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Post by Scouse on Sept 10, 2020 7:39:54 GMT
Hopefully this will cover the doomsday scenario of how supporters can help , or indeed are willing or prepared to help ensure the survival of their clubs and therefore not merged with attendance threads
The latest govt Covid announcement re crowds at elite support level , puts the survival of many clubs , including ours at real risk
Some supporters have previously expressed the view ‘we’re alright Jack ‘ that with wealthy local owners we’ll be fine , that all additional costing fall on the board and they’ll pay..will they
.I hope they’re right , but are they both in the real sense , and in the morale sense , just how secure is the club and as supporters shouldn’t we be helping?
The opening question , what are fans , not the board , prepared to do to ensure ( or try to ensure ) the survival of this club , be that nothing , buy a ST at announced 11 /11 terms with the likelihood of a disrupted Or non attended season , grant the club permission to hold their EB monies with no priority status or other claim ( A number of options similar to the refunding of last years ST monies should have been at least the minimum starting point there IMO ) or renew ST ( or providing funds ) on mass with no likelihood of seeing games ?
Please no name calling
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Post by flea79 on Sept 10, 2020 7:57:20 GMT
A little pessimistic
But there was a discussion had last year where all chairmen place the clubs into voluntary administration which would help in some way but it relies on everybody being straight with it and not poaching players etc
Somebody much more educated will explain it I’m sure
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Post by Veritas on Sept 10, 2020 8:00:50 GMT
I think the impact of supporter action will not be great in the overall scheme of things. However, for my part I am happy to sign up for a revised season ticket even if the prospect of actually attending doesn’t seem that promising at present.
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Post by thehoof on Sept 10, 2020 8:34:40 GMT
Unfortunately it’s the way of the world.
If the club cease to exist it’s not like losing one of your family, or struggling to put food on the table which is a reality for many people these days.
I wouldn’t do anything- yes, I’d miss it, but it’s not the biggest disaster that could happen.
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Post by Scouse on Sept 10, 2020 8:57:29 GMT
Veritas .. agreed , like you I think supporter action will be low , very low
In clubs planning for fans return I’ve only seen PNE give a very abridged version of their expected costing and short fall .. ..from memory they estimated running costs of 18m+ , EFL contribution £7m , owners with a shortfall of over 10m to find
The confidence of fans to renew even limited ST in many cases was probably flatlined by yesterdays announcement, the picture at best is no clearer than the back end of EB ..and that left even taking into account the impact of the unknown relegation threat , normal non renewals etc ,if rumour and anecdotal evidence by people’s online comments a high percentage of people who didn’t have the confidence to renew then
Will they in more pressing times to help their club
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Post by chiswickpotter on Sept 10, 2020 9:09:28 GMT
For Stoke City, its a non-issue. If online gambling continues with games behind closed doors, our owners will continue to generate way more than is needed to fund the club. If there was a catastrophic scenario of say a 12 month national lockdown then the situation may be challenging but even then, Stoke City would be among the best placed clubs in the country. Generally, the current situation is relatively good for us, that's why we have been able to sign a few high wage players and pay a fee for Brown in contrast to many of the clubs we are competing with and despite the FFP challenges we face.
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Post by Gods on Sept 10, 2020 9:29:37 GMT
We have eye watering debt.
Strange to think that towards the end of our tenure in the Prem the Chairman announced a 'break even' strategy.
It's all gone Pete Tong since then.
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Post by thehoof on Sept 10, 2020 9:50:56 GMT
I have not seen the Accounts, but I thought that the debt was in the form of Directors Loans?
Perhaps ( if that is the case) the Coates family will convert the loans into share capital ( as they did several years ago), meaning that the Club has very little debt, but the Owners ( the Coates family) have an investment that they would probably not be able to recover, if they chose to sell up.
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Post by followyoudown on Sept 10, 2020 12:16:50 GMT
For Stoke City, its a non-issue. If online gambling continues with games behind closed doors, our owners will continue to generate way more than is needed to fund the club. If there was a catastrophic scenario of say a 12 month national lockdown then the situation may be challenging but even then, Stoke City would be among the best placed clubs in the country. Generally, the current situation is relatively good for us, that's why we have been able to sign a few high wage players and pay a fee for Brown in contrast to many of the clubs we are competing with and despite the FFP challenges we face. Agreed I think FFP has to be changed ultimately many clubs will require money from their owners just to survive yet the losses incurred likely trigger FFP penalties and hamper your attempts to get money back from being promoted so why bother unless you are mega rich. A sensible change would be to scrap limits on director investment and allow money to be input by increasing share capital and or loans direct from owner but not allow bank / third party loans to be used so the club cant be left in the shit if the owner leaves. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2020 12:46:58 GMT
I'd like to take it out of SCFC grounds and open it up to all of football. Given what the country are going through and the amount of people losing their jobs, I would guess that a certain cross section of the general football 'family' supporter base are losing a lot of patience with football and certainly the higher echelons of the game. I think it's fair to say that some were anyway with the year on year inflation in fees, signing on fees and salary.
Some of it out of jealousy? In a pre covid world quite possibly.
In a Covid and even post covid world full of job losses, ever growing queues at food banks, furlough schemes and a general fight for survival I would think that a lot of people are fast at the point of no return with football in some quarters. I would say many would take the stance of 'why can't football help itself?' given PL clubs are still spending money like it's going out of fashion.
It's a very hard point to argue against and is something I personally wanted to see at the start of lockdown. I felt and still do feel that too much energy and time was spent trying to complete the season as a short term fix, rather than stepping back, looking at the bigger picture, asking the very basic question of 'what if?' (in terms of the virus returning) and trying to fathom a way across all platforms to protect the long term future of our clubs across the entire spectrum and pyramid.
As long as the Premier League teams can compete and finish games, their TV money is safe and their game will only grow stronger in the longer term. The rest it seems, have had the ladder pulled up, been labelled 'Jack' and been told that the bigger boys are 'sodding the rest'.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2020 13:07:47 GMT
I wonder what the difference between the total ticket revenue for a season and the highest paid yearly salary of our players ?
GD
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Post by lordb on Sept 10, 2020 13:10:30 GMT
I wonder what the difference between the total ticket revenue for a season and the highest paid yearly salary of our players ? GD Just that 1 player? We do have other revenues of course |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2020 13:17:52 GMT
I wonder what the difference between the total ticket revenue for a season and the highest paid yearly salary of our players ? GD Just that 1 player? We do have other revenues of course Yes, Just that one top income player GD |
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Post by leicspotter on Sept 10, 2020 17:52:14 GMT
Hopefully this will cover the doomsday scenario of how supporters can help , or indeed are willing or prepared to help ensure the survival of their clubs and therefore not merged with attendance threads The latest govt Covid announcement re crowds at elite support level , puts the survival of many clubs , including ours at real risk Some supporters have previously expressed the view ‘we’re alright Jack ‘ that with wealthy local owners we’ll be fine , that all additional costing fall on the board and they’ll pay..will they .I hope they’re right , but are they both in the real sense , and in the morale sense , just how secure is the club and as supporters shouldn’t we be helping? The opening question , what are fans , not the board , prepared to do to ensure ( or try to ensure ) the survival of this club , be that nothing , buy a ST at announced 11 /11 terms with the likelihood of a disrupted Or non attended season , grant the club permission to hold their EB monies with no priority status or other claim ( A number of options similar to the refunding of last years ST monies should have been at least the minimum starting point there IMO ) or renew ST ( or providing funds ) on mass with no likelihood of seeing games ? Please no name calling I think the first stage would be for the club (any club really) to identify the problem they have and decide if / how fans mighty be able to help. In the case of SCFC, if the owners really did face a financial abyss, maybe brought about by FFP rather than any reluctance on their part to fund the shortfall, then they should make that clear to supporters and suggest how we might help. They might be surprised by the response. Circumstances will dictate just what each individual is able to do I doubt anyone would want to see their club go bust, and most would want to help, within the restrictions of what they can afford, but would probably also want to see how the players and staff were doing their bit. After all, why should someone on minimum wage bail out the salary of the likes of Wimmer and co? |
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Post by bloody56 on Sept 11, 2020 10:04:19 GMT
A little pessimistic But there was a discussion had last year where all chairmen place the clubs into voluntary administration which would help in some way but it relies on everybody being straight with it and not poaching players etc Somebody much more educated will explain it I’m sure Not an option that the Stoke board would want to pursue, because it would bankrupt a lot of small local firms that supply goods and services to football clubs. |
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 11, 2020 11:09:59 GMT
A little pessimistic But there was a discussion had last year where all chairmen place the clubs into voluntary administration which would help in some way but it relies on everybody being straight with it and not poaching players etc Somebody much more educated will explain it I’m sure Not an option that the Stoke board would want to pursue, because it would bankrupt a lot of small local firms that supply goods and services to football clubs. The Rangers liquidation a few years back gave a good example of this: Revealed: The 276 victims owed cash by debt-ridden Rangers |
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Post by Somebody_Told_Me on Sept 11, 2020 11:25:54 GMT
A little pessimistic But there was a discussion had last year where all chairmen place the clubs into voluntary administration which would help in some way but it relies on everybody being straight with it and not poaching players etc Somebody much more educated will explain it I’m sure Not an option that the Stoke board would want to pursue, because it would bankrupt a lot of small local firms that supply goods and services to football clubs. I agree, but leicester did it(albiet not on mass as suggested above). Couldn't afford their 30m stadium, then look what happened!! Rather than struggle for years trying to repay. Final 5.5m written off, even £16k to Ambulance service. I know someone that lost their whole business because of it. CNUTS! |
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Sept 12, 2020 19:48:16 GMT
Hopefully this will cover the doomsday scenario of how supporters can help , or indeed are willing or prepared to help ensure the survival of their clubs and therefore not merged with attendance threads The latest govt Covid announcement re crowds at elite support level , puts the survival of many clubs , including ours at real risk Some supporters have previously expressed the view ‘we’re alright Jack ‘ that with wealthy local owners we’ll be fine , that all additional costing fall on the board and they’ll pay..will they .I hope they’re right , but are they both in the real sense , and in the morale sense , just how secure is the club and as supporters shouldn’t we be helping? The opening question , what are fans , not the board , prepared to do to ensure ( or try to ensure ) the survival of this club , be that nothing , buy a ST at announced 11 /11 terms with the likelihood of a disrupted Or non attended season , grant the club permission to hold their EB monies with no priority status or other claim ( A number of options similar to the refunding of last years ST monies should have been at least the minimum starting point there IMO ) or renew ST ( or providing funds ) on mass with no likelihood of seeing games ? Please no name calling You will be interested in the FSA "Sustain the Game" campaign, and will see that the Stoke City Supporters Club is in the list of backing organisations thefsa.org.uk/our-work/sustainthegame/ |
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