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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 24, 2018 11:16:36 GMT
www.hitc.com/en-gb/2018/09/20/stoke-boss-gary-rowett-praises-excellent-everton-loanee-cuco-m-1/He's probably not going to drop his one defensive signing who he said on Thursday had been "excellent", just to bring in Edwards. And it'll be a shock if Bauer plays for us again before departing in January. Sad to say, there's still no-one better than Pieters at left-back, which is one hell of an indictment about the complacency at the club. The u23s aren't even playing Tymon at left-back and are apparently trying to convert him into a winger. Clucas isn't fit, so he can't play, and has only played about 10% of his career there anyway. And would Martina be better as a right-footer who hadn't played there in his career before this time last year when he was literally the only fit defender Allardyce could play there? Williams is obviously a no-brainer to come in. But Souttar is 19 and his career consists of 13 games for the side that finished bottom of the Scottish Premier League. And Martina hasn't played there since May 2015 Realistically, are we looking at just one change for Rotherham?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Sept 24, 2018 11:18:03 GMT
I'd be surprised if it was anything beyond Williams for Ryan to be honest.
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Post by stokesupporter on Sept 24, 2018 11:20:48 GMT
He might try Pieters in the central position.
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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 24, 2018 11:22:53 GMT
He might try Pieters in the central position. I did think of that. He played there as a youth player apparently, and has played there for Holland and said a few years ago that was where he wanted to play. Would be a hell of a punt though - with the main advantage being that he couldn't play left-back! |
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Post by wuzza on Sept 24, 2018 11:23:22 GMT
It’s a good example of how garbage our selection / development of young talent has been. We’ve had years to progress some youngsters to be ready to take on Championship level football and what have we got - a lad out on loan to Mansfield who is clearly not considered anywhere near good enough yet and another who , as detailed , made little or no impression at a low level of Scottish top flight football.
Our current problems are as much long term as they are short term.
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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 24, 2018 11:29:02 GMT
I'd be surprised if it was anything beyond Williams for Ryan to be honest. Probably - what a sorry state of affairs! You're desperate to make changes but you can't as you have no real options. Pieters has had a free pass for 4 years. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2018 11:33:02 GMT
I think he'll play Williams and Souttar on Wednesday, and if they impress he'll keep them in the team for Rotherham.....
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Post by Ryan_Shawjosh on Sept 24, 2018 11:34:40 GMT
I think he'll play Williams and Souttar on Wednesday, and if they impress he'll keep them in the team for Rotherham..... I was about to say just that. Wouldn't be surprised to see Edwards or Martina at left back. Martina played there for Everton when Baines was out. |
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Post by berahinosgoals on Sept 24, 2018 11:40:48 GMT
Clear the whole lot of the defence, every one of them including butland. At the very least give them all a wake up call and give the young lads an opportunity to shine. They may shine & they may not but even if one does its a positive, they certainly cant do any worse than the current starters.
Sick to death of these bottlers putting in performances worthy of a fine and then being reselected to do the same again.
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Post by PotterLog on Sept 24, 2018 11:42:36 GMT
He might try Pieters in the central position. I did think of that. He played there as a youth player apparently, and has played there for Holland and said a few years ago that was where he wanted to play. Would be a hell of a punt though - with the main advantage being that he couldn't play left-back! When did he say that FM? I’m surprised, when he was asked about his position when he joined us he said explicitly he was a left back. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2018 11:45:16 GMT
You've answered your own question FM. There are literally no other options.
If Souttar comes in and doesn't work we are back to Shawcross, who by now will be at rock bottom.
Our only other realistic option is a player laughed out of Everton on loan, and one we've already seen get the runaround by Nick Powell.
It isn't all bad though. I'm quite enjoying this overhaul. It's simply fabulous.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Sept 24, 2018 11:47:59 GMT
He might not drop Shawcross if goes to 3-5-2🤔
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Post by 1982stokie on Sept 24, 2018 11:49:59 GMT
He might put Fletcher in at CB with Williams
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Sept 24, 2018 11:51:57 GMT
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Post by gingerninja on Sept 24, 2018 11:51:59 GMT
Rowett really has to act now after Saturdays post match outburst, albeit honest appraisal, if he doesn't they will have been hollow words and he will lose what little respect he may have. Sadly Fletcher will be captain Wednesday if Shawcross is rested/dropped.would love Woods to have had a go.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Sept 24, 2018 11:53:58 GMT
I think he'll play Williams and Souttar on Wednesday, and if they impress he'll keep them in the team for Rotherham..... I was about to say just that. Wouldn't be surprised to see Edwards or Martina at left back. Martina played there for Everton when Baines was out. Edwards at RB Williams and Souttar in the middle and Martina at LB. Worth a try. If they're shit and get the runaround at least we know and we haven't lost a lot. If they do well then the rest know we now do have an option and pick up their games or get dropped. |
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Post by wakefieldstokie on Sept 24, 2018 11:59:35 GMT
I think he has to try Souttar against Forrest
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Sept 24, 2018 12:06:58 GMT
I think he has to try Souttar against Forrest At least we will then know whether or not there is currently any realistic option to Ryan and Bruno. At the minute most of us are just guessing because we've never seen Souttar play against that quality of opposition. |
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Post by Gob Bluth on Sept 24, 2018 12:08:41 GMT
It's a shame Ryan Sweeney is out on loan, not because he's better than Souttar but it would have helped to have him play. Souttar at 19 has time on his side but very soon we'll have to work out whether we think Sweeney can make it or not. This isn't a question we have to answer for Souttar just yet.
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Post by cheadlestokie on Sept 24, 2018 12:14:43 GMT
I watched the under 23's play at Villa albeit on You Tube.
Niakate (is that right?) played left back and I thought he looked decent.
Also thought Collins and Souttar played the ball out of the back better than the first team.There was a fair bit of room around the pitch to do so however.
Both also looked decent players.
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booie
Spectator
Posts: 42
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Post by booie on Sept 24, 2018 12:24:02 GMT
I think he will try 3-5-2 as Saido needs to start up front given his recent performances and in defence he can then play Williams in the centre with Cuco on the right and either BMI or Pieters on left.
He can use Edwards as RWB and still keep his midfield 3 of Etebo, woods, Allen.
LWB is then his only decision.
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Post by robrigo on Sept 24, 2018 12:32:03 GMT
It’s quite literally f...ckin disgusting for a professional football club that has just spent the last ten years with their noses submerged in the filthy rich premier league trough to not have any options other than untried kids and Ashley Williams to come into the defence.
Fuck me, I had enough of people at our club have diddly squat foresight. It’s a joke.
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Post by kustokie on Sept 24, 2018 12:38:36 GMT
Desperate times call for desperate measures I’d drop Allen, Pieters, BMI and Shawcross.. Rest Butland. Bring in Willams and move Martini to the middle. Play Edwards at RB and Diouf at LB against Forest. It’s basically an irrelevant game because our only concern is to steady the ship and avoid relegation. Play Afobe and Ince on the wings, Etebo, Woods and Bojan in MF and Berahino or Crouch up top.
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Post by Clayton Wood on Sept 24, 2018 12:48:22 GMT
I think he'll do a try it and see approach.
Wednesday Souttar, Edwards & Williams in.
If we come away with a win/draw* he's got justification to carry it on in full or part to Rotherham.
Get tonked and he'll say we tried it in a 'bonus' game and it didn't work, so back to what we know.
*Normal time before pens
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Post by butler64 on Sept 24, 2018 12:49:43 GMT
Realistically, whatever the result was against Blackburn, changes were always going to be made for the Forest game. For me it will be interesting to see who is then subsequently picked for the Rotherham game. This is a real test for Rowett now as what would happen if Williams was brought in for Shawcross and lets say that Williams has a shocker against Forest? Would he stick with Williams for Rotherham or change again?
Personally, I think Rowett is the wrong man for the job. He has displayed a complete lack of man management skills and the way he has criticised players publically will do nothing for team harmony. If he wanted to criticise them he should have done it in private. All he needed to say in the after match interview was that performances weren't at the level he expected and that he would address this.
I hope that I'm wrong about him, but we have seemingly gone from a poor Premier League team to and even poorer Championship team. The football on Saturday for the most part of the game was some of the most mind numblingly boring that I have ever seen. It only livened up at the end when it seemed like we might grab the most unlikeliest of points.
The result against Forest isn't important to me but the manner in which we play will be. One thing for sure is that this season is looking like one hard long slog.
Cheers
GB
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Post by hooftastic on Sept 24, 2018 12:51:32 GMT
I think that's Rowett' last defence, aside from Martina it's not his defenders.
The problem with that is that Martina has been pretty uninspiring since an impressive debut.
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Post by Jimmyg on Sept 24, 2018 12:51:34 GMT
Martina is OK on the ball but his positional play and defensive game let's him down for me,maybe as a wing back but not in a back 4
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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 24, 2018 12:53:04 GMT
I did think of that. He played there as a youth player apparently, and has played there for Holland and said a few years ago that was where he wanted to play. Would be a hell of a punt though - with the main advantage being that he couldn't play left-back! When did he say that FM? I’m surprised, when he was asked about his position when he joined us he said explicitly he was a left back. In an interview in 2013 by the looks of it! Hard to see him being chucked in there again at the age of 30 out of the blue...but desperate times and all that. Martina hasn't played there for 3 and a half year either. So the options are a kiddie or players who have never really played there, or not played there for a hell of a long time (and to no great standard!) Erik Pieters gets an opportunity today as a central defender in the friendly against Indonesia for the Oranje. It would be a new point of departure for the PSV player, who for the past eighteen months, has rarely been in the news for his soccer performances
"I've been through a lot, and am stronger" says Pieters in AD Sportwereld.
The PSV defender's call-up to the Asian tour is also a surprise for him. But the coach has a purpose. "I've already spoken to Advocaat about playing Pieters as a central defender this season," said Van Gaal yesterday. "I think he has the posture and speed for that position. At PSV he does not play there but this is a good opportunity to test him. Moreover, he can always play left back. "
Pieters is not unfamiliar with the position. He played there in his youth. And even made his league debut there for FC Utrecht.
"Under Bert van Marwijk, I only became a left back due to the Oranje. He felt that was my future. "
He himself thinks that it is time to focus on one position. He understands that it is good for trainers that someone can play more positions. "But as a player you should not hang in between positions. My own ambition is also located in the center. It is in me to coach people and take the lead. If you watch Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund, then the tendency for central defenders are getting longer at the top. At 1.85 meters, I am not overly tall but combined with good timing it is fine. I see the challenge of it. "
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2018 13:05:29 GMT
What a sorry state of affairs.
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Post by jezzascfc on Sept 24, 2018 13:07:50 GMT
Pieters could play the left of a back three, with Martina right and Williams in the middle. Bauer would be ideal as right wing back if he and Rowett had not had "handbags" at the weekend, otherwise young Tom I guess, and McClean or Clucas could compete for left wing back, once fit.
If we went 3-5-2, he could keep his preferred middle three and Afobe would also get some support, with preferably Ince (or Saido/Bojan) in a freer role supporting him.
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