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Post by cheadlestokie on Aug 14, 2010 23:45:21 GMT
Whelan finished last season poorly.I think he had one good game in the last 6 or 7. Whitehead in truth is little better,just a bit quicker around the pitch.
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Post by patobanton on Aug 14, 2010 23:45:52 GMT
Why moan about Delap when Whelan was absolutely garbage today? I know, we are spoiled for choice about who to moan about.
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Post by FullerMagic on Aug 14, 2010 23:49:52 GMT
Whelan's our worst CM option by a distance IMO.
Quite what Pugh is being paid for by the club, when he seemingly isn't even considered as a rival of his, regardless of performance, is anyone's guess.
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Post by Davef on Aug 14, 2010 23:54:29 GMT
I don't really see the need to single out Glenn Whelan. Our midfield as a collective unit was piss poor, end of.
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Post by alexk on Aug 14, 2010 23:54:33 GMT
At least Whelan gets involved in the game. Whitehead regularly goes whole games without touching the ball more than ten times. We can't afford passengers like that.
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Post by andystokey on Aug 14, 2010 23:56:50 GMT
#1 RULE OF MIDFIELD DONT GIVE THE BALL AWAY CHEAPLY.
Tonge, Whelan and too often Liam lose ball in very expensive areas and don't tackle back. Same reason is why Tunny wont be played on the right by TP except in an emergency.
Watch Ringtone and Whitehead and you will see they play percentages much better. Not perfect but better. All this talk of SWP types would just make things worse. We need a right sided "winger" but if we do play him as an out and out winger we need CM's to hold and play simple passes that don't cause undue counter attacks.
The reason Barry, Milner, S Petrov Toure, De Jong, Huddlestone are regulars at top flight clubs is as much to do with NOT making mistakes as playing killer through balls. Midfield is all about building a bridgehead, without that you cant play all this fancy dan stuff.
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Post by cheadlestokie on Aug 14, 2010 23:58:04 GMT
I for one to not intend to single any one player out.I just know we have to do better than Delap,Whelan and Whitehead.When is the last time we truely did better than the opposition in midfield?
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Post by andystokey on Aug 15, 2010 0:22:19 GMT
I for one to not intend to single any one player out.I just know we have to do better than Delap,Whelan and Whitehead.When is the last time we truely did better than the opposition in midfield? Agreed, but when we consider our options for me Deano is good enough if played in CM. Given that Ringtone is a shoo in on the Left our problem is by far and away another disruptive/holding CM and a progressive but hard working right sided player. we need. ?XXX? Deano ?YYY? Ethers Part of the reason Huth looks vulnerable at Right back is less to do with his ability and more to do with who plays in front of him. IMHO XXX someone like Malbranque, Beharami YYY someone like O'Hara, Boateng, J McArthy, Noble
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Post by Davef on Aug 15, 2010 0:28:47 GMT
#1 RULE OF MIDFIELD DONT GIVE THE BALL AWAY CHEAPLY. Tonge, Whelan and too often Liam lose ball in very expensive areas and don't tackle back. Same reason is why Tunny wont be played on the right by TP except in an emergency. Watch Ringtone and Whitehead and you will see they play percentages much better. Not perfect but better. All this talk of SWP types would just make things worse. We need a right sided "winger" but if we do play him as an out and out winger we need CM's to hold and play simple passes that don't cause undue counter attacks. The reason Barry, Milner, S Petrov Toure, De Jong, Huddlestone are regulars at top flight clubs is as much to do with NOT making mistakes as playing killer through balls. Midfield is all about building a bridgehead, without that you cant play all this fancy dan stuff. I thought Matty Etherington was as guilty as any other player in the Stoke team of giving away possession today.
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Post by andystokey on Aug 15, 2010 0:31:02 GMT
fair point, I said better not perfect. Most lost possession was up the pitch, but as full back I would rather have Ringtone playing in front of me than anyone else.
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Post by cheadlestokie on Aug 15, 2010 0:39:01 GMT
But the difference is we know that Etherington can and often does a whole lot better. The other 3 are about the same week in week out.
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Post by potterpaul on Aug 15, 2010 0:40:37 GMT
Posted this before KJ signed and was ridiculed
not sure the result would of been different but I'm sure the performance would have been
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Post by cheadlestokie on Aug 15, 2010 0:44:44 GMT
Lawrence is certainly better than Delap on the right,but we need more pace there than he has got.
Pugh does o.k. as a sub from time to time.No more.Would I want him in the side week in week out?No.
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Post by potterpaul on Aug 15, 2010 0:51:37 GMT
Lawrence is certainly better than Delap on the right,but we need more pace there than he has got. Pugh does o.k. as a sub from time to time.No more.Would I want him in the side week in week out?No. I was just posting a line up with current players but I totally agree with you we are desperate for pace and quality in this area and other parts
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Post by andystokey on Aug 15, 2010 0:56:39 GMT
At least Whelan gets involved in the game. Whitehead regularly goes whole games without touching the ball more than ten times. We can't afford passengers like that. You should try using the Guardian chalkboard, compare Whelan and Whitehead today on Passes and Tackles www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/createDeano 17 passes 16 successful, 5 tackles, 3 won Whelan 18 passes 13 successful, NO Tackles If you want to be really depressed Kevin Foley did 50 passes of which 45 were successful. I thought you might be interested in a simple compare and contrast between Whelan and Noble both on a losing side. Click here to see charts: www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/201C8z2Cm74D0h0u11Qhjust click on each pitch to see breakdown
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 15, 2010 2:54:44 GMT
Whitehead and Whelan are wank together. They were last season and they will be this season. They both need Delap by them.
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Post by prettyricky on Aug 15, 2010 3:11:56 GMT
At least Whelan gets involved in the game. Whitehead regularly goes whole games without touching the ball more than ten times. We can't afford passengers like that. You should try using the Guardian chalkboard, compare Whelan and Whitehead today on Passes and Tackles www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/createDeano 17 passes 16 successful, 5 tackles, 3 won Whelan 18 passes 13 successful, NO Tackles If you want to be really depressed Kevin Foley did 50 passes of which 45 were successful. I thought you might be interested in a simple compare and contrast between Whelan and Noble both on a losing side. Click here to see charts: www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/201C8z2Cm74D0h0u11Qhjust click on each pitch to see breakdown Mate this is well cool I never seen it before how about this for a stat of the four strikers who played today Mama was the only one who hit the target, KJ came close hitting the bar but Mama was the only striker to force a save how about that for all the Mama haters out there. Whelan had one shot but it was one shot more than Whitehead so you can talk schematics all you want but if you wanna talk excitement Whelan is the far better player have you forgotten White Hart Lane last year. Perhaps more worrying the majority of chance fell to Etherington credit him but questions have to be asked as to where the strikers were at the time and why they only managed to muster up one chance each. 60% of our shots were from midfield or a defender I think rather than criticising Whelan who may of not had the best game and as I mentioned earlier may of been carrying an injury he did his job well enough he created chances and had a go, fingers should be pointed at Fuller and Tuncay which they never are because they are favourable characters and don't get me wrong I love em but they let the team down more than anyone else today. It's their job to score the goals and they didn't get in the box enough, they didn't create chances and they didn't hit the target between em.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 15, 2010 3:17:40 GMT
It's the midfield's job to create chances, Riccy and Tuncay shouldn't have to do it themselves! Anyway I'm not having a session of fuckwittery like last night because I need sleep! ;D Peace be with You Ricky and don't speak to Irishmen!
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Post by prettyricky on Aug 15, 2010 3:33:18 GMT
;D I can't believe you don't wanna talk I thought we were really beginning to connect
And as you might of guessed I wont stop there: Since Whitehead and Whelan completed 29 passes between em linked with Etherington who ran down the wing to link up and himself completed 13 passes and tried another 9 passes most of which were into the box I know the service wasn't great but the forward have to take a good deal of the blame. From 9 of Matty's balls in some of which were successful they couldn't create a good goal scoring chance between em. They had little service but they still had some service and the balls they received in the final 3rd and even in the box they did nothing with. I'm just saying while we're criticising the midfield lets have a look at some of the other aspects that failed today it wasn't a one man job the team as a whole under performed
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Post by JoeinOz on Aug 15, 2010 6:36:52 GMT
Whelan kept giving the ball away but he wasn't alone in that. In fact they all made daft avoidable errors. Apart from Jonesy. If Jonesy had been on long enough he may also have made mistakes.
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Post by lee1982 on Aug 15, 2010 8:14:24 GMT
why the bloody hell he didnt start Delap and Whitehead in center mid and Tuncay on the right, just to "surprise" Wolves is beyond me !! I agree Me too
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Post by Paddypotter on Aug 15, 2010 8:25:29 GMT
Using the March4 method of judging a players worth, Whelan played in 33 games last season, helping to collect 42 points out of the 47 points total. Which proves does it not, that Glen is indispensible? Also the ball boy wearing red trainers was there for 16 of our 19 home games in which we collected 26 points, sign him up.
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Post by mikeyb99 on Aug 15, 2010 8:27:35 GMT
I don't really see the need to single out Glenn Whelan. Our midfield as a collective unit was piss poor, end of. Yep.
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Aug 15, 2010 8:31:03 GMT
for me the only players who played well yesterday were Ryan Faye Rory and Whitehead, that was in terms of involvement in the game, Rory should never play on the right but at least he tried.
Not sure if its fair to criticise whelan given that he has not played for a few weeks , but it shows how weak our squad is tha the did play, and then when you see how out of his depth in this league two touch Tonge was when he came on.
For me we still need to do quite a lot of shopping , the squad really needs refreshing , lots of signs yesterday were not encouraging , worst of all was that Wolves outfought us
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Aug 15, 2010 8:35:04 GMT
Part of the reason Huth looks vulnerable at Right back is less to do with his ability and more to do with who plays in front of him.
I think this is rubbish Huth is a good centre half but too big and slow to play as a right back , also I'm sure he is left footed. We need proper full backs. Higgy was shocking yesterday , they targeted him and he never got cloe to their winger, sides will do the same with Huth, put pace against him and he will really struggle , also neither can use the ball well from that position, major problem
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Post by lordb on Aug 15, 2010 8:35:12 GMT
Ethers is our ONLY prem class midfielder & after a decent 1st half he was terrible 2nd half
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Post by roro on Aug 15, 2010 11:03:42 GMT
Agree entirely Whelan is poor at best. Delap is our best midfielder barr none. Ethers massively over rated. I totally agree BadBuy. I just hope yesterday was a blessing in disguise.
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Post by jarvinski on Aug 15, 2010 11:38:50 GMT
whelan is utter SHITE
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2010 11:44:59 GMT
Admit if you are one of the supporters today that sang 'Whelan, Whelan' when he ran to take a corner second half. He's someone that does bugger all throughout the game and always gets his name sung when taking a corner!! Unbelievable. We use to call Whelan 'crab' for always passing sideways. What do you call someone that doesn't pass sideways but backwards! 'crap' ?
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jon71scfc
Lads'n'Dads
Wineen Stace WINEEN!!!
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Post by jon71scfc on Aug 15, 2010 12:02:18 GMT
Whelan was and remains a Championship standard midfielder, riding on the back of 3 goals, our equalizer at Villa, the winner at Spurs and the goal vs Italy
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