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Post by Clem Fandango on Dec 14, 2023 15:37:28 GMT
Lambert was a disastrous appointment. But if we'd kept him on after relegation instead of bringing in Rowett, got rid of the likes of Butland/Allen and gone for a younger squad with some homegrown players potentially blooded we'd be in a much better situation then we are now (and have a lot more money in the bank as well). I've wondered that quite a lot mate. Personally I've felt that Lambert never really got a fair crack of the whip and he's the fall guy for a relegation where the seeds were sown probably long before he arrived. My biggest issue with Lambert was that after 10 years in the prem, never really being in trouble and the backing the managers had from the owners that he was the best manager across the entire world of football that we could come up with.
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Post by robstokie on Dec 14, 2023 15:43:44 GMT
I am trying to reflect objectively on Paul Lambert's tenure after the passage of time. We were told he got the job at least in part based on a dossier (a Powerpoint presentation) he prepared for the interview with an in depth analysis of all our players. You could probably run one off on ChatGPT now but it was seen as a big deal at the time. He won 2 games. His first game at home to Huddersfield and his last game at Swansea when both teams were already relegated ahead of the kick off. The problem was all the games in between! We had lots of winnable matches but somehow contrived to win none of them, but even then we were only relegated by 4 points. It's easy to see where 4 extra points may have come from. Charlie Adam's penalty where we stepped forward to bury Brighton at the death only to see it saved and Charlie move like he was walking through treacle to convert the rebound only to be clattered from behind my Lewis Dunk, now an England player of course. I remember a late Andy Carroll header at West Ham robbing us of another 2 points. We really should not have got relegated, but somehow we were. I always ask myself the question would Mark Hughes have found the extra 4 points had be not been removed in January after the cup extit at lowly, as they were then, Coventry? Probably, but we will never know. You could also look at Butland chucking one in vs Leicester and Charlie being sent off against Everton as key moments too, but the fact is that Lambert was not good enough - his game management on a number of occasions in the run in was far too negative, sacrificing flair whilst we were in a winning position and sitting off teams, allowing them to gain momentum and grind us down. His plan A of relying on Shaq, giving him a free role and relying on others to cover for him too allowed the opposition to double up on Shaq and then outnumber and force us back behind the ball. Also didn't allow us to offer other options in the final third making us look very one dimensional and easy to deal with. Whilst I still stand by us Sacking Sparky as we were in a massive downward spiral (which still hasn't been stopped as of today), hiring such an uninspiring, negative replacement, which the whole world and his dog could see wasn't going to save us was the wrong call. What should have happened was Sparky should have been canned after Bournemouth at home at the very latest (though I personally subscribe to the view he should have gone the end of the previous season where you could see the rot setting in, particularly last 3 months) and we should have gone balls out for Moyes. If we had done that, I genuinely believe we could still be a mid table premier league side, maybe even striving to sneak into the Europa on occasion via 7th or a cup win.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Dec 14, 2023 15:47:26 GMT
Lambert was a disastrous appointment. But if we'd kept him on after relegation instead of bringing in Rowett, got rid of the likes of Butland/Allen and gone for a younger squad with some homegrown players potentially blooded we'd be in a much better situation then we are now (and have a lot more money in the bank as well). I've wondered that quite a lot mate. Personally I've felt that Lambert never really got a fair crack of the whip and he's the fall guy for a relegation where the seeds were sown probably long before he arrived. My biggest issue with Lambert was that after 10 years in the prem, never really being in trouble and the backing the managers had from the owners that he was the best manager across the entire world of football that we could come up with. People talk about relegation from the Premier League being disastrous, but it's actually not if you dust yourself off and come up with a plan to make a quick return. For teams like us it always happens eventually. What was absolutely disastrous and the key to our current malaise was allowing Rowett to spend £60m on the age and type of player he did. It was suicidal. A Lambert or a MON would have given us stability whilst allowing us to bring some good young players through both from the Academy and from the Premier League, or League 1 players looking for their next move. Apart from relegation into League 1 (thanks MON) we couldn't have actually cocked it up anymore than we actually have!
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Post by Clem Fandango on Dec 14, 2023 15:49:50 GMT
I've wondered that quite a lot mate. Personally I've felt that Lambert never really got a fair crack of the whip and he's the fall guy for a relegation where the seeds were sown probably long before he arrived. My biggest issue with Lambert was that after 10 years in the prem, never really being in trouble and the backing the managers had from the owners that he was the best manager across the entire world of football that we could come up with. People talk about relegation from the Premier League being disastrous, but it's actually not if you dust yourself off and come up with a plan to make a quick return. For teams like us it always happens eventually. What was absolutely disastrous and the key to our current malaise was allowing Rowett to spend £60m on the age and type of player he did. It was suicidal. A Lambert or a MON would have given us stability whilst allowing us to bring some good young players through both from the Academy and from the Premier League or League 1 players looking for their next move. Apart from relegation into League 1 (thanks MON) we couldn't have actually cocked it up anymore than we actually have! Bang on mate. I think if you look back at recent (prem era) relegated teams we could be the text book example of how not to do it.
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Post by middleoftheboothen on Dec 15, 2023 2:16:09 GMT
We are having advice from Paul 'fucking' Lambert now and some think we haven't yet hit rock bottom. He is right ofcourse but the irony is off the scale. Someone's asked him the question, hardly a big deal is it. Never said it was mate and I also said he is right. It's kind of ironic though him saying we need to get the appointment right when appointing him was a complete and utter balls up.
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Post by starkiller on Dec 15, 2023 4:11:42 GMT
Someone's asked him the question, hardly a big deal is it. Never said it was mate and I also said he is right. It's kind of ironic though him saying we need to get the appointment right when appointing him was a complete and utter balls up. I still find it difficult to believe that Lambert was the only one available and willing to take the job. I can't remember if Big Sam was available at the time, but something like him was needed.
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 15, 2023 4:12:52 GMT
Felt sorry for Lambert i really did No other manager would touch us, and he knew we were doomed but at least he had a bloody go For that alone i have time for the guy, You need a name change. Can I suggest Alan Partridge and end all your replies with Needless to say I had the last laugh
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Post by nonameface on Dec 15, 2023 6:06:37 GMT
Awful manager and he completely set us up wrong by focusing way too much on defending. It made us toothless and we were never going to be good enough defensively with the squad we had to compensate for fewer goals to get away with it.
Hughes would have kept us up, but he wasn't the right manager either.
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Post by noustie on Dec 15, 2023 6:35:34 GMT
Best player performance I ever saw. Had Ballack in his back pocket despite being half fit and Christian Dailly actually supposed to be marking him.
He's thick as fuck but absolute genius on the pitch - literally 2 seconds ahead of everyone else.
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Post by kidcrewbob on Dec 15, 2023 8:11:56 GMT
I am trying to reflect objectively on Paul Lambert's tenure after the passage of time. We were told he got the job at least in part based on a dossier (a Powerpoint presentation) he prepared for the interview with an in depth analysis of all our players. You could probably run one off on ChatGPT now but it was seen as a big deal at the time. He won 2 games. His first game at home to Huddersfield and his last game at Swansea when both teams were already relegated ahead of the kick off. The problem was all the games in between! We had lots of winnable matches but somehow contrived to win none of them, but even then we were only relegated by 4 points. It's easy to see where 4 extra points may have come from. Charlie Adam's penalty where we stepped forward to bury Brighton at the death only to see it saved and Charlie move like he was walking through treacle to convert the rebound only to be clattered from behind my Lewis Dunk, now an England player of course. I remember a late Andy Carroll header at West Ham robbing us of another 2 points. We really should not have got relegated, but somehow we were. I always ask myself the question would Mark Hughes have found the extra 4 points had be not been removed in January after the cup extit at lowly, as they were then, Coventry? Probably, but we will never know. Thats a painful read mate! I'd forgotten how close to surviving we actually were - and spot-on re Hughes, most wanted him gone in the October when it was clear that he'd lost the plot but the fluke win at Watford saved him and cue the famous and forever to haunt the club "what's all the fuss about". Truly a debacle of epic proportions from which we have never recovered and indeed continue to decline.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Dec 15, 2023 8:55:37 GMT
Its like Posh Spice giving advice on how to sing.
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Post by Goonie on Dec 15, 2023 9:15:43 GMT
PL was also an unmitigated disastrous appointment by a complacent and overconfident board which added to our decline into where we are now.
Personality wise he is not in the twat's camp but is in the Rogue's Gallery for symbolising the club's general incompetence of the last 7 seasons
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Post by clintonbaptiste on Dec 15, 2023 9:51:45 GMT
Carlton fucking Palmer has given his view now. All the legends are having their say
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Post by FullerMagic on Dec 15, 2023 13:49:16 GMT
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Post by theonlooker on Dec 15, 2023 13:52:55 GMT
Ouch. Poor John, not a ringing endorsement of his brainpower there...
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Post by baconburger on Dec 16, 2023 16:38:12 GMT
Paul Lambert. Never seen a problem he can't make worse.
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Post by baconburger on Dec 16, 2023 16:44:19 GMT
Ouch. Poor John, not a ringing endorsement of his brainpower there... Not really. Peter obviously agreed with him that goals are irrelevant. He'd have kept him on to keep up the good work. I'm not sure that demonstrates any brainpower whatsoever.
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Post by redwhitesingfight on Dec 16, 2023 16:52:35 GMT
We should have stuck with Lambo
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Post by longdistancekiddie on Dec 16, 2023 21:10:11 GMT
We should have stuck with Lambert after relugation and he would have kept us up if he didn't play butland
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Post by franklin on Dec 17, 2023 2:14:13 GMT
The moment he was appointed was the moment we were relegated.
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 17, 2023 2:32:02 GMT
It's beyond Scary. It's a fucking never ending nightmare. I remember many moons ago starting a thread questioning the clubs ambitions. Can't remember now whether it was pre or post Lambert but I do remember receiving pelters from the 'club can do no wrong' brigade. But that link demonstrates everything that is wrong with the club and points directly at the owners and board for the debacle we find ourselves in.
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Post by milky on Dec 17, 2023 10:14:03 GMT
I can't believe I'm reading folk suggesting we should have kept Lambert on after relegation?
Honestly?
We were outside the bottom 3 in January, he managed to win his first game and didn't win another until the dead rubber last game at Swansea.In May !
The fact we were just 4 points off survival tells you how a reasonably competent manager would have kept us up with their eyes closed.
It was actually harder to get relegated than to stay up but fair play to the Coates family, they pulled it off !
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