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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 28, 2023 15:34:48 GMT
It is why regulations on big business are essential (as well as fair taxation of shareholders and wealth holders). Consumer rights, employee rights, health and safety regulations and product standards are critical. Otherwise the big businesses just do whatever they want and we have a race to the bottom of standards and conditions as they hold all the power and smaller businesses cannot compete. It is one of the reasons leaving the EU was such a grave error as nowhere else on earth regulates big business like within the EU. It doesnβt go far enough but there is no way our government will go further by themselves. Mistake to mention the EU where poverty and inequality is on the increase. www.wsws.org/en/articles/2023/03/20/phai-m20.htmlAs any true socialist knows the EU is in the grip of capitalism with 10,000s of corporate lobbyists in Brussels. www.alter-eu.org/corporate-capture-in-europe-when-big-business-dominates-policy-making-and-threatens-our-rightAnd you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 28, 2023 15:40:06 GMT
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 28, 2023 15:59:30 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries.
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Post by gawa on Nov 28, 2023 16:20:58 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries. Do alot of our proposed laws not need to get voted in and approved by a load of unelected Lords though such as the unelected foreign secretary of the governing party? So if our elected government voted to abolish the monarchy and the Lords voted against it. It wouldn't become law?
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 28, 2023 16:32:48 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries. This Country was corrupt enough pre-brexit, it is now so much worse, thanks to Brexit.
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Post by phileetin on Nov 28, 2023 16:47:18 GMT
yeah , tony blair and his family are rolling in it .
pissed off to usa after they f**ked up this country.
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Post by wannabee on Nov 28, 2023 16:56:36 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries. Arguably North Korea is the only Country in the World that has pure Sovereignty The type you describe is a Paper Sovereignty The Brexit was in the definition of having absolute physical control of borders, laws and money, rather than effective control of the things that will protect Britainβs National interests. In reality Brexit delivers less Sovereignty than more, certainly as it pertains to EU if UK wants to continue with 50% of its Trade. Previously UK had a seat at the table to influence rules of trade. Now it has been reduced to being a Rule Taker if it wants to continue (I could have used the Tent analogy) Trading across borders means regulating across borders, and the more you want to trade, the more regulation you need. This is equally true for Services as well as goods. Post Brexit UK Government has no influence in the Regulation of Data GDPR or AI which the EU is currently enacting and is completely contrary to UK Government thinking. If UK Firms wish to sell into EU they must follow EU Law. This I contend is giving away Sovereignty due to lack of having a voice. Since Brexit small attempts have been made to diverge from EU Standards and Laws which have floundered and been abandoned through Industry Resistance as it would duplicate regulations and add cost. The UK on its own is not big enough to influence most other Trading Blocks or Countries In Canada and Australian Free Trade Agreement there is a clause where Foreign Corporations can sue the UK Government if the UK Government passes Legislation which is detrimental to their business. This is conducted in an Secret International Court who decide compensation, if any. How does this square with your definition of Sovereignty? What was misunderstood in the Brexit debate is the difference between pooling Sovereignty where you have an influence in the decision making and what is in the National Interest UK within the EU always had influence, in many cases a Veto on decisions. It could have requested a derogation and did if it supported but didn't want to follow some rules. If UK fundamentally disagreed with an EU decision which is unlikely due to having a Veto it always had the option of withdrawing without the Article 50 Rigmarole
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Nov 28, 2023 17:41:25 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries. We could have taxed the rich more, got rid of tbe monarchy, adopted PR or abolished the HOL without leaving the EU.
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Post by oggyoggy on Nov 28, 2023 17:41:51 GMT
And you should be painfully aware the same is happening in Post - Brexit Britain. True, But, We have restored the sovereignty of parliament and the British people can elect the government of their choice. We can elect a government to tax the rich a lot more, or adopt PR, or abolish the monarchy and HoL, or even rejoin the EU. Let the debate continue. It's usually me that engages in whataboutery, pointing out things are worse in other countries. And which of those things you just mentioned werenβt available to us as a member of the EU? The only one in question is the sovereignty of our parliament. Have a look at what has happened with the rwanda policy. We need to leave every international treaty to achieve absolute sovereignty. Every single one.
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Post by oggyoggy on Nov 28, 2023 17:43:16 GMT
yeah , tony blair and his family are rolling in it . pissed off to usa after they f**ked up this country. If he fucked up this country, how would you describe what the tories have done considering absolutely every public service is now worse than it was when they took over from labour, and we all pay much more tax and have less disposable income.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 28, 2023 18:05:41 GMT
It is why regulations on big business are essential (as well as fair taxation of shareholders and wealth holders). Consumer rights, employee rights, health and safety regulations and product standards are critical. Otherwise the big businesses just do whatever they want and we have a race to the bottom of standards and conditions as they hold all the power and smaller businesses cannot compete. It is one of the reasons leaving the EU was such a grave error as nowhere else on earth regulates big business like within the EU. It doesnβt go far enough but there is no way our government will go further by themselves. Mistake to mention the EU where poverty and inequality is on the increase. www.wsws.org/en/articles/2023/03/20/phai-m20.htmlAs any true socialist knows the EU is in the grip of capitalism with 10,000s of corporate lobbyists in Brussels. www.alter-eu.org/corporate-capture-in-europe-when-big-business-dominates-policy-making-and-threatens-our-rightThat's not like you, Coke, you failed to mention a few things: first, that article is about Germany, whereas you, rather disingenuously, indicated that it was about poverty on the increase in the EU. Second, you neglected to mention that the increase in poverty in Germany was down to the pandemic and inflation, which is doubly odd since these were your go-to excuses for explaining away Brexit impacts! I'm not sure anyone, other than a few dyed in the wool Brexiteers!, has ever claimed the EU to be some kind of "socialist paradise"! Everyone knows competition is a fundamental requirement of many of its policies. What it does do, rightly so imo, is use the proceeds of the profits that arise from the relative successes of free market embracing countries and redistribute them to less developed countries. From those according to their ability to those according to their need. One might almost call it the Christian thing to do.
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Post by oggyoggy on Nov 28, 2023 18:19:39 GMT
That's not like you, Coke, you failed to mention a few things: first, that article is about Germany, whereas you, rather disingenuously, indicated that it was about poverty on the increase in the EU. Second, you neglected to mention that the increase in poverty in Germany was down to the pandemic and inflation, which is doubly odd since these were your go-to excuses for explaining away Brexit impacts! I'm not sure anyone, other than a few dyed in the wool Brexiteers!, has ever claimed the EU to be some kind of "socialist paradise"! Everyone knows competition is a fundamental requirement of many of its policies. What it does do, rightly so imo, is use the proceeds of the profits that arise from the relative successes of free market embracing countries and redistribute them to less developed countries. From those according to their ability to those according to their need. One might almost call it the Christian thing to do. You could call it taxing the rich to give to the needy. You can see why Mr Coke opposes me when I suggest doing the same in this country. He says if we ask the rich to pay as much tax as the poor the rich will leave. The rich nations (net contributors) have not left the EU though on the whole. And the one that did (us) did so because of xenophobia and controlling immigration and a notion of sovereignty that never existed (and certainly doesnβt now - see our Rwanda policy).
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Post by Miles Offside on Nov 28, 2023 18:23:31 GMT
This government has indeed been an incompetent shambles for much of the time it's been in office. And for the first time in a long time Labour have finally got a leader and shadow chancellor that won't scare the voters off (even though one sounds like a Dalek and the other a speaking clock).
That said, Starmer's done an about-turn on several major issues and Reeves doesn't look like she'll diverge radically from current government economic policies.
What will likely get Labour elected next year is that they're fresh faces. But what could lead to a hung parliament (or an even bigger surprise result) is the spotlight going on those in the Labour background. Starmer and Reeves wouldn't look out of place in the Lib Dems, or even as pink Tories, while there's plenty in the party who'd love to see a Corbinyte at the helm.
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 28, 2023 19:09:56 GMT
That's not like you, Coke, you failed to mention a few things: first, that article is about Germany, whereas you, rather disingenuously, indicated that it was about poverty on the increase in the EU. Second, you neglected to mention that the increase in poverty in Germany was down to the pandemic and inflation, which is doubly odd since these were your go-to excuses for explaining away Brexit impacts! I'm not sure anyone, other than a few dyed in the wool Brexiteers!, has ever claimed the EU to be some kind of "socialist paradise"! Everyone knows competition is a fundamental requirement of many of its policies. What it does do, rightly so imo, is use the proceeds of the profits that arise from the relative successes of free market embracing countries and redistribute them to less developed countries. From those according to their ability to those according to their need. One might almost call it the Christian thing to do. 1. I picked Germany as it is largest and richest EU country. 2. As for the rest and pre pandemic: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8998029/This shows that from 2010 to 2019 east European countries generally improved, whilst West European generally deteriorated, with exceptions in both cases. The most notable exception was Poland which has had billions of aid poured in by the EU, a lot at British tax payers expense. You make reference to my Christian faith and I'd prefer the money was spent on the NHS, or Stoke on Trentham, or Middlesbrough rather than going into East European oligarchs pockets. www.nytimes.com/2019/11/03/world/europe/eu-farm-subsidy-hungary.htmlThe EU idea of competition is to build a customs barrier plus loads of red tape, quotas, etc to protect the EU corporate interests from competition. Worst of all in the CAP which the UK is now slowly dismantling.
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Post by henry on Nov 28, 2023 19:29:10 GMT
Did you need someone in government to tell you that ? You'll be telling me next the country spunked half a billion quid on not needed ventilators.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 6:30:56 GMT
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Post by knype on Nov 29, 2023 6:44:50 GMT
Wow...
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Post by satoshi on Nov 29, 2023 7:20:39 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 7:24:46 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 7:30:13 GMT
Wow... What's so funny?
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Post by knype on Nov 29, 2023 7:43:57 GMT
Wow... What's so funny? Your post, obsessed. I can imagine you spitting your earl grey everywhere
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Post by satoshi on Nov 29, 2023 7:52:37 GMT
πππππππ
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 8:30:09 GMT
Your post, obsessed. I can imagine you spitting your earl grey everywhere You ok with hunting then mate? If "obsessed" is being appalled and wanting an end to defenceless animals being ripped to pieces by dogs, then yes, I'm "obsessed"
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 8:30:55 GMT
πππππππ Congratulations, crapping on the memory of over 200,000 people dead.
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Post by elystokie on Nov 29, 2023 8:32:09 GMT
Funnily enough there was a consultant on Radio Stoke from the local hospital recently saying how 6 or 7 people were dying every day from COVID during the lockdowns. Quite the scam if they managed to get that many people to volunteer to be 'offed'..
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Post by satoshi on Nov 29, 2023 9:03:51 GMT
Funnily enough there was a consultant on Radio Stoke from the local hospital recently saying how 6 or 7 people were dying every day from COVID during the lockdowns. Quite the scam if they managed to get that many people to volunteer to be 'offed'.. It was with covid. Within 28 days of a positive test to be precise. Anyway letβs not let facts gloss over another wet huddy meltdown.
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Post by satoshi on Nov 29, 2023 9:07:17 GMT
πππππππ Congratulations, crapping on the memory of over 200,000 people dead. You donβt believe anything the conservatives say but you believe everything their experts said regarding covid? Do you believe that Boris had covid? Give your head a wobble mate please.
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Post by elystokie on Nov 29, 2023 9:11:10 GMT
Funnily enough there was a consultant on Radio Stoke from the local hospital recently saying how 6 or 7 people were dying every day from COVID during the lockdowns. Quite the scam if they managed to get that many people to volunteer to be 'offed'.. It was with covid. Within 28 days of a positive test to be precise. Anyway letβs not let facts gloss over another wet huddy meltdown.Β I'll carry on believing a hospital consultant thanks all the same.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Nov 29, 2023 9:13:33 GMT
Congratulations, crapping on the memory of over 200,000 people dead. You donβt believe anything the conservatives say but you believe everything their experts said regarding covid? Do you believe that Boris had covid? Give your head a wobble mate please. No, I believe the vast majority of scientists across the wolrld. Keep you conspioracy theories to the Covid thread mate.
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Post by satoshi on Nov 29, 2023 9:19:43 GMT
It was with covid. Within 28 days of a positive test to be precise. Anyway letβs not let facts gloss over another wet huddy meltdown. I'll carry on believing a hospital consultant thanks all the same. It was always with covid not of covid. That was the entire narrative. It was plastered everywhere.
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