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Post by crapslinger on Oct 20, 2020 7:08:33 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
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Post by lordb on Oct 20, 2020 7:18:48 GMT
Not going to argue that it hasn't been a mess but the fact is the clubs experience mirrors that of other relegated clubs over the years I.e. Failed players on Premier League wages which you either can't shift or find it very difficult to do so.
All Premier League players are going to have to get two wages written into their contracts: a Premier League one and a Championship one - at genuine Championship rates not simply a cut.
That obviously doesn't happen now at any club
Some clubs have gone up and simply chosen not to join in with the money frenzy, obviously they come back down again but at least they are not burdened with obscene contracts.
A salary cap for the Championship, which is not going to be perfect, is bound to be on the cards.
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Post by Gods on Oct 20, 2020 7:20:01 GMT
This is the last season of parachute payments and they are only payable now at 20% or roughly £12m so I guess that is another factor in the 'financial realignment' for which we should read spend less not more !
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Post by spirered on Oct 20, 2020 7:25:26 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2020 7:34:41 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go 😁
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Post by mickstupp on Oct 20, 2020 7:35:06 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go I’m assuming that’s a piss take?
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 20, 2020 7:36:00 GMT
This is the last season of parachute payments and they are only payable now at 20% or roughly £12m so I guess that is another factor in the 'financial realignment' for which we should read spend less not more ! One lesson about this is that, whether you like or loath the concept of parachute payments (and personally I'd prefer PROPER relegation clauses in all our PL contracts) the whole point of parachute payments was to cover player contracts until those contracts expired. Irrespective of how contracts are worded to take account of relegation, we should never have reached relegation with big contracts which stretched beyond the term of the parachute payments - and that is the case with one or two of our player PL contracts which extend beyond the last parachute payment. Scholes should hang his head in shame for allowing that to happen.
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Post by RF10 on Oct 20, 2020 7:51:37 GMT
When a club has had a bad transfer window, it can take a couple of windows to out that right. When a club has had multiple bad windows in a row with players in situation we find, I believe it can take 4 transfer windows to get things how they should be. By the start of next season hopefully we have freed ourselves of the unwanted.
The job he has done with the first team has been great so far but he is referring to the large number of other players which make up the squad.
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Post by sneydgreenstokie1 on Oct 20, 2020 8:07:03 GMT
I think his frustration is simply with the sheer weight of the deadwood. We have done all we can in the market in the light of this - but with FFP we simply cannot just tear contracts up etc. unless the players have been with us for a long period of time
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Oct 20, 2020 8:43:05 GMT
Careful Michael “ snake behind you. “ it’s done for 4 managers and TD already
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Oct 20, 2020 9:06:18 GMT
Careful Michael “ snake behind you. “ it’s done for 4 managers and TD already Didn't realise he'd killed Trouserdog as well. Thought he'd been quiet.
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Post by scfc75 on Oct 20, 2020 9:12:58 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go I’m storming the training ground at 1pm to have him removed, are you with me?
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Post by zerps on Oct 20, 2020 9:25:06 GMT
Players would be hungry if their pay was performance based
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2020 10:00:16 GMT
I think it’s just important to remember that we’re going to be a bit hamstrung for a while longer yet by the awful dealings done in the last few prem years, and then after relegation itself. Despite all that, MON has already turned us into a solid non-shit side and I think it’s a safe bet we’re going to finish top half whilst developing some exciting young homegrown talent. In fact, the championship is a league where being merely non-shit might be enough to sneak promotion. Personally though, as weird as this is to say as a supporter that always wants the best, I think it would be best if we don’t go up for a few years yet. We need time to develop those young players and for the squad to become truly moulded in the gaffer’s vision. When we do go back up (and I think with this manager we will get promoted in the relatively near future) it will probably be for the best that we do so emphatically rather than sneak it through the playoffs as the 5th or 6th best team in the division.
With all that in mind I just think it’s important we don’t get too downhearted if we don’t build in this early season promise because I suspect there will be many bumps in the road to come, and it might be very frustrating for those who are dreaming of the playoffs after our decent start. If you think about the last time we got promoted, the season before we went into the final game with a shot at making the playoffs. I’m not so sure we would’ve had enough to survive if we had snook into 6th that year and gained promotion, whereas we went up automatically a year later and eventually finished well In the Prem the year after and spent a decade up there.
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Post by unknown182 on Oct 20, 2020 10:17:41 GMT
I think he obviously had other areas in mind to strengthen. But was told we need to get rid of Bauer and Wimmer first. He's in the same boat as the rest of us wondering why we handed them such long contracts.
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Post by lordb on Oct 20, 2020 11:12:04 GMT
When a club has had a bad transfer window, it can take a couple of windows to out that right. When a club has had multiple bad windows in a row with players in situation we find, I believe it can take 4 transfer windows to get things how they should be. By the start of next season hopefully we have freed ourselves of the unwanted. The job he has done with the first team has been great so far but he is referring to the large number of other players which make up the squad. Nearly Wimmer contract till 2022,Bauer the same I think?
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Post by Pugsley on Oct 20, 2020 11:14:25 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go Is this a serious post?
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Post by spitthedog on Oct 20, 2020 11:42:26 GMT
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go Is this a serious post? My guess...No!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2020 11:57:20 GMT
Careful Michael “ snake behind you. “ it’s done for 4 managers and TD already Why don't you write to Peter/John Coates to tell them how bad Scholes is. Seems to me that they think it is down to bad managerial decisions or are they just as incompetent as him? Surely the fees paid and length of contacts were agreed at board level?
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Post by wherty on Oct 20, 2020 12:07:03 GMT
I think its more a case of players they've been unable to get rid of on the big contracts.
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Post by spirered on Oct 20, 2020 12:13:28 GMT
sorry, let me add a winky thing
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 20, 2020 12:34:45 GMT
When a club has had a bad transfer window, it can take a couple of windows to out that right. When a club has had multiple bad windows in a row with players in situation we find, I believe it can take 4 transfer windows to get things how they should be. By the start of next season hopefully we have freed ourselves of the unwanted. The job he has done with the first team has been great so far but he is referring to the large number of other players which make up the squad. Nearly Wimmer contract till 2022,Bauer the same I think? What will Bauer be valued at in the books? We gave him a contract when we bought him and the book value will have been based on what we paid for him. Then we got relegated and offered him a new extended contract before the new manager arrived. What will his book value have been when he was awarded the extended contract - will it still have been based on the original fee we paid for him but amortised at a different rate to take account of the extension to the contract?
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Post by Squeekster on Oct 20, 2020 12:45:02 GMT
I think he knew what he was letting himself in for, although perhaps he thought some players might have moved on but that hasn't happened and that has limited the players he could bring in, it's a long term project here so any quick fix was never going to happen, unless by some fluke we get back up.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2020 12:51:02 GMT
Seems as though he isn't impressed with our transfer dealings under this regime from the Sentinel:
He said: “Yeah I think it is – slowly, because we haven’t been able to possibly change the personnel as much as we’d have liked because of the contractual situation of players at the club.
“But I think the players we’ve brought in have all been positives, both in the previous window and this window.
“We’re realigning the club a little bit, financially as well, so there’s that aspect to deal with as well.
“We want a hungry team, a team that is reflective of what Stoke stand for, I think, when the club was successful.
“What we’ve managed to do is get some of the younger players around as well, players who couldn’t get near it because of the bodies that we had and the signings we made.
“It’s taking shape. It’s still a long way from where I would like it to be but I think we’re going in the right direction.”
What sort of a mess have the "transfer" overseen.
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go I assume this is a joke
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Post by hardcastle on Oct 20, 2020 13:58:36 GMT
OK. Appreciate that this goes against the will of the 'string him up' brigade, but if Scholes takes the hit for some of the poor (strategic) decisions taken by the club in recent years (the late timing of Hughes' dismissal, the fincially damaging signings of Wimmer, Saido and Imbula, and the poor managerial appointments since Hughes), is he not also entitled to share in the glow of the decisions we did get very right:
- appointing TP and Hughes in the first place, - the first rate player recruitment record of 2006 to 2009 (on which TP's success was built), - building the new training ground, - the thrill of Wembley and the European campaign, - the timing of TP's dismissal, - backing Hughes in bringing Bojan, Arnie and Shaq here, and - the appointment of MON?
After all, what's good for the goose and all that.
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Post by femark on Oct 20, 2020 14:05:00 GMT
Nearly Wimmer contract till 2022,Bauer the same I think? What will Bauer be valued at in the books? We gave him a contract when we bought him and the book value will have been based on what we paid for him. Then we got relegated and offered him a new extended contract before the new manager arrived. What will his book value have been when he was awarded the extended contract - will it still have been based on the original fee we paid for him but amortised at a different rate to take account of the extension to the contract? It'll be based on his amortised value at the point of contract extension. So if we paid £5m on a 5 year contract and offered him a contract extension after a year. His value at the point of extension would be £4m and that would be amortised over the 5 years of the new contract.
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Post by lordb on Oct 20, 2020 14:07:51 GMT
What will Bauer be valued at in the books? We gave him a contract when we bought him and the book value will have been based on what we paid for him. Then we got relegated and offered him a new extended contract before the new manager arrived. What will his book value have been when he was awarded the extended contract - will it still have been based on the original fee we paid for him but amortised at a different rate to take account of the extension to the contract? It'll be based on his amortised value at the point of contract extension. So if we paid £5m on a 5 year contract and offered him a contract extension after a year. His value at the point of extension would be £4m and that would be amortised over the 5 years of the new contract. So we will probably pay him off February 2022
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Post by nott1 on Oct 20, 2020 14:14:56 GMT
TS gets a lot of stick but but I doubt it's his decision to buy ANY player we have ever signed or made any decision regarding how much they get paid. He may make the odd suggestion (possibly) but it's not his money that is used, and I'm certain he does not write any cheques without the agreement of those above him. In other words he is virtually blameless for signing the likes of Wimmer,Berahino, Bauer et al.
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Post by captainmainwaring on Oct 20, 2020 15:01:14 GMT
TS gets a lot of stick but but I doubt it's his decision to buy ANY player we have ever signed or made any decision regarding how much they get paid. He may make the odd suggestion (possibly) but it's not his money that is used, and I'm certain he does not write any cheques without the agreement of those above him. In other words he is virtually blameless for signing the likes of Wimmer,Berahino, Bauer et al. Correct.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Oct 20, 2020 15:41:45 GMT
This is nothing new, he was aware of the transfer situation a year ago. However, he really should have forseen the impact of Covid which has limited the chance of finding new clubs for a number of the fringe players... For this reason O'Neill must go Is this a serious post? I seriously hope not. I am going to assume its just humour
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