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Post by salopstick on May 17, 2017 18:38:44 GMT
Nice but dim Tim trying to be a comedian on sky now Yet again personal insults!! I give you Tim and raise you a Boris!! Enlighten me on a personal insult He really was trying to be a comedian. Loads of rubbish jokes in his speech
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 17, 2017 18:39:12 GMT
Actually Harry Cole's twitter is quite interesting. Tory's have been sniffing round Bolsover and Tom Watson's seat in West Brom. Labour activists discovered zero voting data for last 20 years in Bolsover! Talk about taking your vote for granted. Could it be possible? Skinner bites the dust?
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Post by essexstokey on May 17, 2017 18:40:06 GMT
No the battle is over the war go's on!!
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Post by salopstick on May 17, 2017 18:42:36 GMT
Actually Harry Cole's twitter is quite interesting. Tory's have been sniffing round Bolsover and Tom Watson's seat in West Brom. Labour activists discovered zero voting data for last 20 years in Bolsover! Talk about taking your vote for granted. Could it be possible? Skinner bites the dust? I hope not. I like Dennis skinner even though we disagree on most things
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Post by mickmillslovechild on May 17, 2017 19:10:39 GMT
1) These useless comparisons to May don't actually defend or answer the issues i mentioned about Farron do they? All they do is deflect completely rather than address the issue. I was talking about how weak Farron was, i don't believe i even mentioned May did i so what has that got to do with it? Parties come out with manifestos and election campaigns in order to try to convince the public to vote for them. Farron basically saying "Vote for me because they didn't let you know what you were voting for in the referendum, and i also won't let you know what my deal with the EU will be until AFTER you elect me either" isn't exactly inspiring confidence when it comes to him convincing me he should get my vote. What you're doing is akin to the US Presidential debates and campaigns, where instead of actually answering criticisms of their policies both sides resorted to "Well, i'm going to ignore your question 'cos i don't have an answer...but look at how bad the other person is instead!" 2) I'm not a bloody Tory anyway so slagging off May to try to deflect attention from Farron's complete inadequacies isn't really going to work with me i'm afraid. 3) Correct, the Tories HAVE done just what i'm accusing Farron of... that's kind of the point i'm making!!!! He's banged on about how terrible it is to do that and how unfair it is to the British public to do that (i.e get the public to vote one way or the other in a major issue without first knowing full facts of what you're voting for) and that's one of the reasons why you shouldn't vote for them because it's soooo despicable...and now is centering his manifesto around doing EXACTLY the same thing. Love the way when supporters of someone see them questioned, instead of actually coming up with an answer to the criticism to defend them, they simply resort to "Well, look at what x has done" instead as if that ties everything up. What's your point? All politicians are useless? I'm not sure of the point you're making or what ideally are you looking for? Always happy to debate any points/problems/issues/policies with you! Incidentally, an election is a competition for power. Therefore, all parties use negative campaigning. Look how the Tories attacked Ed Miliband! I met Ed once and he is one of the most decent, nice, highly intelligent people you could ever meet! To be honest mate, my issue is how weak Farron is being when this is a real chance to get his party back on the map as it were. At the moment there are literally millions of people out there who never have (and ideally never would) voted for the Tories but feel unsure to say the least about voting Labour because the leader (regardless of how much of a avuncular old geezer he is) doesn't even have the backing of a large proportion of his own MPs, so cannot effectively form a strong cabinet...and i'm not even going to get started on Abbott. Farron has the chance to offer an alternative and "steal" those votes and bring the Lib Dems back to being a party that can be taken seriously after destroying the respect most had for them by jumping into bed with the Tories to form a coalition. He isn't doing that though...he's still banging the Brexit drum despite most now accepting the decision (even if they don't agree with it) and just wanting to get on with it, and is doing it in such a muddled way that it looks rushed, chaotic, vague as fuck and has resulted in him doing exactly what he's criticised the govt.for i.e. offering a 2nd referendum without letting anyone know what his plans are. If someone says "You should have let the voting public know what they were voting for first time, so i'm going to give them a second chance and make that a major part of my manifesto if the deal WE broker if we get into power doesn't suit everyone", then i expect them to be able to tell us what the deal they'll try to negotiate actually is beforehand!! Otherwise he's asking us to put him in the highest seat of power in the country without any knowledge of what we're actually voting for....kinda the same thing he's slagged them off for. If he genuinely was concerned about the fact that the public weren't given adequate info re: the major issues that would arise due to Brexit, the impact and effects it could have on the country and how it could effect the everyday working man/woman/small businesses etc, then why hasn't HE at any point come out to let us know what the big issues are (the ones he slags the Tories off for not giving us insight into)? Why hasn't he canvassed public opinion to find out what our concerns actually are and what the issues that are important to us actually are? He's had the best part of a year to do so and just hasn't. Instead he's doing the same as the Tories by giving us all a pat on the head and saying "Don't worry, we know what's best for you. Just trust us and don't worry your pretty little heads about it eh just leave it to us, you wouldn't understand". If he had found out what our concerns and "Wishlists" for any deal might be, then not only would he have been able to question the PM in the commons as to whether she will be taking these issues into account in negotiations (thus showing a strong opposition in Parliament and showing the electorate he was willing to be clear about the issues and fight for them and give them a voice), but he'd also have then been prepared for this GE and would able to tell us exactly what he'll push for in any deals with the EU if he DOES come to power! You know, show the people that he knows what our concerns are and will try to help with those matters...the kinda thing Parties should do when they want to convince you to vote for them in other words. The very fact that if he does come to power, he is willing to offer a "Rejoin" option if we don't like what would be the deal HE brokers says one of two things: either he doesn't know what the public DO want in that deal (in which case he's bullshitting as much as May is).... or he does know what we want but has no faith in his or his party's abilities to be able to deliver that.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 17, 2017 19:33:50 GMT
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 17, 2017 22:12:07 GMT
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on May 17, 2017 22:21:56 GMT
Communist countries actually do surprisingly well, apart from North Korea Vietnam: 27 China: 4 Lao: 16.8 Cuba: 1.6 North Korea: -6
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Post by hammered on May 17, 2017 22:54:55 GMT
May nailed it today by simply pushing Sir Nige’s vision and a bit of left to boot. Having already mopped up most of UKIP since Brexit, she’s now putting them down. And promising a bit of social as well. If she delivers?
As for Jezza – as I said months ago, a patsy till a 21st Century leader swings into view. I can see the appeal in Jezza’s world, but it has moved on (rightly or wrongly) and where we are is not for repeating spend/tax/bust..or just being irrelevant when France has joined the 4th Reich and Trump is on LCD... Also would he deliver?
Fallon still clings to his 22% knowing it will at least give him a voice. But most of his voters will (for now) remain closeted in their idyllic wealth zones sneering at the fools that aren’t them. Bless them . At least we know they can't/never will deliver.
And Sturgeon; "stick yer blue flag...up yer a.."
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Post by LL Cool Dave on May 17, 2017 23:39:53 GMT
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 17, 2017 23:47:35 GMT
She's not against a free vote in the commons over fox hunting. She can't change the law herself. Winter fuel payments will be means tested so rich pensioners who don't need them don't get them. Free school breakfasts might be on the list tomorrow. Ring fencing 100K away from paying for elderly care. I'm hoping the pensions triple lock goes as well. I'm sure the tax triple lock will be changed. She'll be fine by the sound of it .......
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Post by mtrstudent on May 18, 2017 1:43:44 GMT
She's not against a free vote in the commons over fox hunting. She can't change the law herself. Winter fuel payments will be means tested so rich pensioners who don't need them don't get them. Free school breakfasts might be on the list tomorrow. Ring fencing 100K away from paying for elderly care. I'm hoping the pensions triple lock goes as well. I'm sure the tax triple lock will be changed. She'll be fine by the sound of it ....... Raising the pension age, taking away the triple lock and means testing pensioners while protecting £100k of their assets sounds pretty fair to me. The 10s of thousands immigration target is fucking annoying though. One, students count towards it - so great job at messing with a £14 billion export industry - and two, we're a country that's getting fuller of old gits and pensions are sucking up more and more tax money. We need more workers to share the load.
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Post by Northy on May 18, 2017 6:35:58 GMT
You want that an "opposition party should be laying out exactly what deal they would plan to negotiate and tell us that now so we can consider if we therefore want them in power to try to pull that off??" But strong and stable Chicken May's government hasn't done that! We've no idea of the border issue between N.I. and R.o.I, no idea of how we will deal with the so-called 'Divorce Bill' so if Farron is as weak as piss what does that make Clucker? 1) These useless comparisons to May don't actually defend or answer the issues i mentioned about Farron do they? All they do is deflect completely rather than address the issue. I was talking about how weak Farron was, i don't believe i even mentioned May did i so what has that got to do with it? Parties come out with manifestos and election campaigns in order to try to convince the public to vote for them. Farron basically saying "Vote for me because they didn't let you know what you were voting for in the referendum, and i also won't let you know what my deal with the EU will be until AFTER you elect me either" isn't exactly inspiring confidence when it comes to him convincing me he should get my vote. What you're doing is akin to the US Presidential debates and campaigns, where instead of actually answering criticisms of their policies both sides resorted to "Well, i'm going to ignore your question 'cos i don't have an answer...but look at how bad the other person is instead!" 2) I'm not a bloody Tory anyway so slagging off May to try to deflect attention from Farron's complete inadequacies isn't really going to work with me i'm afraid. 3) Correct, the Tories HAVE done just what i'm accusing Farron of... that's kind of the point i'm making!!!! He's banged on about how terrible it is to do that and how unfair it is to the British public to do that (i.e get the public to vote one way or the other in a major issue without first knowing full facts of what you're voting for) and that's one of the reasons why you shouldn't vote for them because it's soooo despicable...and now is centering his manifesto around doing EXACTLY the same thing. Love the way when supporters of someone see them questioned, instead of actually coming up with an answer to the criticism to defend them, they simply resort to "Well, look at what x has done" instead as if that ties everything up. he's just like a Vale fan when they continually turn any conversation into hating Stoke
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 6:45:01 GMT
She's not against a free vote in the commons over fox hunting. She can't change the law herself. Winter fuel payments will be means tested so rich pensioners who don't need them don't get them. Free school breakfasts might be on the list tomorrow. Ring fencing 100K away from paying for elderly care. I'm hoping the pensions triple lock goes as well. I'm sure the tax triple lock will be changed. She'll be fine by the sound of it ....... Raising the pension age, taking away the triple lock and means testing pensioners while protecting £100k of their assets sounds pretty fair to me. The 10s of thousands immigration target is fucking annoying though. One, students count towards it - so great job at messing with a £14 billion export industry - and two, we're a country that's getting fuller of old gits and pensions are sucking up more and more tax money. We need more workers to share the load. The lying, conning Tories are at it again! In 2015 they promised pensioners the triple lock for five more years! Five? They've ended up with two! Why did they make this promise? Because Tory H.Q. worked out they needed the pensioner vote to win the election! As for means testing pensioners we don't know the details how this will work in practice. The Tories promised at the last general election that care wouldn't mean pensioners would have to sell their homes. It was the first promise the tax dodging Cameron dropped after the election! As for migration, Osborne let it out of the bag that the Tory government never even attempted to get immigration down to the tens of thousands, it was another con trick! Tim Farron was right when he said yesterday the Tories had become Britain's French National Front with Chicken May as Britain's Marine le Pen! How bloody true!
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 6:47:55 GMT
1) These useless comparisons to May don't actually defend or answer the issues i mentioned about Farron do they? All they do is deflect completely rather than address the issue. I was talking about how weak Farron was, i don't believe i even mentioned May did i so what has that got to do with it? Parties come out with manifestos and election campaigns in order to try to convince the public to vote for them. Farron basically saying "Vote for me because they didn't let you know what you were voting for in the referendum, and i also won't let you know what my deal with the EU will be until AFTER you elect me either" isn't exactly inspiring confidence when it comes to him convincing me he should get my vote. What you're doing is akin to the US Presidential debates and campaigns, where instead of actually answering criticisms of their policies both sides resorted to "Well, i'm going to ignore your question 'cos i don't have an answer...but look at how bad the other person is instead!" 2) I'm not a bloody Tory anyway so slagging off May to try to deflect attention from Farron's complete inadequacies isn't really going to work with me i'm afraid. 3) Correct, the Tories HAVE done just what i'm accusing Farron of... that's kind of the point i'm making!!!! He's banged on about how terrible it is to do that and how unfair it is to the British public to do that (i.e get the public to vote one way or the other in a major issue without first knowing full facts of what you're voting for) and that's one of the reasons why you shouldn't vote for them because it's soooo despicable...and now is centering his manifesto around doing EXACTLY the same thing. Love the way when supporters of someone see them questioned, instead of actually coming up with an answer to the criticism to defend them, they simply resort to "Well, look at what x has done" instead as if that ties everything up. he's just like a Vale fan when they continually turn any conversation into hating Stoke You're just like a snivelling, grovelling, glory hunting Arsenal fan turning every conversation into running down Uncle Peter's Labour stokies!
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Post by Northy on May 18, 2017 6:59:15 GMT
he's just like a Vale fan when they continually turn any conversation into hating Stoke You're just like a snivelling, grovelling, glory hunting Arsenal fan turning every conversation into running down Uncle Peter's Labour stokies! did I mention labour in that sentence? Nope, you are wrong again
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Post by bathstoke on May 18, 2017 7:10:06 GMT
No the battle is over the war go's on!! Strong is the force in this one
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Post by salopstick on May 18, 2017 7:22:30 GMT
Forget the costings there are some good and bad in all manifestos.
I particularly like the axing of free school meals in infant schools which ONLY AFFECTS THOSE WHO DONT ALREADY QUALIFY for free school meals to be replaced by free breakfast for every child up to primary school. Too many children don't get a proper breakfast. It will mean those on free school meals will actually now get two meals at school.
In this case the lib dems slating May for this are not seeing the big picture.
I wish they would stop making immigration targets they are bound to fail.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on May 18, 2017 7:37:27 GMT
I agree. Doesn't seem to me to do a lot for Middle England, and on the initial face of it seems anti elderly. If it was not for the Brexit question and the Leadership/ personnel qualities of the main parties, in different times, I think the Tories would be struggling with this manifesto
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Post by essexstokey on May 18, 2017 7:38:07 GMT
Free school meals Cut! pensioners hit with cuts! benefits cut! Thousands using food banks!
The Caring face of the Tories!!
You cant trust a tory!!
the conservatives putting the con in politics!
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 7:43:41 GMT
You're just like a snivelling, grovelling, glory hunting Arsenal fan turning every conversation into running down Uncle Peter's Labour stokies! did I mention labour in that sentence? Nope, you are wrong again Yep, but you're still snivelling and grovelling like a true Tory!
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 7:46:18 GMT
Free school meals Cut! pensioners hit with cuts! benefits cut! Thousands using food banks!
The Caring face of the Tories!! You cant trust a tory!! the conservatives putting the con in politics! But they care about those poor fox hounds just desperate to run around a field and tear the guts out of a panting, terrified fox! How dare you accuse the Tories of being such lying, duplicitous bastards?
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 7:48:19 GMT
Forget the costings there are some good and bad in all manifestos. I particularly like the axing of free school meals in infant schools which ONLY AFFECTS THOSE WHO DONT ALREADY QUALIFY for free school meals to be replaced by free breakfast for every child up to primary school. Too many children don't get a proper breakfast. It will mean those on free school meals will actually now get two meals at school. In this case the lib dems slating May for this are not seeing the big picture. I wish they would stop making immigration targets they are bound to fail. Forget the costings? And voters wonder why the Tories have run up record deficits?
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 7:56:03 GMT
Free school meals Cut! pensioners hit with cuts! benefits cut! Thousands using food banks!
The Caring face of the Tories!! You cant trust a tory!! the conservatives putting the con in politics! The B.B.C.'s analysis of the Tory elderly care proposals: "But in the end it can be summed up pretty easily - they want people to pay more towards the cost of their care. Some elements of their plans sound generous and certainly some people will benefit, but large numbers won't. Why? Because we are a nation of homeowners and these plans make sure that whatever sort of care you need, the value of your home can be taken into account." The Tories plan to tax you after you die! Well, that's novel? I wonder who will be flying to the Caribbean to ensure David Cameron pays what he owes when he dies?
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Post by followyoudown on May 18, 2017 8:07:29 GMT
Forget the costings there are some good and bad in all manifestos. I particularly like the axing of free school meals in infant schools which ONLY AFFECTS THOSE WHO DONT ALREADY QUALIFY for free school meals to be replaced by free breakfast for every child up to primary school. Too many children don't get a proper breakfast. It will mean those on free school meals will actually now get two meals at school. In this case the lib dems slating May for this are not seeing the big picture. I wish they would stop making immigration targets they are bound to fail. Forget the costings? And voters wonder why the Tories have run up record deficits? Nicholas lying again they have been reducing the deficit left to them by Labour.
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Post by nicholasjalcock on May 18, 2017 8:22:19 GMT
Forget the costings? And voters wonder why the Tories have run up record deficits? Nicholas lying again they have been reducing the deficit left to them by Labour. And the Tories cashing in selling shares in the nationalised Lloyd's leaving the taxpayer not a penny out of pocket! In fact, if they had not rushed to sell the shares so quickly the British taxpayer might have made a profit! You can't trust the incompetent, lying, conning Tories! Will be taxing after you die now! Unless, you've got your assets in the Caribbean like Cameron!
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Post by sheikhmomo on May 18, 2017 8:22:58 GMT
So we see a Tory policy at long last and what do we have.
A death tax, 'marxist' caps on on energy bills, Brexit means Brext, the same unachievable net migration targets and virtually nothing on taxation.
Strong and stable leadership, who knows? Grubby duplicitous opportunist arseholes, most certainly.
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Post by essexstokey on May 18, 2017 8:24:35 GMT
Forget the costings? And voters wonder why the Tories have run up record deficits? Nicholas lying again they have been reducing the deficit left to them by Labour. Yep the deficit that they had to have to bail out the Tory wbankers who got greedy and run this country into the ground!!
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on May 18, 2017 8:29:41 GMT
She's not against a free vote in the commons over fox hunting. She can't change the law herself. Winter fuel payments will be means tested so rich pensioners who don't need them don't get them. Free school breakfasts might be on the list tomorrow. Ring fencing 100K away from paying for elderly care. I'm hoping the pensions triple lock goes as well. I'm sure the tax triple lock will be changed. She'll be fine by the sound of it ....... Raising the pension age, taking away the triple lock and means testing pensioners while protecting £100k of their assets sounds pretty fair to me. The 10s of thousands immigration target is fucking annoying though. One, students count towards it - so great job at messing with a £14 billion export industry - and two, we're a country that's getting fuller of old gits and pensions are sucking up more and more tax money. We need more workers to share the load. Totally agree about the pensioners and younger folk. It's an odd thing about the student numbers. She doesn't have to include them in the total figures, on fact many cross party observers think they actually shouldn't because they are there own accounted for sub-division. Maybe, just maybe she's continued the 10's of thousands pledge to get the UKIPers on board for the GE but can then 'reorganise' the counting method later
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Post by essexstokey on May 18, 2017 8:30:07 GMT
Dilnot 'many will be worse off'
Economist Sir Andrew Dilnot reviewed the social care system for the Coalition government - he says he's "surprised" and "very disappointed" by the plans.
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