Conspiracy theories and mysteries

[flea79]

25 year anniversary of the Jill Dando murder that remains unsolved

many theories relate to her investigating the child sexual abuse stories from the top of society, of course these things are now starting to be heard properly but its considered likely she was killed to stop her spilling the beans

[noustie]

Cloud seeding is a hoax

Dubai cloud seeds

Absolutely pisses down of biblical proportion shortly afterwards

Too much rain (c.2 years worth) to be blamed on cloud seeding - purely a coincidence that it pissed down more than records commenced there in the 40/50s

www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/18/was-cloud-seeding-responsible-for-the-floodings-in-dubai

[thehartshillbadger]

Apr 25, 2024 9:46:49 GMT noustie said:

Cloud seeding is a hoax

Dubai cloud seeds

Absolutely pisses down of biblical proportion shortly afterwards

Too much rain (c.2 years worth) to be blamed on cloud seeding - purely a coincidence that it pissed down more than records commenced there in the 40/50s

www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/18/was-cloud-seeding-responsible-for-the-floodings-in-dubai

Operation Popeye

[jesusmcmuffin]

Apr 25, 2024 9:46:49 GMT noustie said:

Cloud seeding is a hoax

Dubai cloud seeds

Absolutely pisses down of biblical proportion shortly afterwards

Too much rain (c.2 years worth) to be blamed on cloud seeding - purely a coincidence that it pissed down more than records commenced there in the 40/50s

www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/18/was-cloud-seeding-responsible-for-the-floodings-in-dubai

Was similar 8 or 9 years ago around the same time of year. Not the first the area has had crazy flooding like this.

[flea79]

Apr 25, 2024 10:50:04 GMT jesusmcmuffin said:

Apr 25, 2024 9:46:49 GMT noustie said:

Cloud seeding is a hoax

Dubai cloud seeds

Absolutely pisses down of biblical proportion shortly afterwards

Too much rain (c.2 years worth) to be blamed on cloud seeding - purely a coincidence that it pissed down more than records commenced there in the 40/50s

www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/18/was-cloud-seeding-responsible-for-the-floodings-in-dubai

Was similar 8 or 9 years ago around the same time of year. Not the first the area has had crazy flooding like this.

agreed, in 2011 when i was there we had one afternon/night of very heavy rain and the roads flooded, not to the extent recently seen but it was carnage

[jesusmcmuffin]

Apr 25, 2024 12:02:57 GMT flea79 said:

Apr 25, 2024 10:50:04 GMT jesusmcmuffin said:

Was similar 8 or 9 years ago around the same time of year. Not the first the area has had crazy flooding like this.

agreed, in 2011 when i was there we had one afternon/night of very heavy rain and the roads flooded, not to the extent recently seen but it was carnage

Yep was trying fly out and caused problems. 13 years ago ,wow

[Gawa]

Was the Tiananmen Square massacre a massacre?

SPOILER: Click to show

Kinda, but as other users have mentioned its a bit of a misnomer.

I am going to summarize some information I was reading up on the incident in the last few weeks. I [saw this](https://worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/) posted elsewhere on reddit and it did provide some great context which is hard to find from other Western sources, but I do want to warn that it does appear to be quite biased in its own way, and some of the articles it references paint slightly different pictures than the one it intends.

There was a significant outbreak of violence that occurred in Beijing after months of protest occupying the square. Protestors were present in the square for a multitude of reasons, and the protest movement as a whole does not seem to have been particularly coherent with demands and suffered a great deal of internal disagreements.

In short, they were ordered to leave the square, and held out for a long time. Eventually, the military was sent in, largely without much violence it seems, but without much success in removing the protestors from the square (which was supposed to be used for a political meeting with Gorbachev for something).

Eventually, they did get most of the people to leave the square without too much violence (there were hundreds of thousands of protestors occupying the square, the number of dead in the square was very very few, if any, even according to the contemporary western reporting from bbc, etc.).

Violence did occur throughout the city in major incidents. As another user stated, total death toll is approximately in the range of hundreds to maybe low thousands, but we genuinely do not have good evidence (because yeah, the government of China does suppress information, as does ours). However, there was violence on both sides. Multiple soldiers were beaten to death, and one was stripped naked hung by the neck by a burned car. Dozens, if not hundreds, of military vehicles were destroyed, burned completely.

I personally believe governments have a greater responsibility to their citizens to not engage violently, as much as is feasible, and I cannot dismiss the incident because of the reality that there is so much information we do not have. So I do judge the Chinese government, to some degree, for the situation. But it was far more complicated than I have even described, and as described you can see how violence would get bad.

The article I linked also claims there were bad actors involved in the protests, namely a student who was intentionally trying to lead the protests down a violent path to spark revolutionary change, and another person who was allegedly present, a CIA asset supposedly responsible for a number of color revolutions globally. I don't know whether those claims are true or not, I didn't verify, so I would take them with skepticism until validated.

TL;DR

Many people died, protestors and soldiers alike. We don't really know how bad things were because certain information genuinely has been suppressed. It's a tragic event in recent Chinese history and we should have the honesty to acknowledge its reality, while also recognizing that most people who use the words "Tiananmen Square massacre" have literally no idea where Tiananmen Square is, couldn't guess how many people died, and couldn't even come close to relating the events that occurred.

Source - www.reddit.com/r/socialism/s/QAwzSpYEFq
Informative article referenced - worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/


What do we think?

[musik]

Are they really voting in the ESC or is it made up year after year, to make sure some minority group wins?

[elystokie]

'He died to save us all'

Did he though? 🤔

mandrakeconnection.com/

[lordb]

May 11, 2024 23:51:57 GMT Gawa said:

Was the Tiananmen Square massacre a massacre?

SPOILER: Click to show

Kinda, but as other users have mentioned its a bit of a misnomer.

I am going to summarize some information I was reading up on the incident in the last few weeks. I [saw this](https://worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/) posted elsewhere on reddit and it did provide some great context which is hard to find from other Western sources, but I do want to warn that it does appear to be quite biased in its own way, and some of the articles it references paint slightly different pictures than the one it intends.

There was a significant outbreak of violence that occurred in Beijing after months of protest occupying the square. Protestors were present in the square for a multitude of reasons, and the protest movement as a whole does not seem to have been particularly coherent with demands and suffered a great deal of internal disagreements.

In short, they were ordered to leave the square, and held out for a long time. Eventually, the military was sent in, largely without much violence it seems, but without much success in removing the protestors from the square (which was supposed to be used for a political meeting with Gorbachev for something).

Eventually, they did get most of the people to leave the square without too much violence (there were hundreds of thousands of protestors occupying the square, the number of dead in the square was very very few, if any, even according to the contemporary western reporting from bbc, etc.).

Violence did occur throughout the city in major incidents. As another user stated, total death toll is approximately in the range of hundreds to maybe low thousands, but we genuinely do not have good evidence (because yeah, the government of China does suppress information, as does ours). However, there was violence on both sides. Multiple soldiers were beaten to death, and one was stripped naked hung by the neck by a burned car. Dozens, if not hundreds, of military vehicles were destroyed, burned completely.

I personally believe governments have a greater responsibility to their citizens to not engage violently, as much as is feasible, and I cannot dismiss the incident because of the reality that there is so much information we do not have. So I do judge the Chinese government, to some degree, for the situation. But it was far more complicated than I have even described, and as described you can see how violence would get bad.

The article I linked also claims there were bad actors involved in the protests, namely a student who was intentionally trying to lead the protests down a violent path to spark revolutionary change, and another person who was allegedly present, a CIA asset supposedly responsible for a number of color revolutions globally. I don't know whether those claims are true or not, I didn't verify, so I would take them with skepticism until validated.

TL;DR

Many people died, protestors and soldiers alike. We don't really know how bad things were because certain information genuinely has been suppressed. It's a tragic event in recent Chinese history and we should have the honesty to acknowledge its reality, while also recognizing that most people who use the words "Tiananmen Square massacre" have literally no idea where Tiananmen Square is, couldn't guess how many people died, and couldn't even come close to relating the events that occurred.

Source - www.reddit.com/r/socialism/s/QAwzSpYEFq
Informative article referenced - worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/


What do we think?

Yes it was

[oggyoggy]

Super Jon Walters is white?

[Gawa]

May 12, 2024 9:01:41 GMT lordb said:

May 11, 2024 23:51:57 GMT Gawa said:

Was the Tiananmen Square massacre a massacre?

SPOILER: Click to show

Source - www.reddit.com/r/socialism/s/QAwzSpYEFq
Informative article referenced - worldaffairs.blog/2019/06/02/tiananmen-square-massacre-facts-fiction-and-propaganda/


What do we think?

Yes it was

I'm not so sure mate when you read through those articles. Lots of people died on all sides and it was a tragedy but I don't think it was a planned massacre. And the word massacre makes it sound like only one side died.

I struggle to see how that's a massacre but what's happening in Gaza is self defence.

I dunno just feels we are constantly spoon fed Chinese propoganda. Whether it be bi annual Tiananmen Square reminders. Random balloons in a sky being Chinese spies. Tik tok is stealing our data. Huawei is stealing our data. Or just last week in the uk again accusing China of hacking.

A quick look at China's recent warfare history is a starking contrast compared to America and UKs involvement.

Are they really the bad guys and we are the peacekeepers who keep going to war? Dunno.

[lordb]

May 12, 2024 10:09:27 GMT Gawa said:

May 12, 2024 9:01:41 GMT lordb said:

Yes it was

I'm not so sure mate when you read through those articles. Lots of people died on all sides and it was a tragedy but I don't think it was a planned massacre. And the word massacre makes it sound like only one side died.

I struggle to see how that's a massacre but what's happening in Gaza is self defence.

I dunno just feels we are constantly spoon fed Chinese propoganda. Whether it be bi annual Tiananmen Square reminders. Random balloons in a sky being Chinese spies. Tik tok is stealing our data. Huawei is stealing our data. Or just last week in the uk again accusing China of hacking.

A quick look at China's recent warfare history is a starking contrast compared to America and UKs involvement.

Are they really the bad guys and we are the peacekeepers who keep going to war? Dunno.

You didn't ask if it was a planned massacre, that's a different question and the answer is much less clear

[Gawa]

May 12, 2024 10:11:26 GMT lordb said:

May 12, 2024 10:09:27 GMT Gawa said:

I'm not so sure mate when you read through those articles. Lots of people died on all sides and it was a tragedy but I don't think it was a planned massacre. And the word massacre makes it sound like only one side died.

I struggle to see how that's a massacre but what's happening in Gaza is self defence.

I dunno just feels we are constantly spoon fed Chinese propoganda. Whether it be bi annual Tiananmen Square reminders. Random balloons in a sky being Chinese spies. Tik tok is stealing our data. Huawei is stealing our data. Or just last week in the uk again accusing China of hacking.

A quick look at China's recent warfare history is a starking contrast compared to America and UKs involvement.

Are they really the bad guys and we are the peacekeepers who keep going to war? Dunno.

You didn't ask if it was a planned massacre, that's a different question and the answer is much less clear

A massacre is a deliberate killing of many people in my eyes. So I see it as a tragedy but I don't think the Chinese government had intentions to deliberately kill many people.

Like even in more recent history. The protests in Hong Kong were regularly reported across the West about the brutal Chinese police etc..

But more people died, were arrested and were injured in the USA George Floyd protests. And I suspect the Palestine protests may also surpass that of Hong Kong too if they continue in current trajectory.

I don't deny many people died in Tiananmen - both protestors and members of military/police. But the word "massacre" implies its a deliberate killing to me and that it wasn't. And I feel alot of our media don't give a fair representative view of what happened.

[Deleted]

May 12, 2024 10:09:27 GMT Gawa said:

May 12, 2024 9:01:41 GMT lordb said:

Yes it was

I'm not so sure mate when you read through those articles. Lots of people died on all sides and it was a tragedy but I don't think it was a planned massacre. And the word massacre makes it sound like only one side died.

I struggle to see how that's a massacre but what's happening in Gaza is self defence.

I dunno just feels we are constantly spoon fed Chinese propoganda. Whether it be bi annual Tiananmen Square reminders. Random balloons in a sky being Chinese spies. Tik tok is stealing our data. Huawei is stealing our data. Or just last week in the uk again accusing China of hacking.

A quick look at China's recent warfare history is a starking contrast compared to America and UKs involvement.

Are they really the bad guys and we are the peacekeepers who keep going to war? Dunno.

I have a lot more leniency about what I do/don’t believe China does. I’m not sure about the Tik Tok and Huwaei reports. It could easily just be the US being worried about losing their own companies - see the EV war. The rest, yeah I feel confident that they’ve done. I have lots of family in China. They live a very different way of life and the country. We actually went to visit the square with people who lived through it.

Few countries are actually “bad guys” though. My family in China all live quite happy lives. There’s plenty that don’t but it’s a population that’s over 10x the size of the UK.

[Gawa]

Hartshill badgers Mrs has a bar and he's doing an oatcake night out in it.

[jesusmcmuffin]

Apr 25, 2024 8:20:05 GMT flea79 said:

25 year anniversary of the Jill Dando murder that remains unsolved

many theories relate to her investigating the child sexual abuse stories from the top of society, of course these things are now starting to be heard properly but its considered likely she was killed to stop her spilling the beans

Watched a doc on that a few weeks ago.

The copper was more interested in trying to justify charging Barry George but the Serbian theory seemed to have something in it

[flea79]

May 13, 2024 14:05:56 GMT jesusmcmuffin said:

Apr 25, 2024 8:20:05 GMT flea79 said:

25 year anniversary of the Jill Dando murder that remains unsolved

many theories relate to her investigating the child sexual abuse stories from the top of society, of course these things are now starting to be heard properly but its considered likely she was killed to stop her spilling the beans

Watched a doc on that a few weeks ago.

The copper was more interested in trying to justify charging Barry George but the Serbian theory seemed to have something in it

yeah the whole investigation is still aimed at Barry George who is a bit of a strange chap but is still considered guilty despite the appeal...

guess we will never know what happened

[jesusmcmuffin]

May 13, 2024 14:07:26 GMT flea79 said:

May 13, 2024 14:05:56 GMT jesusmcmuffin said:

Watched a doc on that a few weeks ago.

The copper was more interested in trying to justify charging Barry George but the Serbian theory seemed to have something in it

yeah the whole investigation is still aimed at Barry George who is a bit of a strange chap but is still considered guilty despite the appeal...

guess we will never know what happened

Yep he was an odd fella for sure ...anyone who likes Queen needs investigating for me

[jesusmcmuffin]

The traveller claiming to be from a country from Taured and DB Cooper were always 2 that I found interesting

Lots of docs on DB Cooper on You Tube etc and a few different theories

The traveller who turned up at Tokyo airport claiming to be from a country that doesn't exist with a passport from Taured was an odd one. He could have just been a bit mad to be fair

[salopstick]

not having it

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c99zwkzzrxvo

[CBUFAWKIPWH]

May 17, 2024 7:35:16 GMT salopstick said:

not having it

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c99zwkzzrxvo

Too obvious. Has to be aliens using a pointlessly complex technology nobody has heard of that defies the laws of physics.

[prestwichpotter]

"The BBC is a left wing broadcaster"

[phileetin]

Jun 17, 2024 13:03:55 GMT prestwichpotter said:

"The BBC is a left wing broadcaster"

and not racist either , cos all of them are white.

[Gawa]

The politician Lisa Nandy isn't a real person. She's a robot based of the character DW from kids TV show Arthur.

The plans to impose her on Wigan started back in the 2000s when the DW stadium was first formed. This was blatant dick swinging by her creators.

Further to the above evidence is the clear similarity between Lisa Nandy and DW herself.

Prove me I'm wrong.

[elystokie]

Jun 17, 2024 14:20:04 GMT phileetin said:

Jun 17, 2024 13:03:55 GMT prestwichpotter said:

"The BBC is a left wing broadcaster"

and not racist either , cos all of them are white.

I must have read this a dozen times and I'm still none the wiser.

[lordb]

Jun 18, 2024 11:01:02 GMT elystokie said:

Jun 17, 2024 14:20:04 GMT phileetin said:

and not racist either , cos all of them are white.

I must have read this a dozen times and I'm still none the wiser.

The Spectator, Express and Telegraph are right of centre leaning

[elystokie]

Jun 18, 2024 11:04:13 GMT lordb said:

Jun 18, 2024 11:01:02 GMT elystokie said:

I must have read this a dozen times and I'm still none the wiser.

The Spectator, Express and Telegraph are right of centre leaning

That bit I get.

It's Phil's comment that has me scratching my head (not for the first time TBF).

[Deleted]

Jun 18, 2024 11:13:14 GMT elystokie said:

Jun 18, 2024 11:04:13 GMT lordb said:

The Spectator, Express and Telegraph are right of centre leaning

That bit I get.

It's Phil's comment that has me scratching my head (not for the first time TBF).

The BBC, like most big organizations, have been accused of institutional racism: www.forbes.com/sites/joshwilson/2020/08/31/bbc-employees-speak-up-on-history-of-institutional-racism/

On the other side of it, you have sentiments like this: www.quora.com/Do-you-think-that-BBC-news-teams-go-out-of-their-way-to-interview-ethnic-minorities-over-white-people-when-on-location-reporting-in-the-UK, claiming that they have a prejudice against white people.

If you are a big organization that is in the public eye, you will always come under scrutiny from everyone.

[elystokie]

Jun 18, 2024 13:44:21 GMT @cvillestokie said:

Jun 18, 2024 11:13:14 GMT elystokie said:

That bit I get.

It's Phil's comment that has me scratching my head (not for the first time TBF).

The BBC, like most big organizations, have been accused of institutional racism: www.forbes.com/sites/joshwilson/2020/08/31/bbc-employees-speak-up-on-history-of-institutional-racism/

On the other side of it, you have sentiments like this: www.quora.com/Do-you-think-that-BBC-news-teams-go-out-of-their-way-to-interview-ethnic-minorities-over-white-people-when-on-location-reporting-in-the-UK, claiming that they have a prejudice against white people.

If you are a big organization that is in the public eye, you will always come under scrutiny from everyone.

Ah he was being ironic and playing on the fact that minorities can also be racists 🤦

Fair play, didn't think he had that in his locker 😀