|
Post by sheikhmomo on Jun 3, 2018 12:04:35 GMT
It doesn't really work like that though does it? There have been a series of failures over a number of years and people are desperate to make excuses for them in a way they don't for football managers. Two people have rightly paid the price for failings on the pitch with their jobs, the fact that nobody has paid the same price behind the scenes for the catastrophes off it is nothing short of a scandal. We are club where there are no consequences, no accountability and no responsibility and supporters are complicit in letting that culture spread. Doesn't work like what sorry? Is it not fair to criticise them for the things that clearly they have had a hand in while suggesting that maybe somethings were beyond anyone's control? Is that unreasonable, is that 'fans being complicit'? Or should it just be an all-out witch hunt where they're 100% to blame for everything and anything more considered is part of the problem? You can think Carto and Scholes are jokers who need to be booted out of the club yesterday while still thinking that some things are fairly unavoidable and there wasn't much we could do.I don't think it works like that. You could apply that same reasoning to Lambert's spell in a way. There was lots out of his control but his overall record and trajectory of travel rightfully meant he was booted out. You can quibble about the gruesome twosome's responsibility on individual issues but their overall record and trajectory of travel should see them booted out of the door in the same way. The Coates boys lied to us in that mealy mouthed statement on May 8th. There was a time when that would have led to a witch hunt but football fans have changed somewhat.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jun 3, 2018 12:09:22 GMT
Doesn't work like what sorry? Is it not fair to criticise them for the things that clearly they have had a hand in while suggesting that maybe somethings were beyond anyone's control? Is that unreasonable, is that 'fans being complicit'? Or should it just be an all-out witch hunt where they're 100% to blame for everything and anything more considered is part of the problem? You can think Carto and Scholes are jokers who need to be booted out of the club yesterday while still thinking that some things are fairly unavoidable and there wasn't much we could do.I don't think it works like that. You could apply that same reasoning to Lambert's spell in a way. There was lots out of his control but his overall record and trajectory of travel rightfully meant he was booted out. You can quibble about the gruesome twosome's responsibility on individual issues but their overall record and trajectory of travel should see them booted out of the door in the same way. The Coates boys lied to us in that mealy mouthed statement on May 8th. There was a time when that would have led to a witch hunt but football fans have changed somewhat. I'm not following mate. I'm saying I want them gone. Just like Lambert had it tough and not everything was his fault but enough was to warrant getting rid. I don't see what's to be gained from acting as if every single setback is definitely on them though?
|
|
|
Post by ashleyscfc on Jun 3, 2018 12:38:09 GMT
We seem happily haemorrhage money and have our pants pulled down on deals, Wimmer, Saido, McClean & now this. But wouldnt spend it on the likes on Cedric, Lemina, Maguire when we had the chance. This
|
|
|
Post by Davef on Jun 3, 2018 13:05:35 GMT
We seem happily haemorrhage money and have our pants pulled down on deals, Wimmer, Saido, McClean & now this. But wouldnt spend it on the likes on Cedric, Lemina, Maguire when we had the chance. This Explain how we WOULDN'T spend £12M on Harry Maguire weeks before we spent £18M on Kevin Wimmer.
|
|
|
Post by brinsleymaclagan on Jun 3, 2018 13:40:24 GMT
Why don’t we offer Vale 15m for Pope?? If we buy division one class players guess where we’ll end up!From Bojan Arnie and Shaqiri to Afobe?? Surely we can do better FFS
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2018 14:18:01 GMT
Very confident finisher and someone who Vydra could play off of.
Get them both in.
|
|
|
Post by MilanStokie on Jun 3, 2018 15:00:32 GMT
Why don’t we offer Vale 15m for Pope?? If we buy division one class players guess where we’ll end up!From Bojan Arnie and Shaqiri to Afobe?? Surely we can do better FFS what has afobe done to make you rate him so low? Who exactly are you expecting us to buy?
|
|
|
Post by ProctorDre on Jun 3, 2018 15:06:28 GMT
Why don’t we offer Vale 15m for Pope?? If we buy division one class players guess where we’ll end up!From Bojan Arnie and Shaqiri to Afobe?? Surely we can do better FFS What a stupid post! Afobe is a leading championship player and the type we should be going for, Tom Pope isn’t. Are you expecting us to still get players of Bojan, Arnie, Shaiqir quality now we’ve been relegated?! WE ARE NOT IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE ANYMORE! If you are then strap in mate, you’re in for a fuckin bumpy ride!
|
|
|
Post by arnie3010 on Jun 3, 2018 15:19:40 GMT
Maybe a good player, but not for 16m £!
|
|
|
Post by thebet365 on Jun 3, 2018 16:05:53 GMT
Explain how we WOULDN'T spend £12M on Harry Maguire weeks before we spent £18M on Kevin Wimmer. They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money.
|
|
|
Post by sheikhmomo on Jun 3, 2018 16:12:14 GMT
Explain how we WOULDN'T spend £12M on Harry Maguire weeks before we spent £18M on Kevin Wimmer. They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money. Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times.
|
|
|
Post by Davef on Jun 3, 2018 16:17:00 GMT
They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money. Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times. That doesn't really explain why somebody would think that the club wouldn't pay £12M for a centre half a few weeks before paying £18M for one.
|
|
|
Post by jimigoodwinsbeard on Jun 3, 2018 16:20:45 GMT
They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money. Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times. All valid points. Hughes has been blamed for every single transfer fookup yet Carto and Teflon are seemingly unaccountable. Happy to take credit for any decent transfer we have had and completely absolved of any blame for any transfer fookup.....
|
|
|
Post by thebet365 on Jun 3, 2018 16:20:51 GMT
The wimmer deal is the standout deal that I just can't get my head around. The numbers involved for a not even bit part player just don't make sense.
But it's that sort of deal that proves we don't do things on the cheap. If players haven't come here it's because they preferred to go elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by jimigoodwinsbeard on Jun 3, 2018 16:21:59 GMT
And i've not even mentioned the esteemed rapper Jese!??!😟
|
|
|
Post by stokecitytalke on Jun 3, 2018 16:37:44 GMT
He doesn't have a point at all. He said we wouldn't spend it on those players as if it was a formality. He doesn't really have any proof of that. Several clubs were after those players and they chose other clubs other than us. Yes but the most likely explanation for repeatedly losing out on players to the likes of southampton is that we did not offer competitive terms. Hughes obviously hinted at missing out on preferred targets. It was an issue and a contributory factor to our demise. Not as big a factor as the poor decision making in purchasing the likes of wimmer, berahino etc, and the incompetence of Hughes and lambert of course. When we were after Redmond wasn't it quoted that they offered him £90,000 a week? I wouldn't have thought we would offer as much as that.
|
|
|
Post by Gods on Jun 3, 2018 16:53:56 GMT
They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money. Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times. I don't think anyone is suggesting Hughes did all the financial/contractual process stuff but I don't think there is any doubt he wanted him at the club and he is (or was) after all in charge of the first team playing side. Here is what he said on signing him, plenty of 'we's in there I grant you but he likes to talk in a 'we' Stoke City way. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Potters boss Mark Hughes told the club's official website: "Kevin is an undoubted talent and he will significantly add to the quality of the group of players that I already have at my disposal. "We put a real emphasis on trying to enhance the defensive areas of the squad this summer and we feel that we have been able to do that."
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jun 3, 2018 16:57:01 GMT
Am I missing some sort of defence of Carto and Scholes on here that is getting people all puthery? Can someone point me in that direction?
|
|
|
Post by sheikhmomo on Jun 3, 2018 17:02:35 GMT
Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times. That doesn't really explain why somebody would think that the club wouldn't pay £12M for a centre half a few weeks before paying £18M for one. I think the BMI and Wimmer fiascos raise serious doubts about the whole process, dave. Pissing about over peanuts over Indi and paying 3-400 percent over the odds for Wimmer, why is it so inconceivable that someone made a similar ricket over the value of Maguire?
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 3, 2018 17:08:57 GMT
That doesn't really explain why somebody would think that the club wouldn't pay £12M for a centre half a few weeks before paying £18M for one. I think the BMI and Wimmer fiascos raise serious doubts about the whole process, dave. Pissing about over peanuts over Indi and paying 3-400 percent over the odds for Wimmer, why is it so inconceivable that someone made a similar ricket over the value of Maguire? I want to know what happened from January with the Indi. Scholes said a fee was agreed. What went wrong? And even if it was them pissing about, how was that legally allowed to happen by us if we thought a fee was agreed? The oddest of Scholes defences on here that was.
|
|
|
Post by mickstupp on Jun 3, 2018 17:18:59 GMT
I think the BMI and Wimmer fiascos raise serious doubts about the whole process, dave. Pissing about over peanuts over Indi and paying 3-400 percent over the odds for Wimmer, why is it so inconceivable that someone made a similar ricket over the value of Maguire? I want to know what happened from January with the Indi. Scholes said a fee was agreed. What went wrong? And even if it was them pissing about, how was that legally allowed to happen by us if we thought a fee was agreed? The oddest of Scholes defences on here that was. Don’t know why you continue you whinge about this when you knew all along that we were signing BMI anyway?
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 3, 2018 17:21:49 GMT
I want to know what happened from January with the Indi. Scholes said a fee was agreed. What went wrong? And even if it was them pissing about, how was that legally allowed to happen by us if we thought a fee was agreed? The oddest of Scholes defences on here that was. Don’t know why you continue you whinge about this when you knew all along that we were signing BMI anyway? Because he should have been in the building for the first day of pre season. Him not being here fast played a huge part in us going down for me. Him and Shawcross are a great partnership and the board completely fucked it up.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2018 17:23:13 GMT
They can't because it doesn't suit their agenda to have a pop at Stoke. Player X doesn't sign FFS stoke trying do things on the cheap again Player X signs and flops FFS someone needs sacking for paying 18 million and giving em a 5 year contract on silly money. Surely the more pressing question is which fucking idiot gave executive sign off to a deal so outrageously fucking disastrous as the Wimmer one? I mean the narrative put out by the owners and supported by many supporters is that Hughes identified him, Hughes scouted him, Hughes dealt with his agent, Hughes authorised the fee, Hughes authorised the wage, Hughes authorised the contract length and Hughes made him get fat and high five his mates after a fucking shellacking at Wembley. My God Stoke fans are fucking saps at times. I don't see what the fuss is about mate? The process is perfect and it just works.
|
|
|
Post by bobby1eye on Jun 3, 2018 18:01:44 GMT
Could be an interesting trade with any deal for Allen, Butland or NDiaye. Still, it's the Sun so let's sit tight for a bit. Butland to wolves!!!!!!! Never in this wide world.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Jun 3, 2018 18:03:08 GMT
Don’t know why you continue you whinge about this when you knew all along that we were signing BMI anyway? Because he should have been in the building for the first day of pre season. Him not being here fast played a huge part in us going down for me. Him and Shawcross are a great partnership and the board completely fucked it up. Given that he spent pretty much the whole season injured or playing with an injury, it is pretty hard to argue against that.
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Jun 3, 2018 18:08:12 GMT
Could be an interesting trade with any deal for Allen, Butland or NDiaye. Still, it's the Sun so let's sit tight for a bit. Butland to wolves!!!!!!! Never in this wide world. Why? They're bigger than us and have bigger ambitions. People on here mocked when they were expanding their ground... now it's not big enough. Meanwhile we've put 1200 on the capacity in 10 years.
|
|
|
Post by tony1234 on Jun 3, 2018 18:10:45 GMT
Are we really that stupid that we'd offer more than wolves paid only 48hrs earlier for him. The theory at least is that Wolves are not/have not paid a market rate, they are taking up a previously set 'option to buy'. Must admit I hate to think of us feathering their already deep pockets in this way. And I don't see Mr Coates liking it much either, he has already effectively paid Frank Lampard's wages at Derby for the next 2 years by paying up 2 years on the Rowett contract there and I think this one would just finish him off! He'd be pushing wheel barrows full of free bank notes around the East and West Midlands like some summertime Santa Claus, it would surely offend him to the very core! In any walk of life, if you make stupid decisions and penny-pinch at the wrong time. then it can end up costing you more in the long run.
|
|
|
Post by bobby1eye on Jun 3, 2018 18:13:14 GMT
Butland to wolves!!!!!!! Never in this wide world. Why? They're bigger than us and have bigger ambitions. People on here mocked when they were expanding their ground... now it's not big enough. Meanwhile we've put 1200 on the capacity in 10 years. There's alot of clubs bigger than us with the same ambitions or greater.when Butland goes it won't be to the wankers in orange.hes better than that.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 3, 2018 18:14:13 GMT
Because he should have been in the building for the first day of pre season. Him not being here fast played a huge part in us going down for me. Him and Shawcross are a great partnership and the board completely fucked it up. Given that he spent pretty much the whole season injured or playing with an injury, it is pretty hard to argue against that. And all over what? Tony Scholes' pride?
|
|
|
Post by bobby1eye on Jun 3, 2018 18:15:42 GMT
Butland to wolves!!!!!!! Never in this wide world. Why? They're bigger than us and have bigger ambitions. People on here mocked when they were expanding their ground... now it's not big enough. Meanwhile we've put 1200 on the capacity in 10 years. It wasn't long ago when we were mocking them for having it done and not getting anybody in there. WOLVES ARE NOT BIGGER THAN US.......
|
|