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Post by lawrieleslie on Jan 3, 2018 19:10:11 GMT
I’ve said many many times that I completely disagree with zoos, aquariums etc etc because, in my opinion, the bottom line for all of them is animal exploitation for profit. Now there is this debacle of a polar bear cub born in captivity in that Arctic environment called Scotland. Did anybody see the footage on BBC news showing its parents in a caged enclosure with no icebergs, ice floes or Arctic Sea in sight. It’s disgraceful, if people want to see wild animals in natural environments then watch wild life programmes on TV they’re are brilliant. In contrast there was a superb programme about polar bears on BBC over Christmas and seeing those in captivity tonight made me very angry. Attachment Deleted |
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Post by felonious on Jan 3, 2018 19:25:48 GMT
Spot on. I didn't feel comfortable watching the recent news about Woburn.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Jan 3, 2018 19:32:47 GMT
Yes, I agree.
Civilisation should have gone beyond this sort of thing by now.
The odd petting zoo with a chipmunk or two is ok.
Don't like the idea of these penned up predatory beasts,
and those in the totally wrong climate being captive.
And here's me the hypocrite, 'owning' a cat.
Always found zoos sad and a bit melancholic as a kid.
But you couldn't release them now I don't suppose.
Fantastic creatures. I watched the 'Nature's Weirdest Events' thing over xmas with a 'flock' of something like a third of the worlds' polar bear population descending a hill side, drawn in by the fragrant rotting carcass of a sperm whale.
Crazy sight.
Hostilities suspended for these fiercely territorial beasts with the promise of more than enough food.
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Post by felonious on Jan 3, 2018 19:40:13 GMT
Yes, I agree. Civilisation should have gone beyond this sort of thing by now. The odd petting zoo with a chipmunk or two is ok. Don't like the idea of these penned up predatory beasts, and those in the totally wrong climate being captive. And here's me the hypocrite, 'owning' a cat.Always found zoos sad and a bit melancholic as a kid. But you couldn't release them now I don't suppose. Fantastic creatures. I watched the 'Nature's Weirdest Events' thing over xmas with a 'flock' of something like a third of the worlds' polar bear population descending a hill side, drawn in by the fragrant rotting carcass of a sperm whale. Crazy sight. Hostilities suspended for these fiercely territorial beasts with the promise of more than enough food. You fool, don't you know the cat owns you  |
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Jan 3, 2018 19:52:58 GMT
Yes, I agree. Civilisation should have gone beyond this sort of thing by now. The odd petting zoo with a chipmunk or two is ok. Don't like the idea of these penned up predatory beasts, and those in the totally wrong climate being captive. And here's me the hypocrite, 'owning' a cat.Always found zoos sad and a bit melancholic as a kid. But you couldn't release them now I don't suppose. Fantastic creatures. I watched the 'Nature's Weirdest Events' thing over xmas with a 'flock' of something like a third of the worlds' polar bear population descending a hill side, drawn in by the fragrant rotting carcass of a sperm whale. Crazy sight. Hostilities suspended for these fiercely territorial beasts with the promise of more than enough food. You fool, don't you know the cat owns you Yeah that's why I 'inverted comma'd' it. 18 year long battle of wills. I'm nowhere near breaking him. Nowt for xmas again off of him, never come close to making a cup of tea. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2018 20:15:11 GMT
We are all Animals to be fair, we are just the lucky ones
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Post by maninasuitcase on Jan 3, 2018 20:33:52 GMT
Sadly if they were let free the fucking Chinese would have killed them all for their poxy medicine.
I agree with preservation of near extinct species but all animals should be free.
Its the fucking scum humans and poachers that want caging.
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Post by Northy on Jan 3, 2018 21:06:09 GMT
I went to chester zoo last week, they do some very good conservation and species saving work with the money raised, it is excellent in that field and probably the best in the world.
They have 2 bears there which were rescued from the animal traders, having a far better existence than before.
I didnt think the polar bears should be in that place in scotland.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2018 21:06:39 GMT
Sadly if they were let free the fucking Chinese would have killed them all for their poxy medicine. I agree with preservation of near extinct species but all animals should be free. Its the fucking scum humans and poachers that want caging. I can't imagine living in Britain with wolves, bears , wild boars and packs of dogs running around. It's bad enough with teenagers! We have lost them all except the dogs who now live with us. Just how would you preserve them in a natural environment, perhaps make Loch Ness a national park along with parts of Wales on a scale akin to Yellowstone Park, that's about 60 x 50 miles square by the way. Who would pay for that? Sorry it would be nice but we just don't have the room or the finance for it. Besides my little Cairn Terrier is quite happy sitting by the radiator on his cushion eating his chicken dinner. I don't think he wants to be repatriated to the Highlands of Scotland. Oh and just a thought what are you going to do with all the animals that don't belong here. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2018 22:27:05 GMT
I went to chester zoo last week, they do some very good conservation and species saving work with the money raised, it is excellent in that field and probably the best in the world. They have 2 bears there which were rescued from the animal traders, having a far better existence than before. I didnt think the polar bears should be in that place in scotland. A Polar Bear's natural environment is a very cold, very harsh, often hostile and desolate land. Far away from civilization and barely able to sustain human life. Whereas Scotland is an...errr....well it's a ....Yup...They should fit in fine there. |
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Post by Northy on Jan 4, 2018 7:36:39 GMT
I went to chester zoo last week, they do some very good conservation and species saving work with the money raised, it is excellent in that field and probably the best in the world. They have 2 bears there which were rescued from the animal traders, having a far better existence than before. I didnt think the polar bears should be in that place in scotland. A Polar Bear's natural environment is a very cold, very harsh, often hostile and desolate land. Far away from civilization and barely able to sustain human life. Whereas Scotland is an...errr....well it's a ....Yup...They should fit in fine there. There is talk of rewilding Lynx into parts of scotland, and also wolves, but i think the wolves would be unrealistic. Some great work going on up there with 'trees for life' and other groups that are slowly reclaiming the land from sheep grazing and turning it back into natural habitat and the caledonian forest. a very good watch if you have 20 minutes: - My eldest lad spent a year with these treesforlife.org.uk/news/article/boost-for-scotlandrsquos-international-reputation-for-wilderness-and-wildlife/ |
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Post by felonious on Jan 4, 2018 7:53:50 GMT
You fool, don't you know the cat owns you Yeah that's why I 'inverted comma'd' it. 18 year long battle of wills. I'm nowhere near breaking him. Nowt for xmas again off of him, never come close to making a cup of tea. As I was typing this yesterday the stray turned up as he has been doing for the last 6? years during which he's removed two other strays from the vicinity. He was making that God awful sound which announces that he's brought a present which I exchange for food. Got outside and the lying bugger had nowt but knew it was the only way of getting me to the door with food .....played like a violin  |
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Jan 4, 2018 14:10:11 GMT
Yeah that's why I 'inverted comma'd' it. 18 year long battle of wills. I'm nowhere near breaking him. Nowt for xmas again off of him, never come close to making a cup of tea. As I was typing this yesterday the stray turned up as he has been doing for the last 6? years during which he's removed two other strays from the vicinity. He was making that God awful sound which announces that he's brought a present which I exchange for food. Got outside and the lying bugger had nowt but knew it was the only way of getting me to the door with food .....played like a violin Studies have shown that cats don't use that pitiful 'feed me' cry to communicate amongst themselves, it's something they turn on for us humans. A presumption that through co existing/evolution they've learned to replicate the sound of a distressed human baby to attract our attention. Not sure about that but it is certainly annoying. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2018 14:44:51 GMT
Personally though, I hate Polar Bears.
Evil bastards....
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jan 4, 2018 15:02:41 GMT
As I was typing this yesterday the stray turned up as he has been doing for the last 6? years during which he's removed two other strays from the vicinity. He was making that God awful sound which announces that he's brought a present which I exchange for food. Got outside and the lying bugger had nowt but knew it was the only way of getting me to the door with food .....played like a violin Studies have shown that cats don't use that pitiful 'feed me' cry to communicate amongst themselves, it's something they turn on for us humans. A presumption that through co existing/evolution they've learned to replicate the sound of a distressed human baby to attract our attention. Not sure about that but it is certainly annoying. That's true - most cats are solitary creatures and rarely vocalise at all. They've 'learnt' that we respond to it and that's why they do it. They're not daft. Although a cheetah purring is pretty special... |
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Post by DunnetHeadMoonraker on Jan 4, 2018 19:44:46 GMT
I agree with preservation of near extinct species but all animals should be free. Its the fucking scum humans and poachers that want caging. A few years ago my local paper the John O' Groat Journal had a photo of 3 men who had successfully completed the Macnab Challenge in aid of charity proudly showing their victims. The Macnab Challenge is killing a salmon , a stag and a brace of grouse in one day between dawn and dusk. Apparently killing wild animals is known as a 'sport' |
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Post by potterinleeds on Jan 4, 2018 20:47:25 GMT
There is talk of rewilding Lynx into parts of scotland, and also wolves, but i think the wolves would be unrealistic. Some great work going on up there with 'trees for life' and other groups that are slowly reclaiming the land from sheep grazing and turning it back into natural habitat and the caledonian forest.This, IMHO, is the nub of the problem with zoos, Northy. There isn't much point having a captive breeding programme if there is little or no remaining natural habitat left to re-introduce the things back into - I'd rather the money was spent trying to conserve them where they actually live, although I know that's fraught with huge difficulties. The wolf question is an interesting one. I was amazed to find out last year that wolves are regularly sighted in the area of the north German coastline where we go on holiday - there are apparently about 300 across the northern part of Germany; I've seen reliable film footage of a 2-3 year old wolf taken only 20 miles from where I was going running early every morning along the coast. Where we were, it is dead flat, heavily farmed (although with a low overall population), sparse tree cover (but a fair few small woods distributed fairly evenly I suppose) and lots of big marshy ditches crossing the landscape. I thought that it was far too open for wolves, but I was reading Anthony Dent's (1974) The Lost Beasts of Britain, and he argues that dead flat Holderness (East Yorkshire) may have been one of the most southerly places in England that wolves held on into the late medieval period, precisely because it was then sparsely populated, with plenty of hiding places in scrubby woodland surrounded by marsh. So if wolves can be about in a far more densely populated area that upland Scotland, and yet still have relatively little interaction with people, I wonder if they really could make a comeback in Caledonia? You're probably right in it being unrealistic, but I'd like to see them give it a try with Lynx. |
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Post by Northy on Jan 5, 2018 7:38:30 GMT
There is talk of rewilding Lynx into parts of scotland, and also wolves, but i think the wolves would be unrealistic. Some great work going on up there with 'trees for life' and other groups that are slowly reclaiming the land from sheep grazing and turning it back into natural habitat and the caledonian forest.This, IMHO, is the nub of the problem with zoos, Northy. There isn't much point having a captive breeding programme if there is little or no remaining natural habitat left to re-introduce the things back into - I'd rather the money was spent trying to conserve them where they actually live, although I know that's fraught with huge difficulties. The wolf question is an interesting one. I was amazed to find out last year that wolves are regularly sighted in the area of the north German coastline where we go on holiday - there are apparently about 300 across the northern part of Germany; I've seen reliable film footage of a 2-3 year old wolf taken only 20 miles from where I was going running early every morning along the coast. Where we were, it is dead flat, heavily farmed (although with a low overall population), sparse tree cover (but a fair few small woods distributed fairly evenly I suppose) and lots of big marshy ditches crossing the landscape. I thought that it was far too open for wolves, but I was reading Anthony Dent's (1974) The Lost Beasts of Britain, and he argues that dead flat Holderness (East Yorkshire) may have been one of the most southerly places in England that wolves held on into the late medieval period, precisely because it was then sparsely populated, with plenty of hiding places in scrubby woodland surrounded by marsh. So if wolves can be about in a far more densely populated area that upland Scotland, and yet still have relatively little interaction with people, I wonder if they really could make a comeback in Caledonia? You're probably right in it being unrealistic, but I'd like to see them give it a try with Lynx. there is a lot of reforestation work going around the world,(check out saihanba in china for one) that will need the animals re-introducing, also the bird and animal illegal pet market has devastated some populations with the habitat still intact, some humans need a good education on their local environment sustainability. The palm oil industry is one of the worst at the moment, people need to stop buying products with palm oil in them. |
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Post by eddyclamp on Jan 5, 2018 10:15:49 GMT
I`ve seen polar bears in Florida
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Post by lawrieleslie on Jan 5, 2018 11:58:10 GMT
I`ve seen polar bears in Florida America the great bastion of wildlife conservation, yeh right Remember the movie Free Willy about a whale escaping from human captivity. Starring...........a whale in captivity. |
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