|
Post by thehoof on Mar 18, 2017 23:40:22 GMT
Go on then, name this one incisive pass that Afellay has played. He is good at keeping possession in his own half and always passes it sideways or backwards, and that is why Bayern is right. I am sick of asking for all the stats that point to what an attacking threat he is and getting no reply - that's because he simply does not threaten to create a goal in any way shape or form - go on dig up the stats of Affelay the super creator! Barca thought he was worth signing, 53 caps 7 goals for Holland..etc etc.. If it wasn't for two bad injuries he would be playing for a bigger club than Stoke. Keeping the fookin football isn't a crime by the way and helps take the pressure off the back four..If you don't think he's a quality player then that's your opinion....I've booked you in at 11.30.😉 Just answer the question, don't tell me what he used to be like! Actually you can not find a single thing to prove that currently he is an exciting creative player.
|
|
|
Post by claytonscrubs on Mar 18, 2017 23:43:02 GMT
Barca thought he was worth signing, 53 caps 7 goals for Holland..etc etc.. If it wasn't for two bad injuries he would be playing for a bigger club than Stoke. Keeping the fookin football isn't a crime by the way and helps take the pressure off the back four..If you don't think he's a quality player then that's your opinion....I've booked you in at 11.30.😉
He didn't say that he thought he wasn't a quality player, he asked you to name the incisive pass(es) that he's made since he's been here ... you haven't answered his question.
I watch him keep the ball and pass it to a man in a read and white shirt better than anybody else . That's good enough for me. I'am very easily pleased me.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2017 23:53:53 GMT
Cameron and Allen....lets hope they play underneath the arches for Stoke next season
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 19, 2017 0:07:21 GMT
He didn't say that he thought he wasn't a quality player, he asked you to name the incisive pass(es) that he's made since he's been here ... you haven't answered his question.
I watch him keep the ball and pass it to a man in a read and white shirt better than anybody else . That's good enough for me. I'am very easily pleased me.
Nobody is disputing that, what you're being asked, is what evidence is there for Afellay being the type of player who can provide incisive passes for the forward(s) in front of him and you keep avoiding the question.
Maybe because there actually isn't any?
|
|
|
Post by claytonscrubs on Mar 19, 2017 0:20:54 GMT
I watch him keep the ball and pass it to a man in a read and white shirt better than anybody else . That's good enough for me. I'am very easily pleased me.
Nobody is disputing that, what you're being asked, is what evidence is there for Afellay being the type of player who can provide incisive passes for the forward(s) in front of him and you keep avoiding the question.
Maybe because there actually isn't any?
Right let me try one more time... I don't care if he makes incisive passes or not. Just play him in the middle and let him control the ball and pass to Arnie, Sobhi or any other bugger that plays for Stoke. If that means passing sidewards, backwards or two feet forwards I couldn't care less.. Now go and give your friend bayern another like.. I'am getting very suspicious of you two..😉..night night.
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 19, 2017 0:30:29 GMT
Nobody is disputing that, what you're being asked, is what evidence is there for Afellay being the type of player who can provide incisive passes for the forward(s) in front of him and you keep avoiding the question.
Maybe because there actually isn't any?
Right let me try one more time... I don't care if he makes incisive passes or not. Just play him in the middle and let him control the ball and pass to Arnie, Sobhi or any other bugger that plays for Stoke. If that means passing sidewards, backwards or two feet forwards I couldn't care less.. Now go and give your friend bayern another like.. I'am getting very suspicious of you two..😉..night night. I'm pretty sure Berahino does/will.
Shaqiri is the man there for me.
|
|
|
Post by SneydGreenStokie on Mar 19, 2017 1:28:07 GMT
I thought Geoff and Joe were both excellent today, their energy and athleticism provided the dynamics that the heart of our team has been missing all season, Allen is much better suited to his current role than playing as a number 10.
The only thing we were missing today was that little bit of creativity in the centre of the park to create some opportunities offensively.
I can totally see why Hughes went with SJW against Citeh and Chelsea but against Leicester I think I'd be tempted to play Shaqiri as a number 10 behind Berahino.
This is precisely the reason people like you aren't football managers. Clueless. SGS
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 19, 2017 1:46:46 GMT
I thought Geoff and Joe were both excellent today, their energy and athleticism provided the dynamics that the heart of our team has been missing all season, Allen is much better suited to his current role than playing as a number 10.
The only thing we were missing today was that little bit of creativity in the centre of the park to create some opportunities offensively.
I can totally see why Hughes went with SJW against Citeh and Chelsea but against Leicester I think I'd be tempted to play Shaqiri as a number 10 behind Berahino.
This is precisely the reason people like you aren't football managers. Clueless. SGS Go on then ...
|
|
|
Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 19, 2017 4:07:12 GMT
Cameron is a lot more mobile that Whelan, but he couldn't pass gas after a chili dinner. Neither can Whelan.
|
|
|
Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 19, 2017 4:10:45 GMT
We have a few players who are fine athletes but lousy footballers. Joe Allen and geoff Cameron are two such players. Allen was brilliant against Chelsea. If Whelan had played it would have been a re-run of Spurs away. We've looked much better with two lousy footballers.
|
|
|
Post by Northy on Mar 19, 2017 6:10:44 GMT
I thought Geoff and Joe were both excellent today, their energy and athleticism provided the dynamics the heart of our team has been missing all season, Allen is much better suited to his current role than playing as a number 10.
The only thing we were missing today was that little bit of creativity in the centre of the park to create some opportunities offensively.
I can totally see why Hughes went with SJW against Citeh and Chelsea but against Leicester I think I'd be tempted to play Shaqiri as a number 10 behind Berahino.
Problem is with Bards red card, if Johnson is not fit it'll be Cameron @ RB next week. weve got 2 weeks to get Johnsons shoulder fit, international break coming up.
|
|
|
Post by Clayton Wood on Mar 19, 2017 7:34:42 GMT
Problem is with Bards red card, if Johnson is not fit it'll be Cameron @ RB next week. weve got 2 weeks to get Johnsons shoulder fit, international break coming up. Yeah, realised that after I posted it. At the rate he's progressed in the past I don't think it's a cert he'll be ready, and I'm not convinced 3 at the back is the way to go against Leicester breaking with pace either.
|
|
|
Post by claytonscrubs on Mar 19, 2017 7:50:49 GMT
Right let me try one more time... I don't care if he makes incisive passes or not. Just play him in the middle and let him control the ball and pass to Arnie, Sobhi or any other bugger that plays for Stoke. If that means passing sidewards, backwards or two feet forwards I couldn't care less.. Now go and give your friend bayern another like.. I'am getting very suspicious of you two..😉..night night. I'm pretty sure Berahino does/will.
Shaqiri is the man there for me.
I wouldn't be averse to the idea of playing Shaqiri as a No10 behind Berahino. If he's ever fit and could stay on his feet more . I'am pleased you finally understood the point I was making before. We got there in the end .👍...😉 As for Sneyd calling you clueless....No comment.
|
|
|
Post by Cast no shadow on Mar 19, 2017 7:52:22 GMT
Camerons passing is dreadful, we need better
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 19, 2017 8:09:17 GMT
We have a few players who are fine athletes but lousy footballers. Joe Allen and geoff Cameron are two such players. Allen was brilliant against Chelsea. If Whelan had played it would have been a re-run of Spurs away. We've looked much better with two lousy footballers. I don't doubt that for a minute. Cameron and Allen worked tirelessly and gave us the platform to compete. Neither can pass water and both gave the ball away far too often.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Mar 19, 2017 8:14:02 GMT
Allo was our man of the match IMHO. He covered their runs well. His ideal role is holding midfielder. Sometimes he wastes too much energy covering too much ground. Sometimes it's wiser to walk around a wall than run through it.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 19, 2017 8:18:38 GMT
Allo was our man of the match IMHO. He covered their runs well. His ideal role is holding midfielder. Sometimes he wastes too much energy covering too much ground. Sometimes it's wiser to walk around a wall than run through it. Cameron was infinitely superior to Allen, as was Bruno, shawcross and right up to the last minutes of the game so was Erik pieters who barely gave the superb Willian a kick.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Mar 19, 2017 8:22:53 GMT
Allo was our man of the match IMHO. He covered their runs well. His ideal role is holding midfielder. Sometimes he wastes too much energy covering too much ground. Sometimes it's wiser to walk around a wall than run through it. Cameron was infinitely superior to Allen, as was Bruno, shawcross and right up to the last minutes of the game so was Erik pieters who barely gave the superb Willian a kick. Lots of ours did well yesterday. For me Allo edged it slightly. Granty showed admirable character to make some impressive saves after the early calamity.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 19, 2017 8:25:37 GMT
Cameron was infinitely superior to Allen, as was Bruno, shawcross and right up to the last minutes of the game so was Erik pieters who barely gave the superb Willian a kick. Lots of ours did well yesterday. For me Allo edged it slightly. Granty showed admirable character to make some impressive saves after the early calamity. Grant could have thrown his cap on the 2nd one. More culpable for the 2nd than the first for me.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2017 8:27:43 GMT
Allo was our man of the match IMHO. He covered their runs well. His ideal role is holding midfielder. Sometimes he wastes too much energy covering too much ground. Sometimes it's wiser to walk around a wall than run through it. Cameron was infinitely superior to Allen, as was Bruno, shawcross and right up to the last minutes of the game so was Erik pieters who barely gave the superb Willian a kick. I thought it was Allen's best game for us Dave and he was better than Cameron who gave the ball away much more than Joe. As for Erik you know my opinion of him. It's no use being great for 89 and a half minutes and then losing concentration. He cost us a point.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Mar 19, 2017 8:28:21 GMT
Lots of ours did well yesterday. For me Allo edged it slightly. Granty showed admirable character to make some impressive saves after the early calamity. Grant could have thrown his cap on the 2nd one. More culpable for the 2nd than the first for me. I'll have to watch 2nd one again. I was yoo pissed off to pay attention to the action replays and went bed sulking as soon as the game ended! ☺
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 19, 2017 8:32:02 GMT
Cameron was infinitely superior to Allen, as was Bruno, shawcross and right up to the last minutes of the game so was Erik pieters who barely gave the superb Willian a kick. I thought it was Allen's best game for us Dave and he was better than Cameron who gave the ball away much more than Joe. As for Erik you know my opinion of him. It's no use being great for 89 and a half minutes and then losing concentration. He cost us a point. No doubt. A mistake that costs your team a goal by a defender or goalkeeper renders a 89 minute period of excellence almost useless, sadly. Pieters was brilliant yesterday right up to the moment of that quite ridiculous back pass.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2017 8:37:24 GMT
I thought it was Allen's best game for us Dave and he was better than Cameron who gave the ball away much more than Joe. As for Erik you know my opinion of him. It's no use being great for 89 and a half minutes and then losing concentration. He cost us a point. No doubt. A mistake that costs your team a goal by a defender or goalkeeper renders a 89 minute period of excellence almost useless, sadly. Pieters was brilliant yesterday right up to the moment of that quite ridiculous back pass. We'll have to agree to disagree Dave. For me he's got a major ricket in him. If he's not getting caught on the wrong side, he's ploughing through the back of somebody in dangerous areas. I swear to God one day that one of his crosses will end up in the opposite stand. Unfortunately he's not the only one who seems to find crossing a difficult skill. I agree though defensively he can be very good but there are two many lapses in concentration for my liking.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 19, 2017 8:40:07 GMT
No doubt. A mistake that costs your team a goal by a defender or goalkeeper renders a 89 minute period of excellence almost useless, sadly. Pieters was brilliant yesterday right up to the moment of that quite ridiculous back pass. We'll have to agree to disagree Dave. For me he's got a major ricket in him. If he's not getting caught on the wrong side, he's ploughing through the back of somebody in dangerous areas. I swear to God one day that one of his crosses will end up in the opposite stand. Unfortunately he's not the only one who seems to find crossing a difficult skill. I agree though defensively he can be very good but there are two many lapses in concentration for my liking. I've no problem agreeing to differ. I like being part of a two man Erik pieters fan club (my 3 year old being the other paid up member)
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2017 8:46:52 GMT
We'll have to agree to disagree Dave. For me he's got a major ricket in him. If he's not getting caught on the wrong side, he's ploughing through the back of somebody in dangerous areas. I swear to God one day that one of his crosses will end up in the opposite stand. Unfortunately he's not the only one who seems to find crossing a difficult skill. I agree though defensively he can be very good but there are two many lapses in concentration for my liking. I've no problem agreeing to differ. I like being part of a two man Erik pieters fan club (my 3 year old being the other paid up member) You're a gent sir.
|
|
|
Post by Trouserdog on Mar 19, 2017 9:23:00 GMT
I thought Geoff and Joe were both excellent today, their energy and athleticism provided the dynamics that the heart of our team has been missing all season, Allen is much better suited to his current role than playing as a number 10.
The only thing we were missing today was that little bit of creativity in the centre of the park to create some opportunities offensively.
I can totally see why Hughes went with SJW against Citeh and Chelsea but against Leicester I think I'd be tempted to play Shaqiri as a number 10 behind Berahino.
I think Cameron and Allen are the best midfield pairing for a 4-4-2 (from what we've got available). What we lose in creativity with Cameron is more than compensated for by the athleticism, physical presence and ball-winning ability he brings. The issue I think we'd face with playing Shaqiri behind Berahino is that we'd lack any physical presence up-front and it removes the option of going direct, which I think a team like ours needs to have. Even when playing 3 men in midfield, we simply can't pass the ball well enough from back to front to get the ball to the feet of the front man. Having Walters or Diouf as a deep-lying striker gives us the option of launching it now and again and looking for flick-ons for Berahino to run on to. There's also the issue of whether Shaq would offer anything defensively in that position. Walters harries the opposition- as does Diouf- and both have got the engine to chase down centre backs and drop back into midfield when necessary. Would Shaq do this? I suspect he'd think 'great, I'm number 10, that means I'll stand around here and do some fancy flicks and shit.' I said weeks ago when discussing 4-4-2 that ideally we'll need a second striker to partner Berahino who we simply don't have on the books at the moment: someone big, energetic but with enough class to take the ball down and thread the ball through for Saido. As things stand though, I think I'd give both Walters and Diouf a few games in this position and see which one offers us the most.
|
|
|
Post by cheeesfreeex on Mar 19, 2017 9:50:23 GMT
I thought Geoff and Joe were both excellent today, their energy and athleticism provided the dynamics that the heart of our team has been missing all season, Allen is much better suited to his current role than playing as a number 10.
The only thing we were missing today was that little bit of creativity in the centre of the park to create some opportunities offensively.
I can totally see why Hughes went with SJW against Citeh and Chelsea but against Leicester I think I'd be tempted to play Shaqiri as a number 10 behind Berahino.
I think Cameron and Allen are the best midfield pairing for a 4-4-2 (from what we've got available). What we lose in creativity with Cameron is more than compensated for by the athleticism, physical presence and ball-winning ability he brings. The issue I think we'd face with playing Shaqiri behind Berahino is that we'd lack any physical presence up-front and it removes the option of going direct, which I think a team like ours needs to have. Even when playing 3 men in midfield, we simply can't pass the ball well enough from back to front to get the ball to the feet of the front man. Having Walters or Diouf as a deep-lying striker gives us the option of launching it now and again and looking for flick-ons for Berahino to run on to. There's also the issue of whether Shaq would offer anything defensively in that position. Walters harries the opposition- as does Diouf- and both have got the engine to chase down centre backs and drop back into midfield when necessary. Would Shaq do this? I suspect he'd think 'great, I'm number 10, that means I'll stand around here and do some fancy flicks and shit.' I said weeks ago when discussing 4-4-2 that ideally we'll need a second striker to partner Berahino who we simply don't have on the books at the moment: someone big, energetic but with enough class to take the ball down and thread the ball through for Saido. As things stand though, I think I'd give both Walters and Diouf a few games in this position and see which one offers us the most. You've just described Arnie to a tee for me. I share your reservations re Shaq as a no10. I have some doubts about Diouf as a 'provider' striker too.
|
|
|
Post by alster on Mar 19, 2017 9:57:32 GMT
Both excellent defensively today, but in fairness to Bayern, they both gave up possession to easily and too often. Would like to see this: Cameron Allen Arnie Affelay Sohbi Berahino Needs Shaq for Affelay he just doesn't play enough telling passes to be in that position.
|
|
|
Post by Trouserdog on Mar 19, 2017 10:05:20 GMT
I think Cameron and Allen are the best midfield pairing for a 4-4-2 (from what we've got available). What we lose in creativity with Cameron is more than compensated for by the athleticism, physical presence and ball-winning ability he brings. The issue I think we'd face with playing Shaqiri behind Berahino is that we'd lack any physical presence up-front and it removes the option of going direct, which I think a team like ours needs to have. Even when playing 3 men in midfield, we simply can't pass the ball well enough from back to front to get the ball to the feet of the front man. Having Walters or Diouf as a deep-lying striker gives us the option of launching it now and again and looking for flick-ons for Berahino to run on to. There's also the issue of whether Shaq would offer anything defensively in that position. Walters harries the opposition- as does Diouf- and both have got the engine to chase down centre backs and drop back into midfield when necessary. Would Shaq do this? I suspect he'd think 'great, I'm number 10, that means I'll stand around here and do some fancy flicks and shit.' I said weeks ago when discussing 4-4-2 that ideally we'll need a second striker to partner Berahino who we simply don't have on the books at the moment: someone big, energetic but with enough class to take the ball down and thread the ball through for Saido. As things stand though, I think I'd give both Walters and Diouf a few games in this position and see which one offers us the most. You've just described Arnie to a tee for me. I share your reservations re Shaq as a no10. I have some doubts about Diouf as a 'provider' striker too. On paper you'd think so, but he just seems to go missing whenever he's played centrally. The problem withArnie, I think, is that he doesn't relish the physical battle when he's up against a player bigger and stronger than he is. Stick some big hairy-arsed centre back up against him and he doesn't want to know. Allow him to bully a smaller full-back though and he comes alive. This is the ideal time to try these sort of things out though. After spending £12m on him and chasing him for two years, Berahino leading the line is a given (at least for a while) and so we need to look at all the options we've got that can make it work.
|
|
|
Post by alster on Mar 19, 2017 10:11:54 GMT
I think Cameron and Allen are the best midfield pairing for a 4-4-2 (from what we've got available). What we lose in creativity with Cameron is more than compensated for by the athleticism, physical presence and ball-winning ability he brings. The issue I think we'd face with playing Shaqiri behind Berahino is that we'd lack any physical presence up-front and it removes the option of going direct, which I think a team like ours needs to have. Even when playing 3 men in midfield, we simply can't pass the ball well enough from back to front to get the ball to the feet of the front man. Having Walters or Diouf as a deep-lying striker gives us the option of launching it now and again and looking for flick-ons for Berahino to run on to. There's also the issue of whether Shaq would offer anything defensively in that position. Walters harries the opposition- as does Diouf- and both have got the engine to chase down centre backs and drop back into midfield when necessary. Would Shaq do this? I suspect he'd think 'great, I'm number 10, that means I'll stand around here and do some fancy flicks and shit.' I said weeks ago when discussing 4-4-2 that ideally we'll need a second striker to partner Berahino who we simply don't have on the books at the moment: someone big, energetic but with enough class to take the ball down and thread the ball through for Saido. As things stand though, I think I'd give both Walters and Diouf a few games in this position and see which one offers us the most. You've just described Arnie to a tee for me. I share your reservations re Shaq as a no10. I have some doubts about Diouf as a 'provider' striker too. If you play Arnie, Shaq and Ramadan behind Berahino I don't think there is any need at all to straight jacket them into defined roles they should be allowed to interchange at will all of them have that killer ball in their locker to open up the opposition. Really enjoyed yesterday despite the result. You see I don't expect silky football every game it was just good to see us playing high energy football rather than the old mans walking football that we have often produced. There were plenty of opportunities to criticise but I'll take non of them after a performance like that against a team of far greater quality and amazing energy and stamina. They are a brilliant side and we really gave them one of their toughest games of the season.
|
|