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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2015 20:52:41 GMT
If you require a seam bowler who is an outstanding slip fielder , then that would be an Ideal scenario as this is an unlikely scenario though you could be right .Im sorry but I don't see Woakes as an Anderson type replacement .....I'm not sure that there is one around at the present time When I say Anderson type, I mean bowls a good line and length (just sent down 2 wides as I type this and has the ability to move the ball, he's a million miles from being the bowler Anderson is now but then so was the Anderson we saw in brissy in 2006. I see some potential in Woakes, if others don't we'll see who is right in a couple of years, no need for a meeting at Sir Stan's statue No doubt Woakes has potential , he has talent , I'd be more than happy to see him ( or any other upcoming prospect ) make the grade , it's all about the future of the England team for me Whether it be Woakes , Jordan ,Topley , Willey or anyone else ......I don't think Sir Stan's statue would be an appropriate meeting place , outside of the Grace Gates at Lord's perhaps ?
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Post by followyoudown on Nov 27, 2015 22:01:24 GMT
When I say Anderson type, I mean bowls a good line and length (just sent down 2 wides as I type this and has the ability to move the ball, he's a million miles from being the bowler Anderson is now but then so was the Anderson we saw in brissy in 2006. I see some potential in Woakes, if others don't we'll see who is right in a couple of years, no need for a meeting at Sir Stan's statue No doubt Woakes has potential , he has talent , I'd be more than happy to see him ( or any other upcoming prospect ) make the grade , it's all about the future of the England team for me Whether it be Woakes , Jordan ,Topley , Willey or anyone else ......I don't think Sir Stan's statue would be an appropriate meeting place , outside of the Grace Gates at Lord's perhaps ? Ha ha I think England have some very promising cricketers coming through and we are not far away from having very strong teams in all formats, as the saying goes when Yorkshire are strong England are strong.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2015 23:02:12 GMT
No doubt Woakes has potential , he has talent , I'd be more than happy to see him ( or any other upcoming prospect ) make the grade , it's all about the future of the England team for me Whether it be Woakes , Jordan ,Topley , Willey or anyone else ......I don't think Sir Stan's statue would be an appropriate meeting place , outside of the Grace Gates at Lord's perhaps ? Ha ha I think England have some very promising cricketers coming through and we are not far away from having very strong teams in all formats, as the saying goes when Yorkshire are strong England are strong. I have been involved in the game for over fifty years , as a player , coach, umpire etc. , spectator and tv viewer .....this is the best period that I can recall regarding young talent being in and on the verge of the England team .....we never went for youth in the past , now things are changing for the better and the prospects are very exciting ....as you say there are prospects of good times ahead ....I agree that When Yorkshire are strong so are England .....but it pains me to say it of course as I'm married into a Yorkshire family !
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 30, 2015 18:32:25 GMT
And now the end is near...
Well into the final game of the tour, the third T20. England posted 154-8, Pakistan currently 50-4 off 8 overs and a ball (that ball being a great c&b by Rashid).
England slight favourites I reckon - but it will be close.
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Post by chuckrocky on Nov 30, 2015 19:12:55 GMT
You'd fancy Pakistan to win it from here. Not been a big fan of all the chopping and changing in this series. We're not far off the T20 world cup now and we should be playing our strongest team every match. Playing the likes of Jordan who shouldn't be anywhere near the side we play at the world cup is just a waste of time.
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 19:20:08 GMT
Pakistan will bottle it same as last time
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 19:31:14 GMT
Down to the super over
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 30, 2015 19:34:11 GMT
It's a tie - super over time.
Oh the excitement!
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 30, 2015 19:36:59 GMT
Chris Jordan bowling the super over!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Edit: and wasn't he superb!
Where did that come from - he's been going at 10 in the two T20 games he played in without taking a wicket. He's been bowling terribly. Respect to Jordan and Captain Morgan.
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 19:41:15 GMT
You'd fancy Pakistan to win it from here. Not been a big fan of all the chopping and changing in this series. We're not far off the T20 world cup now and we should be playing our strongest team every match. Playing the likes of Jordan who shouldn't be anywhere near the side we play at the world cup is just a waste of time. Jordan what a fucking over in the super over...superb
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 19:41:49 GMT
Chris Jordan bowling the super over!!!!!!!!!!!!!! superb Jordan take a bow son
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Post by chuckrocky on Nov 30, 2015 19:57:36 GMT
You'd fancy Pakistan to win it from here. Not been a big fan of all the chopping and changing in this series. We're not far off the T20 world cup now and we should be playing our strongest team every match. Playing the likes of Jordan who shouldn't be anywhere near the side we play at the world cup is just a waste of time. Jordan what a fucking over in the super over...superb Yes cracking over, he's usually pretty toss though, he bowls 4 good balls an over but will spoil it with two boundary balls.
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 30, 2015 20:22:22 GMT
Victory!Well done England. You've been excellent in the ODIs and T20s. Enjoy the moment!
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 20:25:36 GMT
Chris Jordan bowling the super over!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Edit: and wasn't he superb! Where did that come from - he's been going at 10 in the two T20 games he played in without taking a wicket. He's been bowling terribly. Respect to Jordan and Captain Morgan. made a mug of you humble pie
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Post by partickpotter on Nov 30, 2015 21:09:13 GMT
Chris Jordan bowling the super over!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Edit: and wasn't he superb! Where did that come from - he's been going at 10 in the two T20 games he played in without taking a wicket. He's been bowling terribly. Respect to Jordan and Captain Morgan. made a mug of you humble pie For sure! Hence the edit. Respect to him for that stunning over. (I'm still not convinced though - but for now I'll enjoy the moment).
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Post by dexta on Nov 30, 2015 21:13:28 GMT
made a mug of you humble pie For sure! Hence the edit. Respect to him for that stunning over. (I'm still not convinced though - but for now I'll enjoy the moment). well done for admitting it..
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 1, 2015 12:47:43 GMT
Some final thoughts on the series;
A tour of two halves - a disappointing test series followed by very encouraging limited over performances in both ODI and T20 formats.
In the tests we had massive problems in our batting and spin bowling. In batting it's fair to say 5 of the top 7 have questions over them; only Cook and Root are performing at the consistent level required. That said - we can predict, with confidence, who will take 4 of those 5 spots; Hales to open, Taylor at 5, Stokes at 6 and Butler (after a resurgent ODI series) at 7. So the vital no. 3 position remains a big problem. We will certainly also go back to Ali at 8 and be our sole spinner in the team. This means spin is still a big problem. The pace bowling is an area of great strength for us - quality and depth.
Seeing as how limited overs cricket seems to be the route into the test team these days, our success had an extra glow. Butler's return to form, Taylor's continued fine form and good knocks from the likes of Hayles, Roy and Vince suggest we have promise in our batting department.
Consider this in the test matches we had one centurion to Pakistan's 5 while 9 of the 12 highest scores ere scored by Pakistani batsmen. In the ODIs this was reversed, 3 England centuries v 1 Pakistan and nine of the twelve top scores were by English batsmen. England's dominance in T20 was equally striking; 9 of the top 10 scores were made by Englishmen.
The bowling was equally encouraging - with no Anderson or Broad (or Wood or Finn) our next generation of quicks generally did very well. Plenty of options. Our spinners did better - although I'm not sure this is a great indicator of improvement in test match cricket, because the odd lose ball that is so costly in tests just doesn't matter in limited overs.
What was encouraging was our match play - we managed to get ourselves out of trouble and, critically, held our nerve at crucial moments in the games.
Overall I'd give England 7/10 for the tour (3 for the tests and nine for both the ODI and T20 series).
Onto South Africa!
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Dec 1, 2015 13:30:22 GMT
I've been saying it for ages & I'll say it again, don't let Butler's form in the limited overs matches blind people to his test form. There's a reason he does good in limited overs cricket & not in tests & it's quite simple to figure out..... It's because he is a limited overs cricketer, he is not a test cricketer.
You wouldn't want Cook in the T20 side, just like Butler shouldn't be in the test side.
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 1, 2015 14:21:48 GMT
I've been saying it for ages & I'll say it again, don't let Butler's form in the limited overs matches blind people to his test form. There's a reason he does good in limited overs cricket & not in tests & it's quite simple to figure out..... It's because he is a limited overs cricketer, he is not a test cricketer. You wouldn't want Cook in the T20 side, just like Butler shouldn't be in the test side. Well as a distant Somerset fan I'll happily tell you in the nicest possible way you are talking garbage, speak to those people who watched him regularly and they will tell you he is a once in a generation talent. He needs to start producing at test level but no doubt about it he will be a test cricketer for a very long time. A few things you need to consider at Somerset he didn't keep wicket on a regular basis as Kieswetter was often wicketkeeper so he is learning his trade at test level, up until the Ashes he was doing ok with the bat, the Aussies have one of the better attacks in the world and the conditions in Pakistan are also pretty unique. The main problem for me is with Englands top 5 / 6, too often Butler (and Stokes and Ali) is coming in at little over 100/150 for 5, in my opinion you won't see the best of him until the top 5 start putting some runs on the board if he is coming in at 250+ for 5 you'll see a completely different player.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Dec 1, 2015 14:27:23 GMT
So he'll be good so long as the top 5/6 all perform & take all presure off him, but we can't play him against a decent attack like Australia or South Africa, and we can't play him in tough conditions like against Pakistan, India or Sri Lanka. Gotcha... When do we next play Bangladesh at home?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2015 14:49:33 GMT
I've been saying it for ages & I'll say it again, don't let Butler's form in the limited overs matches blind people to his test form. There's a reason he does good in limited overs cricket & not in tests & it's quite simple to figure out..... It's because he is a limited overs cricketer, he is not a test cricketer. You wouldn't want Cook in the T20 side, just like Butler shouldn't be in the test side. Well as a distant Somerset fan I'll happily tell you in the nicest possible way you are talking garbage, speak to those people who watched him regularly and they will tell you he is a once in a generation talent. He needs to start producing at test level but no doubt about it he will be a test cricketer for a very long time. A few things you need to consider at Somerset he didn't keep wicket on a regular basis as Kieswetter was often wicketkeeper so he is learning his trade at test level, up until the Ashes he was doing ok with the bat, the Aussies have one of the better attacks in the world and the conditions in Pakistan are also pretty unique. The main problem for me is with Englands top 5 / 6, too often Butler (and Stokes and Ali) is coming in at little over 100/150 for 5, in my opinion you won't see the best of him until the top 5 start putting some runs on the board if he is coming in at 250+ for 5 you'll see a completely different player. Buttler will be fine in the long run ,he's a very talented young player with plenty of ability to be a top class Test cricketer for many years .....I'm not worried about him at all , but I do like to stick with talented players , it does normally pay dividends in the end .....chopping and changing every five minutes does not benefit players or the team .
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 1, 2015 18:35:22 GMT
Well as a distant Somerset fan I'll happily tell you in the nicest possible way you are talking garbage, speak to those people who watched him regularly and they will tell you he is a once in a generation talent. He needs to start producing at test level but no doubt about it he will be a test cricketer for a very long time. A few things you need to consider at Somerset he didn't keep wicket on a regular basis as Kieswetter was often wicketkeeper so he is learning his trade at test level, up until the Ashes he was doing ok with the bat, the Aussies have one of the better attacks in the world and the conditions in Pakistan are also pretty unique. The main problem for me is with Englands top 5 / 6, too often Butler (and Stokes and Ali) is coming in at little over 100/150 for 5, in my opinion you won't see the best of him until the top 5 start putting some runs on the board if he is coming in at 250+ for 5 you'll see a completely different player. Buttler will be fine in the long run ,he's a very talented young player with plenty of ability to be a top class Test cricketer for many years .....I'm not worried about him at all , but I do like to stick with talented players , it does normally pay dividends in the end .....chopping and changing every five minutes does not benefit players or the team . Absolutely spot on for every player who starts a test career like Joe Root there are 4 or 5 who have ordinary starts. The problem will face in a couple of years time is it just won't be feasible for Butler and Root to play all 3 forms of the game, so they may just to rotate them in and out for wholw ODI series particularly overseas.
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 1, 2015 18:37:57 GMT
So he'll be good so long as the top 5/6 all perform & take all presure off him, but we can't play him against a decent attack like Australia or South Africa, and we can't play him in tough conditions like against Pakistan, India or Sri Lanka. Gotcha... When do we next play Bangladesh at home? Yeah very good except that's not what I said, in case you missed it he did ok against NZ and India both of whom have more than reasonable attacks.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2015 21:55:31 GMT
Buttler will be fine in the long run ,he's a very talented young player with plenty of ability to be a top class Test cricketer for many years .....I'm not worried about him at all , but I do like to stick with talented players , it does normally pay dividends in the end .....chopping and changing every five minutes does not benefit players or the team . Absolutely spot on for every player who starts a test career like Joe Root there are 4 or 5 who have ordinary starts. The problem will face in a couple of years time is it just won't be feasible for Butler and Root to play all 3 forms of the game, so they may just to rotate them in and out for wholw ODI series particularly overseas. Yes good call with that rotation of selection policy .....with the talented group of young players that we have coming to the fore at the moment I can see that happening and hopefully the quality and strength is going to be there to allow us to do it , I'm certainly confident and optimistic for the out look for the team in all forms over the next few years .
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