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Post by vestanpance on Nov 17, 2008 12:12:56 GMT
Morning All,
It's rare i embark on a serious thread on here, i'm much happier discussing the relative merits of obtaining your brown wings, or making lewd suggestions on a caption thread, however the general mood and temper surrounding Saturday's defeat has once again left me shaking my head in utter disbelief, and has prompted me into communicating my thoughts.
We were garbage on Saturday. We never got going at all and after Ronaldo scored in the 3rd minute it was pretty clear to all who attended that our Plan B was never going to match their Plan A. But Ladies & Gentlemen, we saw the champions of Europe playing at their peak for large percentages of the game, and we simply cannot do anything about it, irrespective of whether or not Whelan played, or Soares (though the continual inclusion of Cresswell bewilders me, but Pulis works with the players every day so is better positioned than i to pick his squad). But this is not why i started a thread.
Fucking listen to yourselves. Yes we got beaten but after a third of the season we are 15th, a position that i feel sure you would all be rather pleased with if we were offered it at the end of the season. We didn't offer a lot against United but bar Saturday, and the home game against Chelsea, we've looked every bit as competitive as anyone else we've played, yet still the moaning positively fucking thrives. Yes, you can counter with the old "i'm entitled to my opinion" line and you are, but can we please get a sense of perspective. Much better sides than ours will go to Old Trafford this year and get pasted, and as much as i didn't like it nor the manner in which we went down these games are games we put behind us, and move on quickly from. The reason why should be self evident.
Our next two games could, without wishing to over-egg the pudding, define our Premier League season. We now have a struggling Hull City & an under-performing West Bromwich Albion coming to the Britannia Stadium, which is being rightly lauded as one of the most difficult places in the Premier League to play football. THESE are the games that will tell us who we are and whether we dare to hope, not the frankly inevitable capitulation and deluge of goals at OT after going 1-0 behind. I agree to a great extent that we need to alter our ways away from home BUT if we win 11 home games this season, we'll stop up irrespective. We HAVE to remain positive and believe that this can happen, instead of fucking delighting and bathing in the minutae of a beating, and then using this as a pre-meditated attack on a manager whose failings we seem happy to eulogise about, yet his strengths we begrudgingly awknowledge. I was never a big fan but the absurdity of questioning his position really fucking annoys me, particularly as I would imagine several players log on here and are treated to some of the fucking nonsense spouted. It's a question of perspective again and i'm not sure if any fans lose it as quickly as we do.
I'm no happy-clapper, i'm aware of his short-falls as a manager and some of the things he does baffle me, BUT it's him that got us where we are, and it's him that has us fighting in the best league in the world and the fact is Ladies & Gentlemen, we're nobody's fucking fools here either. We all knew what it was going to be like at the start of the seaosn and told each other (and ourselves) that we must remain positive during the inevitable dark times, yet one pasting at United and it would seem all TP's (and our) good work is for nothing. Bollocks. We're 15th and have two very winnable games coming that could see us ensconced in the warm busom of mid-table by the 1st December, and that'll do nicely as far as i'm concerned.
So what was the point of this inane ramble i hear you ask? Well i'm delighted to tell you. The motto of this football club, and indeed this City is "Strength united is stronger", yet perpetually at first sign of trouble we dissolve into petty squabbles and start stupid threads and arguments that are long standing about management style and footballing ideals, when really we should all be saying to ourselves "OK, we got battered, but we've really got to fucking stick together and make the next two games as uncomfortable as possible for our visitors. We walk away with 6 points from these and we can start talking about survival as a distinct possibility, even a probability and these knee-jerk reactions will pale into insignificance. These are the times when the players will need us the most, times when their confidence is on its' arse. They shouldn't have to read some of the bollocks being written on here nor should we enshroud the place in fear and misery. When we came up, i was convinced we would go down with less points than a fork and i suspect i was not the only one. Now i'm starting to believe that this football club could take it's place once again in England's elite, and a big part of that is down to Tony Pulis, irrespective of whether you like it or not. So remember, vis unita fortior and stop fucking moaning, because if you do you'll realise, we might, just might, have a chance this season, if we all play our part.
Cheers
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Post by luke45 on Nov 17, 2008 12:18:12 GMT
Top Post. Goooarrnnnnn Stoke  |
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Post by Widget123 on Nov 17, 2008 12:26:50 GMT
agreed - i think most sensible stoke fans will have realised before saturday that there are always going to be some games we're not even in with a chance of getting a point. saturday was one of them - the next next two games are far more important in shaping our season than bygones.
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Post by lew86 on Nov 17, 2008 12:31:02 GMT
well done VP, shout out next door
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Post by sheikhmomo on Nov 17, 2008 12:32:55 GMT
A bit of debate and criticism is justified after a hammering, regardless of who it is against but it's the real wrist slashers I can't fathom. Our survival prospects are exactly the same as they were at 2:59pm on Saturday yet some people have started to put up the white flag ???
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 12:34:19 GMT
Spot on Vestan. Put it behind us and move on.
Our season won’t be decided on our results against the likes of Man U. The negativity on here is unbelievable.
Look at the progress we have made over the past few seasons. It wasn’t so long ago that we were plying our trade in Division 2 (or League 1, whatever you want to call it).
Saturday was poor, very poor in all honesty but Pulis and the players have been great this season. I’m not saying we just accept defeat before a ball is kicked but they are one of the greatest teams in the world, a bit of perspective is needed. We all know the capabilities of our team (and more importantly the limitations) but we also bridge that gap with desire, determination and effort. That’s not enough to keep us up but we’ve already shown that along with the bit of quality we have, it’s enough to make us competitive and give us a fighting chance of staying up.
Don’t dwell on Saturday, put it behind us and move on.
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Post by vestanpance on Nov 17, 2008 12:37:12 GMT
I don't mind debate momo, in fact i'd welcome it. But we never have it on here, we lurch from brilliance to ineptitude.
We weren't good on Saturday, but away at Old Trafford WILL NOT DEFINE OUR SEASON. Hull & Albion at home will, and i think we shoudl focus our energies and efforts on those, rather than complaining about falling short of a team containing some of the best players in the world.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 12:39:33 GMT
Well said fella, now go for a sit down and a calming cuppa. Dunner let the buggers on 'ere get yer down And after a post like that, I believe it's traditional to honour you with: You're wasted on here, son ah |
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Post by Not_Nick_H on Nov 17, 2008 12:43:29 GMT
Bang on VP. We need a good performance at home on Sat and it will be business as usual. I wish some of the P&G knee-jerkers would read your post.
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Post by vestanpance on Nov 17, 2008 12:47:03 GMT
Nick,
90% of the people who call P&G never go. Honestly, i don't give a shit what they think.
What i want people to look at is the ridiculousness of a situation that has them openly calling for the managers head for the heinous crime of losing away to the Champions of Europe. It's bloody ridiculous mate, it's just nice to know i'm not the only one who sees it that way.
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Post by Beardy200 on Nov 17, 2008 13:28:43 GMT
Morning All, It's rare i embark on a serious thread on here, i'm much happier discussing the relative merits of obtaining your brown wings, or making lewd suggestions on a caption thread, however the general mood and temper surrounding Saturday's defeat has once again left me shaking my head in utter disbelief, and has prompted me into communicating my thoughts. We were garbage on Saturday. We never got going at all and after Ronaldo scored in the 3rd minute it was pretty clear to all who attended that our Plan B was never going to match their Plan A. But Ladies & Gentlemen, we saw the champions of Europe playing at their peak for large percentages of the game, and we simply cannot do anything about it, irrespective of whether or not Whelan played, or Soares (though the continual inclusion of Cresswell bewilders me, but Pulis works with the players every day so is better positioned than i to pick his squad). But this is not why i started a thread. Fucking listen to yourselves. Yes we got beaten but after a third of the season we are 15th, a position that i feel sure you would all be rather pleased with if we were offered it at the end of the season. We didn't offer a lot against United but bar Saturday, and the home game against Chelsea, we've looked every bit as competitive as anyone else we've played, yet still the moaning positively fucking thrives. Yes, you can counter with the old "i'm entitled to my opinion" line and you are, but can we please get a sense of perspective. Much better sides than ours will go to Old Trafford this year and get pasted, and as much as i didn't like it nor the manner in which we went down these games are games we put behind us, and move on quickly from. The reason why should be self evident. Our next two games could, without wishing to over-egg the pudding, define our Premier League season. We now have a struggling Hull City & an under-performing West Bromwich Albion coming to the Britannia Stadium, which is being rightly lauded as one of the most difficult places in the Premier League to play football. THESE are the games that will tell us who we are and whether we dare to hope, not the frankly inevitable capitulation and deluge of goals at OT after going 1-0 behind. I agree to a great extent that we need to alter our ways away from home BUT if we win 11 home games this season, we'll stop up irrespective. We HAVE to remain positive and believe that this can happen, instead of fucking delighting and bathing in the minutae of a beating, and then using this as a pre-meditated attack on a manager whose failings we seem happy to eulogise about, yet his strengths we begrudgingly awknowledge. I was never a big fan but the absurdity of questioning his position really fucking annoys me, particularly as I would imagine several players log on here and are treated to some of the fucking nonsense spouted. It's a question of perspective again and i'm not sure if any fans lose it as quickly as we do. I'm no happy-clapper, i'm aware of his short-falls as a manager and some of the things he does baffle me, BUT it's him that got us where we are, and it's him that has us fighting in the best league in the world and the fact is Ladies & Gentlemen, we're nobody's fucking fools here either. We all knew what it was going to be like at the start of the seaosn and told each other (and ourselves) that we must remain positive during the inevitable dark times, yet one pasting at United and it would seem all TP's (and our) good work is for nothing. Bollocks. We're 15th and have two very winnable games coming that could see us ensconced in the warm busom of mid-table by the 1st December, and that'll do nicely as far as i'm concerned. So what was the point of this inane ramble i hear you ask? Well i'm delighted to tell you. The motto of this football club, and indeed this City is "Strength united is stronger", yet perpetually at first sign of trouble we dissolve into petty squabbles and start stupid threads and arguments that are long standing about management style and footballing ideals, when really we should all be saying to ourselves "OK, we got battered, but we've really got to fucking stick together and make the next two games as uncomfortable as possible for our visitors. We walk away with 6 points from these and we can start talking about survival as a distinct possibility, even a probability and these knee-jerk reactions will pale into insignificance. These are the times when the players will need us the most, times when their confidence is on its' arse. They shouldn't have to read some of the bollocks being written on here nor should we enshroud the place in fear and misery. When we came up, i was convinced we would go down with less points than a fork and i suspect i was not the only one. Now i'm starting to believe that this football club could take it's place once again in England's elite, and a big part of that is down to Tony Pulis, irrespective of whether you like it or not. So remember, vis unita fortior and stop fucking moaning, because if you do you'll realise, we might, just might, have a chance this season, if we all play our part. Cheers Although i kind of agree that at times some fans are really fickle and the criticism often isn't constructive but from what i've read and watched i'll answer a 'few' of your points (highlighted): 1.) LOL - good one 2.) That's one of the main points people are complaining about and you're agreeing with them. 3.) Major problem here ... away from home apart from the 1st half against Boro we've been pretty dire and not looked competitive at all. You can pull out the 2 hard fought draws we've got but i'd say they are the 2 away games we've been least competitive in and they want last. 4.) Have to agree to disagree here. 11 home wins is 33 points and we could need as many as another 10 or 12 on this total that we aint gonna get away from home with our current gameplan. Even so 11 wins out of 19 games is still a massive ask for a club of our size and quality in the prem. 5.) Couldn't agree more. Away tactics frustrate me but his position shouldn't be and 'isn't' under threat at all. 6.) Away from home we are being made to look very foolish, have been very lucky to get the 2 points we've managed so far and unless tactics change im not expecting many more. In summary i agree with a lot of your post but from what i've seen most people are delighted with the season so far and it's just the "away set-up, tactics and personel that are winding people up so much". Apart from that and the Kitson situation i've not really heard many complaints about anything to be honest. |
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Post by bogus on Nov 17, 2008 13:49:52 GMT
I'm no happy-clapper, i'm aware of his short-falls as a manager and some of the things he does baffle me, BUT it's him that got us where we are, and it's him that has us fighting in the best league in the world and the fact is Ladies & Gentlemen, we're nobody's fucking fools here either. We all knew what it was going to be like at the start of the seaosn and told each other (and ourselves) that we must remain positive during the inevitable dark times, yet one pasting at United and it would seem all TP's (and our) good work is for nothing. Bollocks. We're 15th and have two very winnable games coming that could see us ensconced in the warm busom of mid-table by the 1st December, and that'll do nicely as far as i'm concerned. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ When we came up, i was convinced we would go down with less points than a fork and i suspect i was not the only one. Now i'm starting to believe that this football club could take it's place once again in England's elite, and a big part of that is down to Tony Pulis, irrespective of whether you like it or not. I can recognise most of my own thoughts in the above quotes. He got us here, his way, he deserves my backing. I decided early on that I'd stick to a "point a game and we have a chance" mantra to keep my perspective. I also felt that 18-20 points by Christmas would give us a chance. We're on course, best as I can see |
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Post by danpotter on Nov 17, 2008 14:21:04 GMT
Top post. If somebody had said at the start of the season that we wouldn't get 'turned over' until we played Man U on 15th Nov I would have snapped their hand off.
Yes our away form is a concern but we need to believe. These next two home games are vital to how the next couple of months (if not season) shapes up.
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Post by bolly_premprem on Nov 17, 2008 14:30:52 GMT
agrea with Op but I just wanted to add one thing.
We beat Arsenal
if we lose every game for the rest of the season, we can still hold our heads high and say
We Beat The mighty Arsenal
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