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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 25, 2019 9:25:30 GMT
Is it feasible that you might suspend a Manager for one or two matches during an "enquiry" and put the Youth team manager in charge, just to see if a different face, might have an effect. If there was a reasonable response we would then probably confirm that the problem is Jones and not the players or the fans.
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Post by berahinosgoals on Sept 25, 2019 9:25:47 GMT
Not fishing. GR is the best man for the job if they sack Jones. He is.
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Post by Rt Hon Reverend Luvpump on Sept 25, 2019 9:26:21 GMT
To be honest, how often do you see a squad that has spent the money it has, with the quality and potential the squad obviously has, being in this position? 1 win takes us within touching distance of 21st. I don't think you can look at the record books too much. If we replace Jones this week, or even next, a couple of wins can see us out of it and I am pretty sure we are at rock bottom now and a new manager bounce would work. Didn’t work for the last three managers though !
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Post by sheds1862 on Sept 25, 2019 9:31:36 GMT
To be honest, how often do you see a squad that has spent the money it has, with the quality and potential the squad obviously has, being in this position? 1 win takes us within touching distance of 21st. I don't think you can look at the record books too much. If we replace Jones this week, or even next, a couple of wins can see us out of it and I am pretty sure we are at rock bottom now and a new manager bounce would work. New manager bounce ? Even Steve Evans would struggle to bounce here !!
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Post by MilanStokie on Sept 25, 2019 9:38:05 GMT
To be honest, how often do you see a squad that has spent the money it has, with the quality and potential the squad obviously has, being in this position? 1 win takes us within touching distance of 21st. I don't think you can look at the record books too much. If we replace Jones this week, or even next, a couple of wins can see us out of it and I am pretty sure we are at rock bottom now and a new manager bounce would work. Didn’t work for the last three managers though ! Was never going to happen under Lambert, we were a lost cause and he wasn't what we needed Rowett came in during the close season, a new manager bounce isn't going to happen when there are no games! Then we are at Jones....
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Post by thehoof on Sept 25, 2019 9:39:59 GMT
Grimsby AND Rotherham both had 3 points after 8 games in 01/02 and BOTH survived. Well if they stayed up by 1 point we’re buggered! Relegation is more likely than not based on the 3 wins, 0.75 goals per game that we have witnessed over the last 30 games. The players don’t seem to be bothered, but given the zero interest shown in buying our players over the summer, they should be.
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Post by Rt Hon Reverend Luvpump on Sept 25, 2019 10:02:52 GMT
Didn’t work for the last three managers though ! Was never going to happen under Lambert, we were a lost cause and he wasn't what we needed Rowett came in during the close season, a new manager bounce isn't going to happen when there are no games! Then we are at Jones.... Just a couple of wins would have saved us under lambert,but as you say we never got that new manager bounce that all other teams seem to get.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Sept 25, 2019 11:38:16 GMT
Was never going to happen under Lambert, we were a lost cause and he wasn't what we needed Rowett came in during the close season, a new manager bounce isn't going to happen when there are no games! Then we are at Jones.... Just a couple of wins would have saved us under lambert,but as you say we never got that new manager bounce that all other teams seem to get. All other teams apart from some of the more recent teams in Watford and Huddersfield...........
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Post by lordb on Sept 25, 2019 11:49:04 GMT
6 or even 4 points from next two games would give us a chance
hard to see anything other than defeat v Forest
would be quite happy to see Rooster in charge for that one with a new manager sitting in the stands
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Post by Edward Tattsyrup on Sept 25, 2019 11:55:31 GMT
Is it feasible that you might suspend a Manager for one or two matches during an "enquiry" and put the Youth team manager in charge, just to see if a different face, might have an effect. If there was a reasonable response we would then probably confirm that the problem is Jones and not the players or the fans. Jones has to go! even the national media are now starting to question the wisdom of holding fire. however, to suggest that this reoccurring nightmare is all Jones fault, as some have, is bananas. Bigger problems need to be resolved to turn this ship around.
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Post by deadwait on Sept 25, 2019 11:57:57 GMT
Many of these players in the squad are good enough to do well in the Championship. I watched the Bristol City- Middlesboro game some week ago, you wouldn't recognise Afobe , bearing in mind how short a time since he was here. All the players need better guidance, encouragement, but I am afraid that Jones is just not fit for purpose !.
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Post by VolvicStokie on Sept 25, 2019 12:06:27 GMT
Hughton isn't going to take the Stoke job when he's turned down numerous other championship sides.
Us being one of the worst, why would anyone think he would take it?
Deluded
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 25, 2019 12:19:25 GMT
Bolton had 2 points after 8 games two seasons ago and stayed up. Phil Parkinson was manager, and stayed manager throughout the 17/18 campaign and right up until a few games into this season. He has performed a minor miracle keeping Bolton in the Championship that season, as reflected by the club coming within a hair's breadth of folding a few weeks ago. Parky is available, and I say we ditch NJ today and appoint Parky pronto! Whether he'd want to join another clusterfuck club after the agony he endured with the last one is another question.
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Post by LL Cool Dave on Sept 25, 2019 12:28:07 GMT
This squad is good enough to finish mid table
But not with Nathan Jones in charge.
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Post by Los Alfareros on Sept 25, 2019 12:30:53 GMT
Yes unfortunately Nutty Nathan cannot turn this around, I can't begin to go into the whys and wherefores, there are so many things to consider.
The basic fact now for whatever reason is that if he stays we get relegated, so there is no other option but to sack him immediately. Get someone in who can pick a stable, competitive team and we may just scrape enough points to stay up. And no, I don't know who that is.
I am resigned to relegation now, and I cant quite believe that.
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Post by JurgenVandeurzen on Sept 25, 2019 12:31:56 GMT
We need to get a new manager (Hughton) in now. Watch the game (Delap or whoever to pick team) on Friday night with nothing to lose then start the long process of building self-belief in this bunch. Simple tactics and formations, stability, discipline and leaders in all areas of the pitch. Bollocks to keeping the whole squad happy, half of them should be got rid of in January anyway. Why did we even get Hogan, Duffy, Vokes, Cousins? Only one man for the job if that's what we're after.
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 25, 2019 13:00:17 GMT
There are a few ways of looking at it but each is quite chilling considering what we have seen so far. For example for us to ensure survival we now have to achieve top 10 form for the rest of the season. Do you think that is possible with these players ( I won’t even mention the manager!) I still think we've got the base for a half decent side tbh. They just need to be used correctly. I think it's a little extreme to say we need Top 10 form for survival. With that form, we'd make the playoffs! To survive, we just need to scrape a few wins and draws amongst quite a few losses, but absolutely key is at least 8 points from the teams likely to finish in the bottom 3. Right now, our games against Luton, Barnsley and Huddersfield are crucial.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 25, 2019 13:09:08 GMT
I still think we've got the base for a half decent side tbh. They just need to be used correctly. I think it's a little extreme to say we need Top 10 form for survival. With that form, we'd make the playoffs! To survive, we just need to scrape a few wins and draws amongst quite a few losses, but absolutely key is at least 8 points from the teams likely to finish in the bottom 3. Right now, our games against Luton, Barnsley and Huddersfield are crucial. Realistically we need 44/45 points? I'd imagine that's about the average. There's 38 games left so we'll go for 45, we need 1.13 points per game from now. 43 points needed. 10 wins, 13 draws, 15 losses - seems doable I guess? But the thought of us winning any game at the minute seems far fetched.
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 25, 2019 13:43:43 GMT
I think it's a little extreme to say we need Top 10 form for survival. With that form, we'd make the playoffs! To survive, we just need to scrape a few wins and draws amongst quite a few losses, but absolutely key is at least 8 points from the teams likely to finish in the bottom 3. Right now, our games against Luton, Barnsley and Huddersfield are crucial. Realistically we need 44/45 points? I'd imagine that's about the average. There's 38 games left so we'll go for 45, we need 1.13 points per game from now. 42 points needed. 10 wins, 13 draws, 15 losses - seems doable I guess? But the thought of us winning any game at the minute seems far fetched. As we haven't played any other bottom 3 candidates yet, I'll say around 42 points in total should be just about sufficient. So from 38 games left, we need 40 points. That equates to 10 wins, 10 draws, 18 losses. Forest is going to be a bloody tough game, and even a point against them is a feather in the cap.
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Post by lordb on Sept 25, 2019 13:56:12 GMT
Hughton isn't going to take the Stoke job when he's turned down numerous other championship sides. Us being one of the worst, why would anyone think he would take it? Deluded What jobs has he turned down?
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 25, 2019 13:58:46 GMT
I don’t think we can pull this round now Whoever the new manager is (and there as to be one) is stuck with this bunch of players till January They’re League One players at best and they’re not even at their best We’ve already been cut adrift and highly likely will be further adrift by Saturday When was the last time a team had 2 points from 8 games and stayed up We’re doomed I tell you. Doomed My old man always used to say to me its never too late son! I feel your pain though chief. Its hard to see any positives currently.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 25, 2019 14:01:14 GMT
Hughton isn't going to take the Stoke job when he's turned down numerous other championship sides. Us being one of the worst, why would anyone think he would take it? Deluded What jobs has he turned down? He's only turned Wednesday down I think? Doesn't mean he'd turn us down.
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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 25, 2019 14:04:13 GMT
Huddersfield press say he did not apply for that job.
And he let it be known via his mate Cross that, despite being fav for the Wednesday job, he wasn't interested.
I do think it is at least interesting that it was his chum Cross who had the big splash linking him with our job.
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Post by philm87 on Sept 25, 2019 14:10:22 GMT
Bollocks
We are 8 games in
We have under-performed yes but we are in a slightly false position
We started the season without our two best players - a full season with Badou and Etebo in centre mid and we will not go down
We have a very strong squad on paper so if NJ cannot dig us out with back to back wins now then we should expect a new man to come in and at least target mid-table
I would back Hughton or TP to achieve that (and possibly more) with this group of players
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 25, 2019 14:21:49 GMT
What jobs has he turned down? He's only turned Wednesday down I think? Doesn't mean he'd turn us down. Wednesday are a better run club than ours, with a decent, settled squad. If he turned them down, he won't even glance at us. Besides, I think there's a good chance Wolves, Everton or even Newcastle will part ways with their current managers over the course of the season. Hughton would be a strong candidate for any of those jobs. Jokanovic is another who's turned us down, so I think we need to set our sights a bit lower.
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 25, 2019 14:25:57 GMT
Realistically we need 44/45 points? I'd imagine that's about the average. There's 38 games left so we'll go for 45, we need 1.13 points per game from now. 42 points needed. 10 wins, 13 draws, 15 losses - seems doable I guess? But the thought of us winning any game at the minute seems far fetched. As we haven't played any other bottom 3 candidates yet, I'll say around 42 points in total should be just about sufficient. So from 38 games left, we need 40 points. That equates to 10 wins, 10 draws, 18 losses. Forest is going to be a bloody tough game, and even a point against them is a feather in the cap. Slightly outdated stats but gives an idea over an average of 10 years. Between 2005-2015, the average points total for 22nd place was 45.9, with the average for 21st being 49.7 - giving some credence to the notion that 50 points will keep a team up. Only twice in the last 10 years has that not been the case - Peterborough United going down in 2013 with a massive 54 points while Gillingham were relegated in 2005 on goal difference with 50. Based on stats we need 50 on average. Only twice in this 10 year period did teams avoid relegation with less than 49 points.
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Sept 25, 2019 14:29:59 GMT
I'm convinced we'll stay up. When that run will start, and if it's under Jones, I don't know. If we're still without a win in the next 2 games, surely Jones will be out. It's looking more and more like a Pulis return with every match.
The last 2 or 3 years have been so crazy, I won't be surprised if we still challenge for the playoffs this season.
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Post by nott1 on Sept 25, 2019 14:37:53 GMT
Gary rowett is the best option if Jones leaves. I should make an appointment if I were you, you need help if you think that fool will save us!
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 25, 2019 14:50:27 GMT
He's only turned Wednesday down I think? Doesn't mean he'd turn us down. Wednesday are a better run club than ours, with a decent, settled squad. If he turned them down, he won't even glance at us. Besides, I think there's a good chance Wolves, Everton or even Newcastle will part ways with their current managers over the course of the season. Hughton would be a strong candidate for any of those jobs. Jokanovic is another who's turned us down, so I think we need to set our sights a bit lower. They've underachieved for years, for all our faults I still don't think long-term they'll be seen as a better proposition than us. Hughton wouldn't be a strong candidate for Everton or Wolves, both will be aiming significantly higher. Newcastle maybe but he's worked for Ashley once and was treated appallingly, would he be up for that again?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 25, 2019 15:50:02 GMT
As we haven't played any other bottom 3 candidates yet, I'll say around 42 points in total should be just about sufficient. So from 38 games left, we need 40 points. That equates to 10 wins, 10 draws, 18 losses. Forest is going to be a bloody tough game, and even a point against them is a feather in the cap. Slightly outdated stats but gives an idea over an average of 10 years. Between 2005-2015, the average points total for 22nd place was 45.9, with the average for 21st being 49.7 - giving some credence to the notion that 50 points will keep a team up. Only twice in the last 10 years has that not been the case - Peterborough United going down in 2013 with a massive 54 points while Gillingham were relegated in 2005 on goal difference with 50. Based on stats we need 50 on average. Only twice in this 10 year period did teams avoid relegation with less than 49 points. Back to being fucked then I guess. Damn it
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