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Post by ted1965 on Mar 9, 2022 9:56:04 GMT
They say in foorball the better you are the luckier you are and while I am not a believer in omens I have to say football history is littered with such examples that maybe prove Stoke City and those attached to it just don’t have that fortune factor when it really matters.
We have never won the league, uet at least twice we should have, every supporter knows we only had to drawat Sheffield United to win the league, we of course lost and finished 4th the football world doesn’t know or even care at this point. In the season Derby won the league for the 2nd time we were top of the league before Easter and we should have won the league bur we suffered 5 broken legs to key members of the squad, please seriously 3would be unlucky but 5i in one season what does that indicate.
I use just one example Alex Ferguson, if Crystal Palace beat United in the cup final he gets sacked it’s not speculation but fact and the Ferguson dynasty never happens and who knows what follows for both parties.If he had been manager of Stoke chances are we would have lost a scrappy game and manager gome.
The 70s saw us cheated out of 2 FA CUP semi finals to Arsenal and given an even break we could be sitting now with 2 league titles, 1 ir 2 FA Cups to go with our only trophy the 1972 league cup a big dealt the time but now just an afterthought for many supporters.
Even getting into Europe came with a price Ipswich draw some Swedish part timers we get three time European cup holders Ajax outplay them over 180 minute and get fulsome praise from them and the Dutch media but lose on away goals.
There are plenty of other examples of the club just beginning to emerge as a force within the game for some calamity on or off the field to scupper the progress.
The roof not being insured, the consequences of such an action dismantling a side capable of actually winning something more than a solitary league cup, the fire sale resulting in another downturn in our fortunes.
Ritchie Barker having built an exciting football side who were entertaining to watch and giving pleasure suddenly decides to attend a Charles Hughes lecture on how long ball will be the transformation of the game and only masters of this new philosophy will dominate football for years to come, we got totally rinsed and and the wilderness years began. Yes Lou came and we looked on th way back till Celtic has problems the only club outside of Manchester United he would have walked forat the time and so the slide to Chic Bates and beyond continued.
I know we had the break of the Pulis years but even then we had so many false dawns and Hughes gave us 2 and half years of joy but he lost his bottle and couldn’t decide who we were or who wanted us to be and the project collapsed as the board shrugged and dithered over what to do next.even then we are playing some of the best football in the country at times and bearing the best of the best regularly and yet Leicester City win the league, when we played them at the Bet 365, we ripped them apart for 45 minutes and then imploded in the 2nd half and they escaped with a point.
MON, did a remarkable job with Northern Ireland and he has hinted at times he could repeat that here but every time we got momentum something stopped us in our tracks injuries to players who were vital to any success at the time, Campbell was on fire and so were we when he gets an season and possible career ending injury, will he ever be the same player again only time will tell. Harry gets a similar injury as we are looking good this season and once more the season stutters and finally implodes and we are once more floundering around in the middle of nowhere in football terms.
So what next we need a strong finish to the season or maybe the board will once more pull the managerial trigger and begin searching for the next great managerial hope whjo can change the fortunes of Stoke City but does he stand a chance looking at the history he will inherit.
I am fully aware that many other clubs can list many instances of where things could have turned for them but seriously have many clubs with our history had so many false dawns only to see them taken away one way or another. I only listed some there have been plenty of others but I need to consult a psychic and see if I am losing my marbles.
So here we are a story of near misses and what could have been and I wonder if things will ever be different or is this just our destiny within the football history books. The one thing I am sure of we as loyal supporters will continue to fight the history and love the club and hope once more one of those nearly moments come our way and maybe this time the football Gods will smile and say okay maybe it’s finally your turn but I won’t hold my breath.
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Post by somersetstokie on Mar 9, 2022 11:00:49 GMT
You could add specific events, particularly in our final Premier League season, which could have been so different. Butland dropping the ball into his own net. Charlie missing the penalty and the follow up rebound. Its usually very small margins that make the difference.
Sometimes things go the other way, like Banks saving the penalty from Geoff Hurst in the League Cup Semi Final.
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Post by stiggerstackle on Mar 9, 2022 11:09:23 GMT
Bloody hell Ted, as if we weren't depressed before!
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Post by OldStokie on Mar 9, 2022 11:41:11 GMT
Good post Ted, and so true. Every top manager in the world will tell you that you need some luck to be successful.
OS.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 11:49:10 GMT
The semi final loss on Pens.to Liverpool,who knows where we could be now,if we had got to the final and won it.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 9, 2022 11:58:23 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average.
I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each.
The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit.
In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England.
There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have.
As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be.
It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest.
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Post by lordb on Mar 9, 2022 12:32:23 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average. I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each. The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit. In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England. There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have. As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be. It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest. Birmingham haven't won the league or FA Cup either |
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Post by spitthedog on Mar 9, 2022 12:58:58 GMT
If I'm honest I don't expect Stoke to win any trophy or competition in my lifetime. I don't think this is being overly negative or lacking aspiration.
You just hope that we can compete well in the next game we play, that's always been the case for me.
Every game a cup final, or at least it should be.
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Post by cheadlepotter on Mar 9, 2022 13:20:43 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average. I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each. The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit. In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England. There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have. As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be. It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest. When we were at our best in the PL, Leicester were only two League Cup wins ahead of us and now look. For goodness sake, we put them in the 3rd division to get to the 1st. Since then they’ve won the league, the FA Cup, competed well in Europe. If we just say we’re shit and accept it, like SOT does, then we’ll stay shit. It’s not acceptable to me. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 9, 2022 13:45:45 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average. I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each. The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit. In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England. There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have. As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be. It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest. Birmingham haven't won the league or FA Cup either True. But two League Cups, an LC runner-up and two FA Cup runner-up spots would suggest they just nick it, imo. It's a battle of who's less shit though, fair enough. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 9, 2022 13:53:17 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average. I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each. The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit. In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England. There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have. As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be. It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest. When we were at our best in the PL, Leicester were only two League Cup wins ahead of us and now look. For goodness sake, we put them in the 3rd division to get to the 1st. Since then they’ve won the league, the FA Cup, competed well in Europe. If we just say we’re shit and accept it, like SOT does, then we’ll stay shit. It’s not acceptable to me. Leicester is a good comparison. First Division runners-up, FA Cup runner-up four times, three LC wins and two runners-up, all of which were before their most recent successes. I agree that we should be drawing on that as an inspiration for what is possible, but it's also safe to say that they'd done much better than we had for some time before winning the PL and FA Cup. As I said elsewhere, having very wealthy owners is usually a good thing and results in success. At Stoke, it seems to be something of a burden. It's weird. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2022 14:28:10 GMT
When we were at our best in the PL, Leicester were only two League Cup wins ahead of us and now look. For goodness sake, we put them in the 3rd division to get to the 1st. Since then they’ve won the league, the FA Cup, competed well in Europe. If we just say we’re shit and accept it, like SOT does, then we’ll stay shit. It’s not acceptable to me. Leicester is a good comparison. First Division runners-up, FA Cup runner-up four times, three LC wins and two runners-up, all of which were before their most recent successes. I agree that we should be drawing on that as an inspiration for what is possible, but it's also safe to say that they'd done much better than we had for some time before winning the PL and FA Cup. As I said elsewhere, having very wealthy owners is usually a good thing and results in success. At Stoke, it seems to be something of a burden. It's weird. I don't think it's a burden. We had 10 top flight years, Europe, our most successful run of top flight finishes ever, our first cup final and now FFP is restricting us more than the owners. Clubs like Bristol City can only dream of that and let's be honest we're not a massive club in the scheme of things. We can't use Leicester as an example as they are unique in what they've done. More success in recent times than the likes of Spurs, Villa and Everton who must wonder how. The sooner we can rid football of FFP the better |
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Post by Gods on Mar 9, 2022 14:33:34 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think.
I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that.
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Post by cheadlepotter on Mar 9, 2022 14:47:45 GMT
When we were at our best in the PL, Leicester were only two League Cup wins ahead of us and now look. For goodness sake, we put them in the 3rd division to get to the 1st. Since then they’ve won the league, the FA Cup, competed well in Europe. If we just say we’re shit and accept it, like SOT does, then we’ll stay shit. It’s not acceptable to me. Leicester is a good comparison. First Division runners-up, FA Cup runner-up four times, three LC wins and two runners-up, all of which were before their most recent successes. I agree that we should be drawing on that as an inspiration for what is possible, but it's also safe to say that they'd done much better than we had for some time before winning the PL and FA Cup. As I said elsewhere, having very wealthy owners is usually a good thing and results in success. At Stoke, it seems to be something of a burden. It's weird. We’d been FA Cup runners up and two semi finals, and once LC runners up too. Prior to their recent success I don’t think there was the world of difference. Of course they’d been slightly more successful. We can’t accept failure. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2022 15:02:47 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think. I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that. Yep go with that Gods. I always liked Stoke as a bit of an underdog team and why I started following them as a kid. Had no idea where Stoke was ..Still not sure at times 😂 Boro and West Brom I always thought 2 clubs similar to ourselves. |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Mar 9, 2022 15:03:10 GMT
Good post and why I think Jones could still be here and successful if even just one of a few moments had been different.
But Jones didn't seem to cope at all well with the pressure and was rightly sacked.
I still think O'Neill should have time despite what seems from the outside to be some strange decisions. He's got a lot right, and if we don't have the bad luck to key players next season, I expect us to challenge for automatic promotion.
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Post by onionman on Mar 9, 2022 15:14:02 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think. I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that. Yes, we're the Middlesbrough of the Midlands, in pretty much every respect. |
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Post by kidcrewbob on Mar 9, 2022 15:20:13 GMT
We've not been unlucky particularly this season - just shit for the most part on and off the field - he needs to go.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2022 15:34:14 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think. I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that. Yes, we're the Middlesbrough of the Midlands, in pretty much every respect. That's s good point 😃👌 |
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Post by onionman on Mar 9, 2022 15:47:03 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think. I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that. Yep go with that Gods. I always liked Stoke as a bit of an underdog team and why I started following them as a kid. Had no idea where Stoke was ..Still not sure at times 😂 Boro and West Brom I always thought 2 clubs similar to ourselves. I always thought we were the same as West Brom, but they've won 5 FA Cups, a league title and I just discovered they were runners up in the Football World Championship in 1888, which probably puts them on a par with Santos in the eyes of their fans. By the law of averages, most historic clubs from provincial towns have had at least one period where they took a turn at being unusually successful. I guess we got cheated out of our turn first by Hitler, then by a bad storm. |
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Post by shawi on Mar 9, 2022 15:47:31 GMT
Brilliant post Ted & spot on - I've lived through all those moments & emotions but it's in the blood so cannot be changed. Personally, I don't think there's anything to be gained by booting out MON - we've lacked direction for years & I think MON (although naive technically) has the best interests of The Club at heart.
Get this dire season over with, restructure with a Technical Director, sort out obvious defensive frailties .....& the rest
Live in Hope
or Live in The Glebe
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Post by thevoid on Mar 9, 2022 15:58:15 GMT
We had to win that game at Bramall Lane back in 1947 to win the title on goal average. I could live with being a Stoke fan if, at some point in our history, we had won all that there was to win, domestically at least. Even if it was just once each. The fact that we haven't managed that despite apparently having numerous world class players on a fairly regular basis is pretty shit. In fact, I can't really think of a bigger club, with more seasons in the top flight, that has been so consistently underwhelming throughout its history. It's like football and Stoke-on-Trent just don't really go together in the same way that rugby league just doesn't work outside of the north of England. There's only perhaps Birmingham City that approach Stoke in terms of size of club and general uselessness throughout their history, and even they've done better than we have. As a club, we're just shit, nearly always have been and probably always will be. It's not a bad thing to recognise and acknowledge as it helps put everything into perspective. As much as I like to see them do well, and as much as they frustrate me most of the time, I can laugh and shrug it off as being all rather meaningless really. Not an unhealthy way to look at it, I'd suggest. Middlesbrough? Perhaps Coventry? |
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Post by wuzza on Mar 9, 2022 17:27:15 GMT
Let’s face it things started badly in 1888 and we’ve never really recovered !!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2022 17:28:45 GMT
Yep go with that Gods. I always liked Stoke as a bit of an underdog team and why I started following them as a kid. Had no idea where Stoke was ..Still not sure at times 😂 Boro and West Brom I always thought 2 clubs similar to ourselves. I always thought we were the same as West Brom, but they've won 5 FA Cups, a league title and I just discovered they were runners up in the Football World Championship in 1888, which probably puts them on a par with Santos in the eyes of their fans. By the law of averages, most historic clubs from provincial towns have had at least one period where they took a turn at being unusually successful. I guess we got cheated out of our turn first by Hitler, then by a bad storm. I was thinking more before games were interrupted by the odd Brontosaurus when West Brom were good . In my time been nothing between us. Would put Wolves on a higher level, Coventry similar to us in many ways, FA Cup win aside. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 9, 2022 17:29:08 GMT
Has it been a false dawn?
He's had one good season from 3.
He should have been sacked after his 2nd.
As soon as it started, it should have been ended. I wouldn't call it a false dawn tbh.
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Post by silsdenstokie on Mar 9, 2022 17:30:58 GMT
Yeah Ive always thought as Boro and Birmingham as being the most similar to us for underachieving
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Post by somersetstokie on Mar 9, 2022 18:36:17 GMT
When we were at our best in the PL, Leicester were only two League Cup wins ahead of us and now look. For goodness sake, we put them in the 3rd division to get to the 1st. Since then they’ve won the league, the FA Cup, competed well in Europe. If we just say we’re shit and accept it, like SOT does, then we’ll stay shit. It’s not acceptable to me. First Division runners-up, FA Cup runner-up four times, three LC wins and two runners-up, all of which were before their most recent successes. I agree that we should be drawing on that as an inspiration for what is possible, but it's also safe to say that they'd done much better than we had for some time before winning the PL and FA Cup. As I said elsewhere, having very wealthy owners is usually a good thing and results in success. At Stoke, it seems to be something of a burden. It's weird. Strange that its not too long ago that many Stokies probably took Everton as a comparative yardstick for achievement. Regular top half finishes and the occasional Cup. A good role model for us in fact. Now they are one point above the relegation candidates. |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 9, 2022 18:39:12 GMT
Middlesbrough, we're most like Middlesbrough in our size and success (lack of) I think. I'm okay with that, I'd hate to support a team that half the nation purport to follow. There is nothing cool about that. Yes, we're the Middlesbrough of the Midlands, in pretty much every respect. Yep Middlesbrough is also grim as fuck |
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Post by somersetstokie on Mar 9, 2022 18:59:43 GMT
"Yep Middlesbrough is also grim as fuck"Yes. One time home of "The Smog Monsters"! 
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2022 19:10:17 GMT
Yes, we're the Middlesbrough of the Midlands, in pretty much every respect. Yep Middlesbrough is also grim as fuck I once read a stat that 1 In 7 people there had tried zHeroin. Surely that can't be right!!!! |
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