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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 18:12:27 GMT
Do we have in our Squad - On current form?
In line with what Jack was saying about needing players with quality, talent, characters etc, but just how much talent and quality do we need
For me, on current form, we have 2 prem quality players:
Allen
Choupu
OK/Average – can do a job
Shawcross
Zouma
Bruno
Cameron
Grant
Ramadan
Not Good Enough:
Ireland
Affelay
Adam
Jesse
Crouch
Bojan
Muniesa
Edwards(promising)
Liability:
Fletcher
Imbula
Pieters
Haugard
Tymon
Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year.
Fecking Embarrassment
Shaqiri – Can’t run, can’t defend, and can’t influence a game enough – needs playing somewhere different by the new manager so we can get the best out of him or might be time to move him to a champion’s league team or Darlington whoever would have him
Wimmer – We need to be suing Spurs for the Trades Description act, surely should be illegal to advertise him as a football player, this is the biggest heist since the great train robbery
Johnson
Diouf
Berahino
I think I read somewhere that we were the slowest team in the league, cover less ground as a team than anybody else in the league and we have, of course, 1 of the worse defensive units in Europe.
The new manager has some scraps to work with, but Jack was right we need some quality players in the window, heck just some players with a bit of ability also as Jack alludes to and not just 1 player, but 4 or 5 to have a stab at staying in the promised land.
The worry is we now have a new man coming in with no time to evaluate what is possibly the worst/unbalanced squad of players in the prem. That man is more than likely going to have no modern-day prem experience because we, of course, can only do British managers and all the half decent ones have gone – He who hesitates has lost springs to mind, but seriously how did we let it get this bad and wait so long.
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Post by Bojan Mackey on Jan 8, 2018 18:23:40 GMT
I love how Shaqiri, literally the winner of most of our points this season, is now public enemy number one.
I’m also not having Diouf in the “embarrassment” bracket, one of the only players that actually gives a shit.
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Post by superheroantonius on Jan 8, 2018 18:25:26 GMT
More or less agree with that :-)
I would downgrade cameron to poor
I would upgrade fletcher to average if ( a huge if) he his used for an hour here and there. Hes a decent player, no longer young enough to play 38 lots of 90 mins
Diouf is beyond classification, his first touch is poor but his pace and endeavour are top drawer. He barged a swansea player off the ball for our first goal and scored the second to win us a six pointer.He's beyond classification but he is useful.
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Post by foxxy on Jan 8, 2018 18:25:46 GMT
I love how Shaqiri, literally the winner of most of our points this season, is now public enemy number one. I’m also not having Diouf in the “embarrassment” bracket, one of the only players that actually gives a shit. I was as pissed off with Shaq as much as everyone at Newcastle but Jesus without him I dread to think where we’d be. |
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Post by warringtonstokie on Jan 8, 2018 18:25:47 GMT
Fuck me I thought I was miserable
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Post by Bojan Mackey on Jan 8, 2018 18:27:32 GMT
I love how Shaqiri, literally the winner of most of our points this season, is now public enemy number one. I’m also not having Diouf in the “embarrassment” bracket, one of the only players that actually gives a shit. I was as pissed off with Shaq as much as everyone at Newcastle but Jesus without him I dread to think where we’d be. There’s a lot of players who get a pass even though they’ve produced some absolutely myopic shit for a worryingly long time, Shaqiri has one awful game and everyone wants his entrails strungfrom the nearest lamppost. |
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Post by samba :) on Jan 8, 2018 18:46:03 GMT
Prem
Jack
Edwards
Shawx
Zouma
Indi
Geoff
Allen
Ramadan
Chopo
Do a job
Grant
Pieters
Diouf
Shaq
Crouch
Bojan
Muni
Poor
Saido
Tymon up to now
Fletch
Embaressing
Hauggard
Johnson
Imbula
Wimmer
Have i missed anybody?
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 18:56:14 GMT
Prem Jack Edwards Shawx Zouma Indi Geoff Allen Ramadan Chopo Do a job Grant Pieters Diouf Shaq Crouch Bojan Muni Poor Saido Tymon up to now Fletch Embaressing Hauggard Johnson Imbula Wimmer Have i missed anybody? May have missed Afellay - easily done  Jack prem quality on current form? |
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 19:12:04 GMT
I love how Shaqiri, literally the winner of most of our points this season, is now public enemy number one. I’m also not having Diouf in the “embarrassment” bracket, one of the only players that actually gives a shit. We have not got that many points for Shaq to have won I did also say he maybe needs playing differently by the new manager to see if we can get the best out of him. He has too many games where he looks like he can't be arsed for me and his effort against Newcastle in such a massive game was an embarrassment in my opinion - although I do think he may just be bored with playing alongside mediocrity. Nobody can deny Diouf's endeavour, but you can't watch his performance against Cov without thinking we need to be aiming higher. I should hang my head in shame for putting him the embarrassment pile though, he does have a great attitude - but for me miles of prem standard |
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Post by samba :) on Jan 8, 2018 19:15:17 GMT
Prem Jack Edwards Shawx Zouma Indi Geoff Allen Ramadan Chopo Do a job Grant Pieters Diouf Shaq Crouch Bojan Muni Poor Saido Tymon up to now Fletch Embaressing Hauggard Johnson Imbula Wimmer Have i missed anybody? May have missed Afellay - easily done Jack prem quality on current form? i dont know where id put affelay either tbh |
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Post by lordb on Jan 8, 2018 19:18:32 GMT
On current form?
Very few
On achievable capability?
All of them apart from Haugaard and Johnson
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Post by southernish on Jan 8, 2018 19:48:42 GMT
Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year. The people in front of him aren't helping. There have been times when he momentarily kept us in the game. When he doesn't save as many he would be saving us in games, but when you're being peppered with shots you're bound to miss some. |
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 20:18:04 GMT
Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year. The people in front of him aren't helping. There have been times when he momentarily kept us in the game. When he doesn't save as many he would be saving us in games, but when you're being peppered with shots you're bound to miss some. We have seen the odd bit of brilliance from him, but also lot's of errors. For me it is not the quantity of shots he has to save, but more should he stop them or not. It's also not just getting his fingertips to a shot and making a worldy save it's doing the basics correctly - like positioning. Take Chelsea's 1st goal at the Brit all he has to do to prevent us falling behind is stay on his feet and spread his body smiechelesque, leaving it impossible for Morata to score, but actually seemed to dive out of the way and ended up covering no area of his goal, leaving Morata with almost the entire goal to shoot at from what was an awkward angle - this is a goalkeeper who has come out and is not quite sure where his goal is behind him. His positioning and the way he spreads his body has been terrible at times, he has not been great with 1 on 1's and dives 2 minutes before the ball is kicked on pens |
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Post by mermaidsal on Jan 8, 2018 20:21:38 GMT
Watch and see who'll play for the new manager, to game plans they understand and respect, and I reckon there'll be a few pleasant surprises.
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Post by hoppy5869 on Jan 8, 2018 21:31:05 GMT
How many of our current squad would get into most of the other premier league teams????
In my opinion it is 5.
They are butland,shaqiri,Allen,Bruno and zouma(who isn't even ours).
The remainder would struggle to get into a championship team.
When you look at palaces team there is probably 7 players that would walk into our team and improve it
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Post by Hannibal on Jan 8, 2018 21:37:34 GMT
Do we have in our Squad - On current form? In line with what Jack was saying about needing players with quality, talent, characters etc, but just how much talent and quality do we need For me, on current form, we have 2 prem quality players:Allen Choupu OK/Average – can do a jobShawcross Zouma Bruno Cameron Grant Ramadan Not Good Enough:Ireland Affelay Adam Jesse Crouch Bojan Muniesa Edwards(promising) Liability:Fletcher Imbula Pieters Haugard Tymon Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year. Fecking EmbarrassmentShaqiri – Can’t run, can’t defend, and can’t influence a game enough – needs playing somewhere different by the new manager so we can get the best out of him or might be time to move him to a champion’s league team or Darlington whoever would have him Wimmer – We need to be suing Spurs for the Trades Description act, surely should be illegal to advertise him as a football player, this is the biggest heist since the great train robbery Johnson Diouf Berahino I think I read somewhere that we were the slowest team in the league, cover less ground as a team than anybody else in the league and we have, of course, 1 of the worse defensive units in Europe. The new manager has some scraps to work with, but Jack was right we need some quality players in the window, heck just some players with a bit of ability also as Jack alludes to and not just 1 player, but 4 or 5 to have a stab at staying in the promised land. The worry is we now have a new man coming in with no time to evaluate what is possibly the worst/unbalanced squad of players in the prem. That man is more than likely going to have no modern-day prem experience because we, of course, can only do British managers and all the half decent ones have gone – He who hesitates has lost springs to mind, but seriously how did we let it get this bad and wait so long. Zouma 100% falls into the top bracket |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 21:47:19 GMT
Good Prem quality:
-Shaqiri
-Allen
-Butland
-Shawcross
-Indi
-Zouma
Good enough:
-Diouf
-Cameron
-Bojan (could move up if he plays with creativity around)
-Muniesa
-Choupo-Moting
-Edwards (could move up if he keeps his form going)
-Pieters
-Grant
-Crouch as a sub
-Ramadan
Need replacing/Not quite prem level:
-Afellay
-Adam
-Ireland
-Johnson
-Haugaard
-Fletcher
Haven't played enough/Not been here long/Not been used right:
-Tymon
-Wimmer
-Berahino
We're a disciplined defensive midfielder, a winger and right back competition away from a pretty damn decent side. A striker if Saido doesn't work with 3 creative players behind him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 21:49:11 GMT
Do we have in our Squad - On current form? In line with what Jack was saying about needing players with quality, talent, characters etc, but just how much talent and quality do we need For me, on current form, we have 2 prem quality players:Allen Choupu OK/Average – can do a jobShawcross Zouma Bruno Cameron Grant Ramadan Not Good Enough:Ireland Affelay Adam Jesse Crouch Bojan Muniesa Edwards(promising) Liability:Fletcher Imbula Pieters Haugard Tymon Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year. Fecking EmbarrassmentShaqiri – Can’t run, can’t defend, and can’t influence a game enough – needs playing somewhere different by the new manager so we can get the best out of him or might be time to move him to a champion’s league team or Darlington whoever would have him Wimmer – We need to be suing Spurs for the Trades Description act, surely should be illegal to advertise him as a football player, this is the biggest heist since the great train robbery Johnson Diouf Berahino I think I read somewhere that we were the slowest team in the league, cover less ground as a team than anybody else in the league and we have, of course, 1 of the worse defensive units in Europe. The new manager has some scraps to work with, but Jack was right we need some quality players in the window, heck just some players with a bit of ability also as Jack alludes to and not just 1 player, but 4 or 5 to have a stab at staying in the promised land. The worry is we now have a new man coming in with no time to evaluate what is possibly the worst/unbalanced squad of players in the prem. That man is more than likely going to have no modern-day prem experience because we, of course, can only do British managers and all the half decent ones have gone – He who hesitates has lost springs to mind, but seriously how did we let it get this bad and wait so long. Have you watched the goals we've conceded? maybe 3/4 are jack's fault. Have you watched Shaqiri this season at all? We don't deserve good footballers sometimes. Without those two we'd already be down. They've both won us a lot of points. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Jan 8, 2018 21:52:13 GMT
Watch and see who'll play for the new manager, to game plans they understand and respect, and I reckon there'll be a few pleasant surprises. I hope you are right. I cling to the fact that earlier in the season we at least looked solid, so we can be again. |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Jan 8, 2018 22:06:56 GMT
Butland a liability? I really hope the players don't read this board. Especially the younger ones like Tymon and Edwards. Though Butland is clever and level-headed enough to know he's far from a liability.
The reason Shaqiri is here is because he's not consistent. I'm sure he's responsible for more of our goals than any other player this season. There was one game (I can't remember which) where until quite late he was the only one who'd had any shots (and had about 4).
The squad is capable of a top-half finish in my opinion, we just need that defence organised and confidence rebuilding.
On current form I'd agree that Allen and Choupu-Moting look like our two best players (I'd probably throw Adam in), but there are plenty of others who are good enough.
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Post by Theninjabadger on Jan 8, 2018 22:12:35 GMT
I wish all of our embarrassing players had scored or assisted over a 3rd of our goals
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 22:25:41 GMT
Do we have in our Squad - On current form? In line with what Jack was saying about needing players with quality, talent, characters etc, but just how much talent and quality do we need For me, on current form, we have 2 prem quality players:Allen Choupu OK/Average – can do a jobShawcross Zouma Bruno Cameron Grant Ramadan Not Good Enough:Ireland Affelay Adam Jesse Crouch Bojan Muniesa Edwards(promising) Liability:Fletcher Imbula Pieters Haugard Tymon Butland – of the 40 goals or so he has conceded this season, in my opinion, he could of done better with quite a few of them perhaps over half, either way he has been poor, possibly at fault with both goals again on Saturday and could have made himself a bigger target for the goal conceded against Newcastle. Like it or not he is 1 of the reasons we find ourselves in the bottom 3. Not sure if anything to do with injury, but not the same player since he came back – for me a definite liability this season, should not be beyond being dropped especially when you consider how well Grant played for us last year – Grant’s performances possibly one of the reasons we got to the 40pt mark last year. Fecking EmbarrassmentShaqiri – Can’t run, can’t defend, and can’t influence a game enough – needs playing somewhere different by the new manager so we can get the best out of him or might be time to move him to a champion’s league team or Darlington whoever would have him Wimmer – We need to be suing Spurs for the Trades Description act, surely should be illegal to advertise him as a football player, this is the biggest heist since the great train robbery Johnson Diouf Berahino I think I read somewhere that we were the slowest team in the league, cover less ground as a team than anybody else in the league and we have, of course, 1 of the worse defensive units in Europe. The new manager has some scraps to work with, but Jack was right we need some quality players in the window, heck just some players with a bit of ability also as Jack alludes to and not just 1 player, but 4 or 5 to have a stab at staying in the promised land. The worry is we now have a new man coming in with no time to evaluate what is possibly the worst/unbalanced squad of players in the prem. That man is more than likely going to have no modern-day prem experience because we, of course, can only do British managers and all the half decent ones have gone – He who hesitates has lost springs to mind, but seriously how did we let it get this bad and wait so long. Have you watched the goals we've conceded? maybe 3/4 are jack's fault. Have you watched Shaqiri this season at all? We don't deserve good footballers sometimes. Without those two we'd already be down. They've both won us a lot of points. Shaq splits opinion fair enough - he can change a game with a bit of magic but nowhere near effective enough in the majority of the games, for me anyway. As stated we could play him differently under a new manager which will help him influence the game more than he does and hopefully get the best out of him. I can think of more than 4 goals just in our games against Chelsea this season that Butland could have done better with. Opinions are funny things, but for me he has been one of our biggest problems this and year and has cost us more points than we have gained from having him in the team. |
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 22:31:49 GMT
Good Prem quality:-Shaqiri -Allen -Butland -Shawcross -Indi -Zouma Good enough:-Diouf -Cameron -Bojan (could move up if he plays with creativity around) -Muniesa -Choupo-Moting -Edwards (could move up if he keeps his form going) -Pieters -Grant -Crouch as a sub -Ramadan Need replacing/Not quite prem level:-Afellay -Adam -Ireland -Johnson -Haugaard -Fletcher Haven't played enough/Not been here long/Not been used right:-Tymon -Wimmer -Berahino We're a disciplined defensive midfielder, a winger and right back competition away from a pretty damn decent side. A striker if Saido doesn't work with 3 creative players behind him. So that's 4 players away from a decent starting 11 then |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 22:32:07 GMT
Have you watched the goals we've conceded? maybe 3/4 are jack's fault. Have you watched Shaqiri this season at all? We don't deserve good footballers sometimes. Without those two we'd already be down. They've both won us a lot of points. Shaq splits opinion fair enough - he can change a game with a bit of magic but nowhere near effective enough in the majority of the games, for me anyway. As stated we could play him differently under a new manager which will help him influence the game more than he does and hopefully get the best out of him. I can think of more than 4 goals just in our games against Chelsea this season that Butland could have done better with. Opinions are funny things, but for me he has been one of our biggest problems this and year and has cost us more points than we have gained from having him in the team. I agree the 442 is horrendous for Shaq, as is Crouch up front. But for me he's our most effective player. I wouldn't agree about Chelsea. This season i can remember him being at fault for the Mahrez goal, possibly the Zappacosta goal and Saturday's second. Mane's for Liverpool possibly too. But really it's difficult to be on form when the defence in front of you lets the opposition have free shots from 6 yards out. |
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Post by GeneralFaye on Jan 8, 2018 22:32:24 GMT
What a total bollocks conversation. The players aren't good enough for the top 6 clubs, we all know that. However, the majority of our squad would be at another Premier League club if they weren't with us. Does that make them actually that good? That's another argument. There are 2 leagues in the Premier League, let's get it right.
I'm not going to bite to what you've said about Shaqiri.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 22:33:37 GMT
Good Prem quality:-Shaqiri -Allen -Butland -Shawcross -Indi -Zouma Good enough:-Diouf -Cameron -Bojan (could move up if he plays with creativity around) -Muniesa -Choupo-Moting -Edwards (could move up if he keeps his form going) -Pieters -Grant -Crouch as a sub -Ramadan Need replacing/Not quite prem level:-Afellay -Adam -Ireland -Johnson -Haugaard -Fletcher Haven't played enough/Not been here long/Not been used right:-Tymon -Wimmer -Berahino We're a disciplined defensive midfielder, a winger and right back competition away from a pretty damn decent side. A striker if Saido doesn't work with 3 creative players behind him. So that's 4 players away from a decent starting 11 then I think we have a decent starting XI already. A mobile, disciplined defensive midfielder is number 1. Then a backup/competition for Edwards at right back. The winger and striker depend on if we can get real quality that are better than what we have. |
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 22:43:20 GMT
Shaq splits opinion fair enough - he can change a game with a bit of magic but nowhere near effective enough in the majority of the games, for me anyway. As stated we could play him differently under a new manager which will help him influence the game more than he does and hopefully get the best out of him. I can think of more than 4 goals just in our games against Chelsea this season that Butland could have done better with. Opinions are funny things, but for me he has been one of our biggest problems this and year and has cost us more points than we have gained from having him in the team. I agree the 442 is horrendous for Shaq, as is Crouch up front. But for me he's our most effective player. I wouldn't agree about Chelsea. This season I can remember him being at fault for the Mahrez goal, possibly the Zappacosta goal and Saturday's second. Mane's for Liverpool possibly too. But really it's difficult to be on form when the defence in front of you lets the opposition have free shots from 6 yards out. Have to agree to disagree on Butland, he has been pretty mediocre this season for me - and not getting rave reviews from pundits either. A rare talent YES, but should not be beyond criticism if he is making mistakes - you yourself have pointed out 4 off the top of your head, that alone is possibly too many and we should not just let him off or feel sorry for him because the defence has been hopeless - he is part of that defence. |
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Post by blackpoolred on Jan 8, 2018 22:47:11 GMT
So that's 4 players away from a decent starting 11 then I think we have a decent starting XI already. A mobile, disciplined defensive midfielder is number 1. Then a backup/competition for Edwards at right back. The winger and striker depend on if we can get real quality that are better than what we have. Agree with R/B & C/M as priorities but also need some competition if not a replacement for Pieters and as you stated previously a striker |
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Post by bojancity on Jan 8, 2018 22:51:15 GMT
Prem Jack Edwards Shawx Zouma Indi Geoff Allen Ramadan Chopo Do a job Grant Pieters Diouf Shaq Crouch Bojan Muni Poor Saido Tymon up to now Fletch Embaressing Hauggard Johnson Imbula Wimmer Have i missed anybody? How can Shaqiri be put in the ‘does a job’ category? 😂😂 |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 22:52:21 GMT
I agree the 442 is horrendous for Shaq, as is Crouch up front. But for me he's our most effective player. I wouldn't agree about Chelsea. This season I can remember him being at fault for the Mahrez goal, possibly the Zappacosta goal and Saturday's second. Mane's for Liverpool possibly too. But really it's difficult to be on form when the defence in front of you lets the opposition have free shots from 6 yards out. Have to agree to disagree on Butland, he has been pretty mediocre this season for me - and not getting rave reviews from pundits either. A rare talent YES, but should not be beyond criticism if he is making mistakes - you yourself have pointed out 4 off the top of your head, that alone is possibly too many and we should not just let him off or feel sorry for him because the defence has been hopeless - he is part of that defence. No I think he's not been perfect. But he has made far more game-saving saves than he has made game-losing mistakes. Those 4 are the only 4 i can think of, having looked at the results and my best recollection of the goals from each game. Honestly when you're being called on 15 times a game to make saves, a few are going to sneak through. He's not immune to criticism, I just don't think he warrants it beyond very very few mistakes. Definitely not enough to be called a 'liability' |
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