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Post by wannabee on May 3, 2024 14:39:31 GMT
If it saves their own skins though, I don’t understand why they wouldn’t just name names. Do Singh and vdB love Vennells that much they wouldn’t even contemplate throwing her under the bus? A long shot of speculation on my part. But have they all sat down together with their with their legal representatives and come to the conclusion, that if one blabs, then it'll set off a chain reaction and they will all individualy end up in jail and ultimately, the only way they can avoid that eventuality, is to close ranks in an organised conspiracy of defence? It's a variation on the quote variously ascribed to Mark Twain/Abe Lincoln "It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid, than to open it and remove all doubt .... of your Guilt and proceed to Gaol"
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Post by chuffedstokie on May 3, 2024 14:42:25 GMT
To get any of this lot in front of a jury you'd want them charged with whatever carries the longest prison sentence. Some of the evidence would have to be almost 'de-complicated' in order to knit the components together in a sensible timeline. Maybe Singh and Co (not a firm of estate agents 🙂) can see this coming and are going down the damage limitation route.
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Post by PotteringThrough on May 3, 2024 17:07:27 GMT
This was a good exchange today:
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Post by iancransonsknees on May 3, 2024 18:23:46 GMT
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Post by chuffedstokie on May 3, 2024 18:44:26 GMT
Comprehensively dismantled and humiliated. Idiot.
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Post by iancransonsknees on May 3, 2024 19:00:08 GMT
They deserve prison for so obviously lying.
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Post by OldStokie on May 3, 2024 19:15:42 GMT
Surely, in a case before a jury of 'Twelve men good and true', he, and many others during this inquiry would be found guilty of lying and obfuscating before a court if they peddled out the same lies upon lies. The burden of finding them guilty 'beyond reasonable doubt' would be established. As a collective, as others have said, they've obviously been told to not remember anything that could incriminate them.
OS.
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Post by Veritas on May 3, 2024 19:22:00 GMT
Surely, in a case before a jury of 'Twelve men good and true', he, and many others during this inquiry would be found guilty of lying and obfuscating before a court if they peddled out the same lies upon lies. The burden of finding them guilty 'beyond reasonable doubt' would be established. As a collective, as others have said, they've obviously been told to not remember anything that could incriminate them. OS. Send them down
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Post by oggyoggy on May 3, 2024 19:35:28 GMT
They deserve prison for so obviously lying. Or at the very least struck from the roll of solicitors
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Post by PotteringThrough on May 4, 2024 8:07:20 GMT
They deserve prison for so obviously lying. Or at the very least struck from the roll of solicitors He probably can’t remember if he’s on it…
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Post by potteringermany on May 4, 2024 18:10:33 GMT
Or at the very least struck from the roll of solicitors He probably can’t remember if he’s on it… He bloody should do! He saved it on his computer and printed it off, just to remember.
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Post by Northy on May 5, 2024 8:01:32 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 5, 2024 9:36:34 GMT
LOCK. HIM. UP.
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 5, 2024 10:18:04 GMT
If he doesn't serve jail time I'll be amazed. Put him on the stand in a criminal trial and he'll copulate sic 😀
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on May 6, 2024 9:16:22 GMT
Clearly there are a group of people desperately trying to cover their arses who knew what they did was wrong. But equally this is a textbook case of the Peter Principle - people getting promoted way beyond their level of competence. A lot of public money has flowed into the hands of people who are staggeringly incompetent. I'm not sure that in itself is a criminal matter but anyone in a profession should certainly get struck off and never allowed to practice again.
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 7, 2024 10:55:42 GMT
The more evidence heard the more it's a bloody holiday camp at the post office where no one was reading emails, frequently not understanding any email they did read and in the case of jarnail getting a job without the ability to save a document.
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Post by iancransonsknees on May 7, 2024 11:36:38 GMT
The more evidence heard the more it's a bloody holiday camp at the post office where no one was reading emails, frequently not understanding any email they did read and in the case of jarnail getting a job without the ability to save a document. It'd be amazing to know if any of them admitted these things on receipt of the original emails or if they just blagged their way through.
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Post by wannabee on May 7, 2024 14:28:07 GMT
The more evidence heard the more it's a bloody holiday camp at the post office where no one was reading emails, frequently not understanding any email they did read and in the case of jarnail getting a job without the ability to save a document. It puts me in mind of what Hilary Clinton said to Gen Petraeus and Ambassador Crocker in the Senate Iraq Inquiry "Despite what I view is your rather extraordinary efforts in your testimony both yesterday and today, I think that the reports that you provide to us really require a willing suspension of disbelief." Jason Beer KC is an excellent Prosecutor but he doesn’t need to elicit a confession from witnesses just expose the implausibility of their evidence to Wyn Williams to write his final Report. In a Court of Law I would expect a more adversarial approach to witnesses on Trial who I'd expect to sweating more profusely that Prince Andrew
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Post by Paul Spencer on May 7, 2024 15:20:47 GMT
The more evidence heard the more it's a bloody holiday camp at the post office where no one was reading emails, frequently not understanding any email they did read and in the case of jarnail getting a job without the ability to save a document. It puts me in mind of what Hilary Clinton said to Gen Petraeus and Ambassador Crocker in the Senate Iraq Inquiry "Despite what I view is your rather extraordinary efforts in your testimony both yesterday and today, I think that the reports that you provide to us really require a willing suspension of disbelief." Jason Beer KC is an excellent Prosecutor but he doesn’t need to elicit a confession from witnesses just expose the implausibility of their evidence to Wyn Williams to write his final Report. In a Court of Law I would expect a more adversarial approach to witnesses on Trial who I'd expect to sweating more profusely that Prince Andrew Yes there has been many an occasion whilst watching the proceedings, that I've thought to myself, that if this was actually a court of law, just how many times so far, would we have heard the words ... "permission to treat the witness as a hostile witness your honour?"
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 9, 2024 9:15:40 GMT
Someone with a functioning memory and recall.
Hallelujah
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 9, 2024 9:42:30 GMT
Loving Simon Clarke seeing a bus coming and chucking old Jarnail right in front of it.
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Post by metalhead on May 9, 2024 20:44:29 GMT
Someone with a functioning memory and recall. Hallelujah What have I missed?
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 9, 2024 21:35:33 GMT
Someone with a functioning memory and recall. Hallelujah What have I missed? Just a bloke who could actually remember who he emailed. What he emailed. Who he interacted with etc. Shouldn't be big news but given the ineptitude of post office staff he was able to call it out. This was Simon Clarke the barrister who eventually stopped prosecutions.
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Post by chuffedstokie on May 10, 2024 5:02:12 GMT
Loving Simon Clarke seeing a bus coming and chucking old Jarnail right in front of it. I sincerely hope that the CPS are taking copious notes.
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 10, 2024 11:10:50 GMT
Poor Rod.
Doesn't seem to know very much at all only the fact he was overworked.
Sir Wynn obviously has a night out in the city planned too.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on May 14, 2024 10:09:50 GMT
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Post by salopstick on May 14, 2024 11:04:46 GMT
its a tough one. its not as black or white as the headline
the govt accept that over turning the majority may include some that were guilty but they accept thats the price to pay for exonnerating the innocent.
the ones that have been through the courts already is only 13: They are excluded from the Bill because the Government believes that we should tread very carefully where judges in the senior appellant courts have considered a case on its merits. “We recognise this approach may leave a small number of individuals concerned about the way forward for their cases.”
The DWP ones are totally different: “These cases, unlike many of the cases prosecuted by the Post Office or CPS involved wider corroborating evidence beyond that supplied by the faulty Horizon system and so are unlikely to be unsafe in the same way.”
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Post by wannabee on May 14, 2024 11:06:55 GMT
Are they many more ways the Government can Fuck this Up? 13 Convictions will not be overturned which reached the Court of Appeal 7 of those appeals were upheld but 6 appeals were not even heard i.e. in exactly the same position as those Postmasters whose convictions are being quashed. Never mind that the Inquiry has already established that evidence was withheld from the Defence, a criminal act. Talk about making it hard for yourself The longer term consequences is that it gives ammunition to those people who bizarrely believe the Postmasters were guilty somehow
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Post by salopstick on May 14, 2024 11:10:32 GMT
Are they many more ways the Government can Fuck this Up? 13 Convictions will not be overturned which reached the Court of Appeal 7 of those appeals were upheld but 6 appeals were not even heard i.e. in exactly the same position as those Postmasters whose convictions are being quashed. Never mind that the Inquiry has already established that evidence was withheld from the Defence, a criminal act. Talk about making it hard for yourself The longer term consequences is that it gives ammunition to those people who bizarrely believe the Postmasters were guilty somehow by moaning about the DWP ones which on the face of it uses different evidence doesnt help the ones that have already appealed its very difficult to deploy a one size fits all approach
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Post by fullmetaljacket on May 15, 2024 8:52:16 GMT
Poor form yesterday by Wyn not to allow questions from the participants solicitors.
Hope to god he's not a government shill.
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