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Post by leicspotter on Nov 2, 2023 9:00:03 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents
Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.
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Post by jesusmcmuffin on Nov 2, 2023 9:05:13 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total
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Post by bridgnorthstokie on Nov 2, 2023 9:12:20 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.Come on, your just being silly. Everyone knows football didn't exist before the Premier league. Stop this foolishness. How would Alan shearer feel if motd announced he wasn't the greatest scorer ever ...his poor smug face would be devasted.. just stop this nonsense.
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Post by leicspotter on Nov 2, 2023 9:13:15 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total You're right, you can't really compare different eras, but you can appreciate talent when it's there...shame you know who can't As for the Home Internationals, they were more competitive than many tournament qualifiers
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Post by jesusmcmuffin on Nov 2, 2023 9:20:58 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total You're right, you can't really compare different eras, but you can appreciate talent when it's there...shame you know who can't As for the Home Internationals, they were more competitive than many tournament qualifiers I agree not a competition. Both great so why can't it be left like that? I think was Richard Keys said that Kane wasn't on the same planet as Greaves which is nonsense. Old stuff was always better in so many minds of course.
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Post by JoeinOz on Nov 2, 2023 10:24:01 GMT
Kane is notably reliable in one on one's.
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Post by pmjh on Nov 2, 2023 10:27:22 GMT
Both great goalscorers in different eras. Both far from just poachers though. Greaves could make his own chances with his dribbling skills. Kane probably the best passer of a ball for a centre forward iv'e ever seen. Greaves an inside forward. Kane an all round centre forward. Great players both.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Nov 2, 2023 10:30:07 GMT
Nowt against Kane and more a judgement of my sense of humour, but I would piss myself if Kane won fuck all at Bayern this season and Tottenham somehow manage to win the Premier League.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Nov 2, 2023 10:32:18 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total I think the home nations were far superior to the likes of San Marino and Andorra in fairness.......
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Post by jesusmcmuffin on Nov 2, 2023 10:45:52 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total I think the home nations were far superior to the likes of San Marino and Andorra in fairness....... True but the majority of Kane's goals weren't v them either although you can only score v who you play against. Did Greaves ever score at a major tournament? Edit just checked.. score 1 in 4 in the 62 World Cup
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 2, 2023 11:00:19 GMT
Not sure if Greaves took penalties, but he also scored 2 goals in the Charity Shield (which doesn't count anymore?) and did it in less games than Harry. Played in Italy too. I'm a big fan of Kane but I guess a lot of Spuds fans, especially those my age, would still lean towards Greaves as their best ever. Either way, two immense talents Greaves scored more goals in England’s top division than anyone before or since - and he did that despite a year spent in Italy where he won the Serie A title with AC Milan - with 357 goals in 516 games, which is a record that may never be broken.
In fact, the Premier League’s all-time record goalscorer, Alan Shearer, would only be fifth on the list if history was taken into account, with Greaves sitting clear at the top.
For England, Greaves had a better goals-to-minutes record than any of the greats - better than Bobby Charlton, Gary Lineker, Wayne Rooney or Shearer - 44 goals in just 57 internationals, complete with no less than six hat-tricks.
After a 15-year career Jimmy’s staggering statistics told the story... 422 goals in 602 appearances.Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles )
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Post by jesusmcmuffin on Nov 2, 2023 11:10:36 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles)Today's players are athletes , not beer bellied defenders/players and the game these days is so tactical , not kick a player etc and that will stop him. We could go on all day before we start on goalkeepers
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 2, 2023 11:19:42 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles ) I can’t agree on Rooney. Kane is a far better player for me. And the main reason, consistency. I’m not sure England have had a more consistent striker.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Nov 2, 2023 11:37:05 GMT
Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles)Today's players are athletes , not beer bellied defenders/players and the game these days is so tactical , not kick a player etc and that will stop him. We could go on all day before we start on goalkeepers I think the obvious answer to such things is to acknowledge that yesteryears players would benefit from everything the modern day player does were they playing today. The best players of today would be among the best players of yesteryear were they playing then and the best players of yesteryear would be among the best players of the modern day were they playing today. A great player is a great player and would be a great player whatever the era. Jimmy Greaves and Harry Kane would both be among the worlds top strikers whatever era they played in.
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Post by jesusmcmuffin on Nov 2, 2023 11:39:07 GMT
Today's players are athletes , not beer bellied defenders/players and the game these days is so tactical , not kick a player etc and that will stop him. We could go on all day before we start on goalkeepers I think the obvious answer to such things is to acknowledge that yesteryears players would benefit from everything the modern day player does were they playing today. The best players of today would be among the best players of yesteryear were they playing then and the best players of yesteryear would be among the best players of the modern day were they playing today. A great player is a great player and would be a great player whatever the era. Jimmy Greaves and Harry Kane would both be among the worlds top strikers whatever era they played in. Yep Both brilliant and of their time
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Post by lordb on Nov 2, 2023 12:07:13 GMT
Nowt against Kane and more a judgement of my sense of humour, but I would piss myself if Kane won fuck all at Bayern this season and Tottenham somehow manage to win the Premier League. fair enough You'd get very long odds on that I'd suggest
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Post by lordb on Nov 2, 2023 12:10:11 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles ) good post sir I think Kane is better than Rooney myself Charlton not really comparable as different positions, roles in the side If coming with am time England XI I think Kane would get in it now
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Post by bigvern on Nov 4, 2023 17:47:45 GMT
Another one in the onion bag already.
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Post by liathroid on Nov 4, 2023 17:48:54 GMT
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Nov 4, 2023 17:54:30 GMT
Another one in the onion bag already. Harry Kane. Making teams worse since 2013😉
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Post by bigvern on Nov 4, 2023 19:06:58 GMT
Number 2.
14 in 10 games.
A special time to be an England fan.
Please no injuries for next summer.
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Post by bigvern on Nov 4, 2023 19:25:34 GMT
Make that 15 in 10.
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Post by smallthorner on Nov 4, 2023 19:32:09 GMT
Completely different era. Fitness levels , so many things come into play. Some talk about the teams Kane scored v at International level but he did it in major tournaments also and what is rarely mentioned is the amount of England goals that Greaves scored in Home Internationals. A fair chunk of his total Correct. Today's players play on "billiard tables" compared with the quagmires in Greaves' day. Today referees protect players from rough tacklers that would "chop your legs off" in Greaves' day. In Greaves' day the ball was played in the air a lot more with big CFs, Greaves was different. Why was Greaves so much better than his peers? There has never been any other player who dominated goal scoring in any era before or since. 1. He was extremely skillfull and would have been fantastic on today's pitches. 2. He was a deadly accurate shooter; he rarely missed. 3. Like Matthews, he was extremely fast from a standing start, and could get away from his marker. 4. He was extremely intuitive and knew where to go to get into space or where to poach a goal. 5. He used his head; he didn't always blast a shot into the goal although he was perfectly capable of it. Greaves often held the ball and got the GK to commit himself (like many modern penalty takers) then he would pass the ball into the net, instead of blasting it. What is not realised is that although Greaves became the highest goal scorer again after the WC in 66 and played for England, Ramsay soon dropped him at a relatively young age because Ramsay thought he did not fit into his plans for the WC in Mexico in 1970. Greaves could have continued to play for England and amassed an even greater total of goals. Greaves was not Ramsay's sort of player, he was considered not to give 100% all of the time and "hang around" to score. Ramsay preferred players who ran and ran all match, not your more traditional strikers like Astle and Ritchie. He did give Astle a chance because he followed Greaves as the top scorer, but did not persist with him. Kane is an excellent player, one of the best ever, but IMO not as good as Greaves, Charlton, or Rooney. Whilst I'm on this topic, we should also not forget how good were Best, Law, and John Charles. (Who was John Charles some are asking? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Charles ) Top post. Mentioned on the Bobby Charlton thread my dad always used to rate Greaves as one of the greatest. He always used to say his favourite forward line (mixing eras of course) would be Matthews Steele Greaves Finney. With Neil Franklin dominating at the back.😊
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Post by robwahlmann on Nov 4, 2023 19:43:58 GMT
Two games for Jack and two clean sheets! Go on lad!
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Post by alsagerstokie on Nov 4, 2023 19:53:55 GMT
Kane and Bellingham right now 👌
Best two players in the world? Haaland obv up their.
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Post by thornestein on Nov 4, 2023 20:01:03 GMT
understandabley the first name on the Englands team sheet and shows Bayerns lack of knowledge conserning players
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 4, 2023 20:04:09 GMT
Flicked through the highlights of that stream higher up.
Without taking anything away from Kane, if Dortmund are one of the better sides in that league, it's a very poor standard this year.
I doubt whether Harry can believe the amount of time on the ball he's getting in front of goal.
Still, all he can do is stick them away and that's what he's doing so good on him. It's great to see him and Bellingham flourishing abroad. So many English players have struggled when moving to foreign climes. We'll need a few more picking up the skills of playing for top teams abroad if we're serious about winning something as a nation.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2023 23:42:40 GMT
3 more today to make 15 goals in his first 10 Bundesliga games . He must be one of the most composed finishers in world football
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Post by jimigoodwinsbeard on Nov 5, 2023 11:52:10 GMT
I agree with a lot of what bayernoatcake posts, but when he mentions kane and England would be a better team without him I have to roll my eyes a tad. The guy is one of the best finishers in world football.
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Nov 5, 2023 12:28:02 GMT
He’s an outstanding striker.
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