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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 26, 2013 17:11:34 GMT
Jonny Walters now enters double points that he's cost us this season. I like you Jon but sweet Jesus lad, what the fuck is wrong with you in front of goal and why are you continually picked?
Answers on a Postcard to Mark Hughes, somewhere near stoke.*
*All previous correspondence to T Pulis, somewhere near Bournemouth will be forwarded to this address.
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Post by thestatusquo on Oct 26, 2013 17:13:15 GMT
Missed a sitter and could have stopped the cross for their 2nd.
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Post by kingstokie on Oct 26, 2013 17:13:45 GMT
For me, the worst player on the pitch was Palacios. Anonymous in the first half, and looked like he fancied an early bath in the second half.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 26, 2013 17:15:09 GMT
You don't get chances like Walters did today at Old Trafford. We should have won, fairly easily in terms of quality chances, this lad blew it. Again.
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Post by thestatusquo on Oct 26, 2013 17:17:05 GMT
You don't get chances like Walters did today at Old Trafford. We should have won, fairly easily in terms of quality chances, this lad blew it. Again. I can't understand why he keeps playing him momo. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2013 17:20:52 GMT
Neither can I. As I,ve said on another post, he,s got something over someone at Stoke. If he,s a Premiership class footballer, I am! Him, Whelan and Wilson need to go, as far as I,m concerned!
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Post by maninasuitcase on Oct 26, 2013 17:26:41 GMT
Neither can I. As I,ve said on another post, he,s got something over someone at Stoke. If he,s a Premiership class footballer, I am! Him, Whelan and Wilson need to go, as far as I,m concerned! Spot on mate. All three are uber gash. |
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Post by Pugsley on Oct 26, 2013 17:28:21 GMT
I did tell you this 2 years ago. Walters costs us more points that he wins.
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Post by likelyladgalizmo on Oct 26, 2013 17:31:08 GMT
As soon as Wilson P went off. we gave up the game.
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Post by Smudge_SCFC on Oct 26, 2013 17:31:25 GMT
Momo, obviously I'm in agreement over SJW - I don't understand why he has such a hold over a succession of managers? Two of them have recently been sacked as well!!!
I do have recriminations over today though, unfortunately.
I have been solidly behind MH and remain so but nothing can alter my opinion that he messed badly today.
To surrender the initiative so utterly and decisively with such a negative substitution paved the way for our defeat.
We had Man Utd all over the place in the first half and not a single goal attempt in the second.
Just feel so empty and so frustrated.
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Post by foxysgloves on Oct 26, 2013 17:35:10 GMT
Very harsh. If we're going to single out anybody for criticism on a day when we've played as well as we have since entering the Prem I'm not sure I'd pick the bloke who yet again virtually bursts a blood vessel in his efforts.
He should have scored. He may have done better defensively at times. But at the same time he put a serious amount of work in including a couple of decent crosses and setting up Crouch for a very good chance with a smart cushioned header.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 26, 2013 17:36:46 GMT
Very harsh. If we're going to single out anybody for criticism on a day when we've played as well as we have since entering the Prem I'm not sure I'd pick the bloke who yet again virtually bursts a blood vessel in his efforts. He should have scored. He may have done better defensively at times. But at the same time he put a serious amount of work in including a couple of decent crosses and setting up Crouch for a very good chance with a smart cushioned header. That's the issue though isn't it? Should haves and could haves. It's a problem with the team at the moment and it's been a problem with Walters since time began. |
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Post by foxysgloves on Oct 26, 2013 17:39:26 GMT
Very harsh. If we're going to single out anybody for criticism on a day when we've played as well as we have since entering the Prem I'm not sure I'd pick the bloke who yet again virtually bursts a blood vessel in his efforts. He should have scored. He may have done better defensively at times. But at the same time he put a serious amount of work in including a couple of decent crosses and setting up Crouch for a very good chance with a smart cushioned header. That's the issue though isn't it? Should haves and could haves. It's a problem with the team at the moment and it's been a problem with Walters since time began. Absolutely. But there are bigger problems than Jon Walters. For all his efforts today where was Ireland's end product? And where exactly was Nzonzi when we needed some solidity in the second half in the middle. If Jon Walters was as good at hiding as some of our more "able" players he'd be alright. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2013 17:40:07 GMT
As soon as Wilson P went off. we gave up the game. 8-|Replace Wilson P with Arnautovic and you're still not right, but it's closer. Palacios was a walking (or is that him trying to run) red card. In fact not since Fellaini played for Everton at our place have i seen someone seeming so determined to get sent off.  |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 26, 2013 17:42:56 GMT
That's the issue though isn't it? Should haves and could haves. It's a problem with the team at the moment and it's been a problem with Walters since time began. Absolutely. But there are bigger problems than Jon Walters. For all his efforts today where was Ireland's end product? And where exactly was Nzonzi when we needed some solidity in the second half in the middle. If Jon Walters was as good at hiding as some of our more "able" players he'd be alright. It wasn't their day, it happens. Ireland not missing a decent opportunity doesn't mean Walters is absconded from any blame today. He should have scored, if he does we draw. He simply costs us more than he gives imo. I wish he'd fucking hide tbh. Because him getting noticed is doing us fuck all good!  He's like a rabbit in the headlights in this league. |
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Post by Jimm on Oct 26, 2013 17:44:10 GMT
I thought Palacios did well considering it's his first league start, yes he got tired and reckless in the second half but looked a lot more solid than we did with Nzonzi/Adam/Ireland. As for Walters, i haven't got a clue why he's continually picked over our proper wingers, he doesn't offer us anything, we need 2 ball runners in the side. He's pick regardless of form and previous match performances, he must a beast in training
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Post by stokemanusa on Oct 26, 2013 17:46:25 GMT
Ugh for me walters is frustrating... Gives all gets in position then powers the ball when a lil finesse finish is needed... He had it a few seasons back made some phenomenal goals but as of late seems to have steel toed boots and goes for power in the goals center way to much. I don't blame him for the loss or any single player. He missed a sitter again but he offers great play with crouch IMO our strikers were better in the box than any game this season... With the change in style our defensive marking has been atrocious... Wether it's tiredness from more movement than hoofball or losing marks in a moving style it needs sorting fast... Two More strikers would be mint especially pacey ones.
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Post by stokemanusa on Oct 26, 2013 17:49:48 GMT
I thought Palacios did well considering it's his first league start, yes he got tired and reckless in the second half but looked a lot more solid than we did with Nzonzi/Adam/Ireland. As for Walters, i haven't got a clue why he's continually picked over our proper wingers, he doesn't offer us anything, we need 2 ball runners in the side. He's pick regardless of form and previous match performances, he must a beast in training Palacios needed subbing at 60minutes he can't go more than that. Other than that he was good IMO tackled well until his pace was gone but worked well with nzonzi. IMO... Hughes was at fault for poor subs at improper times. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 26, 2013 17:59:31 GMT
Momo, obviously I'm in agreement over SJW - I don't understand why he has such a hold over a succession of managers? Two of them have recently been sacked as well!!! I do have recriminations over today though, unfortunately. I have been solidly behind MH and remain so but nothing can alter my opinion that he messed badly today. To surrender the initiative so utterly and decisively with such a negative substitution paved the way for our defeat. We had Man Utd all over the place in the first half and not a single goal attempt in the second. Just feel so empty and so frustrated. Absolutely gutted Smudge. Never felt so down after a decent performance. Said to my 9 year old nephew after, I hope you see us beat them there as I don't think I will now (and I hope to have 30 years in me yet - but we'll never have a better chance). Was going to leave the dissection until later as I thought we were superb for the most part and obviously the Arnie one was forced on him but I think he gets in to a pickle with the benches he picks to be honest, unless there's injuries I don't know about? |
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Post by FullerMagic on Oct 26, 2013 18:07:38 GMT
Just been having the same conversation, Momo.
Still feel numb.
He boxed himself in with his bench. Do we know if Pennant is fit?
He seems to have little faith in using Assaidi in most circumstances, so we needed a more neutral wide option as well.
Did we really need Wilko AND Wilson on there today? Wilko offers little versatility, unless Cameron was a huge fitness gamble.
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Post by Olgrligm on Oct 26, 2013 18:35:43 GMT
Momo, obviously I'm in agreement over SJW - I don't understand why he has such a hold over a succession of managers? Two of them have recently been sacked as well!!! I do have recriminations over today though, unfortunately. I have been solidly behind MH and remain so but nothing can alter my opinion that he messed badly today. To surrender the initiative so utterly and decisively with such a negative substitution paved the way for our defeat. We had Man Utd all over the place in the first half and not a single goal attempt in the second. Just feel so empty and so frustrated. I think that's very harsh. Arnautovic was injured so his hands were tied. I wouldn't have trusted Assaidi at a goal up, I just wouldn't. Admittedly the Wilson sub was a weird one. The tipping point was when they bought the young lad on, he made them that bit more dynamic and direct in attack. |
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Post by bunnyscfc on Oct 26, 2013 18:40:11 GMT
Momo, obviously I'm in agreement over SJW - I don't understand why he has such a hold over a succession of managers? Two of them have recently been sacked as well!!! I do have recriminations over today though, unfortunately. I have been solidly behind MH and remain so but nothing can alter my opinion that he messed badly today. To surrender the initiative so utterly and decisively with such a negative substitution paved the way for our defeat. We had Man Utd all over the place in the first half and not a single goal attempt in the second. Just feel so empty and so frustrated. absolutely spot-on. They had a full back who was given the run around for 45 minutes, ad he was then given the freedom to get forward and do exactly what he wanted. By putting MW on, Hughes gave United's defence the freedom to push as far forward as they wanted, and we gave them total possession of the ball. As much as I like some of what Hughes has done, he simply gave United the impetus second half. I can take losing, but it will take me a while to get over not winning today, never mind getting a point. We had them on the canvas, and simply offered them a helping hand back up to fight. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2013 19:05:42 GMT
When in the ascendancy and man Utd offering absolutely nothing to then bring on Wilson was a shocker of a decision as this offered us no outlet whatsoever.
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Post by stokemanusa on Oct 26, 2013 19:23:04 GMT
When in the ascendancy and man Utd offering absolutely nothing to then bring on Wilson was a shocker of a decision as this offered us no outlet whatsoever. Moment of the match IMO gutting. Worse than chicaritos open header... I saw that one coming, Hughes throwing in the towel after ranting about pressure... Deflating. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2013 19:35:10 GMT
Trying hard never was as good as natural talent was it.
It's perhaps not fair, but who the hell said life was fair.
SJW is a tryer not a natural afraid to say, can't fault his effort, can't believe his lack of ability at times.
I'd want his engine in mid field in the championship not up front on the prem.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 26, 2013 19:40:17 GMT
Just been having the same conversation, Momo. Still feel numb. He boxed himself in with his bench. Do we know if Pennant is fit? He seems to have little faith in using Assaidi in most circumstances, so we needed a more neutral wide option as well. Did we really need Wilko AND Wilson on there today? Wilko offers little versatility, unless Cameron was a huge fitness gamble. Crazy grapey. Two games ago we didn't have a defender on the bench at all, now this! I'm still gutted but I do think we could be a decent outfit with a fair wind. Think the table will look very scary come Christmas day though. |
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Post by scfc5 on Oct 26, 2013 20:21:13 GMT
Losing Arnie was the turning point for me. Hughes surrendered any impetus by bringing on Wilson. At least if he had had Ethers or Pennant around, we could have stayed positive but with a measure of defensive cover. Assaidi wouldn't have been right at that moment either - no doubt he was on the bench because Hughes expected to have to chase the game.
Walters plays because he gets up alongside the front man, which we need. Playing, say, Arnie and Assaidi, would leave the striker very isolated in our system as neither would get into the box enough. Not having enough men in the box, especially at home, has been a significant problem.
Whether we should be in the position of still having to rely on Walters is a different question and goes back to the Summer's failings, but until January, Walters has to play.
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Post by onionman on Oct 26, 2013 22:00:56 GMT
Momo, obviously I'm in agreement over SJW - I don't understand why he has such a hold over a succession of managers? Two of them have recently been sacked as well!!! I do have recriminations over today though, unfortunately. I have been solidly behind MH and remain so but nothing can alter my opinion that he messed badly today. To surrender the initiative so utterly and decisively with such a negative substitution paved the way for our defeat. We had Man Utd all over the place in the first half and not a single goal attempt in the second. Just feel so empty and so frustrated. absolutely spot-on. They had a full back who was given the run around for 45 minutes, ad he was then given the freedom to get forward and do exactly what he wanted. By putting MW on, Hughes gave United's defence the freedom to push as far forward as they wanted, and we gave them total possession of the ball. As much as I like some of what Hughes has done, he simply gave United the impetus second half. I can take losing, but it will take me a while to get over not winning today, never mind getting a point. We had them on the canvas, and simply offered them a helping hand back up to fight. Worse still, they were able to take Smalling off, and bring on an attacking midfielder, just as we were rocking. Also, Palacios and Ireland were both obviously running on empty for a good 15 minutes before being withdrawn, which was unnecessary as we had like-for-like replacements on the bench. That cost us the crucial goal as Ireland inexpicably was the man marking Rooney at that corner. I'm not saying Adam would have been a good choice to mark Rooney either, but we diced with death by delaying our substitutions, and it cost us. I really like Mark Hughes and his tactics and approach to the first half today were brilliant, but he must be kicking himself tonight. |
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He's like a rabbit in the headlights in this league.
