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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 5, 2020 14:36:42 GMT
I meant trophy wise. Ie fuck all. It's a massive budget in Scotland   true he never managed to win the league and only a couple of domestic cups to show for his time there so fair point...but woefully inadequate?  Rangers have to compete with Celtic who spent 9m on just one player and have a much bigger budget in fairness to Gerrard he has closed what was a huge gap in a relatively short space of time.If he stays I think he will get them very close Maybe you have one thing right as he is fairing better than Celtic in Europe but not domestically I think so. Under Benitez they should have got a couple. It was poor. They do but it's still a massive budget for Scotland. And Celtic have an appalling manager, not beating a side by Neil Lennon is just shite imo. And they do spent a lot but they generate a lot too with player sales. I just thought he'd do better. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 5, 2020 14:47:40 GMT
I don't follow your argument. Gerrard didn't have Tom Ince, Vokes and Gregory in front of him either? No, but he had Hamman or Alonso behind him which allowed him a freer role and to excel. To turn my argument around, so that you understand it, if he had Jordan Cousins or Geoff Cameron behind him as DM, he probably wouldn't have been as good as he could be. I'm no Gerrard apologist, but I feel you and Bayern are being driven by a different agenda  I don't have any opinion on him as a person either way, so I'm not really sure what you mean? He went gallivanting off whether that class of DM was behind him or not, and if that kind of player wasn't there to cover that space, it created problems. The classier midfield players of the time - Scholes, Iniesta etc, had more footballing intelligence to pick their moments. They were also able to adapt their game. Gerrard had a bash at that by sitting deeper as his legs started to go but couldn't really do it - him playing as a sitter in Brazil in 2014 was an unmitigated disaster and one that Tabarez and Uruguay openly targeted. |
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Post by marylandstoke on Mar 5, 2020 15:25:17 GMT
I know a lot of people on here know loads more about the game than I do but, it’s a genuine question and a possible analogy.
Tin hat on and buckled.
Isn't what some have said here a similar situation to Joe Allen. Off to Wales and the internationals often looks pure class surrounded by players who do the hod carrying and the hole fixing. Surrounded by journeymen and charity workers bang average springer spaniel chasing a balloon.
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Post by Pugsley on Mar 5, 2020 18:31:01 GMT
Gerrard has done a great job at Rangers, only a know nothing fool would say other wise.
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tricky
Spectator
long time coming..
Posts: 22 
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Post by tricky on Mar 5, 2020 18:50:37 GMT
Well said Pugs. Bayern talking absolute shite again
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Post by Pugsley on Mar 5, 2020 19:26:19 GMT
Well said Pugs. Bayern talking absolute shite again It's just his opinion. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 5, 2020 19:52:14 GMT
I know a lot of people on here know loads more about the game than I do but, it’s a genuine question and a possible analogy. Tin hat on and buckled. Isn't what some have said here a similar situation to Joe Allen. Off to Wales and the internationals often looks pure class surrounded by players who do the hod carrying and the hole fixing. Surrounded by journeymen and charity workers bang average springer spaniel chasing a balloon. Who’s the class DM Wales have that covers for him? |
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Post by Kpsje on Mar 5, 2020 19:52:18 GMT
always liked gerrard as a player and wish him well as a manager. don’t understand why some people wish him bad luck
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 5, 2020 19:55:02 GMT
Well said Pugs. Bayern talking absolute shite again How? They’ve had a massive budget and he’s got them fighting for second. Celtic have an awful manager and shouldn’t be as far ahead as they are. He’s been backed to the hilt and won nothing? That’s poor. |
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Post by skip on Mar 5, 2020 22:05:52 GMT
Footballer finds managing without sod all training and experience difficult shock.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 5, 2020 22:09:34 GMT
Footballer finds managing without sod all training and experience difficult shock. But he’s been brilliant. He’s got a team that finished 3rd two seasons on the bounce to finish second. |
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Post by adi on Mar 5, 2020 22:11:09 GMT
true he never managed to win the league and only a couple of domestic cups to show for his time there so fair point...but woefully inadequate? Rangers have to compete with Celtic who spent 9m on just one player and have a much bigger budget in fairness to Gerrard he has closed what was a huge gap in a relatively short space of time.If he stays I think he will get them very close Maybe you have one thing right as he is fairing better than Celtic in Europe but not domestically I think so. Under Benitez they should have got a couple. It was poor. They do but it's still a massive budget for Scotland. And Celtic have an appalling manager, not beating a side by Neil Lennon is just shite imo. And they do spent a lot but they generate a lot too with player sales. I just thought he'd do better. I’m no fan of Neil Lennon but appalling? Not great at Bolton but lost on average 4ish games a year for Celtic, and a good return for Hibs suggests he’s not appalling, at least not in Scotland. |
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Post by zerps on Mar 5, 2020 22:13:49 GMT
Footballer finds managing without sod all training and experience difficult shock. But he’s been brilliant. He’s got a team that finished 3rd two seasons on the bounce to finish second. Define league? It’s a sham. |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Mar 6, 2020 15:50:34 GMT
Is there a case that the whole ‘great player’ thing is vastly overrated with Gerrard? Yes, a talismanic leader for Liverpool, scored some great goals, dragged them back from the brink a lot, so in that regard, beloved by them and rightly so. Yet he was also the classic Roy of the Rovers, desperate to be the hero kind who’d go charging off to leave huge gaps, had zero tactical awareness and really required a proper, intelligent DM behind him to allow him to thrive. Istanbul wouldn’t have happened without Hamann coming on, while he was never quite as good after Alonso left. He was also never quite it for England, bar maybe a decent Euro 2012. That he and Lampard could never figure out a way to play together arguably reflects a little on them too, though not as badly as on Sven and McClaren. Very good, iconic player but not in the class of a Pirlo, Gatusso, Iniesta, Xavi and IMO not in Scholes’ class and not as good as Lampard. I never made my mind up who was better between Lampard and Gerrard, but thought it must be the managers' faults that they never really did the business for England. There are a few who fall under that bracket from that England-era, and I wonder if they couldn't handle the pressure. I remember a stat where England did better with both Lampard and Gerrard in the team, rather than one or the other. At club level, Lampard had better players all around him, whereas 2 or 3 players (including Gerrard) often carried Liverpool. Although I called Gerrard a great player, he definitely wasn't in the class of Pirlo, Iniesta, Xavi and Scholes. I didn't see Gatusso much. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 6, 2020 15:53:47 GMT
Is there a case that the whole ‘great player’ thing is vastly overrated with Gerrard? Yes, a talismanic leader for Liverpool, scored some great goals, dragged them back from the brink a lot, so in that regard, beloved by them and rightly so. Yet he was also the classic Roy of the Rovers, desperate to be the hero kind who’d go charging off to leave huge gaps, had zero tactical awareness and really required a proper, intelligent DM behind him to allow him to thrive. Istanbul wouldn’t have happened without Hamann coming on, while he was never quite as good after Alonso left. He was also never quite it for England, bar maybe a decent Euro 2012. That he and Lampard could never figure out a way to play together arguably reflects a little on them too, though not as badly as on Sven and McClaren. Very good, iconic player but not in the class of a Pirlo, Gatusso, Iniesta, Xavi and IMO not in Scholes’ class and not as good as Lampard. I never made my mind up who was better between Lampard and Gerrard, but thought it must be the managers' faults that they never really did the business for England. There are a few who fall under that bracket from that England-era, and I wonder if they couldn't handle the pressure. I remember a stat where England did better with both Lampard and Gerrard in the team, rather than one or the other. At club level, Lampard had better players all around him, whereas 2 or 3 players (including Gerrard) often carried Liverpool. Although I called Gerrard a great player, he definitely wasn't in the class of Pirlo, Iniesta, Xavi and Scholes. I didn't see Gatusso much. I never realised quite what a good player Lampard was until we got promoted and I saw him live. He was a real orchestrator, everything went through him. Very intelligent player. I think Gerrard could drag Liverpool back into games with his talismanic qualities (the 06 cup final being a case in point) but he could become part of the problem himself at times when he didn't have a cleverer, calmer head to run things when he got the urge to indulge his superman routine. |
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Post by stokeykez on Mar 6, 2020 21:11:11 GMT
Any other club he would be a goner, no doubt he will land a prem/champ club soon
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Post by thanksjon on Mar 6, 2020 22:59:17 GMT
He seems to struggle with tactics and man management.He could be our next manager.
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Mar 7, 2020 0:53:26 GMT
I know a lot of people on here know loads more about the game than I do but, it’s a genuine question and a possible analogy. Tin hat on and buckled. Isn't what some have said here a similar situation to Joe Allen. Off to Wales and the internationals often looks pure class surrounded by players who do the hod carrying and the hole fixing. Surrounded by journeymen and charity workers bang average springer spaniel chasing a balloon. Isn't Allen the hod carrier and hole fixer for Wales? |
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