as I said, the second option is actually a double decision, the second half of which is as crucial as the first. That's why I would trust PC's judgement more than my own. But since you are putting me on the spot, I think things may now have reached the point where a change is more likely to be the best option.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 0:05:20 GMT
He’s the perfect deflector of criticism at the moment, a modern day Jez Moxey. An owners dream. I used to know Jez socially when he lived in Congleton. Contrary to what fans at the time thought he was a decent bloke. But he did not think much of the board of directors who sold the club to an Icelandic consortium. Which is the most tactful way of saying that he did not trust a certain well known Stoke on Trent family, without me being sued. Wedgewoods I believe he may have been referring to allegedly
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 0:06:12 GMT
I'm not Malcolm either but think he should go Has oldstoke gone? Hope he hasn't deleted ??? Gorn
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Post by stokemark on Jan 2, 2018 0:07:11 GMT
The only reason Hughes hasn't gone sooner is because Peter Coates and the Board are behind the strategy of self sufficiency and thus know that they are expecting minor miracles from him. It is, frankly, their mess and why you would trust them to address if properly now when they've had the best part of 2 years presiding over this spiralling decline I don't know.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jan 2, 2018 0:08:37 GMT
I think Coates would have acted by now if he thought there was an obvious viable stand out replacement, he might well be thinking 'whats the point' ? ... and he might be right, theres is no realistic replacement out there who you'd say "he'll definitely keep us up" any replacement would likely be every bit the gamble as keeping Hughes on. The margins in the PL are incredibly small. The whole of the lower half of the table is trying to do exactly what we are trying to do. There are no guarantees either way. IMHO If Hughes stays we might go down, but we might not. If he goes, we might stay up, but we might not, not least because that option is of course two decisions - getting rid of Hughes is followed by the choice of an alternative. You would have to offer me very generous odds to take a bet that the three relegated clubs won't have changed their manager in attempt to stay up. There's probably a greater chance that all three relegated clubs will all have changed their manager for that reason. Peter Coates is a shrewd, hands on, chairman who knows english football very well (unlike many foreign-based owners) and is a lifelong supporter of his club (again unlike many owners) who has invested a great deal in Stoke City, both emotionally and financially. He now has a judgement to make. Personally, I would trust his judgement more than my own on this one, simply because he is in a much more informed position than I am to make it. I wish him well in making it and just hope and pray that he gets it right. Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 0:09:23 GMT
He’s the perfect deflector of criticism at the moment, a modern day Jez Moxey. An owners dream. I used to know Jez socially when he lived in Congleton. Contrary to what fans at the time thought he was a decent bloke. But he did not think much of the board of directors who sold the club to an Icelandic consortium. Which is the most tactful way of saying that he did not trust a certain well known Stoke on Trent family, without me being sued. Wedgewoods I believe he may have been referring to allegedly That narrows it down a bit! I wonder who the family might be?? Can you give us a clue please?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 0:23:09 GMT
I used to know Jez socially when he lived in Congleton. Contrary to what fans at the time thought he was a decent bloke. But he did not think much of the board of directors who sold the club to an Icelandic consortium. Which is the most tactful way of saying that he did not trust a certain well known Stoke on Trent family, without me being sued. Wedgewoods I believe he may have been referring to allegedly That narrows it down a bit! I wonder who the family might be?? Can you give us a clue please? My lips are sealed if I told you anymore I would have to insist you had your haircut at Wilf Podmores
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Jan 2, 2018 0:25:14 GMT
I'm cringing in shame, not sure I can bear this humilitation - so we must have been sat next to each other when we lost 0-7 to Birmingham then, is that right? I'm shouting boycott or similar now if the Board don't take action because the stakes are so massively higher and because I and many more Stokies have been there for the long and at times nightmare journey to the Prem. The thought of blowing it all at this point, when it's still salvageable, breaks my heart and I want to do something about it if I possibly can. Sorry if that makes me pathetic, I wish I was such a hero as you xx So you think boycotting the next game is going to be beneficial.? What's with the sarcasm anyway? xx I'm not sure if I reach Sal's threshold for number of posts, , to have a legitimate opinion on this, but, like you, I have never boycotted Stoke games in 60+ years ( which have included plenty of managers far worse than Mark Hughes) and wouldn't start for this reason, but I think Harry is also right that at the end of the day, it's an individual decision how people spend their time and money. There are situations where I think organised boycotts by fans are appropriate. If I were a Blackpool fan, for example, I would join their boycott against their current owners. The Coventry fans boycott of "home" games at Northampton would be another example. But for me, trying to get Mark Hughes sacked gets nowhere remotely near that threshold.
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Post by canadianmoose on Jan 2, 2018 0:36:17 GMT
There’s are still a portion of our fans who can only see the last 5 games. This isn’t just a bad run, it’s 2 years of utter horse spunk, 2 whole years! League position at this very second now is an irrelevant argument. We have been consistently shit for 2 years and it’s getting worse. If we don’t act now we’re fucked. Yes! This is all true. There should be no shocks in our current plight for anyone. The writing was on the wall for two years. I may be a bit kinder and say 18 months but that would be splitting hairs......
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Post by kustokie on Jan 2, 2018 0:53:52 GMT
The margins in the PL are incredibly small. The whole of the lower half of the table is trying to do exactly what we are trying to do. There are no guarantees either way. IMHO If Hughes stays we might go down, but we might not. If he goes, we might stay up, but we might not, not least because that option is of course two decisions - getting rid of Hughes is followed by the choice of an alternative. You would have to offer me very generous odds to take a bet that the three relegated clubs won't have changed their manager in attempt to stay up. There's probably a greater chance that all three relegated clubs will all have changed their manager for that reason. Peter Coates is a shrewd, hands on, chairman who knows english football very well (unlike many foreign-based owners) and is a lifelong supporter of his club (again unlike many owners) who has invested a great deal in Stoke City, both emotionally and financially. He now has a judgement to make. Personally, I would trust his judgement more than my own on this one, simply because he is in a much more informed position than I am to make it. I wish him well in making it and just hope and pray that he gets it right. Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck. I am confused. How can he be a great chairman if he keeps making mistakes?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 2, 2018 0:56:56 GMT
I'm not Malcolm either but think he should go Has oldstoke gone? Hope he hasn't deleted ??? Gorn But people will at least notice that he's gone, unlike pturner eh? 😂
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 0:59:47 GMT
Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck. I am confused. How can he be a great chairman if he keeps making mistakes? I suppose that mistakes can be construed in many ways. Some might even believe that no mistakes at all, have been made. It's all a very subjective business really.
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Post by riproaring on Jan 2, 2018 1:07:27 GMT
The only reason Hughes hasn't gone sooner is because Peter Coates and the Board are behind the strategy of self sufficiency and thus know that they are expecting minor miracles from him. It is, frankly, their mess and why you would trust them to address if properly now when they've had the best part of 2 years presiding over this spiralling decline I don't know. I have said it many times Aston Villa couldn’t do self sufficiency with their income how the fuck can we
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Post by potterpaul on Jan 2, 2018 6:20:23 GMT
Are the powerbrokers in a dilemma right now?
1) Stick with MH until end of season = No or little money available for transfers 2) Engage manager to see out season= Little money for transfers 3) Replace with favoured manager now = Spend big to get back on track and survive the drop
I get the distinct impression that we run the club on that much of shoestring that options 1&2 are seen as the best option.
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Post by JoeinOz on Jan 2, 2018 6:22:53 GMT
I have a vision of us somehow scrambling enough points to get safe then mark just gets kept on. Which would be daft.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jan 2, 2018 6:29:47 GMT
Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck. I am confused. How can he be a great chairman if he keeps making mistakes? He was until the last year or so but things have changed. It happens.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jan 2, 2018 6:31:59 GMT
If Hughes is staying the whole club needs to get pro active over the next two weeks. This week. Bring in the FBs and DM that should have been purchased in the summer. Get in a defensive Coach. Hughes and co to take aside the chosen eleven for the Coventry game. work with them. Next week Hughes to work with the forward players and the Defensive Coach with our defensive players. Makes sense but Scholes is incapable of doing anything quickly or proactively.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 7:28:37 GMT
If Hughes is staying the whole club needs to get pro active over the next two weeks. This week. Bring in the FBs and DM that should have been purchased in the summer. Get in a defensive Coach. Hughes and co to take aside the chosen eleven for the Coventry game. work with them. Next week Hughes to work with the forward players and the Defensive Coach with our defensive players. Makes sense but Scholes is incapable of doing anything quickly or proactively. Especially if it involves spending money.
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Post by smallthorner on Jan 2, 2018 9:52:16 GMT
Listen I don't mean to fall out with a fellow Stokie, blood should be thicker than water at a time like this. I'm just really upset like a lot of people and because you're not yet a regular poster I don't happen to know you as well as many others on here (and trolls do emerge when the team's in trouble, sadly). Please don't feel you're unelcome on the Oatie - but my personal opinion does remain that if the Board leave Sparky in charge for our next Prem game and enough fellow supporters feel the same way, yes I would join a mass bycott if I thought there was a serious chance it would make the Coates family finally see sense. Of course I understand people's emotions are running high at the moment. Especially straight after a game. Just don't think personally that it's the appropriate action. Like you I will be upset and angry if we get relegated. But don't think that anything the fanbase do now will sway Peter one way or the other.... As many posters have already said.. it's going to be a rocky few weeks xx
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 9:57:49 GMT
If Hughes is staying the whole club needs to get pro active over the next two weeks. This week. Bring in the FBs and DM that should have been purchased in the summer. Get in a defensive Coach. Hughes and co to take aside the chosen eleven for the Coventry game. work with them. Next week Hughes to work with the forward players and the Defensive Coach with our defensive players. What does Bowen do then? Can't he coach the defence as an ex defender?
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Post by nutterpotter on Jan 2, 2018 9:59:07 GMT
If Hughes is staying the whole club needs to get pro active over the next two weeks. This week. Bring in the FBs and DM that should have been purchased in the summer. Get in a defensive Coach. Hughes and co to take aside the chosen eleven for the Coventry game. work with them. Next week Hughes to work with the forward players and the Defensive Coach with our defensive players. What does Bowen do then? Can't he coach the defence as an ex defender? Doesn't Bowen do most of the coaching? Hughes just mostly observes training from the side I think?
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cruxmeister
Lads'n'Dads
Thank God footy is played on grass and not on a Stoke fan forum! We'd be proper fucked!
Posts: 72
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Post by cruxmeister on Jan 2, 2018 9:59:08 GMT
So... £6.5m to get rid... Crowdfund?
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Post by nott1 on Jan 2, 2018 9:59:11 GMT
The fanbase has completely turned now. He simply can’t survive a moment longer. The turncoats have. Don't include me thanks!
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Post by salopstick on Jan 2, 2018 10:25:39 GMT
McLaren is reviewing yesterday’s fixtures now. Obviously home for a job
Would he keep us up
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Post by eatonpotter on Jan 2, 2018 10:34:20 GMT
How can Hughes Fix Stoke coming up SSN next, a good start would be to fuck off
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Post by estp1863 on Jan 2, 2018 10:36:32 GMT
If Hughes is staying the whole club needs to get pro active over the next two weeks. This week. Bring in the FBs and DM that should have been purchased in the summer. Get in a defensive Coach. Hughes and co to take aside the chosen eleven for the Coventry game. work with them. Next week Hughes to work with the forward players and the Defensive Coach with our defensive players. What does Bowen do then? Can't he coach the defence as an ex defender? Obviously not
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Rigpig
Academy Starlet
Posts: 143
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Post by Rigpig on Jan 2, 2018 10:48:55 GMT
Maybe a season in the Wankership will do us good. Get back to winning ways with a new manager with a plan. Look at Burnley........
Yes, I'm clutching at straws but what else can you do when things are so fucking dire?
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Post by itsallgonepetetone on Jan 2, 2018 10:58:05 GMT
If you had to make the decision now what would you do Malcolm? Hughes out? Or give him the rest of the season? It would depend to a significant extent on what knowledge I had about who would be available to take over. Nearly all of the discussion treats it as a single decision - Hughes in or Hughes out, whereas, as I said, the second option is actually a double decision, the second half of which is as crucial as the first. That's why I would trust PC's judgement more than my own. But since you are putting me on the spot, I think things may now have reached the point where a change is more likely to be the best option. I agree to a certain point, making a dismissal decision with no thought out plan is brave at best, a gamble at worst. However, the club arguably had good reason to make the decision a month or two ago, in which case they should have their alternative plan in place. In all likelihood they haven’t which makes them incompetent- and they should all be sacked. Their procrastination is a failure in itself.
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Jan 2, 2018 12:10:21 GMT
The margins in the PL are incredibly small. The whole of the lower half of the table is trying to do exactly what we are trying to do. There are no guarantees either way. IMHO If Hughes stays we might go down, but we might not. If he goes, we might stay up, but we might not, not least because that option is of course two decisions - getting rid of Hughes is followed by the choice of an alternative. You would have to offer me very generous odds to take a bet that the three relegated clubs won't have changed their manager in attempt to stay up. There's probably a greater chance that all three relegated clubs will all have changed their manager for that reason. Peter Coates is a shrewd, hands on, chairman who knows english football very well (unlike many foreign-based owners) and is a lifelong supporter of his club (again unlike many owners) who has invested a great deal in Stoke City, both emotionally and financially. He now has a judgement to make. Personally, I would trust his judgement more than my own on this one, simply because he is in a much more informed position than I am to make it. I wish him well in making it and just hope and pray that he gets it right. Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck. I'm not trying to be diplomatic, cobham ( lord knows I've been undiplomatic enough times about people who run football clubs) but I'm wary about expressing very firm opinions when ( to misquote Donald Rumsfeld) I know that I don't know a lot of the key information, and I trust the motivation and acumen of the person who does. I think that Wimmer looks over-priced (which I would imagine is down to the recruitment team), although I don't think he's anything like as poor a player as some claim, but I think recent injuries have shown that it was right to get an additional central defender in. And we did get an experienced midfielder in - whether you think Fletcher was the right choice is another question. I was puzzled by your comment about going with youth being the wrong decision. I would say we haven't gone with youth, despite a lot of fans calling for more of the young lads to be given game time. The obvious exception recently is Edwards, who it looks to me may be here to stay as first choice right back, which is a success and a good managerial decision, isn't it ?
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Post by sufolkstokie on Jan 2, 2018 12:20:16 GMT
Very diplomatic Malcolm. PCs been a great chairman but there’s no Doubt that since the end of last season he’s got it very badly wrong. Should have got rid in the summer and sanctioning some of the recent deals like Wimmer when we desperately needed a midfield make no sense. Then the decision to go with youth when we don’t have any good enough at this level. Great Chairman but some of his current decisions are clearly wrong. We are far weaker than we were last season. This isn’t a case of bad luck. I'm not trying to be diplomatic, cobham ( lord knows I've been undiplomatic enough times about people who run football clubs) but I'm wary about expressing very firm opinions when ( to misquote Donald Rumsfeld) I know that I don't know a lot of the key information, and I trust the motivation and acumen of the person who does. I think that Wimmer looks over-priced (which I would imagine is down to the recruitment team), although I don't think he's anything like as poor a player as some claim, but I think recent injuries have shown that it was right to get an additional central defender in. And we did get an experienced midfielder in - whether you think Fletcher was the right choice is another question. I was puzzled by your comment about going with youth being the wrong decision. I would say we haven't gone with youth, despite a lot of fans calling for more of the young lads to be given game time. The obvious exception recently is Edwards, who it looks to me may be here to stay as first choice right back, which is a success and a good managerial decision, isn't it ? The thing for me Malcolm is that the whole board (because like you I don't know the details) have just watched this happen. The end of last season for the first time just hung up a big illuminated sign for me. Okay I understand why they may have given him one more go. But did no one ask basic questions, such as why are we playing three at the back with no recognised wing backs? maybe that is not the place or role for Mr Banks or Mr Smith? But apart from the Man United game the whole thing just felt not right. Now we find ourselves in a environment where loyalty has produced a situation where it would appear we have little alternatives, which is not a good place to be. Half that team have stopped playing for whatever reason. I do think the accountability goes much higher and wider than the manager and some of those players need a hard look at themselves, along with those who are the guardians of the club. The bottom line is they now have to do something
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