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Post by wagsastokie on Jul 3, 2017 19:28:55 GMT
hope that helps LL  i'm not a shouty leftist . Of course all opinion apart from your figures for 1980s unemployment are not true, the highest unemployment was in 1984 with (agreed an unacceptable) 3.2m. However this was a result of the priority to drive down inflation which was running at 25% when Margret Thatcher came to power. This was ruining the economy and had to be dealt with by increasing interest rates and curbing public spending which drove us into recession and high unemployment. But not 6m. By the time Thatcher was ousted unemployment was down to 2m and inflation was in single figures. The problems of the 1970s was never going to be an easy fix which ever way you look at it but it was caused by oil shortage of 1974 and a combination of poor government administration from both Conservative and Labour combined with egotistical union power. Scargill, Red Robbo and TUC leader Len Murray to name a few. One shudders at what would have happened had the likes of scargill wielded more outrageous demands on the employers. What has split the country is the ungrateful educated young who selfishly voted remain For their own benefit and refuse to accept democracy |
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 3, 2017 19:41:18 GMT
hope that helps LL i'm not a shouty leftist . Of course all opinion apart from your figures for 1980s unemployment are not true, the highest unemployment was in 1984 with (agreed an unacceptable) 3.2m. However this was a result of the priority to drive down inflation which was running at 25% when Margret Thatcher came to power. This was ruining the economy and had to be dealt with by increasing interest rates and curbing public spending which drove us into recession and high unemployment. But not 6m. By the time Thatcher was ousted unemployment was down to 2m and inflation was in single figures. The problems of the 1970s was never going to be an easy fix which ever way you look at it but it was caused by oil shortage of 1974 and a combination of poor government administration from both Conservative and Labour combined with egotistical union power. Scargill, Red Robbo and TUC leader Len Murray to name a few. One shudders at what would have happened had the likes of scargill wielded more outrageous demands on the employers. It's 20yrs since Ok Computer, "Karma Police, arrest this man, he talks in Maths & buzzies like a bad refrigerator" |
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Post by lawrieleslie on Jul 4, 2017 6:09:11 GMT
Of course all opinion apart from your figures for 1980s unemployment are not true, the highest unemployment was in 1984 with (agreed an unacceptable) 3.2m. However this was a result of the priority to drive down inflation which was running at 25% when Margret Thatcher came to power. This was ruining the economy and had to be dealt with by increasing interest rates and curbing public spending which drove us into recession and high unemployment. But not 6m. By the time Thatcher was ousted unemployment was down to 2m and inflation was in single figures. The problems of the 1970s was never going to be an easy fix which ever way you look at it but it was caused by oil shortage of 1974 and a combination of poor government administration from both Conservative and Labour combined with egotistical union power. Scargill, Red Robbo and TUC leader Len Murray to name a few. One shudders at what would have happened had the likes of scargill wielded more outrageous demands on the employers. Nah , sorry that's not accurate . It's like a tabloid view of British political history .... nice try but i'm not having it mate .  It's common knowledge that those statistics were fudged and adjusted to portray less hardline figures . Most serious political commentators knew the numbers were over 6 million , even at the time . I was there .... i left school there were no jobs , none . Everyone I knew was unemployed . In Stoke yes jobs weren't there, my father was made redundant from the pottery industry. But you can't paint a picture of the whole of UK with the plight of Stoke. I prefer to believe official figures rather than anecdotal heresay and opinion from "political commentators". Whatever suits your agenda I guess |
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Post by rat on Jul 4, 2017 6:24:21 GMT
Nah , sorry that's not accurate . It's like a tabloid view of British political history .... nice try but i'm not having it mate . It's common knowledge that those statistics were fudged and adjusted to portray less hardline figures . Most serious political commentators knew the numbers were over 6 million , even at the time . I was there .... i left school there were no jobs , none . Everyone I knew was unemployed . In Stoke yes jobs weren't there, my father was made redundant from the pottery industry. But you can't paint a picture of the whole of UK with the plight of Stoke. I prefer to believe official figures rather than anecdotal heresay and opinion from "political commentators". Whatever suits your agenda I guess Oh come on LL .... It's a widely accepted fact that the Tory's manipulated these figures down , besides ...... even the official figures are a disgrace . I have no agenda , I have a political opinion ..... and I haven't always been a Labour supporter . As you know , in life we have certain choices to make , and I don't think for a minute that the Tories represent the interests of the majority of the people in this country . How is that an agenda ? It's my choice ..... and it's also an opinion that is growing amongst younger people and older people that can read between the lines . |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 8:23:30 GMT
Of course all opinion apart from your figures for 1980s unemployment are not true, the highest unemployment was in 1984 with (agreed an unacceptable) 3.2m. However this was a result of the priority to drive down inflation which was running at 25% when Margret Thatcher came to power. This was ruining the economy and had to be dealt with by increasing interest rates and curbing public spending which drove us into recession and high unemployment. But not 6m. By the time Thatcher was ousted unemployment was down to 2m and inflation was in single figures. The problems of the 1970s was never going to be an easy fix which ever way you look at it but it was caused by oil shortage of 1974 and a combination of poor government administration from both Conservative and Labour combined with egotistical union power. Scargill, Red Robbo and TUC leader Len Murray to name a few. One shudders at what would have happened had the likes of scargill wielded more outrageous demands on the employers. What has split the country is the ungrateful educated young who selfishly voted remain For their own benefit and refuse to accept democracy That and they fell for the bullshit bribes to them and their parents |
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Post by harryburrows on Jul 4, 2017 8:33:46 GMT
What has split the country is the ungrateful educated young who selfishly voted remain For their own benefit and refuse to accept democracy That and they fell for the bullshit bribes to them and their parents Well mate call it a bullshit bribe if you like but it was bang on the money . Labour also realised the importance of social media and how to get the message out to younger voters . The sun and express are preaching to the converted and are fast becoming irrelevant in the great scheme of things |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 8:50:31 GMT
That and they fell for the bullshit bribes to them and their parents Well mate call it a bullshit bribe if you like but it was bang on the money . Labour also realised the importance of social media and how to get the message out to younger voters . The sun and express are preaching to the converted and are fast becoming irrelevant in the great scheme of things Agree, the Social media that's been done and proven by farage and ukip in previous years still doesn't make it less of a bribe whichever way they chose to connect.....if they believe that the rich will be the ones that pay for their university education etc, they are very naive indeed. |
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Post by rat on Jul 4, 2017 8:57:40 GMT
Well mate call it a bullshit bribe if you like but it was bang on the money . Labour also realised the importance of social media and how to get the message out to younger voters . The sun and express are preaching to the converted and are fast becoming irrelevant in the great scheme of things Agree, the Social media that's been done and proven by farage and ukip in previous years still doesn't make it less of a bribe whichever way they chose to connect.....if they believe that the rich will be the ones that pay for their university education etc, they are very naive indeed. I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 9:12:12 GMT
Agree, the Social media that's been done and proven by farage and ukip in previous years still doesn't make it less of a bribe whichever way they chose to connect.....if they believe that the rich will be the ones that pay for their university education etc, they are very naive indeed. I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? My lad is at uni right now with the same debt i would love him to have it for free, but that's not my message anyone who believes that corbyn can deliver that lot are very naive Even if he pulled it off.... "the rich will pay for it" the same rich that employ the masses and basically run the world? wonder where they'll claw it back from ? |
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Post by rat on Jul 4, 2017 9:19:17 GMT
I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? My lad is at uni right now with the same debt i would love him to have it for free, but that's not my message anyone who believes that corbyn can deliver that lot are very naive Even if he pulled it off.... "the rich will pay for it" the same rich that employ the masses and basically run the world? wonder where they'll claw it back from ? So where is the basis for your economic argument ? Mary , if you can prove to me that Jeremy is talking nonsense then i'll gladly take it on board ...... but there are £billions in unpaid taxes lying offshore and £billions exempted onshore by the Tories for their pals .... Uni fees are minute beer in the grand scheme of things . John McDonnell is a strict parliamentarian like no other , you can take it from me , if he says the money is there , you can put your house on it . Please ... let's hear the economic argument for your position . |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 9:52:13 GMT
My lad is at uni right now with the same debt i would love him to have it for free, but that's not my message anyone who believes that corbyn can deliver that lot are very naive Even if he pulled it off.... "the rich will pay for it" the same rich that employ the masses and basically run the world? wonder where they'll claw it back from ? So where is the basis for your economic argument ? Mary , if you can prove to me that Jeremy is talking nonsense then i'll gladly take it on board ...... but there are £billions in unpaid taxes lying offshore and £billions exempted onshore by the Tories for their pals .... Uni fees are minute beer in the grand scheme of things . John McDonnell is a strict parliamentarian like no other , you can take it from me , if he says the money is there , you can put your house on it . Please ... let's hear the economic argument for your position . The basis of my argument is that his spending policies, in my opion, will bankrupt the country. and im not in the slightest bit interested in you taking my thoughts onboard. |
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Post by rat on Jul 4, 2017 9:57:40 GMT
So where is the basis for your economic argument ? Mary , if you can prove to me that Jeremy is talking nonsense then i'll gladly take it on board ...... but there are £billions in unpaid taxes lying offshore and £billions exempted onshore by the Tories for their pals .... Uni fees are minute beer in the grand scheme of things . John McDonnell is a strict parliamentarian like no other , you can take it from me , if he says the money is there , you can put your house on it . Please ... let's hear the economic argument for your position . The basis of my argument is that his spending policies, in my opion, will bankrupt the country. and im not in the slightest bit interested in you taking my thoughts onboard. So is Jeremy going to bankrupt the country simply because " Mary says so" ? Brilliant , just brilliant that , best economic insight and most telling financial analysis i've heard in weeks  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 10:08:02 GMT
Mary also believes you're a sad cunt
I doubt I'm alone on that thought either
So long troll
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Post by rat on Jul 4, 2017 10:24:06 GMT
Mary also believes you're a sad cunt I doubt I'm alone on that thought either So long troll What's your problem ? I'm asking a perfectly reasonable question about your view on JC and you're having a complete hissy fit ? If you don't want to answer then say so . No need for that sort of personal abuse at all . Have a nice day  |
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Post by Northy on Jul 4, 2017 21:05:44 GMT
The basis of my argument is that his spending policies, in my opion, will bankrupt the country. and im not in the slightest bit interested in you taking my thoughts onboard. So is Jeremy going to bankrupt the country simply because " Mary says so" ? Brilliant , just brilliant that , best economic insight and most telling financial analysis i've heard in weeks HMRC said his tax policy claim sums didnt add up on one of the policies they looked at, Corbyn claimed it would bring in £8bn, HMRC said it would be about £150m, quite a big difference? |
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Post by Northy on Jul 4, 2017 21:09:54 GMT
Agree, the Social media that's been done and proven by farage and ukip in previous years still doesn't make it less of a bribe whichever way they chose to connect.....if they believe that the rich will be the ones that pay for their university education etc, they are very naive indeed. I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? thats what needs looking at the fees, they shouldnt be across the board, target what the country needs like engineers and look at bursaries (like the nhs do) instead of our taxes paying for somebody to do another degree in 'a load of bollocks' like a degree in david beckham, or the beatles etc. |
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Post by desman2 on Jul 4, 2017 21:58:45 GMT
What should 'we' have to do? When were 'we' asked if we wanted millions of people from an alien culture to be dumped in our towns & cities? (Always in the poor areas of course) 'Integration' can't just happen by these immigrants taking action can it ? It's requires everyone to muck in a bit doesn't it ? tell me what do you think 'integration' means ? Its what the Hindus managed, the Sikhs managed, The Chinese managed. Getting the idea. |
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Post by lawrieleslie on Jul 4, 2017 22:25:40 GMT
Agree, the Social media that's been done and proven by farage and ukip in previous years still doesn't make it less of a bribe whichever way they chose to connect.....if they believe that the rich will be the ones that pay for their university education etc, they are very naive indeed. I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? I agree with this to a certain extent Rats. Years ago when I left school in 1969 very few went to university and if you did it was to get degrees in engineering, medicine, construction, architecture, art and teaching. There are probably others worthy of listing and these types of degrees should absolutely be funded by the government. Other degrees should be sponsored by business and other means even if it means students paying fees. Over the last year or so has seen the introduction of a higher level or degree apprenticeship and this is another good way to fund students through their degree. |
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Post by thevoid on Jul 5, 2017 3:50:35 GMT
'Integration' can't just happen by these immigrants taking action can it ? It's requires everyone to muck in a bit doesn't it ? tell me what do you think 'integration' means ? Its what the Hindus managed, the Sikhs managed, The Chinese managed. Getting the idea. Plus the Afro-Caribbeans. I'd add the Ghurkas to that list but they had the door shut in their faces because Romanian sex workers and shoplifters took their spots. |
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Post by rat on Jul 5, 2017 12:30:15 GMT
So is Jeremy going to bankrupt the country simply because " Mary says so" ? Brilliant , just brilliant that , best economic insight and most telling financial analysis i've heard in weeks HMRC said his tax policy claim sums didnt add up on one of the policies they looked at, Corbyn claimed it would bring in £8bn, HMRC said it would be about £150m, quite a big difference? You have a link ? There's usually more to it than the usual Daily Mail headline . Co-incidentally , the Tories are ramming yet another pathetic "Jeremy Corbyn will Bankrupt the Country" slogan down everyone's throats at the moment as well |
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Post by rat on Jul 5, 2017 12:40:22 GMT
I'm a firm believer in the State paying for University . Why should our young people pay ? Like all Uni students my daughter has a £60,000 anchor round her neck ...... I bet you didnt owe somebody £60,000 at the age of 24 just so you could get a fairly ordinary job ? thats what needs looking at the fees, they shouldnt be across the board, target what the country needs like engineers and look at bursaries (like the nhs do) instead of our taxes paying for somebody to do another degree in 'a load of bollocks' like a degree in david beckham, or the beatles etc. Not sure I agree with you on just the vocational stuff ..... studying the classics is important ...... even if the student takes a PGCE or vocational qualification later on . There are no 'load of bollocks' degrees really , (albeit some research can be flaky) some are just less obviously vocational ..... but these courses may be incredibly valuable to the undergraduate from a personal interest and professional perspective . I take your point though . |
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Post by rat on Jul 5, 2017 12:43:41 GMT
'Integration' can't just happen by these immigrants taking action can it ? It's requires everyone to muck in a bit doesn't it ? tell me what do you think 'integration' means ? Its what the Hindus managed, the Sikhs managed, The Chinese managed. Getting the idea. The Chinese don't integrate mate , all over the world , they have their own area in every big city . Not sure what your point is really . |
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Post by rat on Jul 6, 2017 13:37:32 GMT
So where is the basis for your economic argument ? Mary , if you can prove to me that Jeremy is talking nonsense then i'll gladly take it on board ...... but there are £billions in unpaid taxes lying offshore and £billions exempted onshore by the Tories for their pals .... Uni fees are minute beer in the grand scheme of things . John McDonnell is a strict parliamentarian like no other , you can take it from me , if he says the money is there , you can put your house on it . Please ... let's hear the economic argument for your position . The basis of my argument is that his spending policies, in my opion, will bankrupt the country. and im not in the slightest bit interested in you taking my thoughts onboard. Corbyn has told a business conference that companies must expect to pay slightly more tax if Labour is in power , arguing that using the money to invest in education would hugely benefit Britain in the long term. www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/06/jeremy-corbyn-uk-firms-must-pay-more-tax-to-fund-better-education |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 6, 2017 13:45:16 GMT
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Post by thevoid on Jul 6, 2017 18:34:00 GMT
Its what the Hindus managed, the Sikhs managed, The Chinese managed. Getting the idea. The Chinese don't integrate mate , all over the world , they have their own area in every big city . Not sure what your point is really . They also don't go planting nailbombs at pop concerts. |
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Post by rat on Jul 6, 2017 18:56:12 GMT
The Chinese don't integrate mate , all over the world , they have their own area in every big city . Not sure what your point is really . They also don't go planting nailbombs at pop concerts. I agree , but the discussion was about integration. And not every muslim is a suicide bomber either . |
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Post by thevoid on Jul 6, 2017 18:59:04 GMT
They also don't go planting nailbombs at pop concerts. I agree , but the discussion was about integration. And not every muslim is a suicide bomber either . Never said they were. But if you were a dog trainer, you'd take a different approach with a rotweiller than a pug based on the increased potential for menace 😎 |
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Post by rat on Jul 6, 2017 19:02:02 GMT
I agree , but the discussion was about integration. And not every muslim is a suicide bomber either . Never said they were. But if you were a dog trainer, you'd take a different approach with a rotweiller than a pug based on the increased potential for menace 😎 So you think that these folks need training .......like dogs ?  nice comparison....... |
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Post by thevoid on Jul 6, 2017 19:06:13 GMT
Never said they were. But if you were a dog trainer, you'd take a different approach with a rotweiller than a pug based on the increased potential for menace 😎 So you think that these folks need training .......like dogs ? nice comparison....... It was a metaphor suggesting different approaches for different groups based on their individual needs. Nice attempt at deflection though. |
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Post by rat on Jul 6, 2017 19:09:15 GMT
So you think that these folks need training .......like dogs ? nice comparison....... It was a metaphor suggesting different approaches for different groups based on their individual needs. Nice attempt at deflection though. I think you just trod in a massive squelching dog turd . And you know it . Dehumanisation isn't on kid  |
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i'm not a shouty leftist .
