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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Nov 1, 2018 13:32:59 GMT
I work in medical research with a vegan, we regularly do in vivo experiments on animals, she's perfectly reasonable and can reconcile not eating animals and using them as experimental models. There is a danger that the "militant vegan" trope is exaggerating just how many vegans are somewhat intolerably smug wankers. IMO there's no greater distribution of wankers among Vegans than any other population.
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Post by PotterLog on Nov 1, 2018 13:45:11 GMT
What do we do with all the animals if everyone turned into Veggies or Vegans? Stop manufacturing them?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2018 13:49:29 GMT
Why is it that normal restaurants always seem to offer a vegetarian/vegan option, yet vegetarian/vegan restaurants never offer a meat option? This. I'm also struggling to get pork in a halal restaurant nor a burger and shake in a kosher restaurant. Their restaurants never have urinals in the women toilets either. Do they have urinals in the Gender Neutrals toilet though? š
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Post by PotterLog on Nov 1, 2018 13:53:27 GMT
Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO.
History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals.
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Post by rickyfullerbeer on Nov 1, 2018 15:53:55 GMT
What do we do with all the animals if everyone turned into Veggies or Vegans? Stop mass-farming them?
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Post by metalhead on Nov 1, 2018 16:21:38 GMT
Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO. History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals. Totally agree. We treat them fucking reprehensibly. Some of the conditions the chickens are kept in are absolutely unacceptable. It's a disgrace and they continue to get away with it. You have to ask the questions as to why? The answers are so simple.
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Post by thevoid on Nov 1, 2018 17:52:19 GMT
His comments didn't 'sitwell' with some people.
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Post by felonious on Nov 2, 2018 18:17:36 GMT
Hmmm, yeah, not to burst your bubble here mate, but I posted about this in my 'General Activists' thread about a week ago. I have no problem with Vegans or Vegetarians living their life as they do, so long as they respect others to live theirs. I am also completely aware of the fact the meat industry is very cruel and is in desperate need of reform. Despite that, blocking a bunch of meat factory workers from getting into work is fucking despicable. How much do you think an operational employee in a meat processing factory makes? Minimum wage? A few quid more? So your modus operandi (or at least 'their modus operandi') is to prevent some of the lowest earners in society from making a days wage? Tell that to their kids eh. You know, just because they work in a meat factory, doesn't mean they agree with the principals or practices behind the work they do..... Most people work, for no other reason than the money. They don't take pride in it, they don't revel in it, they just want a wage and like a bunch of evil fucking despots, your mates think it's acceptable to take that away from them. Rather than targeting the cause of such animal cruelty, the guys at the top who are so rich they probably wrap Aston Martin's in sheepskin just to piss you off, you target the poorest in society in some vain attempt at publicity. What a bunch of morally empty maggots. Furthermore, not only was that protest unfair on the employees of that particular factory, it was also disingenuous.... Most animal cruelty doesn't take place in the processing factories where they deal with carcasses, rather than live animals. Any cruelty that has occurred, has been and gone. No doubt after blocking a bunch of low paid workers from earning a wage, sending them home without any pay, your mates headed round to their favourite artisan food shop to pick up an avocado salad and freshly baked bread, so they could sit at home and celebrate such a wonderful achievement. Maybe they'll get a job one day, but they'll have to cut off their dreadlocks first.... all when Tommy Trustfund's money runs out though, don't panic. Honestly mate, there's enough room in this world for vegans, vegetarians and meat eaters.... it seems only vegans have a problem with the rest. āā¦ your mates headed round to their favourite artisan food shop to pick up an avocado salad and freshly baked bread, so they could sit at home and celebrate such a wonderful achievement.ā Whoah, who said any of these people are/were my mates? You are making a huge leap to assume that just because I wrote something sympathetic to vegans, I must be one of them (which Iām not). And an absolutely ginormous leap to assume that anyone who is a vegan supports these dickhead āmilitant vegansā. Thatās akin to saying that if you like football you probably support hooligans, or if you sympathise with Palestinians, you must be a potential suicide bomber. Itās a stupid position for you to take, so wind your neck in a little bit, calm down, and stop putting one and one together and making five. For what itās worth, I agree with most of what you put in your post. There are militant extremist tossers in every part of society, but not everybody is one. And, in most cases, itās the extremists who damage the cause they appear to think they are fighting for. What can you do? And, finally, I donāt like āavocado saladā although my youngest daughter (who is a vegan) absolutely loves them!
As you said, ā there's enough room in this world for vegans, vegetarians and meat eaters....ā. Donāt tar them all with the same brush. It's time you sorted out that irresponsible daughter of yours
Bad news, avocado fans.
Not only is your favourite breakfast component preventing you from getting on the housing ladder, it is also bad for the environment.
The Water Footprint Network, which campaigns for more efficient water use, calculated that it took around 272 litres of water to grow a single avocado - with a potentially devastating effect on regions where it is grown.
In 2011, an investigation by the Chilean water authority found at least 65 examples of avocado farms illegally diverting rivers and other water sources to their plantations.
That, in turn, was blamed for causing droughts, forcing local villagers to choose between drinking and washing.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-46070037
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Post by felonious on Nov 2, 2018 18:23:45 GMT
Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO. History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals. Totally agree. We treat them fucking reprehensibly. Some of the conditions the chickens are kept in are absolutely unacceptable. It's a disgrace and they continue to get away with it. You have to ask the questions as to why? The answers are so simple. Let's hope that animal husbandry comes up to UK standards when we leave the EU.
www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/feb/16/meat-imports-animal-welfare-standards
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Nov 27, 2018 12:28:13 GMT
Vegan's at it again. ... Love the responce they got
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Post by yeokel on Nov 27, 2018 12:38:57 GMT
Vegan's at it again. ... Love the responce they got There is no ponce in response, even in Brighton
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Post by felonious on Nov 27, 2018 13:03:45 GMT
Mr Sitwell was on the One Show last night in a vegan restaurant having a polite discussion with the lady vegan who outed him. They've both received death threats and threats against the family apparently.
One throwaway tongue in cheek comment to a humourless vegan and your career is in tatters.
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Post by lawrieleslie on Nov 27, 2018 13:17:24 GMT
Probably threw the baby out with the bathwater, apologies. The reason I chomped was because that whole "Bloody Vegans, all they want is to try live on a healthier planet" kind of shit has been trotted out for years. Yeah, perhaps they do, but maybe we should change that to "Blood Vegans, all they want to do is make thousands if low paid workers unemployed so they have to feed their children on flakes of congealed dust". Doesn't have such a nice ring to it, does it? I have very little time for people who are happy to harm the innocent in pursuit of their cause, whether it be animal rights, brexit, BLM, whatever. No cause is so high and mighty that it should harm people like that. I'm aware of the irony there, animals are innocent too and are harmed by a cruel industry. However, we also spent thousands of years slaughtering animals for nutrition. If Vegans only had a problem with the barbaric meat industry, that would be fine, but like most lunatic causes, they want to basically ban food involving animals altogether. Can you even eat eggs, if you're a Vegan? Not for me mate.... and I actually do eat vegetarian food quite a lot. ā Can you even eat eggs, if you're a Vegan?ā I think that vegans do not eat eggs or things that contain egg. I appreciate that it is a debatable point whether an unfertilised egg could be considered vegan, or at least vegetarian, however since most eggs are produced on battery farms I think eggs would fail the āanimal welfare testā for most vegans. (To my mind, battery farmed eggs should fail the āanimal welfare testā for all of us, but thatās a debate for another day) āā¦ and I actually do eat vegetarian food quite a lot.ā So do I. I have a vegan friend and he goes to such extremes that even beer fined with animal derived fining agent is off limits. He only knows one brand that is fined using vegetable agent and he sticks to that. No way am I having a go because itās what he believes in and neither does he try and preach veganism to his friends. Live and let live.
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Post by metalhead on Nov 27, 2018 14:58:49 GMT
Vegan's at it again. ... Love the responce they got Absolute cretins.... absolutely missing the point which is their modus operandi. Vegan pussies once again try and damage a business full of minimum wage workers and people that don't give a shit about their cause. Bunch of absolute fucking tits. Fantastic work by the stag do to utterly humiliate a bunch of absolute pussies. I love how near the end, some red haired nutter walks out screaming "BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" as if the people in the restaurant are somehow in the wrong? Go get a job hun, earn some money and then you might have some legitimacy to your lifestyle.... Mind you, with hair like that, she'll be lucky to get a job serving dead cows to ingrates in McDonald's or Burger King. Then the daft China doll looking lass at the end video recording on her phone.... exactly what are you going to do hun? Shame a bunch of lads for doing something entirely legal? Honestly, they don't give a fuck. They (and I) just want you to fuck off. There's a time and a place, and for some reason, Vegans overwhelmingly just don't get it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2018 15:10:49 GMT
Why is it that normal restaurants always seem to offer a vegetarian/vegan option, yet vegetarian/vegan restaurants never offer a meat option? "RAWR" in hanley do chicken options and its fucking mint!
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Post by yeokel on Nov 27, 2018 16:46:17 GMT
Why is it that normal restaurants always seem to offer a vegetarian/vegan option, yet vegetarian/vegan restaurants never offer a meat option? I think there is a bit of a clue in their title why that might be. Our local chinese doesn't Spanish Tapas. I've never seen a T-Bone steak in a fish resteraunt either, come to think of it and try as I might, I can't get our local Indian to stock Oatcakes! But luckily, we have a local restaurant which doesn't specialise in any specific type of food, so you can get meat, fish, veggie, pizza, pasta and even salad among other things. You could think of them as a "normal restaurant " as opposed to a specialist one. Vegan's at it again. ... Love the responce they got Absolute cretins.... absolutely missing the point which is their modus operandi. Vegan pussies once again try and damage a business full of minimum wage workers and people that don't give a shit about their cause. Bunch of absolute fucking tits. There's a time and a place, and for some reason, Vegans overwhelmingly just don't get it.Really? I think most vegans are fairly quiet unassuming folks, just like everyone else aren't they? But in every group or type, there is always a small, loud mouthed minority to ruin things or go over the top to try to make a point.
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Post by metalhead on Nov 27, 2018 17:28:48 GMT
Absolute cretins.... absolutely missing the point which is their modus operandi. Vegan pussies once again try and damage a business full of minimum wage workers and people that don't give a shit about their cause. Bunch of absolute fucking tits. There's a time and a place, and for some reason, Vegans overwhelmingly just don't get it.Really? I think most vegans are fairly quiet unassuming folks, just like everyone else aren't they? But in every group or type, there is always a small, loud mouthed minority to ruin things or go over the top to try to make a point. I'll bite. Find me the Vegetarians stopping the meat factory workers from doing their job? Find me the Vegetarians stopping the waiters from doing their job? Their actions aren't remotely harming the industry they claim to hate. Their actions CONSISTENTLY harm the innocent. You think the 19 year old waiter getting paid a few pence over the minimum wage is the problem behind the cruel meat industry? Clearly not. He's just trying to do his fucking job. These militant Vegans are the kind of self-entitled champagne socialist perpetual victims that see absolutely nothing wrong with putting someone in poverty out of work, if it makes them feel good. Fucking shameful if you ask me.
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Post by yeokel on Nov 27, 2018 17:33:19 GMT
I agree with all of that, itās just that you seem to be tarring them all with the same brush.
Most are peaceful, normal people as far as I know yet you write āVegans overwhelmingly just don't get itā which simply isnāt true.
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Post by thevoid on Nov 27, 2018 18:31:18 GMT
Vegan's at it again. ... Love the responce they got If any vegan twat tried a stunt like that when I was in a steakhouse I'd just order more meat.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Nov 27, 2018 19:50:00 GMT
Are the Welsh included in this, nothing personal you understand. Much too fond of sheep to be vegans. I find that quite offensive. My late father was Welsh, and he never shagged sheep. In fairness, he was slow on his feet and asthmatic, though.
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Post by FbrgVaStkFan on Nov 27, 2018 20:23:09 GMT
I wish I were a marathon runner so I could tell those vegans about it.
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Post by maninasuitcase on Nov 27, 2018 21:51:37 GMT
What gets me is how vegan food is made to look like it's meat equivalent.
Can't they be more imaginative and think of their own design.
Let's face it most of it looks and tastes like plasticine, and plasticine can be made into many shapes.
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Post by felonious on Nov 28, 2018 6:41:46 GMT
I wish I were a marathon runner so I could tell those vegans about it. There's nothing stopping you.
www.veganrunners.org.uk/
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Post by wagsastokie on Nov 28, 2018 10:22:03 GMT
Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO. History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals. I donāt take veganism as a personal affront can you say that vegans donāt take my meat eating as a personal affront And I can assure you as a meat eater I find not a single thing that makes me feel uncomfortable about my lifestyle choice acept maybe it could be cheaper I know many meat eaters and the one thing they have never said is they feel guilty
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Post by metalhead on Nov 28, 2018 11:15:00 GMT
I agree with all of that, itās just that you seem to be tarring them all with the same brush. Most are peaceful, normal people as far as I know yet you write āVegans overwhelmingly just don't get itā which simply isnāt true. There definitely seems to be a certain smugness behind Veganism though, that doesn't apply to Vegetarianism or Pescetarianism. There's rarely smoke without fire and there is a reason why people are getting pissed off with Vegans. Whether it's that knobhead in work who can't stop moaning about the fact his workmates eat meat, or whether it's some blue haired nutter in the street screaming obscenities at you, it honestly doesn't matter. Veganism is a LIFE CHOICE. So is eating meat. I am not committing a crime by smashing a bucket of KFC whatsoever and I shouldn't be made to feel shit for doing so, especially by a bunch of mostly bratty trustfund tosspots. Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO. History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals. I donāt take veganism as a personal affront can you say that vegans donāt take my meat eating as a personal affront And I can assure you as a meat eater I find not a single thing that makes me feel uncomfortable about my lifestyle choice acept maybe it could be cheaper I know many meat eaters and the one thing they have never said is they feel guilty You've taken PotterLog's comment slightly out of context, I think. I feel no guilt for eating meat, whatsoever.... However I am also fully aware of the cruelty behind the meat industry and no, I don't like it; I don't like it one bit. I would much rather know that the meat you buy, even the cheap stuff, has been humanely and respectfully slaughtered. Ultimately, you only have to look at the numbers and the facts to see exactly why factory farming and the meat industry in general, operates the way it does. Heavy competition (unquestionably from imported meat) has forced the various British meat pipelines, right down to the farmers who work with the livestock, to run their operations down to a price. Cutting costs is absolutely vital, because the meat needs to be sold as cheaply as possible to the consumer. This isn't about Supermarkets trying to cut costs, that's just one part of it. It is also about ensuring that not only the most affluent are able to afford meat. The poorest in this country are only getting poorer, yet they still need to eat and they would quite like to eat some meat occasionally. If it was up to some of these affluent Vegan's, they'd have the poorest in society go hungry.
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Post by metalhead on Nov 28, 2018 12:59:34 GMT
I agree with all of that, itās just that you seem to be tarring them all with the same brush. Most are peaceful, normal people as far as I know yet you write āVegans overwhelmingly just don't get itā which simply isnāt true. Just to backup my point about the overwhelming smugness radiating from the Vegan community, one thing I've been considering for a good 3-6 months now is pescetarianism... aka vegetarianism but also eats fish. Found this link which aims to compare all three veganproducts.org/vegan-vs-vegetarian/Was reading it, with an open mind...... this paragraph sums up Vegans for me though: LOL! Just LOL. Smug alert.
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Post by yeokel on Nov 28, 2018 14:20:04 GMT
I'm beginning to get a feeling that you're not too keen on Vegans.
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Post by metalhead on Nov 28, 2018 15:34:31 GMT
I'm beginning to get a feeling that you're not too keen on Vegans. I have no problem with Vegans who (as you describe) just want to get on with their lives. I have a problem with anyone who think their cause is just enough that it should crash down on some of the weakest in society. I have much the same feelings for BLM, who blocked people getting to work for their protest. Again, the people at the top didn't give a fuck.... while you've got people on 18k a year getting sent home without pay because middle class BLM nutters think it is acceptable to stop them getting to work. It is okay to have a moral or political viewpoint. It is never okay to essentially infringe other peoples human rights, in an attempt to get your point across. Do I hate Vegans? No. Do I hate Veganism? No. Do I think there's a problem with smugness among Vegans? Kind of. Do I think it's acceptable to stop people doing their job? No. At a push, I would turn a blind eye to them doorstepping some multi-billionaire CEO to get their point across.... but not some operational employee mate.
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Post by PotterLog on Nov 28, 2018 16:42:17 GMT
Much of the reason that people take veganism as such a personal affront is because the ethical argument for abstaining from animal products is pretty incontrovertible, and it makes people feel uncomfortable about their own lifestyle choices. IMO. History will not judge our civilisation kindly when it comes to the way we treat animals. I donāt take veganism as a personal affront can you say that vegans donāt take my meat eating as a personal affront And I can assure you as a meat eater I find not a single thing that makes me feel uncomfortable about my lifestyle choice acept maybe it could be cheaper I know many meat eaters and the one thing they have never said is they feel guilty If your conscience is clear thatās fine. I didnāt say the unease about it affected everyone. But try being veggie or vegan for like a day, you will find that people very much take it personally.
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Post by wagsastokie on Nov 28, 2018 16:50:36 GMT
I donāt take veganism as a personal affront can you say that vegans donāt take my meat eating as a personal affront And I can assure you as a meat eater I find not a single thing that makes me feel uncomfortable about my lifestyle choice acept maybe it could be cheaper I know many meat eaters and the one thing they have never said is they feel guilty If your conscience is clear thatās fine. I didnāt say the unease about it affected everyone. But try being veggie or vegan for like a day, you will find that people very much take it personally. One of my sons has been veggie for about 6 years we can happily co exist and he is perfectly happy to cook me a bacon sandwich It is not what someone chooses to eat that is the problem Itās the person that chooses that causes the problem
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