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Post by wembley4372 on Aug 21, 2014 11:53:46 GMT
It'll never work, although I am sympathetic to the issue. I couldn't make myself sit down throughout a whole 90 minutes. No but I bet the team managed it on Saturday!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 11:58:03 GMT
It'll never work, although I am sympathetic to the issue. I couldn't make myself sit down throughout a whole 90 minutes. No but I bet the team managed it on Saturday! Palacios has strung out the last 3 years of his career doing it!
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 21, 2014 12:00:12 GMT
To be honest I don't think it is too expensive. In fact, if they had drafted the contract with the architects properly, they could have recovered the cost of sorting out the problem from the architect as, in terms of the disabled, the stadium is not fit for purpose. The idea of having disabled bays in every stand was a good one and still is a good one. I know a few families who have one person in a wheelchair plus one helper plus two or three other members of family who sit in the stands near the wheelchair. Why should the whole family have to relocate to the new corner just because the club and the architect cocked up the design brief of the bays? We all have our own preferences for where we sit in a stadium and there are plenty of people who don't like sitting in a corner and I don't see why the disabled and their families should have to - especially when the stadium was supposed to be designed to give wheelchair users and their families maximum choice of which stand they sit in!You are right £1 million is a lot of money - the club made an expensive mistake when they cocked up the design brief. But they CAN afford it if they have the will to bite the bullet. Of course, an alternative might be to use the money to see how many people in the two rows in front of the wheelchair bays they could persuade to move seats - perhaps when the new corner is built to give them first choice of vacant seats???????? That would raise an interesting philosophical point if those who were being asked to move said "but I don't want to move to a corner" - just the same response as we might get from the wheel chair users!
Excellent post John.
I don't think the chairs would get anywhere near the full personally customised price quoted above but even if they did, it wouldn't come to much more than what we paid Maurice Edu in wages for a single season!
These chairs (considering how little use they would relatively see) should last twenty years or more.
A total spend of between £500-800k is not a ridiculous sum at all to be required to spend in order to solve a problem that was squarely of their own making.
They could be at least trialling this idea within weeks I would have thought.
The obvious thing to do, Paul is to get the agreement of all the wheelchair season ticket holders in ONE of the bays. Maybe, for the purposes of the trial, any who didn't agree could swap with fans in the next bay who did agree. I bet you could even approach the chair manufacturers and get 6 chairs on loan (possibly even for free) for the trial to take place. And there MUST be a massive discount available should we ever go ahead with chairs in every bay. All that would then be needed would be a covered shelter/awning/tent outside the stand where users could swap from their own chair into an elevator chair. # Great publicity for the club # Great publicity (and potential orders) for the chair manufacturer Everyone is a winner - providing health and safety concerns can be sorted.
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 12:10:05 GMT
Excellent post John.
I don't think the chairs would get anywhere near the full personally customised price quoted above but even if they did, it wouldn't come to much more than what we paid Maurice Edu in wages for a single season!
These chairs (considering how little use they would relatively see) should last twenty years or more.
A total spend of between £500-800k is not a ridiculous sum at all to be required to spend in order to solve a problem that was squarely of their own making.
They could be at least trialling this idea within weeks I would have thought.
The obvious thing to do, Paul is to get the agreement of all the wheelchair season ticket holders in ONE of the bays. Maybe, for the purposes of the trial, any who didn't agree could swap with fans in the next bay who did agree. I bet you could even approach the chair manufacturers and get 6 chairs on loan (possibly even for free) for the trial to take place. And there MUST be a massive discount available should we ever go ahead with chairs in every bay. All that would then be needed would be a covered shelter/awning/tent outside the stand where users could swap from their own chair into an elevator chair. # Great publicity for the club # Great publicity (and potential orders) for the chair manufacturer Everyone is a winner - providing health and safety concerns can be sorted. Are you actually being serious? Elevator chairs!! Just raise the height of the floor by a foot. What happens if someone falls out of one of those chairs? Who is going to organise replacements when they need upgrading or get damaged? I assume the idea would be that wheelchair bound people get a higher view for the entire match and not spend 90 minutes bobbing up and down shouting go go gadget hardcordian chair. In which case a permanently raised platform would best suit the purpose rather than something that requires more effort, attention and maintenance.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 21, 2014 12:16:41 GMT
The obvious thing to do, Paul is to get the agreement of all the wheelchair season ticket holders in ONE of the bays. Maybe, for the purposes of the trial, any who didn't agree could swap with fans in the next bay who did agree. I bet you could even approach the chair manufacturers and get 6 chairs on loan (possibly even for free) for the trial to take place. And there MUST be a massive discount available should we ever go ahead with chairs in every bay. All that would then be needed would be a covered shelter/awning/tent outside the stand where users could swap from their own chair into an elevator chair. # Great publicity for the club # Great publicity (and potential orders) for the chair manufacturer Everyone is a winner - providing health and safety concerns can be sorted. Are you actually being serious? Elevator chairs!! Just raise the height of the floor by a foot. What happens if someone falls out of one of those chairs? Who is going to organise replacements when they need upgrading or get damaged? I assume the idea would be that wheelchair bound people get a higher view for the entire match and not spend 90 minutes bobbing up and down shouting go go gadget hardcordian chair. In which case a permanently raised platform would best suit the purpose rather than something that requires more effort, attention and maintenance.
You haven't actually read the thread have you fella?
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 12:28:20 GMT
Are you actually being serious? Elevator chairs!! Just raise the height of the floor by a foot. What happens if someone falls out of one of those chairs? Who is going to organise replacements when they need upgrading or get damaged? I assume the idea would be that wheelchair bound people get a higher view for the entire match and not spend 90 minutes bobbing up and down shouting go go gadget hardcordian chair. In which case a permanently raised platform would best suit the purpose rather than something that requires more effort, attention and maintenance.
You haven't actually read the thread have you fella?
Of course I haven't, I'm at work. If I read every post I wouldn't have the time to write my own completely relevant responses would I.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 21, 2014 12:29:23 GMT
The obvious thing to do, Paul is to get the agreement of all the wheelchair season ticket holders in ONE of the bays. Maybe, for the purposes of the trial, any who didn't agree could swap with fans in the next bay who did agree. I bet you could even approach the chair manufacturers and get 6 chairs on loan (possibly even for free) for the trial to take place. And there MUST be a massive discount available should we ever go ahead with chairs in every bay. All that would then be needed would be a covered shelter/awning/tent outside the stand where users could swap from their own chair into an elevator chair. # Great publicity for the club # Great publicity (and potential orders) for the chair manufacturer Everyone is a winner - providing health and safety concerns can be sorted. Are you actually being serious? Elevator chairs!! Just raise the height of the floor by a foot.What happens if someone falls out of one of those chairs? Who is going to organise replacements when they need upgrading or get damaged? I assume the idea would be that wheelchair bound people get a higher view for the entire match and not spend 90 minutes bobbing up and down shouting go go gadget hardcordian chair. In which case a permanently raised platform would best suit the purpose rather than something that requires more effort, attention and maintenance. Would that things were that simple, foster! As Paul says, it really would help if you read the thread. Take your time, it will still be here when you get home from work!
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 12:41:19 GMT
Are you actually being serious? Elevator chairs!! Just raise the height of the floor by a foot.What happens if someone falls out of one of those chairs? Who is going to organise replacements when they need upgrading or get damaged? I assume the idea would be that wheelchair bound people get a higher view for the entire match and not spend 90 minutes bobbing up and down shouting go go gadget hardcordian chair. In which case a permanently raised platform would best suit the purpose rather than something that requires more effort, attention and maintenance. Would that things were that simple, foster! As Paul says, it really would help if you read the thread. Take your time, it will still be here when you get home from work! As a matter of principle I refuse to read every post on this thread and exercise my right to respond as I see fit to your invalid arguments Lakeland. If you can't handle the fact that I'm destroying you with knowledge, logic and exceptional reasoning then I suggest you start a debate with Mick.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 21, 2014 12:51:31 GMT
Would that things were that simple, foster! As Paul says, it really would help if you read the thread. Take your time, it will still be here when you get home from work! As a matter of principle I refuse to read every post on this thread and exercise my right to respond as I see fit to your invalid arguments Lakeland. If you can't handle the fact that I'm destroying you with knowledge, logic and exceptional reasoning then I suggest you start a debate with Mick. I wouldn't have the stamina to have a long debate with Mick.
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Aug 21, 2014 12:56:19 GMT
2.40!
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 12:57:57 GMT
As a matter of principle I refuse to read every post on this thread and exercise my right to respond as I see fit to your invalid arguments Lakeland. If you can't handle the fact that I'm destroying you with knowledge, logic and exceptional reasoning then I suggest you start a debate with Mick. I wouldn't have the stamina to have a long debate with Mick. Now HIS mammoth posts I definitely don't read. They should come with a disclaimer warning that you may die of old age whilst attempting to read them.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 21, 2014 13:04:43 GMT
Absolutely pointless idea.
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 13:07:57 GMT
Absolutely pointless idea. I agree. I'm not sure what possessed Lakeland to suggest investing in inflatable wheelchairs and filling them with helium.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 13:11:24 GMT
As a matter of principle I refuse to read every post on this thread and exercise my right to respond as I see fit to your invalid arguments Lakeland. If you can't handle the fact that I'm destroying you with knowledge, logic and exceptional reasoning then I suggest you start a debate with Mick. I wouldn't have the stamina to have a long debate with Mick.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 21, 2014 13:58:23 GMT
I wouldn't have the stamina to have a long debate with Mick. I said a long debate - not a long shag!
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Aug 21, 2014 14:32:08 GMT
I said a long debate - not a long shag! A long mass debate, shirley?
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Post by slash on Aug 21, 2014 14:39:22 GMT
Is this a joke? What a load of wank, come on Stoke. Stickers, you can't be serious
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 14:40:59 GMT
Is this a joke? What a load of wank, come on Stoke. Stickers, you can't be serious
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Post by slash on Aug 21, 2014 14:50:39 GMT
honestly though, this is such a shit idea. stickers won't stop anyone from standing during a football match.
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Post by MadMarko10 on Aug 21, 2014 15:17:38 GMT
I'm seeing a lack of posts from members of the Supporters Council on this. Speaks volumes.
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Post by slash on Aug 21, 2014 15:20:56 GMT
I'm seeing a lack of posts from members of the Supporters Council on this. Speaks volumes. they know as well as us that stickers are a shit idea and won't work
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Post by foster on Aug 21, 2014 15:23:05 GMT
Token gesture. The club knows full well that it won't work.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 22, 2014 10:00:52 GMT
But what can they do?
Closing seats 3/4 rows in front of the disabled bays isn't an option imo, you piss off more people and lose money.
The only option is raising the bays but is that an option? How much would it cost and to raise it high enough would you impede the views of the people in the seats behind? I have no idea.
The club can't win either way, I'd leave it the way it is if it can't be raised without pissing a whole host of other people off.
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Post by slpmarc on Aug 22, 2014 10:11:49 GMT
But what can they do? Closing seats 3/4 rows in front of the disabled bays isn't an option imo, you piss off more people and lose money. The only option is raising the bays but is that an option? How much would it cost and to raise it high enough would you impede the views of the people in the seats behind? I have no idea. The club can't win either way, I'd leave it the way it is if it can't be raised without pissing a whole host of other people off. Spot on, the club are stuck between a rock and a hard place and nothing can be resolved untill the corners are filled in
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Post by ange1 on Aug 22, 2014 18:46:30 GMT
The Supporters Council are also in the same "rock and hard place" Hopefully we will help to resolve the situation, but it will not be a quick fix and the disabled fans who are unhappy appreciate this fact
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Aug 22, 2014 20:07:44 GMT
To be honest I don't think it is too expensive. In fact, if they had drafted the contract with the architects properly, they could have recovered the cost of sorting out the problem from the architect as, in terms of the disabled, the stadium is not fit for purpose. The idea of having disabled bays in every stand was a good one and still is a good one. I know a few families who have one person in a wheelchair plus one helper plus two or three other members of family who sit in the stands near the wheelchair. Why should the whole family have to relocate to the new corner just because the club and the architect cocked up the design brief of the bays? We all have our own preferences for where we sit in a stadium and there are plenty of people who don't like sitting in a corner and I don't see why the disabled and their families should have to - especially when the stadium was supposed to be designed to give wheelchair users and their families maximum choice of which stand they sit in!You are right £1 million is a lot of money - the club made an expensive mistake when they cocked up the design brief. But they CAN afford it if they have the will to bite the bullet. Of course, an alternative might be to use the money to see how many people in the two rows in front of the wheelchair bays they could persuade to move seats - perhaps when the new corner is built to give them first choice of vacant seats???????? That would raise an interesting philosophical point if those who were being asked to move said "but I don't want to move to a corner" - just the same response as we might get from the wheel chair users!
Excellent post John.
I don't think the chairs would get anywhere near the full personally customised price quoted above but even if they did, it wouldn't come to much more than what we paid Maurice Edu in wages for a single season!
These chairs (considering how little use they would relatively see) should last twenty years or more.
A total spend of between £500-800k is not a ridiculous sum at all to be required to spend in order to solve a problem that was squarely of their own making.
They could be at least trialling this idea within weeks I would have thought.
In fact the cheapest elevating chair on that link was £2.1k, not £4.8k . I've no idea about specifications or quality but the total cost might be much less than calculated by some posters, and as you say they would only be used for a couple of hours on 20 days per year. Also the total cost would have to compared with the cost of any alternative solutions. There is no doubt that this is a "left field" idea and there may well be reasons why it isn't viable or appropriate, but I don't think it should be dismissed on cost grounds, or ridiculed or dismissed without a proper evaluation and consultation.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 22, 2014 20:13:57 GMT
Excellent post John.
I don't think the chairs would get anywhere near the full personally customised price quoted above but even if they did, it wouldn't come to much more than what we paid Maurice Edu in wages for a single season!
These chairs (considering how little use they would relatively see) should last twenty years or more.
A total spend of between £500-800k is not a ridiculous sum at all to be required to spend in order to solve a problem that was squarely of their own making.
They could be at least trialling this idea within weeks I would have thought.
In fact the cheapest elevating chair on that link was £2.1k, not £4.8k . I've no idea about specifications or quality but the total cost might be much less than calculated by some posters, and as you say they would only be used for a couple of hours on 20 days per year. Also the total cost would have to compared with the cost of any alternative solutions. There is no doubt that this is a "left field" idea and there may well be reasons why it isn't viable or appropriate, but I don't think it should be dismissed on cost grounds, or ridiculed or dismissed without a proper evaluation and consultation. Indeed Malcolm. Rather than individual campaigners emailing the club with links to the manufacturer's web site, surely it would be better for the supporters council to be presenting it as a considered suggestion and presented in a context of cost and feasibility when compared to other possible solutions.
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Post by arnieforpresident on Aug 22, 2014 20:19:22 GMT
The only way it would work was if the stickers were double sided ! Bang on, can you imagine remaining seated when stoke score. I jump up when Stoke score at home never mind at the game. Some common sense needed here imo & that isn't it. The best idea would be to rebuild one of the stands
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Post by Stafford-Stokie on Aug 22, 2014 20:20:58 GMT
In fact the cheapest elevating chair on that link was £2.1k, not £4.8k . I've no idea about specifications or quality but the total cost might be much less than calculated by some posters, and as you say they would only be used for a couple of hours on 20 days per year. Also the total cost would have to compared with the cost of any alternative solutions. There is no doubt that this is a "left field" idea and there may well be reasons why it isn't viable or appropriate, but I don't think it should be dismissed on cost grounds, or ridiculed or dismissed without a proper evaluation and consultation. Indeed Malcolm. Rather than individual campaigners emailing the club with links to the manufacturer's web site, surely it would be better for the supporters council to be presenting it as a considered suggestion and presented in a context of cost and feasibility when compared to other possible solutions. There will be loads of H&S issues with these chairs I think. For 1, what is there to stop these chairs falling forward onto the people in front? You would need a barrier at least 5-6 foot high to prevent this. Then you have the issue of raised chairs blocking the advertising boards and maybe even the people behind. I know they will probably only raise a few feet but everything around will be exaggerated.
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Post by arnieforpresident on Aug 22, 2014 20:27:35 GMT
How much did the Britannia Stadium cost when it was constructed?
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