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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 30, 2017 21:44:46 GMT
I think they were rightly waiting for the keeper to come. They were all well into the 6 yard area, which is where the keeper should be dealing with it. As I said, Wara looked out of his depth but he was bound to. He will have learnt a lot hopefully. There seemed to be a lot of people there today that didn't get that it was our u23s vs their first team. Again that doesn't excuse what was a poor performance but it gives the background to it. Having Souttar and Sweeney playing together at the back would have made a massive difference. But they wouldn't have improved Haugaard's dithering. The 2nd and 3rd goals are Haugaard's forte. They are balls the CB is expecting the keeper to collect. Ask any Wigan fan and they will tell you is that how he deals with crosses. Two of Crewe's players Lowery 19 and Cooper 20 looked a level above ours to me today . Not sure u-23 football is much use better to get them in open age football Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas.
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Post by swampySCFC on Jul 30, 2017 21:56:07 GMT
Two of Crewe's players Lowery 19 and Cooper 20 looked a level above ours to me today . Not sure u-23 football is much use better to get them in open age football Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. We need to do better to be honest. There is no evidence that we have anybody capable of a top game
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 30, 2017 22:14:12 GMT
Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. We need to do better to be honest. There is no evidence that we have anybody capable of a top game There's loads of evidence. There's also plenty to suggest it's bloody hard. That the side we put out today had weak spots in vital areas that you weren't surprised were exploited. Our full u23 side probably wins that today. Our weakened one with none of the front 3 that would play, minus a CB that would play and minus the full backs got beat 3-1 and 2 of them were because of the senior goalkeeper!
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Post by foxysgloves on Jul 31, 2017 8:29:56 GMT
Haggard is as far from a Premier League goalkeeper as it's possible to be. Without being Gordon Marshall.
On the positive side, his name autocorrects on my phone in a pleasingly appropriate fashion.
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Post by Gods on Jul 31, 2017 8:35:13 GMT
Two of Crewe's players Lowery 19 and Cooper 20 looked a level above ours to me today . Not sure u-23 football is much use better to get them in open age football Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. All of which take me nicely back to the idea for which I am sometimes ridiculed that in the 1st team we shouldn't start thinking we can replace Walters, Whelan, Arnie, Bruno and Bardo with a few kids however (allegedly) promising they may be, we need instead to go out and acquire some 'been there, done it' sort of guys if we want to remain in a league which rewards pragmatism and grit. Oh and this week would be nice!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 31, 2017 9:06:41 GMT
Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. All of which take me nicely back to the idea for which I am sometimes ridiculed that in the 1st team we shouldn't start thinking we can replace Walters, Whelan, Arnie, Bruno and Bardo with a few kids however (allegedly) promising they may be, we need instead to go out and acquire some 'been there, done it' sort of guys if we want to remain in a league which rewards pragmatism and grit. Oh and this week would be nice! We've got the been there, done it types though. As ever the answer lies somewhere in between. We need both.
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Post by rambler on Jul 31, 2017 9:18:12 GMT
I know the Crewe players were more experienced but the Stoke players didn't even look like footballers, they were truly awful, even Sweeney who just seemed to shoulder barge a few people out of the way a few times. Our left winger was one of the worst players I've ever seen, every single player was extremely one footed and there was no game plan what so ever. I'm not sure firstly how half of these players even got scouted, and secondly what they do in training each day. It should have been about 7-1 to Crewe. Final point, lord knows what the u23 management were doing, they just stood there as quite as can be and didn't seem to care whatsoever. Now I see why we haven't had any players coming through, they were worse than Stafford Rangers. Possession must have been about 70:30 to Crewe, I think our goal was the first shot we had, I think that any local Sunday team could have done the same job as that Stoke team.
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Post by Gods on Jul 31, 2017 9:19:37 GMT
All of which take me nicely back to the idea for which I am sometimes ridiculed that in the 1st team we shouldn't start thinking we can replace Walters, Whelan, Arnie, Bruno and Bardo with a few kids however (allegedly) promising they may be, we need instead to go out and acquire some 'been there, done it' sort of guys if we want to remain in a league which rewards pragmatism and grit. Oh and this week would be nice! We've got the been there, done it types though. As ever the answer lies somewhere in between. We need both. I think we should have a nucleus of say 18 players that is notionally the '1st team' and it is comprised entirely of 'been there, done it, stand up' guys. That is our insurance policy against the Championship and our revenue stream being cut off. Then we have perhaps 4 young players who we thing are at the right level and we slot them in as and when either circumstances allow (an easier game, our league position looks good...) or occasionally but hopefully not often needs must (injury, suspension, loss of form...) that's what I'd work towards anyway but I'm not the manager and it's not my money!
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 31, 2017 9:20:49 GMT
We've got the been there, done it types though. As ever the answer lies somewhere in between. We need both. I think we should have a nucleus of say 18 players that is notionally the '1st team' and it is comprised entirely of 'been there, done it, stand up' guys. That is our insurance policy against the Championship and our revenue stream being cut off. Then we have perhaps 4 young players who we thing are at the right level and we slot them in as and when either circumstances allow (an easier game, our league position looks good...) or occasionally but hopefully not often needs must (injury, suspension, loss of form...) that's what I'd work towards anyway but I'm not the manager and it's not my money! I think that's the plan but with more than 18 tbh.
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Post by Gods on Jul 31, 2017 9:28:15 GMT
I know the Crewe players were more experienced but the Stoke players didn't even look like footballers, they were truly awful, even Sweeney who just seemed to shoulder barge a few people out of the way a few times. Our left winger was one of the worst players I've ever seen, every single player was extremely one footed and there was no game plan what so ever. I'm not sure firstly how half of these players even got scouted, and secondly what they do in training each day. It should have been about 7-1 to Crewe. Final point, lord knows what the u23 management were doing, they just stood there as quite as can be and didn't seem to care whatsoever. Now I see why we haven't had any players coming through, they were worse than Stafford Rangers. Possession must have been about 70:30 to Crewe, I think our goal was the first shot we had, I think that any local Sunday team could have done the same job as that Stoke team. Glyn Hodges said in his interview that it was disappointing and that we left something in the dressing room. We have good players who have been doing well. He didn't know if it was the pressure of a large crowd or the fact that it was a local derby but for some reason we didn't turn up. To be honest he sounded a little crest-fallen.
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Post by rambler on Jul 31, 2017 9:38:45 GMT
I know the Crewe players were more experienced but the Stoke players didn't even look like footballers, they were truly awful, even Sweeney who just seemed to shoulder barge a few people out of the way a few times. Our left winger was one of the worst players I've ever seen, every single player was extremely one footed and there was no game plan what so ever. I'm not sure firstly how half of these players even got scouted, and secondly what they do in training each day. It should have been about 7-1 to Crewe. Final point, lord knows what the u23 management were doing, they just stood there as quite as can be and didn't seem to care whatsoever. Now I see why we haven't had any players coming through, they were worse than Stafford Rangers. Possession must have been about 70:30 to Crewe, I think our goal was the first shot we had, I think that any local Sunday team could have done the same job as that Stoke team. Glyn Hodges said in his interview that it was disappointing and that we left something in the dressing room. We have good players who have been doing well. He didn't know if it was the pressure of a large crowd or the fact that it was a local derby but for some reason we didn't turn up. To be honest he sounded a little crest-fallen. Whenever we got the ball we just booted it up the pitch and then ran around, well, jogged around, defending. There is being nervous and then not knowing how to play football, it was actually like they had never seen or played a football game before. I blame the management, either give them proper coaching or scout people who can actually play football, it is clear to me that those players were only scouted because they have the right build, they are athletes, but are actually pretty bad at football. I know plenty of people whose sons got dropped by Vale and Stoke for being too small, even though they were probably the best players in the team.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 31, 2017 9:41:19 GMT
I know the Crewe players were more experienced but the Stoke players didn't even look like footballers, they were truly awful, even Sweeney who just seemed to shoulder barge a few people out of the way a few times. Our left winger was one of the worst players I've ever seen, every single player was extremely one footed and there was no game plan what so ever. I'm not sure firstly how half of these players even got scouted, and secondly what they do in training each day. It should have been about 7-1 to Crewe. Final point, lord knows what the u23 management were doing, they just stood there as quite as can be and didn't seem to care whatsoever. Now I see why we haven't had any players coming through, they were worse than Stafford Rangers. Possession must have been about 70:30 to Crewe, I think our goal was the first shot we had, I think that any local Sunday team could have done the same job as that Stoke team. I think 5 would have been fair but then 2 knocked off because 2 they scored were easy saves/claims. I don't know what were people expecting? I'm in a few group chats with Stoke fans and as soon as I saw the team announced and who was missing I said we were going to get destroyed. And if I had come on here and see they were 4/1 I'd have put a tenner on it. I only bet 10p usually. 😂 As I've said, it was a poor performance but my word there's ottness about. There was at the ground too. Some of the reactions were pathetic.
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Post by magwitch on Jul 31, 2017 9:54:17 GMT
Glyn Hodges does not give me the impression that he is on top of his job. Perhaps he should consider retirement.
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Post by PerCyfilth ....Captains Log on Jul 31, 2017 10:08:19 GMT
Hodges is too old..we need a younger more ambitious coach for the U23s to get them playing the game as its played today...not 25 years ago.He needs to go. As it stands not one of those playing could make the jump.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 31, 2017 10:11:33 GMT
The only good word I've seen Man City folk have for any of our coaches is Hodges.
We've got 3/4 players who could feature in the first team and have been coached by him.
Why exactly should he be fired after our u23s with a good number missing lost to the Crewe first team 3-1?
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Jul 31, 2017 10:11:52 GMT
Two of Crewe's players Lowery 19 and Cooper 20 looked a level above ours to me today . Not sure u-23 football is much use better to get them in open age football Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. I wouldnt argue with you the point that I was trying to make is that the Young Crewe players benefit from getting experience and that all these teams ( U-21 & U23 we have are in my view a waste of time after under 18s they should go into adult football, probably better that clubs like ours dont hoard them but let them play lower down then give the teams a decent fee if they are good enough . We should have a decent reserve team that is regional and maybe plays midweek and mixes first team fringe players and youngsters its a model that worked for years better than the current one seems to . Another problem for us is that prior to promotion we did not really give a toss about youth development for about 20 years and have a lot of catching up to do The other issue yesterday was tactics and formation , having those lads mimic the first team system that doesnt work with the first team with players who clearly did not suit it seemed daft , Crew had a much more positive style of play actually moving forward and passing the ball forward and getting men forward works wonders
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 31, 2017 10:21:05 GMT
Have they played much first team football themselves? And they had 4/5 massively experienced pros playing which makes a huge difference. Dagnall is one short of 500 pro games and scored 14 goals last season in league 2. He was against a 17 year old who couldn't make our FA youth cup starting XI. Porter , 9 short of 500 pro games. Scored 16 in Laague 2 last season. Campbell- a couple of games in the Checkatrade vs Raynes (421 pro games). Nolan 242 pro games. Etc etc etc It helps these players and they were in key areas. I wouldnt argue with you the point that I was trying to make is that the Young Crewe players benefit from getting experience and that all these teams ( U-21 & U23 we have are in my view a waste of time after under 18s they should go into adult football, probably better that clubs like ours dont hoard them but let them play lower down then give the teams a decent fee if they are good enough . We should have a decent reserve team that is regional and maybe plays midweek and mixes first team fringe players and youngsters its a model that worked for years better than the current one seems to . Another problem for us is that prior to promotion we did not really give a toss about youth development for about 20 years and have a lot of catching up to do The other issue yesterday was tactics and formation , having those lads mimic the first team system that doesnt work with the first team with players who clearly did not suit it seemed daft , Crew had a much more positive style of play actually moving forward and passing the ball forward and getting men forward works wonders They will have played u23 football themselves. It serves a purpose to a point. From that point I agree they need to go into proper football. It's an issue that transcends us and is a problem in English football in general. Most teams mimic tactics down the youth sides so if they're needed they can come straight into the team. There were some strange selections granted. Wara has come from nowhere. McJannett is a left back. I'm guessing they're trying to get rid of Moha so that's why he didn't start. And it was a friendly. There's an air of experimention and in this case, learning. It was an education for these lads. I keep harping on about Wara but he will have learned so much.
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Post by Gods on Jul 31, 2017 11:09:43 GMT
Glyn Hodges does not give me the impression that he is on top of his job. Perhaps he should consider retirement. He came with Sparky in 2013 didn't he? Presumably the Welsh connection. Although on hearing his interview he is the most 'sarf London' sounding Welshman I've ever heard!
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