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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 17:14:20 GMT
Shawcross was injured for a lot of that season, Walters didn't play as much, Cameron was good in a completely different position to where pulis played him, Whelan was decent. We were incredible because of Bojan, Shaqiri, Arnie, Afellay, Imbula (in parts), Johnson, Afellay (during false 9). It's ridiculous to not give Hughes credit for what he did early on, we became a completely different team because of him. We weren't that good though. Incredible is just unrealistic, one or two incredible performances does not equal an incredible team. We didn't finish on a positive GD for example, or score a tremendous amount of goals. Leicester winning the league was incredible. We had a very good purple patch at the end of summer through to new year and the rest was pretty shit. Injuries to Shawcross & Butland both impacted us that season and we lost more games without them, which kind of proves my point on its own. We all know that TP left us a spine that would last beyond his years, he knew that himself. All it needed was peppering out with creativity and that's what Sparky did. If you think about it, he didn't even do that properly because most of the creative players you mentioned have hardly set the club alight. Arnie is excluded. Bojan has his fans but really, his time at Stoke has not been a success. TP’s ‘solid spine’ got him the sack.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 17:28:34 GMT
Shawcross was injured for a lot of that season, Walters didn't play as much, Cameron was good in a completely different position to where pulis played him, Whelan was decent. We were incredible because of Bojan, Shaqiri, Arnie, Afellay, Imbula (in parts), Johnson, Afellay (during false 9). It's ridiculous to not give Hughes credit for what he did early on, we became a completely different team because of him. We weren't that good though. Incredible is just unrealistic, one or two incredible performances does not equal an incredible team. We didn't finish on a positive GD for example. Leicester winning the league was incredible. We had a very good purple patch at the end of summer through to new year and the rest was pretty shit. Injuries to Shawcross & Butland both impacted us that season and we lost more games without them, which kind of proves my point on its own. We all know that TP left us a spine that would last beyond his years, he knew that himself. All it needed was peppering out with creativity and that's what Sparky did. If you think about it, he didn't even do that properly because most of the creative players you mentioned have hardly set the club alight. Arnie is excluded. Bojan has his fans but really, his time at Stoke has not been a success. Just disagree with pretty much all of that apart from the Butland injury fucking us. We were 5 points from a Champions League spot with 7 games left. Not a purple patch really.
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Post by vahl on May 6, 2018 17:30:36 GMT
We weren't that good though. Incredible is just unrealistic, one or two incredible performances does not equal an incredible team. We didn't finish on a positive GD for example, or score a tremendous amount of goals. Leicester winning the league was incredible. We had a very good purple patch at the end of summer through to new year and the rest was pretty shit. Injuries to Shawcross & Butland both impacted us that season and we lost more games without them, which kind of proves my point on its own. We all know that TP left us a spine that would last beyond his years, he knew that himself. All it needed was peppering out with creativity and that's what Sparky did. If you think about it, he didn't even do that properly because most of the creative players you mentioned have hardly set the club alight. Arnie is excluded. Bojan has his fans but really, his time at Stoke has not been a success. TP’s ‘solid spine’ got him the sack. Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked.
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Post by steinosjockstrap on May 6, 2018 17:33:37 GMT
For me,the best football I've ever seen from Stoke came under Hughes (been going since 1982). Does anyone else remember walking from the ground after ending 2014/2015 by hammering Liverpool 6-1? I really thought our moment had arrived............. How wrong I was.....
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Post by march4 on May 6, 2018 17:43:35 GMT
Hughes will be remembered as the man who took over a strong, stable, well run Premier League football team and slowly turned it into an omnishambles.
The decline began the day he was appointed.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 17:45:25 GMT
TP’s ‘solid spine’ got him the sack. Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked. We were close to being relegated. It wasn't football, it was results that got TP sacked.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 17:46:02 GMT
Hughes will be remembered as the man who took over a strong, stable, well run Premier League football team and slowly turned it into an omnishambles. The decline began the day he was appointed. That classic decline where you get better and better for 3 seasons...
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Post by vahl on May 6, 2018 17:46:30 GMT
We weren't that good though. Incredible is just unrealistic, one or two incredible performances does not equal an incredible team. We didn't finish on a positive GD for example. Leicester winning the league was incredible. We had a very good purple patch at the end of summer through to new year and the rest was pretty shit. Injuries to Shawcross & Butland both impacted us that season and we lost more games without them, which kind of proves my point on its own. We all know that TP left us a spine that would last beyond his years, he knew that himself. All it needed was peppering out with creativity and that's what Sparky did. If you think about it, he didn't even do that properly because most of the creative players you mentioned have hardly set the club alight. Arnie is excluded. Bojan has his fans but really, his time at Stoke has not been a success. Just disagree with pretty much all of that apart from the Butland injury fucking us. We were 5 points from a Champions League spot with 7 games left. Not a purple patch really. From Oct to Dec we lost 3 matches. We won 8 out of 13 games in that period. That's a purple patch. We were getting 3-4 goals scored against us by the Top 6 every single time we played them. It was a milestone for the club with the points tally and all that but it is still a good example of TP's base, with a Sparky topping doing the business.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 17:48:50 GMT
Just disagree with pretty much all of that apart from the Butland injury fucking us. We were 5 points from a Champions League spot with 7 games left. Not a purple patch really. From Oct to Dec we lost 3 matches. We won 8 out of 13 games in that period. That's a purple patch. We were getting 3-4 goals scored against us by the Top 6 every single time we played them. It was a milestone for the club with the points tally and all that but it is still a good example of TP's base, with a Sparky topping doing the business. We then won several after Dec too to get so high in the table.
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Post by vahl on May 6, 2018 17:55:46 GMT
From Oct to Dec we lost 3 matches. We won 8 out of 13 games in that period. That's a purple patch. We were getting 3-4 goals scored against us by the Top 6 every single time we played them. It was a milestone for the club with the points tally and all that but it is still a good example of TP's base, with a Sparky topping doing the business. We then won several after Dec too to get so high in the table. We won 6 games from Dec to May - 3 of them were against the 3 that were relegated (Norwich, Newcastle, Villa) That whole season was based on a purple patch tbh
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Post by GeneralFaye on May 6, 2018 17:57:41 GMT
Hughes will be remembered as the man who took over a strong, stable, well run Premier League football team and slowly turned it into an omnishambles. The decline began the day he was appointed. The last sentence isn't true though is it March? Improving at first, for at least 2 and half seasons in fact isn't a decline as far as I'm aware
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 17:59:33 GMT
TP’s ‘solid spine’ got him the sack. Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked. It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 18:13:33 GMT
We then won several after Dec too to get so high in the table. We won 6 games from Dec to May - 3 of them were against the 3 that were relegated (Norwich, Newcastle, Villa) That whole season was based on a purple patch tbh That's not a small amount of wins. 6 is pretty alright considering we went to shit halfway through april.
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Post by owdestokie2 on May 6, 2018 18:20:05 GMT
Destruction
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Post by cheeesfreeex on May 6, 2018 18:20:21 GMT
Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked. It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish. Nah. Tone didn't agree with the Carto conundrum. Unbeaten at the Brit for twelve months as we smashed Liverpool Boxing Day. Needed back up in that Xmas window with N'Zonzi, Huth, Crouch, Ryan, Adam etc not available. The recruitment team brought in a pubescent Butland and Brek Shea to complete the campaign. 8th at xmas under TP. He didn't take us down, though he may well have dug his heels in to prove a point. Pig's Heads in lockers etc was shite and symptomatic I suppose. But we weren't relegated and obviously he was a casualty of the lack of backing. Like Sparky... Bauer and N'Diaye brought in three months too late. It is what it is. Neither TP nor Hughes got us relegated.
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on May 6, 2018 18:24:24 GMT
I think it depends on the next few years. If we return for another extended spell in the Premier League within the next two seasons then Hughes' legacy is more likely to be those three 9th place finishes. If we languish in the Championship or worse, his legacy will be relegation and decline.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 18:24:33 GMT
It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish. Nah. Tone didn't agree with the Carto conundrum. Unbeaten at the Brit for twelve months as we smashed Liverpool Boxing Day. Needed back up in that Xmas window with N'Zonzi, Huth, Crouch, Ryan, Adam etc not available. The recruitment team brought in a pubescent Butland and Brek Shea to complete the campaign. 8th at xmas under TP. He didn't take us down, though he may well have dug his heels in to prove a point. Pig's Heads in lockers etc was shite and symptomatic I suppose. But we weren't relegated and obviously he was a casualty of the lack of backing. Like Sparky... Bauer and N'Diaye brought in three months too late. It is what it is. Neither TP nor Hughes got us relegated. We finished 11-12 very poorly. 8th at Christmas but the signs were all there. Couldn’t score, no pace, didn’t convince, Liverpool game aside (and he went out of his way not to pick that side again). The Carto thing didn’t come out of nowhere, it was brought in for a reason.
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Post by vahl on May 6, 2018 18:32:02 GMT
Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked. It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish. I do remember, but again, I think it was boredom both sides in the end mostly. It's a good way to summarise it. Everything went stale and the fans just wanted to watch some decent football for once. It was also in part because of him/us being successful with his brand of football, it contributed to his own downfall. Don't tell me that we didn't put the cat amongst the pigeons, teams were going out of their way in how they approached playing against us but we got sussed and it was going downhill fast, including off the field.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on May 6, 2018 18:33:51 GMT
Nah. Tone didn't agree with the Carto conundrum. Unbeaten at the Brit for twelve months as we smashed Liverpool Boxing Day. Needed back up in that Xmas window with N'Zonzi, Huth, Crouch, Ryan, Adam etc not available. The recruitment team brought in a pubescent Butland and Brek Shea to complete the campaign. 8th at xmas under TP. He didn't take us down, though he may well have dug his heels in to prove a point. Pig's Heads in lockers etc was shite and symptomatic I suppose. But we weren't relegated and obviously he was a casualty of the lack of backing. Like Sparky... Bauer and N'Diaye brought in three months too late. It is what it is. Neither TP nor Hughes got us relegated. We finished 11-12 very poorly. 8th at Christmas but the signs were all there. Couldn’t score, no pace, didn’t convince, Liverpool game aside (and he went out of his way not to pick that side again). The Carto thing didn’t come out of nowhere, it was brought in for a reason. Finishing 12th pooorly I'll take... though I'm looking forward to the fresh challenge of the drop. So Carto & co were brought in to do what? Avoid high wage, high cost wasters that Tone attracted.... or summat? Really?
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Post by Miles Offside on May 6, 2018 18:34:13 GMT
Some fans tend to see any issue around Stoke in terms that are black or white. It's more complex than that.
Personally, I never liked Hughes before he came to Stoke but it would be dishonest to say that I wasn't impressed when he led us through a very good spell.
Unfortunately, for the last couple of seasons he reverted back to what I thought he was before he came - arrogant, over-rated (because he'd been a great player) and just not very good as a manager.
He's responsible for both our relegation and the fact that he could get nothing out of Berahino, Imbula and Wimmer - three players that their combined transfer fees and contracts cost the club a whole year of its Premier League income.
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Post by skelman on May 6, 2018 18:35:11 GMT
"The man who lost the plot, but thought he was above it all"
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Post by senojbor on May 6, 2018 18:37:41 GMT
Wasn't it more that we just wanted to change it up tactically and see some carpet football instead? I think we got bored of each other in the end and it just happened. It's hard for me to believe that the players that are now a big part of Stoke City folklore were the reason he got sacked. We were close to being relegated. It wasn't football, it was results that got TP sacked. Really? We ended up with 42 points which is decent in anyone's book.
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Post by senojbor on May 6, 2018 18:40:40 GMT
It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish. Nah. Tone didn't agree with the Carto conundrum. Unbeaten at the Brit for twelve months as we smashed Liverpool Boxing Day. Needed back up in that Xmas window with N'Zonzi, Huth, Crouch, Ryan, Adam etc not available. The recruitment team brought in a pubescent Butland and Brek Shea to complete the campaign. 8th at xmas under TP. He didn't take us down, though he may well have dug his heels in to prove a point. Pig's Heads in lockers etc was shite and symptomatic I suppose. But we weren't relegated and obviously he was a casualty of the lack of backing. Like Sparky... Bauer and N'Diaye brought in three months too late. It is what it is. Neither TP nor Hughes got us relegated. How very true.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2018 18:41:06 GMT
We were close to being relegated. It wasn't football, it was results that got TP sacked. Really? We ended up with 42 points which is decent in anyone's book. For the money he'd spent and the time we'd been in the league it was crap. Our lowest ever PL total (til now).
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 18:48:00 GMT
It was nothing to do with the style of play. It was in part to do with his touch in the transfer market deserting him but mostly it was to do with the fact that results and performances had been steadily declining for 18 months. This ‘solid spine’ won three times in his last five months, delivered what was at that point the club’s lowest Premier League points tally, had players at each others’ throats and had been outscored by all except one team in the entire four division pyramid. That’s the reality of what he left behind. It needed a little more than a spit polish. I do remember, but again, I think it was boredom both sides in the end mostly. It's a good way to summarise it. Everything went stale and the fans just wanted to watch some decent football for once. It was also in part because of him/us being successful with his brand of football, it contributed to his own downfall. Don't tell me that we didn't put the cat amongst the pigeons, teams were going out of their way in how they approached playing against us but we got sussed and it was going downhill fast, including off the field. If results had remained good there would have been no case to get rid would there? Surely a good manager adapts to being sussed? What actually happened was he’d built quite an exciting team and spent a fair wedge to completely dismantle it.
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Post by chamberlain on May 6, 2018 18:49:54 GMT
Relegation , ruining all the good work done previously and a squad of players not fit for purpose
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 18:51:12 GMT
We finished 11-12 very poorly. 8th at Christmas but the signs were all there. Couldn’t score, no pace, didn’t convince, Liverpool game aside (and he went out of his way not to pick that side again). The Carto thing didn’t come out of nowhere, it was brought in for a reason. Finishing 12th pooorly I'll take... though I'm looking forward to the fresh challenge of the drop. So Carto & co were brought in to do what? Avoid high wage, high cost wasters that Tone attracted.... or summat? Really? Winning four games between New Year’s Day and May isn’t a great look is it? Nor is finishing 92nd in the scoring charts after spending £14m on strikers that summer. Carto and co were brought in for that reason basically, yeah, as a reaction to Pulis only being interested in signing expensive players with Premier League experience and having little interest in overseas markets or players with resale value. Obviously it’s gone hideously wrong almost from the word go, the wrong bloke was appointed and it’s been a disaster. But the thinking beyond it was strong and warranted and had we actually put some thought into the structure it should’ve worked (and may yet do with the right people).
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 6, 2018 18:52:12 GMT
We were close to being relegated. It wasn't football, it was results that got TP sacked. Really? We ended up with 42 points which is decent in anyone's book. When we lost to Villa and Man Utd in April it looked for all the world like we’d be dragged into a scrap. We were absolutely crap and couldn’t buy a win.
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Post by partickpotter on May 6, 2018 18:53:23 GMT
The man who flattered to deceive.
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Post by elystokie on May 6, 2018 19:30:46 GMT
Hughes will be remembered as the man who took over a strong, stable, well run Premier League football team and slowly turned it into an omnishambles. The decline began the day he was appointed. That's just embarrassing.
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