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Post by miggoscfc on Aug 8, 2017 10:27:06 GMT
nah diouf is the perfect wingback, we need a diouf v2 on the left Nobody who can cross a football then? Surprising but dioufy has great crossing ability. If we are sticking with this formation and can't get anyone with as much pace and energy as diouf has then he has to be first choice. Sadly I think he will wind down his contract because of it, Bera, Crouch and Jos are all in front of him and Ngoy is best deployed as a striker as well nothing I've seen suggests he can defend so wouldn't expect him to play there.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 10:34:26 GMT
Nobody who can cross a football then? Surprising but dioufy has great crossing ability. If we are sticking with this formation and can't get anyone with as much pace and energy as diouf has then he has to be first choice. Sadly I think he will wind down his contract because of it, Bera, Crouch and Jos are all in front of him and Ngoy is best deployed as a striker as well nothing I've seen suggests he can defend so wouldn't expect him to play there. I don't think he does, consistently. I like him as a striker but he doesn't have the quality on the ball to be a long-term option there. We need a specialist.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 10:35:18 GMT
Nobody who can cross a football then? joselu doesnt mind dioifs crossing And from what you've seen he's going to do that week in, week out is he?
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Post by samba :) on Aug 8, 2017 10:46:36 GMT
joselu doesnt mind dioifs crossing And from what you've seen he's going to do that week in, week out is he? he's smart about how he plays, we also wont make many crosses this season
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 11:24:25 GMT
And from what you've seen he's going to do that week in, week out is he? he's smart about how he plays, we also wont make many crosses this season So we're going to use wing backs but not cross the ball much? What's the point of that?
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Post by samba :) on Aug 8, 2017 11:28:50 GMT
he's smart about how he plays, we also wont make many crosses this season So we're going to use wing backs but not cross the ball much? What's the point of that? We won't, we can't be! Hughes knows what he's doing, pieters and diouf wouldn't be wingbacks and little saido wouldn't have been signed if our main attacking threat was from crosses
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 11:35:21 GMT
So we're going to use wing backs but not cross the ball much? What's the point of that? We won't, we can't be! Hughes knows what he's doing, pieters and diouf wouldn't be wingbacks and little saido wouldn't have been signed if our main attacking threat was from crosses If you're playing wingbacks, isn't the whole point of them that they're further forward and have more attacking responsibility? And you can still cross the ball to a little lad - you don't have to put it on his head?
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Post by johnbutlershair on Aug 8, 2017 11:55:45 GMT
And from what you've seen he's going to do that week in, week out is he? he's smart about how he plays, we also wont make many crosses this season If we persist with Berahino up front crossing will be absolutely pointless!
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Post by alster on Aug 8, 2017 12:04:25 GMT
We won't, we can't be! Hughes knows what he's doing, pieters and diouf wouldn't be wingbacks and little saido wouldn't have been signed if our main attacking threat was from crosses If you're playing wingbacks, isn't the whole point of them that they're further forward and have more attacking responsibility? And you can still cross the ball to a little lad - you don't have to put it on his head? Its not what Berahino thrives on though, he needs through balls, he needs a midfielder to see or anticipate his runs and release the ball quickly taking advantage of the moment that his intelligent movement creates. He's not lightning fast he's not going to run away from a defence its all about that fleeting moment. So far we're either holding onto the ball too long or belting it to him in the air neither of which suit the type of player we chased for so long. Do we actually bother what a players attributes are when we decide we want them or do we just sign names?
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Post by parsonage1955 on Aug 8, 2017 12:06:09 GMT
Isn't that Shaq's role?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 12:06:45 GMT
If you're playing wingbacks, isn't the whole point of them that they're further forward and have more attacking responsibility? And you can still cross the ball to a little lad - you don't have to put it on his head? Its not what Berahino thrives on though, he needs through balls, he needs a midfielder to see or anticipate his runs and release the ball quickly taking advantage of the moment that his intelligent movement creates. He's not lightning fast he's not going to run away from a defence its all about that fleeting moment. So far we're either holding onto the ball too long or belting it to him in the air neither of which suit the type of player we chased for so long. Do we actually bother what a players attributes are when we decide we want them or do we just sign names? I don't think we'll exclusively be relying on crosses though, nor will we exclusively be crossing to Berahino? I completely agree about the recruitment point though, with almost every striker or big money signing it seems we haven't given any thought as to how we want to use them.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 8, 2017 12:07:42 GMT
Shaq in a 3-4-3 will be tucked inside and have a lot more freedom, in theory, to roam in the final third.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 8, 2017 12:10:49 GMT
If you're playing wingbacks, isn't the whole point of them that they're further forward and have more attacking responsibility? And you can still cross the ball to a little lad - you don't have to put it on his head? Its not what Berahino thrives on though, he needs through balls, he needs a midfielder to see or anticipate his runs and release the ball quickly taking advantage of the moment that his intelligent movement creates. He's not lightning fast he's not going to run away from a defence its all about that fleeting moment. So far we're either holding onto the ball too long or belting it to him in the air neither of which suit the type of player we chased for so long. Do we actually bother what a players attributes are when we decide we want them or do we just sign names?
When Berahino had his blinding season at West Brom he was playing in a two and it's widely known that he's poor in the air.
Yet we're seemingly going to play him as a 'one', with wing-backs and no number 10.
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 8, 2017 12:19:47 GMT
Its not what Berahino thrives on though, he needs through balls, he needs a midfielder to see or anticipate his runs and release the ball quickly taking advantage of the moment that his intelligent movement creates. He's not lightning fast he's not going to run away from a defence its all about that fleeting moment. So far we're either holding onto the ball too long or belting it to him in the air neither of which suit the type of player we chased for so long. Do we actually bother what a players attributes are when we decide we want them or do we just sign names?
When Berahino had his blinding season at West Brom he was playing in a two and it's widely known that he's poor in the air.
Yet we're seemingly going to play him as a 'one', with wing-backs and no number 10.
....and not especially quick either so put him up front on his own then!
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Post by alster on Aug 8, 2017 12:59:10 GMT
When Berahino had his blinding season at West Brom he was playing in a two and it's widely known that he's poor in the air.
Yet we're seemingly going to play him as a 'one', with wing-backs and no number 10.
....and not especially quick either so put him up front on his own then! He's not a pace merchant but he's quick enough and intelligent enough in his movement to buy that moment of space to get a shot away if we have someone with the vision and technique to slide balls through to him. If he failed on that basis he'd have no one to blame but himself. As things stand we just seem to be setting him up to fail by expecting him to be something he isn't or never has been. I simply can't blame him at all our recruitment policy seems to be written on the back of a postage stamp. In Chinese.
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 8, 2017 13:17:41 GMT
....and not especially quick either so put him up front on his own then! He's not a pace merchant but he's quick enough and intelligent enough in his movement to buy that moment of space to get a shot away if we have someone with the vision and technique to slide balls through to him. If he failed on that basis he'd have no one to blame but himself. As things stand we just seem to be setting him up to fail by expecting him to be something he isn't or never has been. I simply can't blame him at all our recruitment policy seems to be written on the back of a postage stamp. In Chinese. Why doesn't he do it then if he has got this ability? It seems like both Diouf and Joselu can do this, but where is Berahino? I must just say I was very optimistic when he came to Stoke, but after the last third of last season and all the friendlies so far he doesn't fill me with confidence. I hope I'm wrong, but so far he really looks like a big flop to me, sorry!
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Post by jstoke7 on Aug 8, 2017 13:20:43 GMT
I wonder about Delph in that role. Thoughts?
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Post by alster on Aug 8, 2017 13:21:54 GMT
He's not a pace merchant but he's quick enough and intelligent enough in his movement to buy that moment of space to get a shot away if we have someone with the vision and technique to slide balls through to him. If he failed on that basis he'd have no one to blame but himself. As things stand we just seem to be setting him up to fail by expecting him to be something he isn't or never has been. I simply can't blame him at all our recruitment policy seems to be written on the back of a postage stamp. In Chinese. Why doesn't he do it then if he has got this ability? It seems like both Diouf and Joselu can do this, but where is Berahino? I must just say I was very optimistic when he came to Stoke, but after the last third of last season and all the friendlies so far he doesn't fill me with confidence. I hope I'm wrong, but so far he really looks like a big flop to me, sorry! We simply don't see the runs and play him in. Its either big stupid punts from the back or midfielders holding the ball too long. If you watch him you can see him setting off on runs and they are ignored whilst we dither on the ball.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Aug 8, 2017 13:24:54 GMT
I'm thinking of having a fiver on Pieters scoring 5+ this season {All comps}. In one of those 'I didn't see that coming' sensational footballing stories Erik will step out of the shadows and thrive this season.
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Post by arnie3010 on Aug 8, 2017 13:27:36 GMT
It's a little bit funny to see that a lot of our problems are selfmade.
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Post by bertiestan on Aug 8, 2017 13:29:29 GMT
It's a little bit funny to see that a lot of our problems are selfmade. Thought you were going belt out n Elton john tune then.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 13:31:21 GMT
Would love Masuaku from West Ham.
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Post by arnie3010 on Aug 8, 2017 13:35:19 GMT
It's a little bit funny to see that a lot of our problems are selfmade. Thought you were going belt out n Elton john tune then. I have to disappoint you sir
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 8, 2017 13:39:01 GMT
Why doesn't he do it then if he has got this ability? It seems like both Diouf and Joselu can do this, but where is Berahino? I must just say I was very optimistic when he came to Stoke, but after the last third of last season and all the friendlies so far he doesn't fill me with confidence. I hope I'm wrong, but so far he really looks like a big flop to me, sorry! We simply don't see the runs and play him in. Its either big stupid punts from the back or midfielders holding the ball too long. If you watch him you can see him setting off on runs and they are ignored whilst we dither on the ball. Compared to Diouf he doesn't make half as many such runs, but that is my impression! I really hope he will come good, but my hope is fading after each game he plays unfortunately!
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Post by arnie3010 on Aug 8, 2017 13:40:21 GMT
Would love Masuaku from West Ham. We should put a bid in for him and Sam Byram
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Post by alster on Aug 8, 2017 13:55:04 GMT
We simply don't see the runs and play him in. Its either big stupid punts from the back or midfielders holding the ball too long. If you watch him you can see him setting off on runs and they are ignored whilst we dither on the ball. Compared to Diouf he doesn't make half as many such runs, but that is my impression! I really hope he will come good, but my hope is fading after each game he plays unfortunately! You mean you notice Diouf's runs because he has the pace to run away from a defence giving a longer period for the ball to be played. If you watch Berahino closely he make tons of runs that are ignored because as I say he isn't a pace merchant so if he is not being fed quickly the moment is lost. I'm not saying he will not fail anyway but if you don't use him properly what was the point in buying him or chasing him for ages if actually he's not the type of forward you want. He's a striker that needs an Ozil who times and executes precision passes and throughballs with regularity. IMO Shaq is our best bet to do that.
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 8, 2017 14:09:12 GMT
Compared to Diouf he doesn't make half as many such runs, but that is my impression! I really hope he will come good, but my hope is fading after each game he plays unfortunately! You mean you notice Diouf's runs because he has the pace to run away from a defence giving a longer period for the ball to be played. If you watch Berahino closely he make tons of runs that are ignored because as I say he isn't a pace merchant so if he is not being fed quickly the moment is lost. I'm not saying he will not fail anyway but if you don't use him properly what was the point in buying him or chasing him for ages if actually he's not the type of forward you want. He's a striker that needs an Ozil who times and executes precision passes and throughballs with regularity. IMO Shaq is our best bet to do that. So if this is why he was brought in and then should be one of our main aspects during training, it's still impossible to achieve in real games? Could there be anything else than the midfielders releasing the ball too late?
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Post by Mendicant on Aug 8, 2017 14:10:29 GMT
It's a little bit funny to see that a lot of our problems are selfmade. And you can tell everybody, we need a left wing back.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Aug 8, 2017 14:11:31 GMT
Compared to Diouf he doesn't make half as many such runs, but that is my impression! I really hope he will come good, but my hope is fading after each game he plays unfortunately! You mean you notice Diouf's runs because he has the pace to run away from a defence giving a longer period for the ball to be played. If you watch Berahino closely he make tons of runs that are ignored because as I say he isn't a pace merchant so if he is not being fed quickly the moment is lost. I'm not saying he will not fail anyway but if you don't use him properly what was the point in buying him or chasing him for ages if actually he's not the type of forward you want. He's a striker that needs an Ozil who times and executes precision passes and throughballs with regularity. IMO Shaq is our best bet to do that. I reckon it's the thinking behind the front three, with the possibility of two number 10's. In theory/on paper. Bojan and Shaq being the providers {and obv. chipping in with goals too.} around Berahino. Wing backs as much about pulling the opposition defence out of shape etc as traditional line hugging crossers. That front three has zilch aerial ability, wouldn't entirely suit me. Joselu or perhaps Moting as one of the '10's' would address that. We'll see.
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Post by alster on Aug 8, 2017 14:13:34 GMT
You mean you notice Diouf's runs because he has the pace to run away from a defence giving a longer period for the ball to be played. If you watch Berahino closely he make tons of runs that are ignored because as I say he isn't a pace merchant so if he is not being fed quickly the moment is lost. I'm not saying he will not fail anyway but if you don't use him properly what was the point in buying him or chasing him for ages if actually he's not the type of forward you want. He's a striker that needs an Ozil who times and executes precision passes and throughballs with regularity. IMO Shaq is our best bet to do that. So if this is why he was brought in and then should be one of our main aspects during training, it's still impossible to achieve in real games? Could there be anything else than the midfielders releasing the ball too late? You're clutching at straws non of our strikers score a satisfactory amount of goals thats a systematic failure not one player.
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