Alex Neil

[The Toxic Avenger]

Oct 4, 2023 14:03:53 GMT thestatusquo said:

Oct 4, 2023 13:46:27 GMT StokieNath said:

Genuinely don’t understand why people want him gone. 3 promotions on a CV. Proof is in the pudding. It will click. We’ve got half the squad out with injuries. We saw the potential against Watford, Rotherham and Brizzle.
Give him time.

The promotions he got by and large with teams created by the previous managers. When they became his own teams is when things started to go wrong. He’s been here 12 months and other than an odd spell here and there it’s been pretty dreadful. With a combination of being away and shift work I didn’t see the team win at home until February and having missed the first couple of games this time around I’m not seeing much difference. They did put some effort in last night but quality was in short supply. He now has a worse record than mad Nath. I know he has injuries but not to bring in players that he and everyone else knew we needed before the deadline was verging on negligence. Losing can become a habit and with the games we’ve got coming up in the next month we could easily find ourselves at the bottom of the table

Where did it ‘start to go wrong’ for Sunderland sorry?

[baconburger]

Oct 4, 2023 14:08:34 GMT The Toxic Avenger said:

Oct 4, 2023 14:03:53 GMT thestatusquo said:

The promotions he got by and large with teams created by the previous managers. When they became his own teams is when things started to go wrong. He’s been here 12 months and other than an odd spell here and there it’s been pretty dreadful. With a combination of being away and shift work I didn’t see the team win at home until February and having missed the first couple of games this time around I’m not seeing much difference. They did put some effort in last night but quality was in short supply. He now has a worse record than mad Nath. I know he has injuries but not to bring in players that he and everyone else knew we needed before the deadline was verging on negligence. Losing can become a habit and with the games we’ve got coming up in the next month we could easily find ourselves at the bottom of the table

Where did it ‘start to go wrong’ for Sunderland sorry?

Or Norwich for that matter it went downhill when they got promoted same as it has there under a number of managers. Have any of them survived and gone on to be re promoted?

[The Toxic Avenger]

Oct 4, 2023 15:05:54 GMT baconburger said:

Oct 4, 2023 14:08:34 GMT The Toxic Avenger said:

Where did it ‘start to go wrong’ for Sunderland sorry?

Or Norwich for that matter it went downhill when they got promoted same as it has there under a number of managers. Have any of them survived and gone on to be re promoted?

Yeah think he wasn't doing a brilliant job after they came back down and they needed a change but that happens to all managers in the end.

[thornestein]

Oct 4, 2023 15:15:42 GMT The Toxic Avenger said:

Oct 4, 2023 15:05:54 GMT baconburger said:

Or Norwich for that matter it went downhill when they got promoted same as it has there under a number of managers. Have any of them survived and gone on to be re promoted?

Yeah think he wasn't doing a brilliant job after they came back down and they needed a change but that happens to all managers in the end.

it’s irrelevant what he’s done elsewhere , we can only judge on what he’s done here , and so far that’s not a very good job

[The Toxic Avenger]

Oct 4, 2023 15:17:55 GMT thornestein said:

Oct 4, 2023 15:15:42 GMT The Toxic Avenger said:

Yeah think he wasn't doing a brilliant job after they came back down and they needed a change but that happens to all managers in the end.

it’s irrelevant what he’s done elsewhere , we can only judge on what he’s done here , and so far that’s not a very good job

Take it up with the people who keep banging on about his record elsewhere, I was just responding to them.

[Gods]

I think this season is already a write-off in terms of doing any damage at the right end of the table. We will likely be sitting on 10 points a quarter of the way through it after Leicester away next weekend so effectively the season is a gonna already.

But honestly I don't think we should change AN or indeed Tricky or US Jared though, they are only ones who know how this thing is supposed to work.Its certainly lost on everyone else.

Got to hope we can somehow stay up.

Hang tough, re-group in July.

[shakermaker]

Oct 4, 2023 15:05:54 GMT baconburger said:

Oct 4, 2023 14:08:34 GMT The Toxic Avenger said:

Where did it ‘start to go wrong’ for Sunderland sorry?

Or Norwich for that matter it went downhill when they got promoted same as it has there under a number of managers. Have any of them survived and gone on to be re promoted?

I think the point is that at Norwich he got promoted with a team created before he arrived. When they got the the Premier League, he made diabolical signings that sent them straight down again - Ricky van Wolfswinkel anyone?

At Sunderland, he again achieved success with somebody else's squad. Even with the few games he managed them last season, he barely played any of the summer signings - I think Clarke is the only one who broke in.

Granted, we have a different Head of Recruitment to the one at Norwich - one proven in success at Sheffield United - albeit the same Technical Director in Tricky. But the point is, Neil has so far shown no success at this club or anywhere else with players brought in under his watch.

[independent]

Clarke and Roberts were signed by Sunderland in the window before AN joined the club. AN managed Norwich from Jan 9, 2015 to Mar 10, 2017.  So, he got them promoted after joining them in January.  In the Premier League 2015/16 and got relegated. Not a surprise, but what is relevant is that he had them in the Championship from Aug.2016 until he was sacked in March 2017. Similarly, he joined Sunderland in January and got them promoted in a couple of months. Some might say that he didn't get the time to wreck them.

[Clayton Wood]

Oct 4, 2023 11:58:41 GMT i1da said:

Genuine question: How long should it take for a group of individuals who have never played together before to become a well-oiled effective unit?  Given that we bought an entirely new team and that the week-to-week opposition are at various levels of skill, motivation and “cohesion”, can we realistically expect to steam roll over everyone?  I look at the MASSIVE investment in Man City, yet it took several years for the project to gel.  Same with Chelsea, and to a different degree Man United.  

When we have come across a weaker team, we have hammered them (twice).  Against better units, we have “huffed and puffed” but failed.  Did we expect that within 10 games we would be seamlessly swatting everyone aside?  As long as we remain competitive and improve our “cohesion” game by game, I believe we are heading in the right direction.  This season we will be top half and continuing to improve.  What else did anyone realistically expect?

Happy clappers will tell you it will take all season.
Overdue already for the rest.
Hope this helps.

[Deleted]

I've changed my mind. Stick with him.

We aren't going up this season anyway, I'd only get rid of we are in relegation trouble.

Let's see if he learns how to get the best out of this bunch over the next couple of months at least.

As others have said, with our owners things can get a lot worse

[george2again]

Oct 4, 2023 18:53:42 GMT @deleted said:

I've changed my mind. Stick with him.

We aren't going up this season anyway, I'd only get rid of we are in relegation trouble.

Let's see if he learns how to get the best out of this bunch over the next couple of months at least.

As others have said, with our owners things can get a lot worse

Every game we seem to have no plan, no system in place and very little passion( scoring last minute apart) . AN bar one run last season has been appalling with turgid football and a lack of a system to stick to. I really think he’ll be gone by the end of the month. The fixtures we have and his seemingly lack of any plan will decide his fete.

[vidigal7]

So the theory is Neil can only get promoted with good players, that's not a big shock really is it to be honest, I'd say that's usually the case for most managers.

It's a good job our signings look good then. If people are prepared to look you can clearly see we havn't been able to play what people would call our best 11.

As for signings, I don't know what more people expect, our main striker purchased in the summer has been injured. Overall I believe we've done some good business this summer, people need to get real if building a squadin one summer gets you promotion everybody would be doing it. It isn't like we've made bad signings, quite the opposite, with resale value to as theyre the right age. So we can add the parts needed to this which is a good first base

[Bojan Mackey]

Oct 4, 2023 18:53:42 GMT @deleted said:

I've changed my mind. Stick with him.

We aren't going up this season anyway, I'd only get rid of we are in relegation trouble.

Let's see if he learns how to get the best out of this bunch over the next couple of months at least.

As others have said, with our owners things can get a lot worse

We are in relegation trouble.

[gingerninja]

The club are in a difficult position, they obviously want the manager to succeed, we all do, but what if, as could happen, we get very few points in the next 5 or 6 games, our position in the league then wouldn't look too healthy?.

[biddulphchav]

Oct 5, 2023 7:15:38 GMT vidigal7 said:

So the theory is Neil can only get promoted with good players, that's not a big shock really is it to be honest, I'd say that's usually the case for most managers.

It's a good job our signings look good then. If people are prepared to look you can clearly see we havn't been able to play what people would call our best 11.

As for signings, I don't know what more people expect, our main striker purchased in the summer has been injured. Overall I believe we've done some good business this summer, people need to get real if building a squadin one summer gets you promotion everybody would be doing it. It isn't like we've made bad signings, quite the opposite, with resale value to as theyre the right age. So we can add the parts needed to this which is a good first base

That’s all well and good, but his record here is awful. If we are in and around the relegation spots in 4-5 weeks in my view he needs to go. Even allowing for the fact we have a new squad and have some players injured, we are still underperforming massively - and the buck stops with the manager

[vidigal7]

Oct 5, 2023 7:22:53 GMT biddulphchav said:

Oct 5, 2023 7:15:38 GMT vidigal7 said:

So the theory is Neil can only get promoted with good players, that's not a big shock really is it to be honest, I'd say that's usually the case for most managers.

It's a good job our signings look good then. If people are prepared to look you can clearly see we havn't been able to play what people would call our best 11.

As for signings, I don't know what more people expect, our main striker purchased in the summer has been injured. Overall I believe we've done some good business this summer, people need to get real if building a squadin one summer gets you promotion everybody would be doing it. It isn't like we've made bad signings, quite the opposite, with resale value to as theyre the right age. So we can add the parts needed to this which is a good first base

That’s all well and good, but his record here is awful. If we are in and around the relegation spots in 4-5 weeks in my view he needs to go. Even allowing for the fact we have a new squad and have some players injured, we are still underperforming massively - and the buck stops with the manager

I'd rather stick quietly confident that we can add to this in January.

I've got to say I think we've been unlucky, some new signings are just getting settled in and as a result I think we've shown improvement over the last 2 games. We're talking about fine margins here, we were beat by 12 men v Southampton with a depleted team,.

People mention the lack of a certain type of central defender, well apparently we were in for a 'brute from europe' and we've tried to get in Lascelles from Newcastle, so the intention was there, it was recognised. Is it Neil's fault we didn't get either because how I thought it was is other people do the negotiations.

The players we have brought in is a big positive for me, we should let him finish what he has started because going into the next two windows it's clear what we need and I'm convinced we'll get the right type. You can't do a complete rebuild in one summer

[stokie1947]

who would we replace him with another British manager same o same o talk about groundhog day

[vidigal7]

Oct 5, 2023 7:35:36 GMT stokie1947 said:

who would we replace him with another British manager same o same o talk about groundhog day

You'll be in for a brucey bonus

[questionable]

Oct 5, 2023 5:57:42 GMT george2again said:

Oct 4, 2023 18:53:42 GMT @deleted said:

I've changed my mind. Stick with him.

We aren't going up this season anyway, I'd only get rid of we are in relegation trouble.

Let's see if he learns how to get the best out of this bunch over the next couple of months at least.

As others have said, with our owners things can get a lot worse

Every game we seem to have no plan, no system in place and very little passion( scoring last minute apart) . AN bar one run last season has been appalling with turgid football and a lack of a system to stick to. I really think he’ll be gone by the end of the month. The fixtures we have and his seemingly lack of any plan will decide his fete.

I also think he’ll be gone by the end of the month, as much as I enjoyed the “effort” against Southampton his time here has been appalling.

Summer signings although enjoyable AN has ignored the defensive frailties which is unacceptable

Hopefully the club have a replacement in mind and talks are already planned.

[benjaminbiscuit]

Oct 5, 2023 7:18:21 GMT Bojan Mackey said:

Oct 4, 2023 18:53:42 GMT @deleted said:

I've changed my mind. Stick with him.

We aren't going up this season anyway, I'd only get rid of we are in relegation trouble.

Let's see if he learns how to get the best out of this bunch over the next couple of months at least.

As others have said, with our owners things can get a lot worse

We are in relegation trouble.

We are dead certs as things stand neil , Jared and most of all Martin as the overseer of absolute chaos have to go .I’m actually starting to feel a bit foe Neil,I never felt he was the right man and have said so since day 1 he’s a mediocre mid table nabager his Preston record dats so but he’s not a catalyst of chaos and relegation as he is proving here so some and or something around him are  making a mediocre manager a bad one .

[baconburger]

Oct 5, 2023 7:35:36 GMT stokie1947 said:

who would we replace him with another British manager same o same o talk about groundhog day

Another dour British manager that what they almost always go for their taste in football is very conservative.

[FullerMagic]

Nothing really on the Sheff Weds or Rangers betting lists, although you'd hope we may be slightly more attractive than Wednesday with their ownership.

m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32334465
Wednesday
Nathan Jones 4/1
Dean Smith 6/1
Slaven Bilic (Saudi) 7/1
Neil Warnock 10/1
Giuseppe Iachini (Parma) 14/1
Benito Carbone 16/1
Carlos Carvalhal 16/1
Jess Thorup 16/1
Paul Ince 16/1
Scott Parker 16/1
Bruno Lage 20/1
Joey Barton 20/1
Mark Warburton 20/1
Sabri Lamouchi 20/1
Vítor Campelos (Gil Vicente) 33/1
m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32317665
Rangers
Frank Lampard 11/8
Kevin Muscat (Yokohama) 10/3
Steven Davis 9/2
Pascal Jansen (Alkmaar) 5/1
Derek McInnes 7/1
Philippe Clement 14/1
Chris Wilder 18/1
Ryan Lowe 18/1
John Eustace 20/1
Neil Warnock 20/1
Ralph Hasenhuttl 20/1
Scott Parker 20/1
Dean Smith 25/1
Jesse Marsch 25/1
Jon Dahl Tomasson 25/1
Kjetil Knutsen (Bodo/Glimt) 25/1
Nathan Jones 25/1
Robbie Nielsen 25/1
David Martindale 40/1
Jacob Neestrup (Copenhagen) 40/1
Karel Geraerts 40/1
Michael Carrick 40/1
Rafa Benitez 40/1
Ruud van Nistelrooy 40/1
Steven Gerrard 40/1
Ally McCoist 50/1
Gerardo Seoane 50/1
John Terry 50/1
Karl Robinson 50/1
Oliver Glasner 50/1
Wayne Rooney 50/1
Barry Ferguson 66/1
Steve Bruce 66/1
Giovanni van Bronckhorst 80/1
Chris Hughton 100/1
Danny Cowley 100/1
Graeme Murty 100/1
Kevin Phillips 100/1
Leam Richardson 100/1
Mike Newell 100/1
Paul Hartley 100/1
Scott Brown 100/1

[gingerninja]

The name which looms large for me, is Chris Wilder, not employed, the family love him and I know he has watched at least 3 of our last 5 games..

[baconburger]

Oct 5, 2023 8:03:28 GMT FullerMagic said:

Nothing really on the Sheff Weds or Rangers betting lists, although you'd hope we may be slightly more attractive than Wednesday with their ownership.

m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32334465
Wednesday
Nathan Jones 4/1
Dean Smith 6/1
Slaven Bilic (Saudi) 7/1
Neil Warnock 10/1
Giuseppe Iachini (Parma) 14/1
Benito Carbone 16/1
Carlos Carvalhal 16/1
Jess Thorup 16/1
Paul Ince 16/1
Scott Parker 16/1
Bruno Lage 20/1
Joey Barton 20/1
Mark Warburton 20/1
Sabri Lamouchi 20/1
Vítor Campelos (Gil Vicente) 33/1
m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32317665
Rangers
Frank Lampard 11/8
Kevin Muscat (Yokohama) 10/3
Steven Davis 9/2
Pascal Jansen (Alkmaar) 5/1
Derek McInnes 7/1
Philippe Clement 14/1
Chris Wilder 18/1
Ryan Lowe 18/1
John Eustace 20/1
Neil Warnock 20/1
Ralph Hasenhuttl 20/1
Scott Parker 20/1
Dean Smith 25/1
Jesse Marsch 25/1
Jon Dahl Tomasson 25/1
Kjetil Knutsen (Bodo/Glimt) 25/1
Nathan Jones 25/1
Robbie Nielsen 25/1
David Martindale 40/1
Jacob Neestrup (Copenhagen) 40/1
Karel Geraerts 40/1
Michael Carrick 40/1
Rafa Benitez 40/1
Ruud van Nistelrooy 40/1
Steven Gerrard 40/1
Ally McCoist 50/1
Gerardo Seoane 50/1
John Terry 50/1
Karl Robinson 50/1
Oliver Glasner 50/1
Wayne Rooney 50/1
Barry Ferguson 66/1
Steve Bruce 66/1
Giovanni van Bronckhorst 80/1
Chris Hughton 100/1
Danny Cowley 100/1
Graeme Murty 100/1
Kevin Phillips 100/1
Leam Richardson 100/1
Mike Newell 100/1
Paul Hartley 100/1
Scott Brown 100/1

Not exactly lists to get you rushing into the shed to sharpen the 🪓.

[liamo]

The big issue for me is the lack of direction, yes we've had a massive overhaul and the players will take time to gel and all that shite manager speak we all use but in reality, we should be able to see a style of play? Win or lose when was the last time we all came away from a game thinking "well i can see what he was trying to do"

Hull brought 15 new players in, they're not tearing it up but they're up there, before Brighton clicked they were toothless and couldn't score but you could see a style of play evolving and they did that in the prem

We're not scoring goals and we're not defensively sound, that only ends one way sadly

[Staffsoatcake]

He really has to get some wins in our next 5/6 matches,if he doesnt,we will be in the bottom 3,putting him under real pressure.

[NassauDave]

Oct 5, 2023 8:11:24 GMT baconburger said:

Oct 5, 2023 8:03:28 GMT FullerMagic said:

Nothing really on the Sheff Weds or Rangers betting lists, although you'd hope we may be slightly more attractive than Wednesday with their ownership.

m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32334465
Wednesday
Nathan Jones 4/1
Dean Smith 6/1
Slaven Bilic (Saudi) 7/1
Neil Warnock 10/1
Giuseppe Iachini (Parma) 14/1
Benito Carbone 16/1
Carlos Carvalhal 16/1
Jess Thorup 16/1
Paul Ince 16/1
Scott Parker 16/1
Bruno Lage 20/1
Joey Barton 20/1
Mark Warburton 20/1
Sabri Lamouchi 20/1
Vítor Campelos (Gil Vicente) 33/1
m.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/32317665
Rangers
Frank Lampard 11/8
Kevin Muscat (Yokohama) 10/3
Steven Davis 9/2
Pascal Jansen (Alkmaar) 5/1
Derek McInnes 7/1
Philippe Clement 14/1
Chris Wilder 18/1
Ryan Lowe 18/1
John Eustace 20/1
Neil Warnock 20/1
Ralph Hasenhuttl 20/1
Scott Parker 20/1
Dean Smith 25/1
Jesse Marsch 25/1
Jon Dahl Tomasson 25/1
Kjetil Knutsen (Bodo/Glimt) 25/1
Nathan Jones 25/1
Robbie Nielsen 25/1
David Martindale 40/1
Jacob Neestrup (Copenhagen) 40/1
Karel Geraerts 40/1
Michael Carrick 40/1
Rafa Benitez 40/1
Ruud van Nistelrooy 40/1
Steven Gerrard 40/1
Ally McCoist 50/1
Gerardo Seoane 50/1
John Terry 50/1
Karl Robinson 50/1
Oliver Glasner 50/1
Wayne Rooney 50/1
Barry Ferguson 66/1
Steve Bruce 66/1
Giovanni van Bronckhorst 80/1
Chris Hughton 100/1
Danny Cowley 100/1
Graeme Murty 100/1
Kevin Phillips 100/1
Leam Richardson 100/1
Mike Newell 100/1
Paul Hartley 100/1
Scott Brown 100/1

Not exactly lists to get you rushing into the shed to sharpen the 🪓.

No kidding!

[thornestein]

Oct 5, 2023 7:15:38 GMT vidigal7 said:

So the theory is Neil can only get promoted with good players, that's not a big shock really is it to be honest, I'd say that's usually the case for most managers.

It's a good job our signings look good then. If people are prepared to look you can clearly see we havn't been able to play what people would call our best 11.

As for signings, I don't know what more people expect, our main striker purchased in the summer has been injured. Overall I believe we've done some good business this summer, people need to get real if building a squadin one summer gets you promotion everybody would be doing it. It isn't like we've made bad signings, quite the opposite, with resale value to as theyre the right age. So we can add the parts needed to this which is a good first base

mmaee was never meant to be our main striker so that’s bs , he was holding out for Stewart and when that went tits up he tried for the wba lad , some of the signing look poor but you will always get that , but the two key signings we needed Neil failed to get so takes the blame

[Deleted]

We are the softest touch at set pieces in the entire league.

In a league where the bottom half teams, rely on set pieces heavily and practice them religiously .

So basically in games where we are looking to pick up points, we are likely to concede from set pieces.

Have we got enough about us , to score enough goals , to get around this ?

We will see?

But there is an obvious danger , in being poor at defending set pieces and somehow hoping you can score more than the other lot .

[Biblical]

Oct 4, 2023 15:24:58 GMT Gods said:

I think this season is already a write-off in terms of doing any damage at the right end of the table. We will likely be sitting on 10 points a quarter of the way through it after Leicester away next weekend so effectively the season is a gonna already.

But honestly I don't think we should change AN or indeed Tricky or US Jared though, they are only ones who know how this thing is supposed to work.Its certainly lost on everyone else.

Got to hope we can somehow stay up.

Hang tough, re-group in July.

This is where I’m at as well. Hopefully there is more to come from the current group.

- Burger has shown glimpses of what he can do but the niggly injuries haven’t helped. Hopefully he can prove why we’ve spent a sizeable chunk on him.
- Bae has looked lively
- No idea what to make of Mmaee yet but if he can regain fitness and play like the player we think we’ve signed then he could make a huge difference.
- Vidigal’s return to fitness will be most welcome
- Haksabanovic looks decent to me
- Not seen enough of Junior yet but I am impressed by what I’ve seen.

So in an attacking sense the problems can be solved by players already at the club if injuries clear up etc.

It’s the defence that concerns me the most, unless we get a free agent in I’m worried about going with those CB’s until January.

Neil can talk about performances all he likes but he’s got to start getting results. It’s still not a given that he’s a complete dud at the moment though.

Whilst I think we may struggle to get top half with the current set up, the right signings in January with CB as a priority and a central striker if Mmaee doesn’t live up to expectations then things could look very different for the 2nd half of the season.