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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 3, 2024 6:49:13 GMT
Attacking mosques seems like terrorism to me. Stabbing three little girls to death was deemed to be not terror related. There is no evidence to suggest the stabbings were part of a politically motivated agenda. All the available evidence suggests it was a random act by a young man with mental health issues. Its terrifying but there is no evidence that it was an act of terrorism. It's the far right who have tried to link this incident with Islamist terrorism and are using it as a justification for their own acts of politically motivated violence. Why are they even attacking mosques over this incident? The young man who did this was a British citizen born in Wales to Rwandan parents (a country that is 90% Christian and 2% Muslim). Why aren't they attacking Welsh Presbytarian churches? |
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 3, 2024 6:51:28 GMT
My last word this evening on this thread. There are certain people on here not willing to give an explanation about the wider picture. The guy with a swastika, we all agree is a disgusting prick. Why are people continually going on about a bloke with a tattoo and furthermore going on about him being from Stoke(which is a pathetic attempt at deflection btw). I’ve had a couple of responses to the question I posed the other night about what people think the root cause of this weeks issues are but the vast majority resort to picking out single Twitter videos of utter Neanderthals as a reason. It’s bizarre and frankly makes you look a bit dim. The root cause is bad parenting, austerity/widening gap between the rich and the poor and social media stoking violence (for example, Farage and Robinson). Why that means a mosque or police officers need to be attacked, I have no idea. |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Aug 3, 2024 6:53:01 GMT
My last word this evening on this thread. There are certain people on here not willing to give an explanation about the wider picture. The guy with a swastika, we all agree is a disgusting prick. Why are people continually going on about a bloke with a tattoo and furthermore going on about him being from Stoke(which is a pathetic attempt at deflection btw). I’ve had a couple of responses to the question I posed the other night about what people think the root cause of this weeks issues are but the vast majority resort to picking out single Twitter videos of utter Neanderthals as a reason. It’s bizarre and frankly makes you look a bit dim. The root cause is bad parenting, austerity/widening gap between the rich and the poor and social media stoking violence (for example, Farage and Robinson). Why that means a mosque or police officers need to be attacked, I have no idea. Thank you |
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Post by salopstick on Aug 3, 2024 7:01:32 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said.
Bollicks they were just cunts
I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts.
But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc
That’s the narrative
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Post by oggyoggy on Aug 3, 2024 7:14:06 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative I’ve not seen that narrative. |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Aug 3, 2024 7:21:31 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative There are none so blind as those who will not see |
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Post by PotteringThrough on Aug 3, 2024 7:46:55 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative I know people that will agree with the riots that are happening now. I even suspect a couple of them might attend. I know of no one who thought the 2011 one was a good thing or the right thing to do. That might be because I’m from Stoke and these recent ones are closer to home. We’ve had a real shift in recent years of people in power and with large platforms openly telling lies and spreading misinformation and it going unchecked & unpunished. Southport is a prime example, an incorrect name and backstory was spread far and wide. We’re at a very divisive point in our history, again. The cost of living crisis is hitting people hard, still. The messages from certain quarters of people in power and authority are seemingly pushing this divisive narrative and emboldening the actions of the minority. I feel like for some people it’s just a release of pent up aggression and an easy way to get back at those who’ve (perceptually) wronged them without expecting any punishment. For others it’s definitely motivated by something else. The laws to protest we’re changed by the last government and seriously impacted peoples rights to protest peacefully. (It’s still legal to protest peacefully - it’s not legal to riot). They now target protesters who continually protest for the same thing e.g. climate change and just stop oil who disrupt traffic. I think the laws do need changing - this one needs to be repealed because it limits the right to peaceful protest and gives the police powers over & above our human rights. |
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Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Aug 3, 2024 7:54:25 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative This. I’d say that the large majority of those that riot aren’t doing it because of a political ideology but because they’re primarily - opportunists who loot for financial gain. - they have it in their genes to destroy because their lives are so miserable and they want to make others lives just as miserable (I’m sure that some will claim that’s a class thing but for me that should never justify bad behaviour). - get a kick out of winding up the police because they have a dislike for authority. - because they feel it gives them a feeling of belonging and being part of a group even if that groups doing wrong. The majority of those that do it may lineup behind a cause but for most of them that cause is secondary and they’d never have the ability to sit in a room and hold their own in a debate around what they say they’re fighting for and I’d imagine some wouldn’t even know why they’re doing it and that goes for some of the more peaceful marches having seen some reports. Most, not all of those involved are totally ignorant and unintelligent and just looking for an excuse to cause trouble. This was never more apparent than when they targeted a mosque when the character responsible for the killings wasn’t even a muslim (not that it justifies attacking innocent people because of their religion or their colour even if he was). As you say there’s a lot of hypocrisy because people will justify riots for other causes like when known criminals lose their lives and become martyrs or because someone disagree with something that happened 200-300 years ago. Ultimately these characters are racists but they don’t represent everyone that’s concerned about immigration or is central / right in their politics or has a concern around grooming gangs or knife crime in London unlike them those riotings reasons are based on “prejudice”, “bigotary” rather than genuine concern that some have. These characters behaviour has taken this country back years but as I’ve said previously they don’t dictate what the vast majority believe and they should never be looked on as representing anyone other than themselves in the same way as others who riot do. My biggest fear is that their behaviour will completely shut down any healthy debate because when ever there’s a discussion to be had people will be met with the R word or you’re just like them. |
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Post by PotteringThrough on Aug 3, 2024 8:10:07 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative My biggest fear is that their behaviour will completely shut down any healthy debate because when ever there’s a discussion to be had people will be met with the R word or you’re just like them. Now would be the best time to have open and honest debates with the people involved to get real understanding of why they’re doing it and before ulterior narratives can be formed. |
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Post by mrnovember on Aug 3, 2024 8:10:18 GMT
Stabbing three little girls to death was deemed to be not terror related. There is no evidence to suggest the stabbings were part of a politically motivated agenda. All the available evidence suggests it was a random act by a young man with mental health issues. Its terrifying but there is no evidence that it was an act of terrorism. It's the far right who have tried to link this incident with Islamist terrorism and are using it as a justification for their own acts of politically motivated violence. Why are they even attacking mosques over this incident? The young man who did this was a British citizen born in Wales to Rwandan parents (a country that is 90% Christian and 2% Muslim). Why aren't they attacking Welsh Presbytarian churches? I've absolutely no idea why you are asking me any of those questions. I never suggested that this incident was linked to islamic terrorism specifically and I didn't try to justify the attacks on mosques. I simply said that if stabbing 3 children to death cannot be defined as terrorism, then throwing bricks and bottles at a building cannot either. Bayern was being a dramatic narcissist. Who knows, maybe he wanted to redirect a conversation that was already live on two/three other threads, back to his own. While we're here though, mental illness is undoubtedly the root cause. But there will be a motivating or influencing factor that put the knife in his hand that day. Now that could be anything from religious or political extremism to over consumption of violent forms of media. Mental illness is the root cause but there will be some other catalyst. In my opinion of course. We'll find out at as it progresses through the courts. |
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Aug 3, 2024 8:11:23 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative There are none so blind as those who will not see The other night you said we should leave left and right out of this. As soon as a post comes along attacking leftists you're on it like a rash. |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Aug 3, 2024 8:15:35 GMT
There are none so blind as those who will not see The other night you said we should leave left and right out of this. As soon as a post comes along attacking leftists you're on it like a rash. My point is it doesn’t matter if you’re left or right or whatever, a whole spectrum has played a part. Not just those being portrayed in the media as “racists” and “far right wing”. That’s what I’m agreeing with |
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Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Aug 3, 2024 8:18:58 GMT
My biggest fear is that their behaviour will completely shut down any healthy debate because when ever there’s a discussion to be had people will be met with the R word or you’re just like them. Now would be the best time to have open and honest debates with the people involved to get real understanding of why they’re doing it and before ulterior narratives can be formed. I was listening to LBC yesterday and this was exactly what someone said. Get all parties in a room for a debate including those rioting. I’m pretty sure that they’d embaress themselves but it takes a hell of a lot more to do that than smash things up, attack the police and set cars alight. They also wouldn’t have all their mates to back them up. |
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Post by henry on Aug 3, 2024 8:22:15 GMT
Why share the video then and give him more publicity ? |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 8:35:24 GMT
Why share the video then and give him more publicity ? That video is all over the internet right now. I don't think sharing it on here is going make it anymore worse 🤣 that moron needs putting down. |
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Post by henry on Aug 3, 2024 8:43:02 GMT
Why share the video then and give him more publicity ? That video is all over the internet right now. I don't think sharing it on here is going make it anymore worse 🤣 that moron needs putting down. According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 8:49:11 GMT
In 2011 the leftists gloated at the riots against the government set off by a criminal getting shot in London. It turned into a lot of scroungers and idiots smashing cities up across the country. Chickens coming Home to roost they said. Bollicks they were just cunts I dont support these new riots. No normal people do. Again mindless cunts. But because it’s coming from the right the leftists now condemn it and all laws need changing, gestapo formed etc etc That’s the narrative This. I’d say that the large majority of those that riot aren’t doing it because of a political ideology but because they’re primarily - opportunists who loot for financial gain. - they have it in their genes to destroy because their lives are so miserable and they want to make others lives just as miserable (I’m sure that some will claim that’s a class thing but for me that should never justify bad behaviour). - get a kick out of winding up the police because they have a dislike for authority. - because they feel it gives them a feeling of belonging and being part of a group even if that groups doing wrong. The majority of those that do it may lineup behind a cause but for most of them that cause is secondary and they’d never have the ability to sit in a room and hold their own in a debate around what they say they’re fighting for and I’d imagine some wouldn’t even know why they’re doing it and that goes for some of the more peaceful marches having seen some reports. Most, not all of those involved are totally ignorant and unintelligent and just looking for an excuse to cause trouble. This was never more apparent than when they targeted a mosque when the character responsible for the killings wasn’t even a muslim (not that it justifies attacking innocent people because of their religion or their colour even if he was). As you say there’s a lot of hypocrisy because people will justify riots for other causes like when known criminals lose their lives and become martyrs or because someone disagree with something that happened 200-300 years ago. Ultimately these characters are racists but they don’t represent everyone that’s concerned about immigration or is central / right in their politics or has a concern around grooming gangs or knife crime in London unlike them those riotings reasons are based on “prejudice”, “bigotary” rather than genuine concern that some have. These characters behaviour has taken this country back years but as I’ve said previously they don’t dictate what the vast majority believe and they should never be looked on as representing anyone other than themselves in the same way as others who riot do. My biggest fear is that their behaviour will completely shut down any healthy debate because when ever there’s a discussion to be had people will be met with the R word or you’re just like them. Yeah exactly this. Those that have been rioting last few days and those that are "marching" today which absolutely won't be peaceful..they don't gave a genuine cause for rioting or marching because 99% of them are too thick to know why. They just want jump on the bandwagon as they think it makes them look tough. Same as in the london riots in 2011 with the looting. 99% of people in that had no idea why they were actually there all they wanted do is cause trouble and steal. And this is the problem with any sort of protest or whatever, the actual cause gets lost in minutes because there majority of the group just want trouble. |
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Post by Foster on Aug 3, 2024 8:51:32 GMT
That video is all over the internet right now. I don't think sharing it on here is going make it anymore worse 🤣 that moron needs putting down. According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. That's true. They're only adding fuel to the fire. I never go on any of those shit SM sites and so i wouldnt see any of these extreme clips if they weren't shared on here. Edit: You only need to see how angry and one-sided those that share most SM on here are to see the negative effect that it has. |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 8:52:48 GMT
That video is all over the internet right now. I don't think sharing it on here is going make it anymore worse 🤣 that moron needs putting down. According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. But the point still stands that that clip is all over twitter and facebook and god knows what else where millions can and have seen it. Telling someone they shouldn't share it on here isn't going to solve anything as it's already gone way beyond that. Saving 30 people from seeing the neanderthal on here isn't going slow it down. I get your point but it's just gone so far beyond that. |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 8:57:32 GMT
According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. That's true. They're only adding fuel to the fire. I never go on any of those shit SM sites and so i wouldnt see any of these extreme clips if they weren't shared on here. Edit: You only need to see how angry and one-sided those that share most SM on here are to see the negative effect that it has. You've got the 2 sides..the people who want to see things like that and look for it. And the ones who don't. I am firmly on the ones who don't. The reason I saw it on Twitter is because "Stoke" was trending in the UK at number 4 or 5 last night. I clicked on it as I was unsure why Stoke was trending and it was just all videos and pictures of him. |
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Post by Eggybread on Aug 3, 2024 9:17:26 GMT
The guy is utter pond life but the problem is you lot can’t see past the end of your own noses. Why are you not asking why these things are happening rather than just throwing buzzwords around? Are you not interested in making the country a better place to live? I’ve asked this question multiple times without a reasonable response and I expect the same on this one "Are you not interested in making the country a better place to live?" I would think that most if asked the question would say yes. But not at the cost of blaming all the woes and issues on immigrants, its pathetic far right rhetoric. Any way Im popping up to Hanley/Park today for a summer stroll.  |
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Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Aug 3, 2024 9:18:36 GMT
That video is all over the internet right now. I don't think sharing it on here is going make it anymore worse 🤣 that moron needs putting down. According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. Spot on. For some bad attention is better than no attention. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 3, 2024 9:23:15 GMT
There is no evidence to suggest the stabbings were part of a politically motivated agenda. All the available evidence suggests it was a random act by a young man with mental health issues. Its terrifying but there is no evidence that it was an act of terrorism. It's the far right who have tried to link this incident with Islamist terrorism and are using it as a justification for their own acts of politically motivated violence. Why are they even attacking mosques over this incident? The young man who did this was a British citizen born in Wales to Rwandan parents (a country that is 90% Christian and 2% Muslim). Why aren't they attacking Welsh Presbytarian churches? I've absolutely no idea why you are asking me any of those questions. I never suggested that this incident was linked to islamic terrorism specifically and I didn't try to justify the attacks on mosques. I simply said that if stabbing 3 children to death cannot be defined as terrorism, then throwing bricks and bottles at a building cannot either. Bayern was being a dramatic narcissist. Who knows, maybe he wanted to redirect a conversation that was already live on two/three other threads, back to his own. While we're here though, mental illness is undoubtedly the root cause. But there will be a motivating or influencing factor that put the knife in his hand that day. Now that could be anything from religious or political extremism to over consumption of violent forms of media. Mental illness is the root cause but there will be some other catalyst. In my opinion of course. We'll find out at as it progresses through the courts. The reason I responded is that I don't think your statement that just because the stabbings aren't considered terrorism throwing bricks or bottle can't either - that simply doesn't follow. Terrorism isn't defined in terms of the severity of the act - it is defined by purpose and intent. You might be right that a triggering factor in the stabbings case was terrorism related but at the moment that is pure speculation. Some people participating in the riots may well have been indulging in violence for other reasons but it's pretty much an established fact that some of the people involved were motivated by a far right political agenda. Poltically motivated attacks on mosques are acts of terror. |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 9:25:27 GMT
According to the person holding the camera their were only a 1000 viewing it. Then it gets posted all over the internet by the people who rightfully hate this kind of thing. You are literally spreading their propaganda. Swastika man is probably wanking himself into a frenzy over all the coverage he's getting. Spot on. For some bad attention is better than no attention. Once again though my point was sharing it on here isn't going to make it worse. It's already viral and seen by millions..i simply said not sharing it on here won't suddenly make him get any less attention. It's gone beyond that point. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 3, 2024 9:29:12 GMT
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Post by Foster on Aug 3, 2024 9:32:32 GMT
Spot on. For some bad attention is better than no attention. Once again though my point was sharing it on here isn't going to make it worse. It's already viral and seen by millions..i simply said not sharing it on here won't suddenly make him get any less attention. It's gone beyond that point. I think we can consider Henrys underlying point to be about 'people' in general that are opposed to the clips, but then share them everywhere, only make matters worse. |
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Post by elystokie on Aug 3, 2024 9:33:10 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Aug 3, 2024 9:34:52 GMT
Been smoking again mate?😉 |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 9:36:01 GMT
Once again though my point was sharing it on here isn't going to make it worse. It's already viral and seen by millions..i simply said not sharing it on here won't suddenly make him get any less attention. It's gone beyond that point. I think we can consider Henrys underlying point to be about 'people' in general that are opposed to the clips, but then share them everywhere, only make matters worse. Yeah I completely agree with that part if you're doing it on a platform with a huge reach. The original post of that on Twitter spread like wildfire. It went from just the clips of him, to finding his name and that he was from Stoke to finding pictures of his family and even an article saying how he lost his job as a lorry driver because he crashed. By the time I had clicked on "Stoke" to see why it was trending all that information was being shared by thousands on a place where millions could see it. Crazy |
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Post by stokiejoe89 on Aug 3, 2024 9:37:31 GMT
Not sure what that is but Munya was very funny on Taskmaster |
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