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Post by f1rew0rks on Mar 29, 2020 13:33:24 GMT
I'm all for alternative views and a sense of perspective, not sure a piece from the Mail gives either. I dont usually like the mail either, so maybe try this one? |
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Post by felonious on Mar 29, 2020 13:33:35 GMT
We got more out of being in the EU than we put in š If you don't count the Ā£66bn annual trade deficit It's an interesting concept funding other countries to compete with you, bringing cheap labour into the country to suppress wages and setting up factories in these subsidised poorer nations of Europe. |
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Mar 29, 2020 13:35:24 GMT
Is this a Coronavirus thread or Party political oneš¤
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 29, 2020 13:36:28 GMT
So 7,000ish more tests and only 2,000ish more positive. That seems down in the increase of positive cases from more tests? I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? |
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Mar 29, 2020 13:42:09 GMT
So 7,000ish more tests and only 2,000ish more positive. That seems down in the increase of positive cases from more tests? I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? The delayed rollout of NHS staff may have finally started. So they will now be counted in the figures: www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-52072568 |
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Post by Davef on Mar 29, 2020 13:42:11 GMT
So 7,000ish more tests and only 2,000ish more positive. That seems down in the increase of positive cases from more tests? I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? Aren't they contact tracing as well? So everyone who's admitted to hospital will have close family and friends tested as well? |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 29, 2020 13:43:31 GMT
I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? Aren't they contact tracing as well? So everyone who's admitted to hospital will have close family and friends tested as well? Are they Dave, when did that re-start? |
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Post by devondumpling on Mar 29, 2020 13:44:06 GMT
I dont want to pay more tax so yes, I'll be on cash work foreigners a lot after this, they are working us to the bone and bleeding us dry for our efforts allready, more so with the tax hikes and double N.I they will put in place after this has finished. Maybe though if we didnt send Ā£130 billion pounds out in the name of aid in the last ten years we wouldn't need to resort to draconian measures. Look how much we threw into the E.U, one of the biggest contributors, When this is over its slave britain, double tax and double N.I. We got more out of being in the EU than we put in š Your are talking rubbish, www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48256318 UK second biggest contributor after Germany? In 2018 the UK made an estimated gross contribution (after the rebate) of Ā£13.2 billion. The UK received Ā£4.3 billion of public sector receipts from the EU, so the UK's net public sector contribution to the EU was an estimated Ā£8.9 billion.24 Jun 2019 |
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Post by Clayton Wood on Mar 29, 2020 13:44:17 GMT
So 7,000ish more tests and only 2,000ish more positive. That seems down in the increase of positive cases from more tests? I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? Regardless of the testing, since the UK and Italy were level pegging on 233 deaths respectively (but 14 days apart): UK increase of 995 to 1,228, Italy 1,576 to 1,809. We could rocket past them any day soon of course, but testing anything with a pulse doesn't seem to be the panacea some think imo. |
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Post by devondumpling on Mar 29, 2020 13:45:04 GMT
Our Government only relaxed regulations and red tape on the manufacture and supply of PPE yesterday. Yesterday. And neither article actually has anything to do with whatās written in the one I posted. Theyāve said they can do it and have what they need. They just need the govt go ahead. No doubt there are, just waiting on the normal Civil Service lethargy. |
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Post by Davef on Mar 29, 2020 13:46:36 GMT
Aren't they contact tracing as well? So everyone who's admitted to hospital will have close family and friends tested as well? Are they Dave, when did that re-start? I'm just assuming that's happening Paul... |
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Mar 29, 2020 13:47:32 GMT
Are they Dave, when did that re-start? I'm just assuming that's happening Paul... We havenāt been contact tracing for a long time, and you can only get tested if you are in hospital or frontline NHS staff (which only started en masse on Friday) |
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 29, 2020 13:47:56 GMT
Did we really ? That depends on whether you believe there would be any increase trade without being members. Every study I saw said we got more out of it than we put in. Yes but my point is what is the basis for that, how is the trade determined as being due to us being in the EU and wouldn't happen regardless, I accept being in the EU made it easier to trade but not sure the get more out argument holds, a bit like the immigrants contribute more than they take out is an apples and oranges comparison although no doubt the vast majority of people come to work and make a better life for themselves. |
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Post by devondumpling on Mar 29, 2020 13:50:09 GMT
Is this a Coronavirus thread or Party political oneš¤ And the answer is? |
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Post by dutchstokie on Mar 29, 2020 13:52:35 GMT
There are plenty of people on this thread who deserve the lies and terror of this Government. 8 |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 29, 2020 13:52:58 GMT
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Post by Veritas on Mar 29, 2020 13:53:23 GMT
You could say that if you wanted to show an amazingly naive world view and complete misunderstanding of the consequences of the virus. You'd think other countries would be pissing it too if its just a matter of the uk not funding enough diversity coordinators, gender realignments and nhs art collections, it might just be me but all those countries seem to have even more draconian restrictions. Any talk of funding can be taken up afterwards but the idea that any amount spent would have been anything other than pissing in the wind in the face of a pandemic is crackers, the nhs england guy said the actions they have taken re staff, temp facilities, cancelling day to day ops has given them the equivalent of 50 new hospitals and that there is not a healthcare system in the world that could afford to keep 50 hospitals on standby with staff sitting around for a once in a generation event like this. As to whether it will bring about a change in attitude I imagine that will last as long as it takes for people having to put in more themselves and thats everyone none of the pretending someone else can pay for it all, I am happy to pay more in tax but I expect there to be better use made of the extra money and the current money, not everyone is though this very thread has had people saying if they dont get paid they will go out to work and if they dont get the help they think they should they would be doing cash in hand jobs, ring any bells ? I dont want to pay more tax so yes, I'll be on cash work foreigners a lot after this, they are working us to the bone and bleeding us dry for our efforts allready, more so with the tax hikes and double N.I they will put in place after this has finished. Maybe though if we didnt send Ā£130 billion pounds out in the name of aid in the last ten years we wouldn't need to resort to draconian measures. Look how much we threw into the E.U, one of the biggest contributors, When this is over its slave britain, double tax and double N.I. It is selfish individuals like you that give the self- employed a bad reputation, I don't suppose you will reduce your use of public services and facilities to make up for you stealing from the public purse. |
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Post by dutchstokie on Mar 29, 2020 13:56:09 GMT
Our Government only relaxed regulations and red tape on the manufacture and supply of PPE yesterday. Yesterday. 9 |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 29, 2020 13:56:29 GMT
There are plenty of people on this thread who deserve the lies and terror of this Government. 8 Cheers Bert  |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 29, 2020 13:58:02 GMT
Our Government only relaxed regulations and red tape on the manufacture and supply of PPE yesterday. Yesterday. 9 Thanks Ern  |
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Mar 29, 2020 14:01:49 GMT
Testing in of itself wonāt stop anything at this point. no one is saying it is, but the data from Korea, Germany etc show that extensive contact tracing and testing of mild cases has a huge role in establishing R0 values, allocation of resources, preparation etc and buying time. We missed the boat on it.
Now it is essential in as much as ensuring NHS staff are safe and when if comes through, the antibody test ensuring folks can get back to work.
Thereās a reason only 152 have died in Korea.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 29, 2020 14:03:26 GMT
So 7,000ish more tests and only 2,000ish more positive. That seems down in the increase of positive cases from more tests? I was just thinking the same thing mate. And they're only testing people in hospital, so 5,000 people are in hospital but they've tested negative? What are we missing here? Yeah thatās how I read it. Not sure tbh. And obviously it might mean sod all but it could be positive. And as someone else has put if you compare us like for like on that 14 day track with Italy weāre now about 400/500 deaths behind. All very rudimentary I know but hopefully it means we are spreading it out a bit. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2020 14:05:07 GMT
Are they Dave, when did that re-start? I'm just assuming that's happening Paul... That's what South Korea are doing. To great effect. |
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Post by MilanStokie on Mar 29, 2020 14:05:18 GMT
I think he's said that people are ignoring requests to stay indoors in Milan similar to a small proportion of the population over here. My daughter left Milan 4 weeks ago her office there closed down two days before this so the measures have been building up for some time before the last two weeks. I think from today's conference we're being led to believe that it will take 12 weeks from now to get on the downward spiral and we're 2 to 4 weeks behind Italy. If we're right Italy still has some way to reach it's peak  Unfortunately the peak prediction from a few weeks ago looks likely and possibly will be even later. It's not expected to slow down until around 4th April. That's new cases however, the deaths are likely to rise or stay high now until May. I would not be surprised to see this hit 10,000 before the end of March. That's 10,000 souls in approximately 5 weeks. As grim as it sounds, the data is highly predictable. I didn't expect 10,000 as early As it did. Those days of almost 1000 really hit hard. I posted this on 19th march. Just follow the data and you will see just how bad this gets for the UK. I think you will see similar numbers to Italy right now by 4th April. The graphs have been very useful tbh. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2020 14:06:27 GMT
Testing in of itself wonāt stop anything at this point. no one is saying it is, but the data from Korea, Germany etc show that extensive contact tracing and testing of mild cases has a huge role in establishing R0 values, allocation of resources, preparation etc and buying time. We missed the boat on it. Now it is essential in as much as ensuring NHS staff are safe and when if comes through, the antibody test ensuring folks can get back to work. Thereās a reason only 152 have died in Korea. How far off is the antibody test? |
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Mar 29, 2020 14:08:15 GMT
Testing in of itself wonāt stop anything at this point. no one is saying it is, but the data from Korea, Germany etc show that extensive contact tracing and testing of mild cases has a huge role in establishing R0 values, allocation of resources, preparation etc and buying time. We missed the boat on it. Now it is essential in as much as ensuring NHS staff are safe and when if comes through, the antibody test ensuring folks can get back to work. Thereās a reason only 152 have died in Korea. How far off is the antibody test? Iāve not heard anything since Whittyās update a couple of days ago. You might have heard talk of an āantigenā test but thatās another form of diagnosis (faster than traditional pcr) of a live case rather than immunity like the antibody test. So I assume itās still being validated, hopefully NHS staff start getting it in thenmext couple of weeks. We have 3.5 million ordered in though. |
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Post by Clayton Wood on Mar 29, 2020 14:18:12 GMT
How far off is the antibody test? Iāve not heard anything since Whittyās update a couple of days ago. You might have heard talk of an āantigenā test but thatās another form of diagnosis (faster than traditional pcr) of a live case rather than immunity like the antibody test. So I assume itās still being validated, hopefully NHS staff start getting it in thenmext couple of weeks. We have 3.5 million ordered in though. Back with some more lay-man's thoughts  If these 'underlying health conditions' have the effect of suppressing the natural immune system, is there any way that 'at risk' groups could have their immunity boosted? It wouldn't stop them catching it but may reduce the effects/mortality. I'd start charging by the response here mate  |
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Post by Gods on Mar 29, 2020 14:19:50 GMT
Testing in of itself wonāt stop anything at this point. no one is saying it is, but the data from Korea, Germany etc show that extensive contact tracing and testing of mild cases has a huge role in establishing R0 values, allocation of resources, preparation etc and buying time. We missed the boat on it. Now it is essential in as much as ensuring NHS staff are safe and when if comes through, the antibody test ensuring folks can get back to work. Thereās a reason only 152 have died in Korea. How far off is the antibody test? We bought 3.5 million of the antibody tests didn't we although I think the CMO said (rightly) the NHS want to do their own testing on them to make sure they work. No test being better than a test which can let you down. Not sure what we'll do with them if they don't work, flog them to a 3rd world country on a discount I suppose! Meantime the administration timing of this test seems fiendishly complex in the sense that it is only a few weeks after someone has recovered that the antibodies will show. Presumably that is why it is not a cheap and available substitute for the 'has someone got it' swab test. |
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Post by musik on Mar 29, 2020 14:24:26 GMT
the purpose of restrictions. This isn't because it will cure people or "kill" the virus. It's simply to play for time until a vaccine can be produced. Once a vaccine is found, then in years to come by use of the vaccine (and the fact millions will have been exposed and only have had mild/no symptoms) a herd immunity will be built up, rendering these strains far less dangerous to life. The common cold, smallpox, influenza, Spanish flu etc. were originally deadly and killed massive amounts until herd immunities were built. They have been now, hence us not needing to do this everytime the flu is around. The point is that if we don't follow these restrictiona now, many more unnecessary deaths will occur as due to the speed of the spread, the health service will crumble meaning many, many people that could have been treated and WOULD have survived will die because of lack of resources. It's almost as if all of this has been previously explained by many, many scientists out there already....yet you ignore it completely. Do you think it's normal for Italy and Spain to be wheeling out 1,000 dead people a day due to the same illness? Is it a yearly occurence for so many people of all ages without any health conditions at all to be rushed into intensive care for urgent treatment? No, the people that need urgent medical treatment for the flu each year are not spread out across such a wide age range and are also spread out more thinly in terms of timeframe and therefore medical infrastructures can cope far more easily and therefore save more people. It really isn't that hard to grasp Thank You! Very good explanation. I think I got it now. I'll be out in 18 months. šāļøš |
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Post by Clayton Wood on Mar 29, 2020 14:27:32 GMT
the purpose of restrictions. This isn't because it will cure people or "kill" the virus. It's simply to play for time until a vaccine can be produced. Once a vaccine is found, then in years to come by use of the vaccine (and the fact millions will have been exposed and only have had mild/no symptoms) a herd immunity will be built up, rendering these strains far less dangerous to life. The common cold, smallpox, influenza, Spanish flu etc. were originally deadly and killed massive amounts until herd immunities were built. They have been now, hence us not needing to do this everytime the flu is around. The point is that if we don't follow these restrictiona now, many more unnecessary deaths will occur as due to the speed of the spread, the health service will crumble meaning many, many people that could have been treated and WOULD have survived will die because of lack of resources. It's almost as if all of this has been previously explained by many, many scientists out there already....yet you ignore it completely. Do you think it's normal for Italy and Spain to be wheeling out 1,000 dead people a day due to the same illness? Is it a yearly occurence for so many people of all ages without any health conditions at all to be rushed into intensive care for urgent treatment? No, the people that need urgent medical treatment for the flu each year are not spread out across such a wide age range and are also spread out more thinly in terms of timeframe and therefore medical infrastructures can cope far more easily and therefore save more people. It really isn't that hard to grasp Thank You! Very good explanation. I think I got it now. I'll be out in 18 months. šāļøš Ah, here you are. Just thinking of you as I read this Lockdown, what lockdown? Sweden's unusual response to coronavirus |
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